tenpoless
No 6-pack, just 2Pac
Been thinking the same. Bruno/Ronaldo or Bruno/Cavani or Cavani/Ronaldo up to.I don't see any reason why we can't try 4-4-2?
Been thinking the same. Bruno/Ronaldo or Bruno/Cavani or Cavani/Ronaldo up to.I don't see any reason why we can't try 4-4-2?
Because if we meet a team like Brighton, Southampton or Palace, they will be happy to sit back and let the match end 0-0. We will risk having too little creative power to break them down.
I don't see any reason why we can't try 4-4-2?
In games we are less scared the 3-5-2 will need to be swapped for 3-4-3, which is more attacking and can use Sancho.Because at home, we are gonna be expected to control the game and create more. Spurs were woeful too
Ole organized a relatively stable defense just last year and the year before. As already pointed out, the formation switch wasn't the only thing new today. Without even mentioning the toothless opponent from today (9 goals in ten matches for Spurs this season), if we had put Varane next to Maguire or Lindelof and setup the team to sit deep and wait for counters, who is to say, that we wouldn't have got the same or an even better result with a 4-2-3-1 or a 4-4-2. We can't always just stay on the first level of looking at the status quo and pretend, this formation does this, that formation does that. Every formation can be played in lots of ways. Some formations are more suited to some approaches, some are less suited.Because Ole has trouble organizing the defence (and midfield for that matter). The easiest way to circumvent that is to stack the defence with players and let our forwards deliver the moments.
Who says we have to choose one tactic for eternity let alone even two games in a row. While every thinkable formation can be played in a multitude of ways, we can adjust so many variables to so many situations on the pitch. So this argument thankfully carries absolutely no value. Look at Fergie, when we needed a goal, he brought on all the strikers he had on the bench. Didn't care with how many he started. You can adapt in infinite ways, from match to match, even within a match. You disliking a formation, is therefor just that - you are disliking it.Our major weakness under Ole previous 2 years has been breaking down teams who sit behind the ball, and I don't see this 5 at the back helping that in the slightest. However, I would rather us attempt to grind out some 1-0 wins playing like this than see us getting torn to shreds like we have done nearly every game this season.
So you would play Shaw at Centerback because of his qualities to bring the ball forward? Is that really smart? I mean the up-and-down part is the one that should be carried out by the wingback, so... This would then probably rule out Telles as wingback, think he lacks the engine. If though, we don't interpret the LWB position more as a LM position and the player there more for his role in midfield play, that might work just fine. Best thing with Telles are his early crosses anyways.That us definitely worth a try, with Shaws ability to bring the ball forward it could work..
The only possible role for him at this formation, is to rotate with Bruno.I think Sancho fits in if he plays more of a 3-4-3. It's not a massive stretch of the imagination to see that depending on the setup of our opponents.
It's probably not impossible that he could play the Bruno position, either. As a potential rotation. I don't like it so much as Bruno is a lot more combative and more accustomed to dropping into deeper central areas but it's not impossible, having his technical ability in the game more often could work.
Not as a wingback, that's not a good idea. Doesn't seem to have any defensive instincts and I don't think he's shown the engine so far. If we're going for offbeat changeups for that role Lingard would be better. Although no reason to completely dismiss Dalot from that role either.
I like this formation. Even if it means scoring against bus parking sides will be difficult, we probably won't get sliced open embarrassingly often like it has happened so far this season.
I think Sancho can shine in a forward's role or in Bruno's role with time. Less defensive responsibility will suit a lot of our attackers who frankly have very poor defensive stats(Especially Sancho & CR7) to start with.
I don't see any reason why we can't try 4-4-2?
Problem with 442 is the wing positions. They are not very good defensively so it will end up being a 424 or a 415 if you plan on playing Bruno in midfield.
The only practical thing for Ole to do is play a 532. He can rotate Rashford and Greenwood in for Cavani and Ronaldo. Sancho could maybe play the AM position or more likely he could possibly play a wingback role with a Telles against easier opposition. Lingard could come in for Bruno on occasion.
I hope Ole uses this formation until the team get some consistency. He should use the full squad once he gets over this rough patch. He will be sacked at some point but I would like to see him make it to the end of the season.
3-5-2 is not a counter-attacking formation but with our players, it definitely is IMO. Quality attacking wingbacks are very important in this formation especially against deep seated teams and while I really like Shaw & AWB, their attacking output leaves a lot to be desired compared to the modern wingbacks.Repeat with me: 3-5-2 is not a counter-attacking formation and you can break down bus-parking teams with it. We used to play 4-2-3-1 and were both counter attacking and struggle with buses.
It is not about formation as much about how team plays.
The problem with 3-5-2 is our wide players will be benched, but we can definitely transform into 3-4-3 in many games
That is fair. Shaw was brilliant in attack, last season, but has been extremely lukewarm this season. AWB has almost never been decent in attack... until yesterday. I couldn't believe my eyes but honestly he was very decent. Not world class, but on a different level compared to his past. Not sure if this can happen again or how often?3-5-2 is not a counter-attacking formation but with our players, it definitely is IMO. Quality attacking wingbacks are very important in this formation especially against deep seated teams and while I really like Shaw & AWB, their attacking output leaves a lot to be desired compared to the modern wingbacks.
With someone like Trent/Reece James I would agree 3-5-2 can be a very effective formation against all types of teams.
