2024 U.S. Elections | Trump wins

Suedesi said:


GTFTHUUXkAE9ONi

https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/21/why-biden-dropped-out-00170106



Biden really didn't want to go.

  1. Biden gets COVID.
  2. Biden stays home.
  3. Biden's Twitter account announces he’s dropping out.
  4. No speech or anything prepared; he's not seen.
In a classic coup, they’d keep him at home and just announce his drop-out without his consent. Then Biden faces a new reality: either accept it and play along or embarrass himself by claiming it wasn’t his decision. People will say he’s demented and forgot it anyway, forcing him out regardless. The perfect coup.
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You would do well on 4Chan.
 
It's a good thing Biden finally dropped out but it is really late and unfortunate that Democrat voters were deprived of a real primary where Kamala would have to win votes and earn the nomination. Voters deserve to have their nominee put through the hard process and have to answer questions. We all knew they would line up and coronation the establishment pick but it still feels a bit crap. Biden should never have tried to seek relection. Anyway it is what it is now I suppose.
 
Sly said:
Is @Suedesi the Caf Infowars correspondent?

At least he isn't coy anymore and embraces his trumpism. I guess he got fed up with his centrism schtick. Not that anyone takes him seriously anyways.
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Suedesi isn't a trumpist. It's techbroism, basically, of the Shadowstats kind. Maybe some hints of neo-reactionary/dark enlightenment.

Combine that with an unhealthy ego boost from calling the Trump/Biden thing better than most here, and the result is more unhinged than normal.
 
Raoul said:
AOC seems to be going full centrist lately as well. Ultimately, everything is related to the possibility of Trump getting re-elected.
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I don't think she's going centrist or "selling out" as some say but rather she's trying to angle for more influence and not be cast aside. She made thr absolutely wrong call and backing Biden after the debate though. That was just embarrassing.
 
Revan said:
I do not think so. But like Bernie, she understands that the best way of getting her agenda done is to play nice with the president. Otherwise, it will just lead to division and while might be cool for Twitter, won't result with much else.

About the second point, I think that Trump will get re-elected which will suck. Unfortunately, I think that his campaign is far better than before, and they have been saving him from himself several times. And Kamala is a historically unpopular politician which will make this election not particularly close (still think that Trump will win all 6 swing states, but unlike vs Biden, won't win Minnesota, New Mexico, Virginia etc).

Dems shot themselves in the foot when they decided that the best way of winning the election was by having a demented person as their candidate. And then, when they convinced to drop him with 1 year of delay, decided to crown the second most disliked active politician in their party.
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She has advocated for Biden staying in the race as recently as a few days ago and is now all in on Harris. The fringe protester who came to Congress 6 years ago has gradually morphed into more of a progressive centrist after Pelosi took her under her wing and showed her how politics really works. Pelosi herself was thought to be a left winger when she started in politics and gradually wound up the standard bearer of corporate establishment Democratic politics.
 
oneniltothearsenal said:
It's a good thing Biden finally dropped out but it is really late and unfortunate that Democrat voters were deprived of a real primary where Kamala would have to win votes and earn the nomination. Voters deserve to have their nominee put through the hard process and have to answer questions. We all knew they would line up and coronation the establishment pick but it still feels a bit crap. Biden should never have tried to seek relection. Anyway it is what it is now I suppose.
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That's what happened last time around, where there was that synchronised dropping of all candidates and their endorsement of Biden, that got Biden to be the nominee instead of Bernie. But Biden was actually a strong candidate, and the VP of a very popular president.

In an open primary, despite being 'the successor', there would not have been a chance of Kamala winning. Let's not forget that she was polling less than 1% last time around (despite starting as favorite) and had to quit even before Iowa caucus. She would have done better this time around, but no way good enough to beat the likes of Newsom or Whitmer.
 
Raoul said:
She has advocated for Biden staying in the race as recently as a few days ago and is now all in on Harris. The fringe protester who came to Congress 6 years ago has gradually morphed into more of a progressive centrist after Pelosi took her under her wing and showed her how politics really works. Pelosi herself was thought to be a left winger when she started in politics and gradually wound up the standard bearer of corporate establishment Democratic politics.
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But, she is still quite left wing. There is no left-wing candidate except Bernie who can go close to winning the nomination, and we saw what happened twice when he went close. While she might be Bernie's successor (I do not buy this), it is a few years too early for her.

Kamala, or Newsom, or Whitmer, it is all the same for her. Policy wise, there won't be a difference from them, so better to attach herself to the winner (especially when you consider that Newsom endorsed Harris) and try to push her policies. And it is clear that Harris will win the nomination, without being seriously challenged by anyone. I think this just shows that she has politically matured, but not that she is suddenly a centrist or sold herself out.
 
