2016 US Presidential Elections | Trump Wins

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Interesting interview of author Les Leopold on the rise of the deregulated financial markets, "financial strip-mining" the corporate culture of raising stock and the manipulation of stock prices by companies buying back their own shares.

http://www.salon.com/2016/03/06/its...ns_how_the_1_percent_killed_the_middle_class/

Stockholders would be indifferent between dividends and buybacks, except that there's a 30% tax on dividends for foreign investors in the US, and most hedge funds are in the Cayman Islands or similar. Want to be in on the goodies? Buy stocks. (Actually, if you don't know what you're doing, don't)

Also, wonder if wage and benefit differences had anything to do with GM's woes, and not just "a financial crunch"... from Wiki:

Gary Burtless of the Brookings Institution argued that hourly wages were similar between the Big Three and the transplants. "The basic hourly wage received by aUAW worker in a Big Three plant is close to that received by a Toyota or Honda worker in a U.S. plant. The UAW-negotiated wage was roughly $28 an hour in 2007. For new workers, the hourly wage was lower at $14 an hour; senior workers made more money. The major cost difference between UAW members and employees in foreign-nameplate factories in the U.S. comes in fringe benefits. The UAW has been one of the more successful American unions in fighting for generous pensions and health benefits for its members."[23]

Dan Ikenson of the Cato Institute argued that "total compensation is the cost of labor to the companies, and for GM it is about $73 per hour and for Toyota about $48. The average cost differential between the Big Three and all the foreign nameplate companies is about $30 per hour. That's huge." His computation includes all labor-related costs (e.g.., wages, healthcare, and pension—for both current workers and retirees.)[23]

Andrew Sorkin of the New York Times indicated that GM and Chrysler pay $10–20 more per hour than transplants; this was vigorously disputed by David Cole of the Center for Automotive Research.[24][25]

Average annual wages for production workers at the Big Three were $67,480 in 2007, and $81,940 for skilled workers. In Canada, GM’s 2008 average labor costs (including both wages and benefits) were $69 per hour, and Toyota's at $48 per hour, with similar productivity.[26]

According to the Heritage Foundation, the ratio of retirees to workers varies across the Big Three. For each active worker at GM, there were 3.8 retirees or dependents in 2006. At Chrysler, there were 2.0 and at Ford there were 1.6.[27] This means the legacy labor cost burden for GM is significantly greater than its competitors.[28]

Peter Morici, a professor at the University of Maryland, College Park’s school of business, testified that the extremely high labor and product development costs will keep the Big Three from developing the high quality vehicles needed to become profitable and surviving.[13][29][30]

The Asian-owned companies' U.S. employees are mainly non-unionized; the Big Three are bound by contracts with the UAW.

But if you prefer, just union on and complain about Wall Street.
 

This is a pure inequality metric, not a poverty one:

A new report by the United Nations Children's Fund, on the well-being of children in 35 developed nations, turned up some alarming statistics about child poverty. More than one in five American children fall below a relative poverty line, which UNICEF defines as living in a household that earns less than half of the national median. The United States ranks 34th of the 35 countries surveyed, above only Romania and below virtually all of Europe plus Canada, Australia, New Zealand and Japan.

By this metric some hypothetical desolate country but equally so might be great. We know the US is unequal and I'm not arguing against it, but this is dissimulation.
 
Stockholders would be indifferent between dividends and buybacks, except that there's a 30% tax on dividends for foreign investors in the US, and most hedge funds are in the Cayman Islands or similar. Want to be in on the goodies? Buy stocks. (Actually, if you don't know what you're doing, don't)

Also, wonder if wage and benefit differences had anything to do with GM's woes, and not just "a financial crunch"... from Wiki:



But if you prefer, just union on and complain about Wall Street.
The big three are responsible for only 3% of our economy and the pension issue was caused by them and not the unions.
 
This is a pure inequality metric, not a poverty one:



By this metric some hypothetical desolate country but equally so might be great. We know the US is unequal and I'm not arguing against it, but this is dissimulation.
$22 000 in US would be the same for someone who brings home $1000 in some country in Africa, everything is more expensive in US than in that country, that's the only way to compare countries.
 
$22 000 in US would be the same for someone who brings home $1000 in some country in Africa, everything is more expensive in US than in that country, that's the only way to compare countries.

