2020 US Elections | Biden certified as President | Dems control Congress

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fergieisold said:
They aren't mutually exclusive.

Look at the shit show now over stopping the counts, or continuing the counts. This could all be easily avoided but the system isn't good enough.
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You would need one hell of a system to prevent the same side declaring the counts to both stop and continue at the same time.
 
GlastonSpur said:
It's not so amazing, because paper votes are ultra reliable and leave a physical audit trail, whereas pretty much every e-system that has previously claimed to be secure has eventually been hacked. And even if it hasn't been hacked, there is no way of proving to public satisfaction that it hasn't.

You need complete confidence in the vote-counting process - and to be able to reliably recount if needed. Only a paper-trail system gives you that. Reliability and public confidence are far more important than speed.
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I don't disagree with any of that, but it doesn't appear that voting by mail is proving to public satisfaction that it hasn't been compromised in some way either, to the point of the Trump's own son circulating fake propaganda of ballots being burned. Postal votes are only ultra-reliable once delivered to a polling station too, and are rather volatile up until that point. I am sure Trump and his cult of voters will be bemoaning the postal vote and claiming some sort of fraud for years to come.

But even a hybrid of paper-trail and automation would make sense. I was reading a lot of these counts are manual and are not using optical scanners (and from the one time I did election duty in Scotland, it was manual counting). The margin for human error if counting manually would be higher than a machine, and you could feed it through the machine a couple of times to account for error in less time than it would take a group of people to do the same job.

Though I do think speed has become a bit more important after seeing the current circumstances of protesting and intimidation outside of where the counting is taking place.
 
The guy who teaches next door to me’s wife works with refugees for a living... helps them find a place to live, work, enrolls kids into school, etc. He’s basically told me due to Trump’s refugee policy her company has had to massively downsize and that based on the further cuts to refugees proposed by Trump, if he wins it’ll mean she’s out of a job.

I’m finding it hard to sleep due to being anxious about this result. I can’t imagine what they’re going through as this is dragged out.
 
America horrifies and fascinates me. But I have to go back to the real world now. I am pretty sure this election is decided now. Trump did really well, but Biden did amazing. Penn is going to Biden. Nevada, too. No way for Trump to win these, from the info at hand. That result means tipping point. Biden has beaten Trump as president. GA probably he might hold, doubtful. Arizona won't matter, will probably be a draw. We do have to wait for every vote to be counted. But Biden supporters can see the light at the end of the tunnel.
 
Brwned said:
So were they wrong then or wrong now? Or they just always right in some post-modern definition of truth?
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They were right from the off by the looks of it.
 
"And I would have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for you meddling Dems"
 
Just a matter of time now, the news just dragging it out since they've nothing to report.
 
OnlyTwoDaSilvas said:
I don't disagree with any of that, but it doesn't appear that voting by mail is proving to public satisfaction that it hasn't been compromised in some way either, to the point of the Trump's own son circulating fake propaganda of ballots being burned. Postal votes are only ultra-reliable once delivered to a polling station too, and are rather volatile up until that point. I am sure Trump and his cult of voters will be bemoaning the postal vote and claiming some sort of fraud for years to come.

But even a hybrid of paper-trail and automation would make sense. I was reading a lot of these counts are manual and are not using optical scanners (and from the one time I did election duty in Scotland, it was manual counting). The margin for human error if counting manually would be higher than a machine, and you could feed it through the machine a couple of times to account for error in less time than it would take a group of people to do the same job.

Though I do think speed has become a bit more important after seeing the current circumstances of protesting and intimidation outside of where the counting is taking place.
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That's only because Trump cultists will never accept that the election has been lost legitimately: there is no vote-delivery-and-counting-system that would ever satisfy them.
 
mariachi-19 said:
David Perdue*(R)2,432,91150.03%
Jon Ossoff(D)2,317,98047.66%

.3% is alllll we neeeeeddd

I reckon if this goes to run off in January, Dems will clean up and take control of the Senate.
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Can they even win the senate at this point? Maybe I'm not updated here (been at work), but last I heard it looked like the Dems would need to win BOTH Georgia-elections to even tie the senate (and control it through VP)? That doesn't seem very likely.
 
JJ12 said:
Bookies change with poll predictions - not sure what’s been so hard for people to work out here.
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I understand this obvious fact, but how many bookies were ‘Biden for the win’ at 700P EST two days ago (midnight GMT in the fourth - I think this is correct). Save for a u turn here, that’s who will be proven right at the beginning of reporting.
 
