The Spurs thread | 2017-18 season | Serious thread - wummers/derailers will be threadbanned

[Varun]

"We are helping him to move on"

 

[Enigma_87]

Spurs aren't punching above their weight at all, you've got one of the better keepers in the league, the best CB's in the league, the best striker in the league, one of the best players in the league (Eriksen) and the likes of Alli, Son, Dembele & Dier. The fact you haven't spent as much as other sides to build that side is a testament to your recruitment not an indication that you're overachieving

And yes while you were beaten by the better side at the weekend and while we've been better than you all season it was still an opportunity on your home pitch to win a game and go to a final and once again when it counts Spurs were found wanting so why can you do it in January in the league but not this past weekend unless it's a mentality thing?

Find it pretty odd that quote - that Spurs are punching above their weight.

They haven't won a major cup or title since how many? 27 years?

Even Portsmouth, who reside in League Two now have won the FA cup 10 years ago.

People drool over Poch but in reality he hasn't won anything since he was hired and Spurs "success" is down more to the recruitment process giving them one of the best squads in the league.

He's doing an ok-ish job considering him underachieving in Europe and the domestic cups. His team is as good as Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal for the top 4.

 

[Morpheus 7]

Weak mentality, why keep this going about a fecking tweet. Say no comment and move on like a proper manager, focus on the Watford game. If Kane's hurt then you have to wonder about his mental strength. God modern day football is so strange, I can't imagine Fergie chatting about how Roy is feeling about a tweet. Sensitive much.

 

[An Irish Red]

You know Harry Kane is coming across really badly when even Glaston isn't trying to defend him.

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

You know Harry Kane is coming across really badly when even Glaston isn't trying to defend him.

Nah he's pretty much in hiding anyway because we knocked them out the Cup last week. He does it every time we beat Spurs.

If not for that he'd be on here talking nonsense and defending Kane. And talking about their new stadium.

 

[Karel Podolsky]

Even Portsmouth, who reside in League Two now have won the FA cup 10 years ago.

And Wigan 5 years ago.

 

[GlastonSpur]

Nah he's pretty much in hiding anyway because we knocked them out the Cup last week. He does it every time we beat Spurs.

If not for that he'd be on here talking nonsense and defending Kane. And talking about their new stadium.

Actually I commented on the semi-final match several days ago ... and have made several other posts since then. But someone or other on here (you, in this instance) makes this claim every time that Spurs lose a match.

I guess such folk are less good than others at obsessively tracking my every move, whereas I couldn't give a toss as to who posts and who doesn't, and when they do or don't.

As for Kane, he doesn't need defending. He claimed a goal he thought he'd got the last touch on, as every striker would, and his claim was vindicated. Every else is just so much stuff and nonsense.

 

[Freak]

Opposition fans have so much ammunition to mock Harry during games now.

 

[Can23]

"We are helping him to move on"

I can't believe they don't realise they're making it much worse looking for sympathy.

 

[James Peril]

"We are helping him to move on"

Which is ironically what Poch would have said if something terrible happened to Kane’s loved ones, knock on wood. We’re talking about a tweet for god’s sake, from some jerkoff employee with a phone. 2018, it kills me, everyone is offended by everything. Poch has dealt with this pretty poorly, he is only going bring more ridicule at Kane - he’s going to get booed and harrassed from the stands. Will it make a difference? Hell no, but nobody wants to be screamed at for 90 minutes.

 

[GlastonSpur]

... historically Spurs have had saleable assets that have allowed them to invest. .... Spurs won't have £100m lying around ready to invest in the squad ...

Actually, that's a half-truth. The other half of the truth is that our need to invest heavily in the new stadium and new training ground has prevented us, for a fair few years now, from spending much on incoming transfers in net terms ... because without huge extra borrowing we couldn't afford to do both things at the same time.

However, that period of austerity is now easing off for three reasons:

1. Because of our successive seasons qualifying for the CL (and all the extra income it brings - an extra £52m this time around).
2. Because we posted record revenue of over £306m for the year ended 30 June 2017 (that's as of nearly 10 months ago - our revenues will have gone up further since then), with a profit for the year after interest and tax of £41.2m.
3. Because from August/September onwards the much higher income streams from our new stadium will start to come in.