So you actually think that kids born in the lower 25% in the US today are worse than the median kid born in Romania?
 
Can someone live in New York city with $22000 and not be just poor but very poor?

Why would someone even try? How does it relate to what I was saying before? There's PPP measurements to adjust GDP per Capita figures, and the US still scores pretty highly.
 
Stockholders would be indifferent between dividends and buybacks, except that there's a 30% tax on dividends for foreign investors in the US, and most hedge funds are in the Cayman Islands or similar. Want to be in on the goodies? Buy stocks. (Actually, if you don't know what you're doing, don't)

Also, wonder if wage and benefit differences had anything to do with GM's woes, and not just "a financial crunch"... from Wiki:



But if you prefer, just union on and complain about Wall Street.

Yes, and you can continue on with the adolescent Libertarian fantasies and wall street´s cock down your throat and pretend 2008 never happened, nor any crimes or conflicts of interest happened, no bubbles, no manipulation, no loss of so many´s people´s money and saving, no massive unemployment, nor rigged "free" markets and explain the virtues of the vampire high speed trading . . . but wait, who ever was talking about unioning on?



Who would you trust, this guy or Bernie Sanders?? We already know who you would choose.

 
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So you actually think that kids born in the lower 25% in the US today are worse than the median kid born in Romania?


Seems to me it's more indicative of the wealth gap. Poor Americans are living the life of riley compared to poor people in the likes of Romania. But if you can't afford a house and good food then it's all relative, isn't it?
 
i really love 'studies indicate that raising the minimum wage will harm small businesses BS' yeah. the entire economy will go down the tubes. I helped close books for small businesses some years back for a brief time and I can tell that even businesses that were coming out of bankruptcies were paying the owners and family members pretty well while paying minimum wage to workers. So lets dispense with this notion about small businesses being harmed by raising the minimum wage to $15.00. btw if that was the wage at MacDonalds, its hardly going to kill the business. So raise a penny on burgers. They would more than make up those wage increases.
 
Who would you trust, this guy or Bernie Sanders?? We already know who you would choose.

Goldman has bought me dinner a few times, so I gotta side with them :smirk:. Bernie just wants me to pay three median household incomes worth of taxes, instead of the current one and a half. He'll also smile and say its actually for my benefit when he does.
 
Goldman has bought me dinner a few times, so I gotta side with them :smirk:. Bernie just wants me to pay three median household incomes worth of taxes, instead of the current one and a half. He'll also smile and say its actually for my benefit when he does.

He says it will benefit an average middle class family . If you're paying more in tax than most people make in a year, im going to go ahead and say you're not in the middle class.
 
i really love 'studies indicate that raising the minimum wage will harm small businesses BS' yeah. the entire economy will go down the tubes. I helped close books for small businesses some years back for a brief time and I can tell that even businesses that were coming out of bankruptcies were paying the owners and family members pretty well while paying minimum wage to workers. So lets dispense with this notion about small businesses being harmed by raising the minimum wage to $15.00. btw if that was the wage at MacDonalds, its hardly going to kill the business. So raise a penny on burgers. They would more than make up those wage increases.

I guess we'll just have to do it and find out what happens... I'll bet a beer on it though. FWIW, I'll tell you what I found interesting from a meeting with the CFO of a large US franchise. He mentioned the franchisees were actually having trouble hiring, that there were signs of help wanted on the chain's stores all over.

Now this is a chain where franchisees probably pay min. wage or just above, so not the most interesting jobs in the world. But the franchisees are also very reluctant to pay above the rate, even in the face of high turnover. Corporate would recommend that they do so, but it can only recommend and not order in the existing structure. The franchisees are mostly owners of a few units, not very sophisticated. But its honestly their loss, in that environment I'd be the first to offer higher wages to offset turnover and improve customer experience in my stores. Their non-franchise competitor, that already pays more than min. wage, is probably licking their lips.

Overall from the corporate point of view at least in restaurant business the last 12 months or so has seen very thin supply on the labor side, with many chains, and especially the most successful ones, raising wages to keep turnover down.
 
i really love 'studies indicate that raising the minimum wage will harm small businesses BS' yeah. the entire economy will go down the tubes. I helped close books for small businesses some years back for a brief time and I can tell that even businesses that were coming out of bankruptcies were paying the owners and family members pretty well while paying minimum wage to workers. So lets dispense with this notion about small businesses being harmed by raising the minimum wage to $15.00. btw if that was the wage at MacDonalds, its hardly going to kill the business. So raise a penny on burgers. They would more than make up those wage increases.