Based on one game against an awful Spurs side ? We'd have beaten them no matter the formation. If there are more games proving the solidity of the back 4 then by all means, let's play it regularly. I find the early conclusions against a shit team very prematureIn games we are less scared the 3-5-2 will need to be swapped for 3-4-3, which is more attacking and can use Sancho.
A lot of teams playing back 3 do rotate between the two setups. Point is whether you use 3 CBs or 2 CBs.
Also, we don't really have a choice. Our defensive play sucks and our forwards don't / can't press so we need to fix our defense with the players we have. Seems like back 3 is the only thing we can so to stop leaking goals. Hating the reality doesn't change it
Where is Bruno going to play in a 3-4-3?In games we are less scared the 3-5-2 will need to be swapped for 3-4-3, which is more attacking and can use Sancho.
Pogba is perfect in a 3-5-2 double pivot because we have additional cover for his poor defensive awareness and tracking back.Either playing a 3-4-3 or 3-5-2, it just shows the that there is no forsite in managements decisions on players. Lets grab the shiney new toy to appease the fans. Theres no position for Pogba in a 3-4-3 and with a 3-5-2, their is alot of talent riding the bench.
You seriously don’t care if our best young prospects don’t play much?!I think it has to be this system for the remainder of Ole's season. Utd were shipping goals playing a pressing 4231. 532 is solid and, although not the most entertaining formation, will get results.
I don't care is Greenwood or Sancho don't start much, results are of greater concern.
The way Greenwood, Martial and Sancho play.. Some of our younger players may have been mollycoddled into thinking they are the dog’s bollocks without putting in the hard yards. Thankfully we have experienced heads upfront to jolt and show them how average they really are.You seriously don’t care if our best young prospects don’t play much?!
I think we should forget about Pogba if we're not playing 352 or need an impact sub.I think from this peformance, CR7's arrival derailed a lot of OGS's tactical preparations for this season. Also, because he is not a tactically astute, so he has problems fitting in CR7 into the team.
The old 4-2-3-1 would transit into a 4-2-4 while counterattacking, but because the front line did not press as hard and as coordinated with CR7, and CR7 would not be able to come deep to retrieve the ball, it created too much pressure in the defense and center midfield.
However with this new formation, the club has way too many wingers. It is hard to play them with this position, and only way for OGS is to go back to last season's 4-2-3-1 against weaker teams with Pogba on left midfield. So this formation would closer to Liverpool's 4-3-3 and would utilize our wingers/inside forwards.
This is far too extreme. Yes they should work harder and other managers may demand that from them but you are being far too harsh. Sancho is acclimatising to life here and hasn’t adjusted yet, but he’s proven his class for years prior as one of footballs top prospects. Greenwood has been arguably our best attacking player this season overall, he’s carried us in games at times and scored some cracking goals. Again it’s fair to question his work rate but his work on the ball this season has been top draw more often than not. The fact that people are willing to write off two players with yeh potential to be the best in world football says it all about where we are at and the attitude of some of this fan base.The way Greenwood, Martial and Sancho play.. Some of our younger players may have been mollycoddled into thinking they are the dog’s bollocks without putting in the hard yards. Thankfully we have experienced heads upfront to jolt and show them how average they really are.
Even if we play Greenwood, Rashford, Martial, Pogba, Sancho, none of them would press or fight for the ball. But once we put them all in our bench, we start seeing a far more compact system, and playing with more intense and urgency. Also, our back four under 4 defender system just isn’t good enough, McFred or Pogba/Matic in 424 look very lost and easy to cut through, thats why we need to change it to 3 CB + 2 WB, which gives our defensive players better structure/framework to work along.I think from this peformance, CR7's arrival derailed a lot of OGS's tactical preparations for this season. Also, because he is not a tactically astute, so he has problems fitting in CR7 into the team.
The old 4-2-3-1 would transit into a 4-2-4 while counterattacking, but because the front line did not press as hard and as coordinated with CR7, and CR7 would not be able to come deep to retrieve the ball, it created too much pressure in the defense and center midfield.
However with this new formation, the club has way too many wingers. It is hard to play them with this position, and only way for OGS is to go back to last season's 4-2-3-1 against weaker teams with Pogba on left midfield. So this formation would closer to Liverpool's 4-3-3 and would utilize our wingers/inside forwards.
No, this is the problem when we do not have enough central midfielders when we were 4-2-3-1. Same issue as last season when we lost to Spurs at home.I think we should forget about Pogba if we're not playing 352 or need an impact sub.
We already have too many forwards / wingers to care about Paul, something that won't be a problem next season most likely.
I would like to see them as wide forwards in a 3—4—3, they would do really well imo.Can we get refund for Sancho, Amad, Pellistric? 3 wingers.
You seriously don’t care if our best young prospects don’t play much?!
I like Pogba on the left against packed defenses. He is useful in build up playas you said. But now with Sancho I'd rather use him as the link between midfield and Bruno +CF as he'll be a part of that team long term.No, this is the problem when we do not have enough central midfielders when we were 4-2-3-1. Same issue as last season when we lost to Spurs at home.
The center midfield is a pressure cooker. McFred usually get overwhelmed by opponents' pressing, and create more pressure by going back to DDG or Maguire with the ball if they cannot find Shaw. However, when Pogba is around, McFred has an extra outlet to play to, and the ball can then be passed to Fernandes.
The only way that we can omit Pogba is by slowing the game down and controlling the game by having both wingers drop back and play slow possession football. However, OGS likes direct, counterattacking football in which the front is too far away from McFred and if Pogba/vdB serves as the extra midfield to receive the ball from Fred and bring it to Fernandes.