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Revan said:
But, she is still quite left wing. There is no left-wing candidate except Bernie who can go close to winning the nomination, and we saw what happened twice when he went close. While she might be Bernie's successor (I do not buy this), it is a few years too early for her.

Kamala, or Newsom, or Whitmer, it is all the same for her. Policy wise, there won't be a difference from them, so better to attach herself to the winner (especially when you consider that Newsom endorsed Harris) and try to push her policies. And it is clear that Harris will win the nomination, without being seriously challenged by anyone. I think this just shows that he has politically matured, but not that she is suddenly a centrist or sold herself out.
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That's right. She's interesting in winning more than attempting to gain policy concessions that appeal to her voting base. She appears to understand how the game works now.
 
So, i respect that fact that Kamala came out yesterday and said something along the lines of she wanted to "win this nomination".

But in the meantime, she has had numerous members of the party come out and endorse her. So many that it makes it almost impossible for anyone to run against her. Even Joe Manchin knows that there is no point,

Maybe once Biden endorsed her, then this was always going to happen, but i think it would have been smart to allow potential candidates to come forward and challenge her.

We know from UK politics, when an unelected Prime Minister or candidate gets put forward, then it normally doesn't end well.
 
berbatrick said:


There's some clown posts on this page, but fetterman as usual makes the best one.
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He is slowly preparing, in a slow cooker, his republican defection. First a health problem that make him change his "views". Now the betrayal to Biden by the D elites made him see how undemocratic the party is and finally, Trump is a real hero avoiding bullets like matrix
 
gaffs said:
So, i respect that fact that Kamala came out yesterday and said something along the lines of she wanted to "win this nomination".

But in the meantime, she has had numerous members of the party come out and endorse her. So many that it makes it almost impossible for anyone to run against her. Even Joe Manchin knows that there is no point,

Maybe once Biden endorsed her, then this was always going to happen, but i think it would have been smart to allow potential candidates to come forward and challenge her.

We know from UK politics, when an unelected Prime Minister or candidate gets put forward, then it normally doesn't end well.
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While I agree, the Dems also have to avoid the fracture of the party after the Bernie Sanders debacle that led to Trump getting elected in the first place. If they can unify behind one person, then it's far better to do that than get in another battle and risk losing portions of the party with so little time left.
 
4bars said:
He is slowly preparing, in a slow cooker, his republican defection. First a health problem that make him change his "views". Now the betrayal to Biden by the D elites made him see how undemocratic the party is and finally, Trump is a real hero avoiding bullets like matrix
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Nah, as it is Pennsylvania, even if goes republican on presidential level this time, is not a republican state.

He will go the way of Sinema, if he does this.
 
4bars said:
He is slowly preparing, in a slow cooker, his republican defection. First a health problem that make him change his "views". Now the betrayal to Biden by the D elites made him see how undemocratic the party is and finally, Trump is a real hero avoiding bullets like matrix
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I feel like it's inevitable now. Maybe not for a while, months or longer, but he'll be an independent at the very least at some point.
 
gaffs said:
So, i respect that fact that Kamala came out yesterday and said something along the lines of she wanted to "win this nomination".

But in the meantime, she has had numerous members of the party come out and endorse her. So many that it makes it almost impossible for anyone to run against her. Even Joe Manchin knows that there is no point,

Maybe once Biden endorsed her, then this was always going to happen, but i think it would have been smart to allow potential candidates to come forward and challenge her.

We know from UK politics, when an unelected Prime Minister or candidate gets put forward, then it normally doesn't end well.
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I think she's saying all the right things here. Those that were tipped to be potential contenders immediately endorsed her, so there's little she could've done in terms of encouraging a full contest among opponents who don't exist. In terms of timelines, there isn't much time between now and when the party selects a nominee, so the party seem to be quickly coalescing around one person so they can turn towards dealing with Trump.
 
gaffs said:
So, i respect that fact that Kamala came out yesterday and said something along the lines of she wanted to "win this nomination".

But in the meantime, she has had numerous members of the party come out and endorse her. So many that it makes it almost impossible for anyone to run against her. Even Joe Manchin knows that there is no point,

Maybe once Biden endorsed her, then this was always going to happen, but i think it would have been smart to allow potential candidates to come forward and challenge her.

We know from UK politics, when an unelected Prime Minister or candidate gets put forward, then it normally doesn't end well.
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There is no time left to have any potential candidates come forward & challenge Kamala. Every key player on the left realizes this, thus the support.
 