Definitely. henry Ford made his products cheap and paid his workers enough that they could afford them. Who else is going to buy goods and services in this country?
 
Goldman has bought me dinner a few times, so I gotta side with them :smirk:. Bernie just wants me to pay three median household incomes worth of taxes, instead of the current one and a half. He'll also smile and say its actually for my benefit when he does.

I´m assuming if Bernie wants you to pay that much in taxes, you´re making a shit ton of money, and most likely are in reality paying a very low percentage in taxes. And aren´t you one of these recent bushy tailed immigrants who wants to make the libertarian dream come true in the US? How much have you actually paid into this country and its institutions and its infrastructure that´s made it such a great place to make a lot of money in? Wall Street did not build this country. Sounds like you just got here and are cashing in? Sounds ideal.
 
Definitely. henry Ford made his products cheap and paid his workers enough that they could afford them. Who else is going to buy goods and services in this country?

This was also the philosophy of Mitsubishi I believe. They manufacture almost everything. their own workers buy the same products. Everyone benefits. Just am example. But it can work.
 
I´m assuming if Bernie wants you to pay that much in taxes, you´re making a shit ton of money, and most likely are in reality paying a very low percentage in taxes. And aren´t you one of these recent bushy tailed immigrants who wants to make the libertarian dream come true in the US? How much have you actually paid into this country and its institutions and its infrastructure that´s made it such a great place to make a lot of money in? Wall Street did not build this country. Sounds like you just got here and are cashing in? Sounds ideal.

Never had any illusions about a 40% effective tax rate being the libertarian dream. Cross the 50% barrier and it become egregious.
 
Goldman has bought me dinner a few times, so I gotta side with them :smirk:. Bernie just wants me to pay three median household incomes worth of taxes, instead of the current one and a half. He'll also smile and say its actually for my benefit when he does.

When someone pays so much taxes I'm sure they can deduct a lot more than the middle class, they may own more than 1 house and they can go on vacation masked as a business trip, so yes they pay more because they made more but they deduct way more than a normal soul. I'm leaning to the right and always did which started in Portugal when I saw the left destroying the country but I believe in a fair world for people who work or wants to work, I'm not against rich people because we need them and they need us I just want all the loopholes closed and I don't care if they tax everybody the same rate because the country would get more money in taxes.

P.S. I bet you Goldman's dinner was added to his expenses.

Warren Buffett paid 17.4%
http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin...-class-pays-higher-tax-rates-millionaires-se/
 
When someone pays so much taxes I'm sure they can deduct a lot more than the middle class, they may own more than 1 house and they can go on vacation masked as a business trip, so yes they pay more because they made more but they deduct way more than a normal soul. I'm leaning to the right and always did which started in Portugal when I saw the left destroying the country but I believe in a fair world for people who work or wants to work, I'm not against rich people because we need them and they need us I just want all the loopholes closed and I don't care if they tax everybody the same rate because the country would get more money in taxes.

P.S. I bet you Goldman's dinner was added to his expenses.

Warren Buffett paid 17.4%
http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin...-class-pays-higher-tax-rates-millionaires-se/

:eek: I don't even own a house!

Joking aside, there's a reason why investment income is taxed lower, and it benefits the middle class too. The money they make working one year gets taxed 20-30%, if they intelligently choose to save some of that and invest it, do you want to tax the yield of that the 2nd go around at 20-30% again? Don't you think the tax rate on investment yield, which affects net return, influences their decision to save vs. spend? Most countries in the world have lower rates for investment income.

I'm not entirely against some level of inheritance tax though, just needs to have some thought put into it, since there are both economic and moral aspects. The answer for the tax system is not simply 'more from the 1%', the how matters greatly.

P.S. In a sense the US government was a 40% partner in everything GS or any other IB ever bought for me or their thousands of other clients on thousands of occasions, because its booked as a cost and comes out of their bottom line, therefore reduces their tax burden in $ terms. (Or maybe GS somehow runs a P&L loss, not bothered to check)
 
One sticking point makes his debate performance pathetic?

