2024 U.S. Elections | Trump v Harris

Trump is still an awful debater, just as i remember, can't answer a question, no substance all lies, the usual.

Biden was worse than i thought he ever could be though, sadly, keep him far away from a september debate and hope for the best.
 
Dudu said:
Where the feck was this guy? He would have likely won.
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Someone posted the lead-up to that bit. So...he started off exactly like his debate, incoherent, and only revved up near the end.



Basically it looks like he's usually off sometimes on, and it's random. I think he gets fired up attacking Trump, and that's it.
 
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Insanity said:
Trump is a shitbag but there is too much fear mongering going on in this thread. US is not going to become an Ethno-Fascist Christian state. The system still has checks and balances, they'll hold. It's going to be a shit show but a lot of it will also be bluster.
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I don't know. It held up in 2020 because people (Republicans among them no less!) did their jobs. It is to my understanding that a lot of lojalists have been installed in various positions at local level that could do a lot of shenanigans.
 
I think they’ll replace him. Everyone wants to do so but the damage has been already done
 


A related question is why Sotomayor isn't retiring right now.

People who consider themselves party loyalists should ask themselves what the party is, who it serves, etc. In my opinion, it has some moments of cohesion, and a lot of moments like this, which really reveal its priorities!
 
Insanity said:
Trump is a shitbag but there is too much fear mongering going on in this thread. US is not going to become an Ethno-Fascist Christian state. The system still has checks and balances, they'll hold. It's going to be a shit show but a lot of it will also be bluster.
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In large part, maybe, but to take one example from his presidency, there were thousands of migrant children taken from their parents and held in cages. There are still 1,400 kids who have not been reunited with their parents. https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2024/05/07/immigration-family-separation/

So for most of us that was just an ugly episode, but for literally thousands of people it was among the worst nightmares imaginable. I fear it will be the same but 1,000 instances. Marginalized communities will take a beating, immigrants and refugees will take a beating, thousands of women will die because they were not able to get abortions, thousands more will be born as the children of rape/incest, environmental protections will be gutted which will rush us towards a global warming apocalypse, Putin will be emboldened because Trump will be too busy resting Putin's balls on his chin to do anything, and so on.

We probably won't get to the death camps phase, but Project 2025 does call for something not entirely dissimilar.
 
Rado_N said:
I’m not even watching the video, but those comments will now feature in a bajillion GOP/PAC tv commercials.

How could anyone think saying these things is a good idea.
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Saying what things? Admitting he is old? It is exactly what he needs to do now. And move on and start campaigning on the dangers of letting a felon fraud his way into the White House again.
 
Hamnat said:
Saying what things? Admitting he is old? It is exactly what he needs to do now. And move on and start campaigning on the dangers of letting a felon fraud his way into the White House again.
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“Biden himself admits he’s not capable of being President”.

You think nuance and context will come into it at all with the people being fed commercials between segments on Fox News?
 
Rado_N said:
“Biden himself admits he’s not capable of being President”.

You think nuance and context will come into it at all with the people being fed commercials between segments on Fox News?
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Where are you getting this from? I realize you said you didn't actually watch the video of what he was saying... He is literally at a rally now. Are you suggesting he said 'he is not capable of being President?'
 
Hamnat said:
Where are you getting this from? I realize you said you didn't actually watch the video of what he was saying... He is literally at a rally now. Are you suggesting he said 'he is not capable of being President?'
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Read the quotes in the tweet.
 
"When you get knocked down, you get back up"

Like to think his team call this the Chumbawamba doctrine.
 
This feels like such a watershed moment. This is a campaign defining moment, and who knows what is going to happen in a second Trump term?
 
berbatrick said:


A related question is why Sotomayor isn't retiring right now.

People who consider themselves party loyalists should ask themselves what the party is, who it serves, etc. In my opinion, it has some moments of cohesion, and a lot of moments like this, which really reveal its priorities!
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Oh Jesus, she's 70! You got a serious point. After they managed to move on Breyer, they should really take this last chance.
 
The stuff from a few weeks ago when the videos of Biden freezing and zoning out should have been a real wake up call but lots of people (including in this thread) used the excuse that the videos were AI and edited. Had you gone on YouTube and seen the full raw footage, you would realised there were major issues and Biden was in fact freezing. We put our head in the sand and tried to pretend here were no issues and now the worst case scenario is unfolding in front of our eyes.
 
