I feel you, you're right that a little positivity never hurts.
İlkay Gündoğan Transfer Thread
- Thread starter Devil may care
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) are here to discuss Amad saving our blushes in a win against Southampton as well as our now annual loss at home to Brighton. They discuss Amorim's post-match comments, revisit how mid-table we may or may not be, and discuss some transfer news.
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Think this depends on the Xavi situation - IF he was to leave Barcelona in the summer, I can see Gündogan leave for the Spanish giants, no doubt.
Many have a sneaky feeling that he won't renew his contract and therefore Dortmund are willing to sell. Udinese's Inler is a rumour at the moment.
Many have a sneaky feeling that he won't renew his contract and therefore Dortmund are willing to sell. Udinese's Inler is a rumour at the moment.
Xavi is signing for City's MLS team after the World Cup if you believe Sky Italia. Barcelona are looking at Vidal or Gundogan as replacements.
Rumor is he is going to New York Red Bulls, the team City owns is NYC FC.
This theory rarely works on me. If we returned to the top of the game, and developed a few top class players, it will be fecking easier for us to attract good players, not more difficult! This whole 'why would Thiago want to go to Bayern where they have Martinez, Bastian, Kroos, Goezte instead of United where they only have Carrick, Cleverley, Anderson a 40 year old Giggs and a CB Jones?'. The answer is sort of in the question! If Real got rid of all of their top players and replaced them with average ones, they would be less appealing, not more so.
Also, someone has to actually play there (Madrid). They can't all be substitutes, and there is no reason Gundogan cannot be a regular midfielder there, seeing as in all likelihood, at least one person has to be.
If he ends up at Madrid that means one quality player will likely be playing on the bench more than they want to out of Modric or Khedira. Both would be welcome additions for me.
I am correct in saying they aren't entirely sure what is wrong with his back?
I am correct in saying they aren't entirely sure what is wrong with his back?
More about football? Football is also about trophies and he'd be giving up Champions League football for at least a season (as I don't think we're going to make top 4 this year) as well as probably surrendering any chance of winning the league in a not so distant future. It's hard to argue that we are better equipped than Madrid to have a go at league title or Champions League in the near future.
He could also go to Everton and be one of the best players in their history. That's not more appealing than playing for Real Madrid either. As things stand there's little reason for players to pick United ahead of Madrid - less respected manager, weaker team, less chances of winning trophies and very likely no CL football for at least a season. Dortmund are actually a better team than us right now, of that I have little doubt.
Modric has been one of their best players this season, hasn't he? Khedira isn't all that to be honest, I wouldn't mind him here for a simple reason that he's better than nearly all midfielders that we have but he's far from spectacular.
Khedira would be a great signing for us. May not be the world's best, but he's got an incredible amount of experience at a great age and would massively improve our midfield.
Interestingly I had a dream last night in which I was at Old Trafford (which incidentally to it's pre-1980s lay-out, complete with grassed bank for the Stretfrod end) and Roy Keane was playing, accompanied everywhere he went by his loyal German Shepherd dog called Khedira. It's a sign I tell ya.
Interestingly I had a dream last night in which I was at Old Trafford (which incidentally to it's pre-1980s lay-out, complete with grassed bank for the Stretfrod end) and Roy Keane was playing, accompanied everywhere he went by his loyal German Shepherd dog called Khedira. It's a sign I tell ya.
Xavi's Heir is Fabregas - Exactly why he did not join us this season.
They will more than likely fill the bench with Rafinha (Thiago's younger brother) or buy a younger spanish prospect (Oli Torres).
Gundogan could well be an option, but It is not really Barcelona's style. They prefer to promote within where possible.
He has and alongside Isco, Alonso, Khedira and Illaramendi they really don't need Gundogan at all. I think Khedira is a tad underrated. He isn't world class but he is a good player. He is a good box to box player. My main gripe would be that he isn't clinical enough with his chances, but at least he is getting in there. He always seem to show more of his abilities for Germany. He is asked to play a certain role for Real which limits him in my opinion.
Seeing as Xavi is now gonna be leaving Barca I reckon that will see Gundogan plump for a move there. Shame really bloody ideal player for our midfield but it was essentially always a bit of a pipe dream signing this fellow.
F U Barca
F U Barca
United, probably. Bigger club, more recent success, better platform to succeed in the future. If we don't win anything over the next 2-3 season I'm pretty sure our board will take care of that properly and we'll always aim to win trophies - it just might not happen in the very near future but over time it'll be taken care of.