This leads me to your 2nd point, your confidence that Spurs won't have £100m lying around this summer to invest in the squad. I wouldn't be so sure if I were you, for the reasons I've given.

 

[acnumber9]

Actually, that's a half-truth. The other half of the truth is that our need to invest heavily in the new stadium and new training ground has prevented us, for a fair few years now, from spending much on incoming transfers in net terms ... because without huge extra borrowing we couldn't afford to do both things at the same time.

However, that period of austerity is now easing off for three reasons:

1. Because of our successive seasons qualifying for the CL (and all the extra income it brings - an extra £52m this time around).
2. Because we posted record revenue of over £306m for the year ended 30 June 2017 (that's as of nearly 10 months ago - our revenues will have gone up further since then), with a profit for the year after interest and tax of £41.2m.
3. Because from August/September onwards the much higher income streams from our new stadium will start to come in.

This leads me to your 2nd point, your confidence that Spurs won't have £100m lying around this summer to invest in the squad. I wouldn't be so sure if I were you, for the reasons I've given.

That much higher income may go towards your much higher outgoings.

 

[James Peril]

Actually, that's a half-truth. The other half of the truth is that our need to invest heavily in the new stadium and new training ground has prevented us, for a fair few years now, from spending much on incoming transfers in net terms ... because without huge extra borrowing we couldn't afford to do both things at the same time.

However, that period of austerity is now easing off for three reasons:

1. Because of our successive seasons qualifying for the CL (and all the extra income it brings - an extra £52m this time around).
2. Because we posted record revenue of over £306m for the year ended 30 June 2017 (that's as of nearly 10 months ago - our revenues will have gone up further since then), with a profit for the year after interest and tax of £41.2m.
3. Because from August/September onwards the much higher income streams from our new stadium will start to come in.

This leads me to your 2nd point, your confidence that Spurs won't have £100m lying around this summer to invest in the squad. I wouldn't be so sure if I were you, for the reasons I've given.

Bla bla bla, the king of bullshit. We’ve heard it for ten years now, on and on and on, and when this season finishes; Tottenham will yet again be without a trophy. 100M you say? Well great, good for you. Hopefully you bring in a new Aurier, Sissoko or Moura. 100M ain’t what it used to be mate.

 

[Drawfull]

Weak mentality, why keep this going about a fecking tweet. Say no comment and move on like a proper manager, focus on the Watford game. If Kane's hurt then you have to wonder about his mental strength. God modern day football is so strange, I can't imagine Fergie chatting about how Roy is feeling about a tweet. Sensitive much.

Modern day life is strange. A user on another forum I use has today decided that the game 'Chinese Whispers' (Telephone, for the US crowd) is racist. And I think I'm going to be arrested since I touched someone's shoulder in the supermarket today.

I once read that the New Labour experiment of not bollocking anyone, or telling them they have failed is itself a failure, and whilst I am certainly not blaming Labour (that line of policy is long-lived, to say the least), we've inadvertently created a generation that sees blame, affection and banter as a slur on their existence. It's a complete clusterfeck and this example of the FA kowtowing to slight media pressure is a perfect example.

If Kane really is that thin-skinned, and we won't know the real truth I feel for many years, he also exemplifies the problems we have with blame, banter, sarcasm and so on being taboo in the current climate. If only he could shoulder a bit of responsibility, instead of other players' goals.

 

[Rhyme Animal]

Modern day life is strange. A user on another forum I use has today decided that the game 'Chinese Whispers' (Telephone, for the US crowd) is racist. And I think I'm going to be arrested since I touched someone's shoulder in the supermarket today.

I once read that the New Labour experiment of not bollocking anyone, or telling them they have failed is itself a failure, and whilst I am certainly not blaming Labour (that line of policy is long-lived, to say the least), we've inadvertently created a generation that sees blame, affection and banter as a slur on their existence. It's a complete clusterfeck and this example of the FA kowtowing to slight media pressure is a perfect example.

If Kane really is that thin-skinned, and we won't know the real truth I feel for many years, he also exemplifies the problems we have with blame, banter, sarcasm and so on being taboo in the current climate. If only he could shoulder a bit of responsibility, instead of other players' goals.

It's wrong to suggest it's a generational thing, imo, as tempting as it might be.