In Michigan and Ohio that one line would be enough to turn of hundreds of thousands of motors*. Remember "Osama is dead and GM is alive"? It was Obama's main campaign slogan in Ohio.
Having seen his answer it wasn't at all clear that he supported the auto bailout when it was separate from the wall street bailout. And by painting him as an opponent of auto workers, she can dent the blue collar support he really needs.

EDIT: *voters :lol:
 
In Michigan and Ohio that one line would be enough to turn of hundreds of thousands of motors*. Remember "Osama is dead and GM is alive"? It was Obama's main campaign slogan in Ohio.
Having seen his answer it wasn't at all clear that he supported the auto bailout when it was separate from the wall street bailout. And by painting him as an opponent of auto workers, she can dent the blue collar support he really needs.

EDIT: *voters :lol:

Never heard that one. Pithy one-liner, that.

I know it's a major point to Michigan, but I hardly think a two hour debate (or however long it went on) can be summarised as pathetic off the back of that alone.
 
:eek: I don't even own a house!

Joking aside, there's a reason why investment income is taxed lower, and it benefits the middle class too. The money they make working one year gets taxed 20-30%, if they intelligently choose to save some of that and invest it, do you want to tax the yield of that the 2nd go around at 20-30% again? Don't you think the tax rate on investment yield, which affects net return, influences their decision to save vs. spend? Most countries in the world have lower rates for investment income.

I'm not entirely against some level of inheritance tax though, just needs to have some thought put into it, since there are both economic and moral aspects. The answer for the tax system is not simply 'more from the 1%', the how matters greatly.

P.S. In a sense the US government was a 40% partner in everything GS or any other IB ever bought for me or their thousands of other clients on thousands of occasions, because its booked as a cost and comes out of their bottom line, therefore reduces their tax burden in $ terms. (Or maybe GS somehow runs a P&L loss, not bothered to check)

Thats a tax I'm against.
 
In Michigan and Ohio that one line would be enough to turn of hundreds of thousands of motors*. Remember "Osama is dead and GM is alive"? It was Obama's main campaign slogan in Ohio.
Having seen his answer it wasn't at all clear that he supported the auto bailout when it was separate from the wall street bailout. And by painting him as an opponent of auto workers, she can dent the blue collar support he really needs.

EDIT: *voters :lol:


Don't think it'll change the final result much though.
 
Potential numbers & scenarios -

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Don't think it'll change the final result much though.



It's the kind of thing that makes me doubt him as a candidate. Yes, your opponent will lie. But you can't let them get away!
 
Potential numbers & scenarios -
Yup, even winning 52% of the remaining is a tough ask, though if he's clearly ahead of 2nd place by the convention I don't think there's much they could do to stop him being nominated. Another Florida poll also out saying that Trump has an 8 point lead in voting intention but Rubio is banking an actual lead from early votes - if Trump has another poor period between now and the 15th, Rubio could still pull it off.
 
It's the kind of thing that makes me doubt him as a candidate. Yes, your opponent will lie. But you can't let them get away!

War has rules, mud wrestling has rules.
Politics has no rules.

That wasn't even a lie by Clinton, just half-truth. Imagine what will happen with him on the debate stage against the GOP nominee, who will repeatedly smear him while he helplessly keeps trying to pivot to his Wall Street stump speech. It's going to be a massacre.
 
War has rules, mud wrestling has rules.
Politics has no rules.

That wasn't even a lie by Clinton, just half-truth. Imagine what will happen with him on the debate stage against the GOP nominee, who will repeatedly smear him while he helplessly keeps trying to pivot to his Wall Street stump speech. It's going to be a massacre.

I have felt that he has got better with every appearance and in fact this debate she was the one looking desparate to pivot to Obama/Republicans, but this mistake is unforgivable.
I also think that it might be different with Trump in that it will be a lot more shout-y and Trump will be doing personal insults while Bernie repeats his stump lines, which should help him. Still, this is scary.
 
War has rules, mud wrestling has rules.
Politics has no rules.

That wasn't even a lie by Clinton, just half-truth. Imagine what will happen with him on the debate stage against the GOP nominee, who will repeatedly smear him while he helplessly keeps trying to pivot to his Wall Street stump speech. It's going to be a massacre.
Well, thankfully not :D
 
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