Liverpool have been a better team this season but it's the first time in ages that it happens. It will go back to normal if we pull ourselves together or if Suarez departs. I wouldn't blame a player who picked Liverpool though as Rodgers has been doing a fine job there and it's always tempting to join a side on the rise - with United it's difficult to tell when we're going to get going again.
Assuming the offers were the same, I'd assume most would opt for United, a lot of football players don't get what happened in the 70s and 80s,over the last 20 years, we have been the team and I think that is the sole reason there, plenty of clubs have had a bad season or two, it doesn't ruin your stock, never winning the PL compared to a team that has won it for fun?
To be honest it may depend a little on your position.
A quality midfielder should be aware that he has a rare chance to walk into the United team and be the man who pushes us back up to the top. Whereas a goalie may favour Liverpool.
I think the vast majority would pick United.
Put siply, United may be in a rough patch - but the club has the resources to spend a lot of money to redress the balance and get back competing at the very top. That isnt the case at all clubs, and not Liverpool - or so it seems.
Also, on the whole, we can probably still pay a bit more.
And you wouldn't have to put up with the scouse accent as much.
And you wouldn't have to put up with the scouse accent as much.
This is why I am never in the positivity camp.
Ok guys, you've beaten me down, there's no way he'll come here if Real Madrid want him. so this one's a dud, to the....whoever else is left thread!Inler hasn't been at Udinese for awhile and is pretty settled at Napoli. Plus, he'll be 30 in June. Who was he linked to? If it were Dortmund, would be very curious to see how much more Klopp could get out of him. I have long felt he's got an even bigger game in his locker.
I really doubt we will sign him. It will be like fabregas all over again.
Madrid and Barca aren't going to sign everybody, but they might sign a midfielder each - and they'll probably lose at least one midfielder each. There will be more than two midfielders change clubs this year and United are neither so poor, nor so unattractive that they can't buy one.
But not to be in the list of clubs available to a player like Gundogan? That would be shameful. Admitting defeat before the scrap's even started. Madrid don't always get their man, nor do Barca - but they wouldn't buy any top player either, if they didn't go through the process of courting the player, sounding out the agents, making the bids.
But not to be in the list of clubs available to a player like Gundogan? That would be shameful. Admitting defeat before the scrap's even started. Madrid don't always get their man, nor do Barca - but they wouldn't buy any top player either, if they didn't go through the process of courting the player, sounding out the agents, making the bids.
We will definitely be interested, but I dont think we stand a chance if barca or real are interested.
Going to United trying to fill the void left by the Ginger Prince is the biggest role for any midfielder to fill... So go all in and get this fecker asap..
Let's say we're competing with Madrid for Gundogan. Obviously most people would say Madrid are comfortably the more attractive club. What can we actually do to convince a player like Gundogan to come here instead? Do we have the financial muscle to pay more than Madrid if we really wanted to? What do we actually have to offer that Madrid don't in that scenario?
Sweet-talking is the way forward. Project an image of him being a United legend, a first teamer for the next decade etc. It's a hit and hope sort of situation.
Forget Madrid - lets talk about City or Chelsea - simply put going forward we need to adapt to the changing times by paying the selling club more and also offer better compensation. History counts for some but, not as much. There are so many clubs now with ambitious projects in pretty much every league, that we need to change with the times. It used to be that if we wanted a given player just a few years ago, at best we'd have 1 club we are really competing against. Now, for every target we are competing against probably 4 or 5, all of which can match us in ambition - most are beating us with the willingness to spend and not dilly dally to try and get the best possible deal.
If we really wanted Baines in years gone by - don't think Everton could have held on to him but, even a club like Everton now are able to withstand our offers.
For us to compete against Madrid et all - it comes down to a real desire to secure the player. Pay the club what they want and really let the player know they are wanted.
In a Glazer-less world, absolutely.
It would be amazing if we could get him but as many on here I doubt that we can outbid Real. But maybe he relishes the challenge of playing in the PL especially after quite a few of his national teammates have moved to English clubs over the last couple of years.
He definitely won't move until Summer and at that point Barcelona will likely be looking for a midfielder as Xavi cannot carry on much longer and he's been rumoured to be departing to MLS anyway. You'll also have teams like Chelsea or City who might use a midfielder and have the financial power to attract a player like Gundogan. Madrid have also been linked and with Alonso coming to the end of his career there's a good chance that Gundogan could replace him.