Carolina Red said:
The guy who teaches next door to me’s wife works with refugees for a living... helps them find a place to live, work, enrolls kids into school, etc. He’s basically told me due to Trump’s refugee policy her company has had to massively downsize and that based on the further cuts to refugees proposed by Trump, if he wins it’ll mean she’s out of a job.

I’m finding it hard to sleep due to being anxious about this result. I can’t imagine what they’re going through as this is dragged out.
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And then you have the refugees traversing Central America to be refused a hearing and getting a one-way ticket in handcuffs straight back to the people they're fleeing from. Plenty of stuff to keep you awake at the moment.
 
OnlyTwoDaSilvas said:
I don't disagree with any of that, but it doesn't appear that voting by mail is proving to public satisfaction that it hasn't been compromised in some way either, to the point of the Trump's own son circulating fake propaganda of ballots being burned. Postal votes are only ultra-reliable once delivered to a polling station too, and are rather volatile up until that point. I am sure Trump and his cult of voters will be bemoaning the postal vote and claiming some sort of fraud for years to come.

But even a hybrid of paper-trail and automation would make sense. I was reading a lot of these counts are manual and are not using optical scanners (and from the one time I did election duty in Scotland, it was manual counting). The margin for human error if counting manually would be higher than a machine, and you could feed it through the machine a couple of times to account for error in less time than it would take a group of people to do the same job.

Though I do think speed has become a bit more important after seeing the current circumstances of protesting and intimidation outside of where the counting is taking place.
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There’s literally only anecdotal evidence of any mail in voter fraud. It’s the gullible that are screaming into the wind about this. There’s no evidence of any credible shenanigans or errors that could be remotely applied to the process. I would posit that it has been a boon for voting increase across the board with no more substantial harm through fraud vs. any other voting process.
 
Penna said:
:lol: Yes, how dare you vote!
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Voting is just about forgivable but how dare they COUNT the votes!

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nimic said:
Can they even win the senate at this point? Maybe I'm not updated here (been at work), but last I heard it looked like the Dems would need to win BOTH Georgia-elections to even tie the senate (and control it through VP)? That doesn't seem very likely.
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Warnock will have a slight lead against Loeffler once the campaign begins. Ossoff / Purdue will be tight, but no reason a three point swing can’t occur either way. It could come down to who can tap into their side that hasn’t voted yet.
 
nimic said:
Can they even win the senate at this point? Maybe I'm not updated here (been at work), but last I heard it looked like the Dems would need to win BOTH Georgia-elections to even tie the senate (and control it through VP)? That doesn't seem very likely.
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I don’t even know how to read into the Senate vote there. Perdue is getting nearly identical number with Trump, but Ossoff is lagging behind Biden by about 100k votes. You’d have thought 3rd party voters who don’t vote for Biden would be more receptive to unseating the incumbent, but apparently not.

Still, a 2nd chance is a 2nd chance. And it’s a guarantee Dem voters and donors will again blow a feck ton of money on that race.
 
Carolina Red said:
The guy who teaches next door to me’s wife works with refugees for a living... helps them find a place to live, work, enrolls kids into school, etc. He’s basically told me due to Trump’s refugee policy her company has had to massively downsize and that based on the further cuts to refugees proposed by Trump, if he wins it’ll mean she’s out of a job.

I’m finding it hard to sleep due to being anxious about this result. I can’t imagine what they’re going through as this is dragged out.
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Was honestly expecting to get to the end of this and read “but they still voted for Trump”.
 
calodo2003 said:
I understand this obvious fact, but how many bookies were ‘Biden for the win’ at 700P EST two days ago (midnight GMT in the fourth - I think this is correct). Save for a u turn here, that’s who will be proven right at the beginning of reporting.
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They’d either all be ‘Biden for the win’ or none of them would’ve been. Due to the obvious fact noted.
 
Really is remarkable how predictable this situation was. Bernie pretty much did a play-by-play of the past two days on Jimmy Fallon a week before the election - including the specific states that would flip from Trump to Biden after election day.
 
JJ12 said:
They’d either all be ‘Biden for the win’ or none of them would’ve been. Due to the obvious fact noted.
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You said many were right from the off. Who was right from the off & what were they stating early on? Why would every bookmaker use the same exact odds? They obviously weren’t all for Biden at the start of the count?
 
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