Morty_ said:
Nah, as it is Pennsylvania, even if goes republican on presidential level this time, is not a republican state.

He will go the way of Sinema, if he does this.
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nimic said:
I feel like it's inevitable now. Maybe not for a while, months or longer, but he'll be an independent at the very least at some point.
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Maybe. But as I see him like a grifter he is, I think he will go straight to republican

Sinema was a very weird case IMO. The way her views shifted
 
ManUtd1999 said:
So, Whitmer has endorsed Harris!

That’s disappointing, even if expected.
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It is over (but then it was over yesterday too). Obama is the last big-one who has yet to endorse her, which I'll expect will come shortly.

I sincerely hope I am wrong, but I do not see how Harris defeats Trump.
 
Revan said:
Basically, with Raoul going quite left and suedesi going quite right, I am the Caf’s last centrist. So I find Manchin’s political views quite refreshing, at a time where there is an ever-increasing polarization and almost a hive-minded mentality in both sides of the spectrum.
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4bars said:
Maybe. But as I see him like a grifter he is, I think he will go straight to republican

Sinema was a very weird case IMO. The way her views shifted
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When did that happen? I haven't followed her political career before senate, but in the senate she started and ended like a centrist, maybe even center-right Democrat. Basically a Manchin clone.

But unlike Manchin, I do not think that she was that genuine in those views, and neither needed to be as 'non-progressive'. She was from a state that was not deep red, in fact, a state that was becoming more blue than red.
 
Revan said:
It is over (but then it was over yesterday too). Obama is the last big-one who has yet to endorse her, which I'll expect will come shortly.

I sincerely hope I am wrong, but I do not see how Harris defeats Trump.
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Its going to be close. If there's one thing Harris brings to the table its the possibility of activating various demographics that Biden was struggling with.
 
Revan said:
It is over (but then it was over yesterday too). Obama is the last big-one who has yet to endorse her, which I'll expect will come shortly.

I sincerely hope I am wrong, but I do not see how Harris defeats Trump.
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This is NYT's take

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/21/us/politics/why-obama-hasnt-endorsed-harris.html

Republicans interpreted that as a snub. But people close to Mr. Obama, who has positioned himself as an impartial elder statesman above intraparty machinations, said not to read too much into it — and had no alternate candidate in mind when he made the decision not to immediately endorse Ms. Harris.

Mr. Obama adopted an identical stance four years ago when Mr. Biden’s aides pressured him to endorse early in the Democratic primaries before Senator Bernie Sanders dropped out. (Mr. Obama’s favored phrase back then was “I don’t want to thumb the scale.”) Endorsing too early now would also be a political mistake — fueling criticism that Ms. Harris’s nomination, should it come, was a coronation rather than the best possible consensus under rushed circumstances, they said.
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Raoul said:
Its going to be close. If there's one thing Harris brings to the table its the possibility of activating various demographics that Biden was struggling with.
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Don't forget there is nothing like going into bat with nothing to lose, maybe Harris will enter the fray in a fearless mode and show up a 78-year-old (orange) guy who will be not quite sure how to play it with Ms Harris, it's not the game he planned to take part in... or is it?
 
NotThatSoph said:
Suedesi isn't a trumpist. It's techbroism, basically, of the Shadowstats kind. Maybe some hints of neo-reactionary/dark enlightenment.

Combine that with an unhealthy ego boost from calling the Trump/Biden thing better than most here, and the result is more unhinged than normal.
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I'm quite new to this current iteration of Suedesi but my current feeling is it's a cut above the average WUM we get, who are generally either far too lazy and unoriginal, or just too thin skinned, to be of any more than the briefest source of amusement. He seems to be putting in a decent shift here. There's obvious attempts at humour. You can see a love of the craft.
 
No one is beating Trump at this stage. At least, their chances aren't significantly better than Harris's.
 
Rado_N said:
I know these people are just dumb, knuckle dragging racists, but whether her parents were or weren’t natural born citizens isn’t even relevant ffs
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Long form birth certificate RRAAAAAH !
At least she didn't attend a madrassa in her youth... I think ?
 
The United said:
No one is beating Trump at this stage. At least, their chances aren't significantly better than Harris's.
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It only comes down to 500k-1m voters in 5-10 states. This election has never been a done deal for Trump.

Don't think Harris will do better than Biden in those states and polling supports that?. Newsom or some other might do though.

I don't get how the plan could be to put Harris in given that, must be someone else lined up.
 