Footballers of this generation have MORE banter and jibes from social media etc than ever before, and rarely complain about it.

I would suggest that your Souness, Dalgleish, Keano, Neville, Gerrard, Giggs and even Fergies would have a lot more of an issue with the amount of 'banter' and jibes from social media if they were young players/managers.

This is just an insight into Spurs mollycoddling culture and how it seems Harry Kane has a hard time taking a bit of a joke.

This has been obvious about Spurs for literally years though - there is a 'nearly' mentally that runs through that club, and rather than address it (which Dele Alli himself alluded to in his interview directly after we ditched them out of the F.A Cup), they put the focus on anything and everything else.

 

[finneh]

Actually, that's a half-truth. The other half of the truth is that our need to invest heavily in the new stadium and new training ground has prevented us, for a fair few years now, from spending much on incoming transfers in net terms ... because without huge extra borrowing we couldn't afford to do both things at the same time.

However, that period of austerity is now easing off for three reasons:

1. Because of our successive seasons qualifying for the CL (and all the extra income it brings - an extra £52m this time around).
2. Because we posted record revenue of over £306m for the year ended 30 June 2017 (that's as of nearly 10 months ago - our revenues will have gone up further since then), with a profit for the year after interest and tax of £41.2m.
3. Because from August/September onwards the much higher income streams from our new stadium will start to come in.

This leads me to your 2nd point, your confidence that Spurs won't have £100m lying around this summer to invest in the squad. I wouldn't be so sure if I were you, for the reasons I've given.

Your period of austerity is far from over. You've traded the high cost of saving to build a stadium for the high cost of servicing a large debt. Ask Arsenal fans who also were naive enough to believe that the gates of their stadium opening was the beginning of a yellow brick road. A decade later and no trophies is what they had to show (not that this would be as unusual for Spurs fans).

Along with the imminent cost of uplifting several player salaries there will be precious left for £100m net investment.

Of course as other Spurs fans have said several priced assets may leave. I don't believe for one second they will let Kane or Erikson go (unless a Neymar bid comes in) but a couple of Alderweireld, Alli and Dembele are certainly very likely (as well as Rose).

I believe Spurs can afford to spend £100m, possibly even £150m... But they'll need to recoup half of it by selling key players.

That's the problem for Spurs now... The stock pile of mediocre players on low wages who are therefore very saleable has been exhausted. Now for every Alderweireld you sell you need a world class centre back to even tread water. For every Dembele you need a top class midfielder just to maintain your level. For every Alli you need a 20-25+ G+A contribution to be status quo.

Last year was an example of Walker leaving and Spurs being weaker because of it. Aurier is much worse as is Trippier. Luckily you had Bentaleb, N'Jie and Wimmer aa non-contributors to essentially trade for Sanchez who's a good contributor.

This season there is no £50m money tree of useless players that you can shake. Couple that with a large transfer fee inflation whereby unproven but exciting players are being rumoured at the £40m+ mark and you have a problem. They play well at the world cup? Double that problem.

Care to provide the kind of Summer ins and outs that you feel may well occur? You don't need to name specific names if you don't want to.

 

[Alabaster Codify7]

What Poch should have said:

"Kane is world-class, and world-class players don't worry about these things - they can say what they want, Harry will be back on the field next weekend, breaking records, smashing the net, it doesn't matter to him, as a man, or to us, as a club">

I'm available for £200 an hour as a PR consultant, if Spurs fancy it? Coz that was the most rank-amateur way I've seen anything handled by a big club.

 

[GlastonSpur]

That much higher income may go towards your much higher outgoings.

I'm sure some of it will, but there'll still be extra left over compared to recent years.

 

[GlastonSpur]

Your period of austerity is far from over. You've traded the high cost of saving to build a stadium for the high cost of servicing a large debt. Ask Arsenal fans who also were naive enough to believe that the gates of their stadium opening was the beginning of a yellow brick road. A decade later and no trophies is what they had to show (not that this would be as unusual for Spurs fans).

Along with the imminent cost of uplifting several player salaries there will be precious left for £100m net investment.

Of course as other Spurs fans have said several priced assets may leave. I don't believe for one second they will let Kane or Erikson go (unless a Neymar bid comes in) but a couple of Alderweireld, Alli and Dembele are certainly very likely (as well as Rose).