All these teams will be willing to put £150k+ per week offer on the table. All will be able to offer Dortmund £35m+. All will offer Champions League football and will compete for trophies in the following couple of years. I don't want to spoil the party but we, most likely, won't be in the Champions League, won't offer him the same wages and won't offer Dortmund the same fee.
A year ago we'd have been among favourites IMO. Now there isn't even a slightest part of me that thinks we could get him.
All these teams will be willing to put £150k+ per week offer on the table. All will be able to offer Dortmund £35m+. All will offer Champions League football and will compete for trophies in the following couple of years. I don't want to spoil the party but we, most likely, won't be in the Champions League, won't offer him the same wages and won't offer Dortmund the same fee.
A year ago we'd have been among favourites IMO. Now there isn't even a slightest part of me that thinks we could get him.
Are you serious Rossa, we are a club who has had unparalleled success in the premier league era. We could well finish above Liverpool this year it will be tight. But a 6 month blip over 20 odd year! Really! The only 2 teams we'd struggle to compete with are the cash clubs City and Chelsea as for some players cash is king and I can accept it as we were once like that!
Ah, you're right of course.
Saw him linked with Dortmund in the German press, that's all.
Meanwhile, Dortmund have signed former Sunderland player Dong-Won Ji - he'll play for Augsburg until the summer and will join BVB in July.
Perhaps Benitez is planning to reorganize his midfield and Inler would be shopped. Would love to see him on a team like Dortmund, tbh
Meanwhile, Xavi (About to turn 34 y.o.) hit 700 appearances for Barcelona in their win over Getafe last night, a record he continues to own for the club since 2011 and will likely surpass Raul's 741 for the capital club next season.
Gündoğan would be a great addition to the squad if Xavi will indeed move on or see less playing time but I'd still be a bit cautious about his back injury - these are often chronic issues
If Madrid get him, does that mean Modric will be available?
I would, of course, choose United for many reasons, also the reasons you mention above. Liverpool are, however, playing more attractive football at the moment; they still have the history and label as a big club, and they are progressing under Rodgers. It will be interesting to see what kind of players Moyes manages to attract. I doubt Liverpool would be able to sign the biggest stars yet as there is great uncertainty about the quality of the squad, especially if Suarez leaves. Thing is, I have no idea what a player considers before signing for a club; why would Moura rather sign for PSG for instance? Why would Thiago turn down playing every week for United for playing sporadically for Bayern...
Moura was probably a financial question, though I'm sure PSG (not unreasonably) would be able to convince him he was joining a top club, that were intending to be a very top club. They'd already signed Thiago Silva and Zlatan that summer, their manager was Ancelotti. All good omens for an ambitious young player.
Thiago, since he recovered from injury, has been playing every week. He may not be an automatic choice for their strongest first XI, but he'll believe that he can be. Self belief is an essential for top players. Plus, there's a question about whether we even tried to make him a priority. Did he want to hear words of appreciation from the manager? Did he want a guarantee of games, or a release clause if he didn't get them, in his contract? In other words did we actually try or did we just say, "We're Man United, we might consider hiring you at the right price - if our manager gets the right background checks done on how hard you work in training."
I think our squad depth in CM is massively overrated. We lost Tymoshchuk on a free, sold Gustavo and let Can and Kirchhoff go on loan/sold with buyback clause. We play with 3 CMs and have 4 players (Schweinsteiger, Martinez, Kroos and Thiago) for those 3 positions with a few others who could help out, if necessary. We actually need another CM (looks like we signed Rode for next season already) to have more cover. Even with everyone fit, Thiago will play 80% of the games, he was just unlucky that he got injured early in the season and was out for a few months.
The same could be the case at Madrid, depending on Ancelotti's ideas for the team. Right now I'd say Isco is the more likely one to be dropped for the big games with 3 quality CMs playing, so if Gündogan finds his best form at Madrid, he won't have much problems to see more than enough playing time.
Didn't Lahm play there occasionally? And if needed you could also play Alaba there, he has had some fine performances in CM for the national team.
Yeah, but our back up fullbacks are hardly worldclass? Like I said, we have quite a few versatile players who can fill in (Götze and Shaqiri can play one of the more attacking CM positions as well), but it usually means we open up gaps in other positions. I just responded to the suggestion that Thiago will only play sporadically in our team, which simply isn't true, certainly not with our constant injury problems, but even with everyone fit it wouldn't be a problem.
I actually have no idea who your back up fullbacks are, probably says all about their quality
And yes, I see your point, it's still hard to accept what kind of options you guys have in CM - Status