Álvaro Morata | Chelsea player

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WPMUFC said:


twitter user claiming Morata has removed Real Madrid from his social media accounts, claimed it was there 2 days ago.
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Meh, when we know he is coming its hard to worry about this kind of thing. This isnt a ' is Pogba wearing red socks???' type of transfer
 
Carl said:
Surprised his numbers at juve were so poor. Was under the impression he was excellent that season, hence all the interest in him last summer.
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He was excellent. He played an important role in them getting to the CL final. Don't get too hung up on numbers.
 
AXVnee7 said:
Will do.

But as for those strikers, it doesn't look like they are gettable. Lukaku reportedly wants Chelsea, and even then I question his ability. Kane and Mbappe on the other hand I have less doubt about. However Kane is nigh impossible to get and Mbappe very expensive. Signing either of the latter two would mean we'd grossly deplete our budget. We need quality in several positions so dropping £120m+ is not ideal. Levy would demand even in excess of that for Kane, and the player himself is not one to push a move through so it's just not likely. Morata is one of the better options available to us right now. Mbappe looks like he is staying, and that's probably best as he could be a one season wonder, however unlikely that is.
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The same risk applies with morata as well, despite his age, he has had only one good season as a goal scorer similar to mbappe.
 
Ban said:
Yeah but it means you can't back your argument.

Who should we sign for more money?

You say you're not a scout. And then you proceed with Bailly comparison. So we should sign a lesser knows and better player for more or less money.

Overpaying. By your accounts how much we should pay for Morata?
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My argument that morata has only one good season and paying 60m+ for someone of his profile is overpaying significantly? I can and have backed the former up and the latter we will only find out with time.

I really dont get what you are trying to say here, a fee similar to bailly or sane or jesus would be appropriate for me. The fee you pay for someone who is young and has potential.
 
MJJ said:
Going by the last two seasons and whoscored.

Madrid- Minutes Played-1501. Goals=18
Juventus- Minutes Played-1990 Goals=9

You call that same?

Edit-season before that.

Minuted Played- 2065 Goals- 13

If anything, this season was the anomaly.
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Ok they weren't same but that's still a healthy rate?

16/17 -83
15/16 -221
14/15 - 158
13/14 - 83

A goal every 180 minutes is effectively a goal every 2 games. So he has been better than that in 3 of the last 4 seasons. Plus it would probably improve with age
 
MJJ said:
My argument that morata has only one good season and paying 60m+ for someone of his profile is overpaying significantly? I can and have backed the former up and the latter we will only find out with time.

I really dont get what you are trying to say here, a fee similar to bailly or sane or jesus would be appropriate for me. The fee you pay for someone who is young and has potential.
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So Morata is old and doesn't have potential?

Why compare him to Bailly and Jesus and their prices. Different players different circumstances.

I'm trying to say you're on about other players we should sign but don't come up with any names. And first you said you'd be happy with a better player for more money then that we should pay the same price as for sane and jesus for an unknown but better player.
 
MJJ said:
Not really, I would be happy to either sign someone better for a higher fee or someone better for an equivalent fee. I never mention signing someone better for a less.

I like morata as a player and am hopeful that he can do well here as his style of play does fit our team but we are vastly overpaying for him and there is a significant risk attached with the signing. I am pretty sure if that had happened we all would have laughed at liverpool.

As for naming players who might be available, last year if you had asked me for a centre back target I would not have been able to name bailly as I am not a scout. But instead of paying 45/60m for stones, we signed a lesser known and better player in Bailly. Me not being able to name a player doesnt mean that there arent good players available.
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Transfer fees are, and always have been, a dumb thing to fixate on without context.

Would be have laughed at Liverpool paying £60m for VVD? Maybe but it would mostly depend on how he played, if he had joined them and been a success we'd not be laughing. Same as paying £30m for Rio Ferdinando 15 years ago looked like a bargain when he came to leave.

City paid £50m for Stone which looks hilarious because he's shit. Liverpool paid £35m for Carroll which was again funny because he was garbage.

The only question that matters is will Morata be good for us? I think he will so don't give a feck what he costs and I'm aware enough to see that transfer fees have become so crazy that it's pretty much meaningless.

As for your last paragraph, you've just said yourself that the club pulled off a great signing we knew nothing about last summer, so if the club now thinks the best move we can make is for Morata then that's a pretty good sign there's nothing better available.
 