I believe Spurs can afford to spend £100m, possibly even £150m... But they'll need to recoup half of it by selling key players.

That's the problem for Spurs now... The stock pile of mediocre players on low wages who are therefore very saleable has been exhausted. Now for every Alderweireld you sell you need a world class centre back to even tread water. For every Dembele you need a top class midfielder just to maintain your level. For every Alli you need a 20-25+ G+A contribution to be status quo.

Last year was an example of Walker leaving and Spurs being weaker because of it. Aurier is much worse as is Trippier. Luckily you had Bentaleb, N'Jie and Wimmer aa non-contributors to essentially trade for Sanchez who's a good contributor.

This season there is no £50m money tree of useless players that you can shake. Couple that with a large transfer fee inflation whereby unproven but exciting players are being rumoured at the £40m+ mark and you have a problem. They play well at the world cup? Double that problem.

Care to provide the kind of Summer ins and outs that you feel may well occur? You don't need to name specific names if you don't want to.

I didn't say that austerity was over, I said it would be less than before.

Our debt servicing costs won't be all that much, precisely because we saved for years with the new stadium in mind so as to reduce construction borrowing needs. That's one difference with Arsenal's post-stadium situation. The other difference is that our wage bill is much lower than their's was (and is).

You forget that our income is booming: it jumped by 46% between the two last sets of published accounts ... an increase of £96.5m in one year alone. It will have increased further since then.

So we don't need to find some mysterious money tree to shake in order to get £100m to spend in net terms this summer if we want to.

Players out: Alderweireld most likely, Dembele possibly, Rose possibly also, and probably Llorente too.

Players in: Sessegnon perhaps, de Ligt perhaps ... not sure who else.

 

[finneh]

I didn't say that austerity was over, I said it would be less than before.

Our debt servicing costs won't be all that much, precisely because we saved for years with the new stadium in mind so as to reduce construction borrowing needs. That's one difference with Arsenal's post-stadium situation. The other difference is that our wage bill is much lower than their's was (and is).

You're debt servicing costs will be huge because your stadium ended up costing the best part of double the original estimate at somewhere near the £850-900m mark.

You forget that our income is booming: it jumped by 46% between the two last sets of published accounts ... an increase of £96.5m in one year alone. It will have increased further since then.

The income you refer to is all related to television income that is not controlled by yourselves or consistent (thank God for your sake as everything negotiated by your board has been done to a laughably low value). You can't run a business on income that could disappear on the toss of a coin.

The main source of income for any top level club that intends to run a steady ship is commercial income. Spurs are a decade behind on that front and show few factual signs of making that ground. The stadium naming rights deal was supposed to be the jewel in the crown... However there seems to be no real interest at the current valuation.

Levy is way too smart to spend money like CL income is guaranteed... He'll be running the business like you haven't qualified. That means no £200k weekly salaries and no top class players that demand such salaries.

So we don't need to find some mysterious money tree to shake in order to get £100m to spend in net terms this summer if we want to.

Players out: Alderweireld most likely, Dembele possibly, Rose possibly also, and probably Llorente too.

Players in: Sessegnon perhaps, de Ligt perhaps ... not sure who else.

So you're selling two key players in Alderweireld and Dembele (plus two squad players) and signing "Sessegnon perhaps, De Ligt perhaps"... That's exactly my point. You'll be selling two key players and two squad players and bringing in two younger punts that you hope will fill their boots.

Best case scenario is in 3 years De Ligt is 75% of the player that Alderweireld is now and Sessegnon opts for gametime at Spurs rather than a 40% greater salary at Chelsea.

You're transfer vision depicts the exact scenario I'm prophecising. £50m net spend... Replace guaranteed quality with potential quality... Best case scenario it's status quo.

 

[The Bloody-Nine]

Mauricio Pochettino will still have to sell players in order to buy them next season despite an increased ground capacity

Mauricio Pochettino has expressed the belief on several occasions. When Tottenham Hotspur move into their 62,062-seat stadium next season, the club will enter a new era of financial power. “It would be the time to say: ‘Now, we will win the title,’” the manager said in December. The theory has been that the stadium’s increased revenues will help the club to attract and keep the A-list players.