Revan said:
And independents. And Democrats.

There is no doubt that 'the party elite' have controlled the Democrat party (same as how it was for GOP before Trump). They fecked Bernie twice, and stole his nomination. They had a demented puppet as president for 3.5 years, and now they will have another puppet who did nothing to earn this (she was polling less than 1% before she quit last time around). So, it is not very hard to campaign on this, and actually it is completely true.

The crazy thing is that all this is done in a name of a candidate who has little to no chance of winning. She has a -12 approval rate, she doesn't speak that well, she cannot relate well with people, she was hidden from public for 3.5 years when VP, and she was the tsar of immigration policy, the weakest point of Democrats. It is as suicide as it was continuing with Biden. The only thing she has is that she is not demented, and won't lose the 'genocide Joe' few voters. But that won't be near enough.

'Trump is a threat to democracy, so let's throw the election' is batshit crazy.
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Bernie 1) was never getting elected, a large % of Americans think he's a communist 2) he's not a Democrat, he's an independent so the DNC have no control ovr hime
 
Red in STL said:
Bernie 1) was never getting elected, a large % of Americans think he's a communist 2) he's not a Democrat, he's an independent so the DNC have no control ovr hime
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Probably, but he was going to win the nomination if the party establishment did not coordinate all other candidates (coincidentally except Warren) to drop out and endorse Biden.

And 4 years earlier, he was basically winning states but not winning electoral votes cause all superdelegates were going for Clinton.

I do not particularly like Bernie’s policies, but he is a very rare case of a not corrupted (at least not strongly corrupted) politician, and someone who is actually genuine. I do not think the US (both parties) have had a serious candidate like that in my lifetime. And yes, he is a Democrat, he has caucused with them and voted with Democrat president/leader all the time.
 
DOTA said:
I'm quite new to this current iteration of Suedesi but my current feeling is it's a cut above the average WUM we get, who are generally either far too lazy and unoriginal, or just too thin skinned, to be of any more than the briefest source of amusement. He seems to be putting in a decent shift here. There's obvious attempts at humour. You can see a love of the craft.
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It's been a process, ramping up for a while.

It's ridicule, from a position of perceived superiority, not insincere beliefs, I think. Some exaggerations here and there, and hiding the ball. I don't know if you noticed that gfactor guy (country is finished!), he was just a straight up liar. That's not what's going on here.
 
Maticmaker said:
Ah, but is it a 'proposed coup'... or an 'actual coup'..... or a 'failed coup'.... or is it just being called a 'coup' to give the fecked up democrats a vestige of a 'fig leaf cover'..... coup? :lol:
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Democrats don't believe in fig leaves that's a GOP thing :rolleyes:
 
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oneniltothearsenal said:
It's a good thing Biden finally dropped out but it is really late and unfortunate that Democrat voters were deprived of a real primary where Kamala would have to win votes and earn the nomination. Voters deserve to have their nominee put through the hard process and have to answer questions. We all knew they would line up and coronation the establishment pick but it still feels a bit crap. Biden should never have tried to seek relection. Anyway it is what it is now I suppose.
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Would agree with this sentiment. Fortunately, she does seem to poll better than Trump? Maybe I recall incorrectly and we'll have to see more in the next months of course.
 
VorZakone said:
Would agree with this sentiment. Fortunately, she does seem to poll better than Trump? Maybe I recall incorrectly and we'll have to see more in the next months of course.
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Until that debate, she was polling worse than Biden. Now, she polls better than Biden, but still loses in polls against Trump.
 
From a British pov, surely Harris over Biden is a positive step? They've gone from no chance of winning and being humiliated to a wildcard that can easily press Trumps buttons.

He won't take well to a black woman debating him and he's going to struggle to insult her otherwise the racist card will be played. She might not be favourable now, but one good debate can change public opinion and she's got wealthy backers. I think she'll have his number personally.
 
Mb194dc said:
It only comes down to 500k-1m voters in 5-10 states. This election has never been a done deal for Trump.

Don't think Harris will do better than Biden in those states and polling supports that?. Newsom or some other might do though.

I don't get how the plan could be to put Harris in given that, must be someone else lined up.
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I agree that Harris may not be the best candidate. However, this situation isn't primarily about the candidate's quality. It's simply too late to prepare a proper campaign, given the messy situation the Democrats are in.

No serious candidate would try to enter the race at this point for that reason. And they would have to attack some of Biden's policies and it would make the infighting in the party worse. At least with Harris, there is hope that she could continue some of Biden's 'good' policies and motivate disheartened Democrats to come out and vote.
 
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