GJNJ said:
Mourinho likes strikers to have a number 9 shirt, show when he gave Ibra the 9 shirt last year taking it off Martial.
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Are you sure you aren't thinking about LVG here ? I remember he liked his strikers to have a 9 in there numbers, like Rashford 39 and Wilson 19.
 
AndyJ1985 said:
He was excellent. He played an important role in them getting to the CL final. Don't get too hung up on numbers.
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I'm not a stats man tbh, apart from when we're talking about goals and signing a goalscorer.

I watch nowhere near as much football as I used to, so maybe he has lots of other qualities that he'll bring (hold up wise).
 
SachinJ22 said:
Good. Anything more that €70m means we would have got fleeced. And the people who are arguing if he is good enough or not, we can only judge him after a season or two. If he fails to play well the fans will get on his case. I would have still preferred Aubameyang for the same amount or Kane but I'm not Jose or Woodward.
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We could offer Levy 140m for Kane and I am not sure he would take it. Aubameyang is undoubtedly a good striker, but Morata fits the profile of what Mourinho looks for in his 9's more comprehensively.

This transfer looks on, I'm happy
 
So around £61M... I guess it could be worse in this crazy market. He's also not bad looking so should make some of our sponsors happy, even better for them if he's got some kind of personality. For the important thing, he better make sure he knows he needs to put the ball in the back of the net, don't want him joining the rest of our lads missing chances left, right and centre!
 
prath92 said:
Ok they weren't same but that's still a healthy rate?

16/17 -83
15/16 -221
14/15 - 158
13/14 - 83

A goal every 180 minutes is effectively a goal every 2 games. So he has been better than that in 3 of the last 4 seasons. Plus it would probably improve with age
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His scoring rate at juventus drops even further when he plays as a striker, I do agree that his scoring rate should improve with age but if what you posted above is true, than he has a significantly higher scoring rate at madrid compared to juventus.
 
9 goals in 20 international games is very impressive, I wonder who he scored against? Have always been a fan at club level but know little about his international career. Did he get 3 goals in 4 games at Euro 2016? don't remember that. Not bad for a "bench warmer"
 
MJJ said:
His scoring rate at juventus drops even further when he plays as a striker, I do agree that his scoring rate should improve with age but if what you posted above is true, than he has a significantly higher scoring rate at madrid compared to juventus.
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His mins per goals + assists is very good in every season.
 
Ban said:
So Morata is old and doesn't have potential?

Why compare him to Bailly and Jesus and their prices. Different players different circumstances.

I'm trying to say you're on about other players we should sign but don't come up with any names. And first you said you'd be happy with a better player for more money then that we should pay the same price as for sane and jesus for an unknown but better player.
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Please stop putting words in my mouth. Where have I said that?

Not really, I proposed two scenarios.

  • If we are paying a fee close to our transfer record, get someone who is close to his peak and is as much of a guarantee as you can get so he warrants the price.
  • If we are paying for potential, which is the case for morata, then the fee should be the same for players of similar talents.
 
MJJ said:
Please stop putting words in my mouth. Where have I said that?

Not really, I proposed two scenarios.

  • If we are paying a fee close to our transfer record, get someone who is close to his peak and is as much of a guarantee as you can get so he warrants the price.
  • If we are paying for potential, which is the case for morata, then the fee should be the same for players of similar talents.
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We should pay the same as for a defender, Bailly?
Ok.
 
Rado_N said:
Transfer fees are, and always have been, a dumb thing to fixate on without context.

Would be have laughed at Liverpool paying £60m for VVD? Maybe but it would mostly depend on how he played, if he had joined them and been a success we'd not be laughing. Same as paying £30m for Rio Ferdinando 15 years ago looked like a bargain when he came to leave.

City paid £50m for Stone which looks hilarious because he's shit. Liverpool paid £35m for Carroll which was again funny because he was garbage.

The only question that matters is will Morata be good for us? I think he will so don't give a feck what he costs and I'm aware enough to see that transfer fees have become so crazy that it's pretty much meaningless.

As for your last paragraph, you've just said yourself that the club pulled off a great signing we knew nothing about last summer, so if the club now thinks the best move we can make is for Morata then that's a pretty good sign there's nothing better available.
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I hope that is true and we finally sort out our striker issue with him.
 