Rado_N said:
Biden seeking a second term is unequivocally not fighting for ordinary folks, it’s a selfish drive from a senile old man who’s more concerned with wanting to stay in power than what is best for the country.
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It is, but what is Obama going to say if they're not ousting Biden? :p Gotta back the old dog 100% if you can't move him on.
 
Rado_N said:
Doesn’t mean we have to drink the kool aid.
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Of course not, as long as people vote for him I don't give a shit what they think about Biden or anyone else. Just keep the mango-Mussolini away.
 
After 2028. Could trump be made speaker of the house and a possible R puppet potus and VP resign and trump be president again?
 
SirAF said:
Of course not, as long as people vote for him I don't give a shit what they think about Biden or anyone else. Just keep the mango-Mussolini away.
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This is the crux of it though, isn't it? The (reasonable) concern is that people aren’t gonna go vote for him.
 
Rado_N said:
This is the crux of it though, isn't it? The (reasonable) concern is that people aren’t gonna go vote for him.
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It is. But people need to think very carefully about this if they do not want to vote "only" because he's declining. We all know what's at stake here, I don't need to make a long list.

If people had just held their nose in 2016 Trump would have been gone from politics and Biden would still be enjoing ice cream in his retirement. SCOTUS wouldn't have looked bad either. Americans shouldn't make the same mistake they did back then.
 
Panic mode post incoming:

You can't help but feel that this debate will be studied as a defining moment of history, the marker for how Democrats - in their hubris, their fear, their delusion - failed to offer the Americans even the most basic and viable alternative to Trump, and paved the way for the rapid erosion of American democracy, with ripples felt in geo-politics all across the world for generations to come as a consequence.

Biden is going senile - he's been exposed brutally with the whole world watching on a stage of his own making. It is now an objective truth that people are seeing with their own eyes, and anyone still denying it the way they have been in the previous few months is clearly still living in delusion or lying. He's lost his mental faculties. He cannot process whole thoughts, he cannot articulate, he cannot finish his sentences. Trump is a vile vile candidate, and I suppose a significant part of the population, people who think like me, will still strongly vote Biden in order to keep Trump away. But this part of the population would have voted for a cabbage over Trump. It is the slim margins in the swing states that need to be swayed - and this display of senility has just turned most of them away.

Biden is not stepping down, and the people who enabled him so far will not have the courage to force him to do so. It will be Biden v Trump, and after this debate I don't see how Trump doesn't win. Folks at Project 2025 must have had a rave last night, with Clarence Thomas as their chief guest.
 
SirAF said:
It is. But people need to think very carefully about this if they do not want to vote "only" because he's declining. We all know what's at stake here, I don't need to make a long list.

If people had just held their nose in 2016 Trump would have been gone from politics and Biden would still be enjoing ice cream in his retirement. SCOTUS wouldn't have looked bad either. Americans shouldn't make the same mistake they did back then.
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This is where reality needs to come into play, and the bold should be DEMOCRATS shouldn’t make the same mistake.

The American people aren’t going to go and vote for Biden when they don’t like him and aren’t enthused by the prospect of him staying on as POTUS.

People generally don’t get motivated to vote against a worse prospect, they stay home.

Instead of hoping for a major change in reality the party and Biden himself need to adapt and work within the reality they are faced with.
 
Rado_N said:
This is where reality needs to come into play, and the bold should be DEMOCRATS shouldn’t make the same mistake.

The American people aren’t going to go and vote for Biden when they don’t like him and aren’t enthused by the prospect of him staying on as POTUS.

People generally don’t get motivated to vote against a worse prospect, they stay home.

Instead of hoping for a major change in reality the party and Biden himself need to adapt and work within the reality they are faced with.
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I understand and respect your point, but I vehemently disagree. The voters have a grave responsibility too. We all know what Trump is and what he represents. YOU (well, not you specifically Rado!) have the chance to stop him. fecking do it. Don't come crying afterwards when they had the chance to stop it. Would it have been so bloody horrible if Hillary had won? Of course not. In fact it would have been 100x better.
 
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