Ah, sorry I misunderstood your post.I meant the entirety of his posts
Ah, sorry I misunderstood your post.I meant the entirety of his posts
Yes definitely.You won't like it when they come back with a vengeance, led by Farage or someone like them. It's going to take a while, but it will happen.
Maybe so, but that wasn't what we were debating.I think too many people are over-estimating the importance of Palestine to the majority of people in the UK.
It's strange to go out of your way to bat for someone like Starmer.It's so disappointing to see this from you
I did not call you uneducated? I called you uneducated on the subject, "the Palestanian", a conclusion I built upon your prior interactions. I am sorry if I offended. That was not my intention.You think it's ok to call people you disagree with uneducated?
You expect too much of the UK - given it’s self-imposed isolation after Brexit, there is no way it will go directly against a key US policy. Neither have most of the other West European nations for that matter (unlike the invasion of Iraq in 2003).Maybe so, but that wasn't what we were debating.
Even though the UK do have a responsibility to help resolving it giving their history in the conflict.
This is Starmer's biggest task and the reason why so many people are sceptical. We know that centrist neo-liberalism might work for a bit butv tends to collapse in the face of rising populism (see France, USA, even here etc) My problem with Starmer is that he seems to represent that and that will lead to the rise of the right.
I liked and voted for Corbyn's policies as many did, but he was a weak leader, Starmer seems to be made of sterner stuff, but he is playing to small the c conservative majority. My hope is that he is making the Labour party as small a target as possible to woo those voters and get into power with a large majority and once in, they'll begin to shift towards the left. People need to see government really working for them and that means proper socialist policies, otherwise it'll just be seen as more of the same and we will eventually end up with a Farage or Badendoch as Prime Minister. A Cameron-lite government, which lots of people fear from Starmer, would create even more fertile ground for populism.
I'm lucky enough to live in a constituency where the Greens stand a very real chance of winning and as a result I will be voting for them as I want parliament to be as left of centre as possible. If I was in any doubt about Labour's victory, I would switch my vote to make sure we got rid of the Tories, but thankfully that doesn't seem to be an issue. My hope is that the Lib Dems beat the Tories and become the party of opposition, but that's probably just a dream, unless we have another D-Day moment.
Do Israel give one single feck about anything we tell them? They dance to the US tunes, not ours.Maybe so, but that wasn't what we were debating.
Even though the UK do have a responsibility to help resolving it giving their history in the conflict.
I did not call you uneducated? I called you uneducated on the subject, "the Palestanian", a conclusion I built upon your prior interactions. I am sorry if I offended. That was not my intention.
Unconditional support of Israel with the way they have been behaving isn't sustainable, US hegemony is slowly declining. It's not about whether Israel listen to us only, once the UK change their position, France are more likely to then other countries will follow suit. But we have to take that first step even if it seems futile in this very moment. Leaving things like they are will be how we looked back at apartheid in SA. I would hope we wouldn't be on the wrong side of history again.Do Israel give one single feck about anything we tell them? They dance to the US tunes, not ours.
I've already explained to Grinner above why this unconditional support of Israel isn't sustainable and things are changing, Norway, Ireland and Spain recently recognised a Palestinian state, this won't make a difference in the short run but I'm sure it's starting to make other European countries think twice about it and I would hope it is a start of a domino on this matter.You expect too much of the UK - given it’s self-imposed isolation after Brexit, there is no way it will go directly against a key US policy. Neither have most of the other West European nations for that matter (unlike the invasion of Iraq in 2003).
As for Starmer, it’s simple voting tactics - the sad truth is that most British people don’t really care that much about this issue while taking an anti-Israeli position risks re-opening the anti-Semitic narrative of the Corbyn years. Also, there is no obvious strategic rationale for the UK to support Palestine (unlike Ukraine). It’s not morally defensible but since when did morality dictate national policy?
I fully get why some voters will defect to the Greens over this issue. Maybe I would too but my MP was dismissed from the shadow cabinet over this issue and so it seems right to support him.
Why are France waiting for us to make a first move? As for SA, as usual the story is more complicated,Unconditional support of Israel with the way they have been behaving isn't sustainable, US hegemony is slowly declining. It's not about whether Israel listen to us only, once the UK change their position, France are more likely to then other countries will follow suit. But we have to take that first step even if it seems futile in this very moment. Leaving things like they are will be how we looked back at apartheid in SA. I would hope we wouldn't be on the wrong side of history again.
You do you.good effort...