MJJ said:
The same risk applies with morata as well, despite his age, he has had only one good season as a goal scorer similar to mbappe.
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Yes, but he here he will have a full season playing upfront in his favoured position. Something he hasn't had before. As for the risk, well Mbappe would cost £120-140m, and his stock would plummet drastically if he flops. Signing Morata for £60m is less of a risk financially.

If I had the choice I would go with Mbappe. But again he is likely not gettable this season. He looks RM bound.
 
Tiber said:
9 goals in 20 international games is very impressive, I wonder who he scored against? Have always been a fan at club level but know little about his international career. Did he get 3 goals in 4 games at Euro 2016? don't remember that. Not bad for a "bench warmer"
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1 v Ukraine, the only goal in a 1-0 win (Euro 2016 qualifiers)
2 v South Korea, scored the 4th and 6th goals in a 6-1 win (friendly)
2 v Turkey, scored the 1st and 3rd goal in a 3-0 win (Euro 2016 groups)
1 v Croatia, scored the opening goal in a 2-1 loss with Perisic scoring a late winner (Euro 2016 groups)
2 v Liechtenstein, scored the 6th and 7th in a 8-0 win (World Cup 2018 qualifiers)
1 v Colombia, scored a late equaliser to draw the game 2-2 (friendly)
 
MJJ said:
Look if you want to blindly defend a player and take posts out of context, please be my guest. Just stop quoting me, as for the above :wenger: are sane and jesus defenders?
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MJJ said:
I really dont get what you are trying to say here, a fee similar to bailly or sane or jesus would be appropriate for me. The fee you pay for someone who is young and has potential.
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It seems you don't. Comparing fees for defenders, strikers and wingers is a bit strange.
 
Raw said:
1 v Ukraine, the only goal in a 1-0 win (Euro 2016 qualifiers)
2 v South Korea, scored the 4th and 6th goals in a 6-1 win (friendly)
2 v Turkey, scored the 1st and 3rd goal in a 3-0 win (Euro 2016 groups)
1 v Croatia, scored the opening goal in a 2-1 loss with Perisic scoring a late winner (Euro 2016 groups)
2 v Liechtenstein, scored the 6th and 7th in a 8-0 win (World Cup 2018 qualifiers)
1 v Colombia, scored a late equaliser to draw the game 2-2 (friendly)
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Thanks!

Interesting/strange that an 'overrated bench warmer' manages to play and score for Spain
 
AndyJ1985 said:
He was excellent. He played an important role in them getting to the CL final. Don't get too hung up on numbers.
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Looking at his stats, he was never a first team regular with Juventus. Made more sub appearances than starts both seasons in Seria A and when Champions League is factored it the number of games he started to sub appearances is close to even. Seems to have been favoured in the Champions League but not first choice in the league.

14/15 Seria A- 11 starts - 18 sub appearances
14/15 CL - 9 starts - 3 sub appearances

Overall 42 appearances being 20 starts and 22 sub appearances

Second season - season after he scored in CL semi final and Final

15/16 Seria A - 16 starts - 18 sub appearances
15/16 CL - 6 starts - 2 sub appearances

Overall 42 appearances - 22 starts - 20 sub appearances
 
Is this 100% done? Anyone know if he was Mourinho's no 1 preference? If he was, then I have no qualms as fully trust Mourinho's judgement.

The issue comes if he was no 2 or 3 preference.
 
sammsky1 said:
Is this 100% done? Anyone know if he was Mourinho's no 1 preference? If he was, then I have no qualms as fully trust Mourinho's judgement.

The issue comes if he was no 2 or 3 preference.
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I guess we won't know that. Only name which was mentioned was Mbappe and I don't think we were ever in for him.
 
jymufc20 said:
Are you sure you aren't thinking about LVG here ? I remember he liked his strikers to have a 9 in there numbers, like Rashford 39 and Wilson 19.
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Na, i'm aware of lvg and his thoughts on No.9 shirts

I just assumed because they took a number off player to give to another player without either player being aware of it it must have been the managers choice.

Mourinho does talk about positions in terms of numbers but the he doesn't strike me as someone who cares what numbers players have.
 
WPMUFC said:


when Morata and Pogba last played together.
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Some of his finishing is really good. It's been a while since we've had a striker that would score that type of goal, on his weaker foot too (?).

This is what convinces me that there is still a lot more to come from him and the numbers in terms of goals will follow. Tap into that potential and I could see him becoming one of the best strikers around.
 
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