The view has sat uncomfortably with the cost of construction. It seems a long time ago that £400m was the ballpark figure. Then, it became £750m and £850m, and now, nobody would be surprised if it reached a billion. Tottenham have taken out £400m in bank loans, which are repayable over a five-year period. This month they announced in their financial results for the year ended 30 June 2017 that the “cumulative spend” on the project had increased from £115.3m to £315.1m. The club’s profits were robust. They stood at £41.2m after interest and tax. But whichever way you dress it up, there is a lot of money to find. It is no wonder chairman Daniel Levy “struggles to sleep at night”, according to Pochettino.

The penny – or great mountains of them – appears to have dropped with Pochettino and when he addressed the press, before Monday’s game against Watford at Wembley, there was a shift in his stance.

“The move to the new stadium is not suddenly going to change everything and millions of pounds will rain from the sky,” Pochettino said. “You have to manage and know exactly the expectations. It will be important to review and set the principles again; how it will be with the team once we move.”

Pochettino’s comments felt significant, just like the ones he made after the FA Cup semi defeat against Manchester United. In four post-match interviews he used the same phrase. The club needed more time to achieve success, he said, and it would be “with me or another” manager.

Pochettino was asked for clarification and explained Tottenham’s project was fixed so strongly for the long term it was inevitable another manager would one day take over the responsibility. His contract runs for a further three years. The project is designed for many more.

It remains difficult to escape the impression that Pochettino is approaching a crossroads. He has urged Levy on more than one occasion to move quickly in this summer’s transfer market while he ignored a question about whether he would lead the club into the new stadium and, instead, answered one of his own – the classic politician’s trick. “If I stay here for three more years, the project will not change,” Pochettino said. “We cannot change because the club cannot change. Whether it is me or another, that is the right project to keep pushing.

Full article.

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...ck-stadium-costs-escalate-mauricio-pochettino

 

[Mastadon]

Spurs on 850m-900m debt with a stadium the size of the Emirates and they think they are going to be minting it? That’s not how it worked for us with half the debt and we were in a much stronger position as a club.

That debt is insane. Funding a stadium fully on debt is insane. It took many years of austerity under Wenger to get out of the woods and it’s cost us dearly. If the owners don’t use money from their own pockets to fund the team or pay down that debt it will be impossible for Spurs to stay top 4 unless Poch is going to work miracles.

 

[GlastonSpur]

Spurs on 850m-900m debt with a stadium the size of the Emirates and they think they are going to be minting it? That’s not how it worked for us with half the debt and we were in a much stronger position as a club.

That debt is insane. Funding a stadium fully on debt is insane. It took many years of austerity under Wenger to get out of the woods and it’s cost us dearly. If the owners don’t use money from their own pockets to fund the team or pay down that debt it will be impossible for Spurs to stay top 4 unless Poch is going to work miracles.

You shouldn't talk such nonsense. Spurs are not borrowing anything even close to that amount.

 

[Mastadon]

You shouldn't talk such nonsense. Spurs are not borrowing anything even close to that amount.

You’re right I misunderstood it then. How are they paying for a stadium that costs 850 mil then? Are the owners putting in anything?

 

[borrays]

Wow £400 millions to be re-paid in just 5 years? That's massive for club like Spurs. Expect to see some stars selling for next 2 years.

 

[GlastonSpur]

You’re right I misunderstood it then. How are they paying for a stadium that costs 850 mil then? Are the owners putting in anything?

Spurs are one of the most profitable clubs in the Prem, so the club has been able to invest £315m of it own-generated money as of 10 months ago ... a sum that will have increased a fair bit since then. The NFL have put in a small amount. The bulk of the remainder has been borrowed as far as I know, although I think there are various schemes involving advance sales of corporate boxes and reserved seats.

 

[Adisa]

Full article.

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...ck-stadium-costs-escalate-mauricio-pochettino

Spurs fans don't want to accept it.
At some point he will say "feck it, I've taken them as far as I can".

 

[IrishRedDevil]

£400m to be repaid in 5 years sounds like a huge sum. Repaying that debt, while renewing Contracts (increase wages for underpaid stars) and buying new players to further improve will be quite the task.

 

[SambaBoy]

Going to be hard for Spurs over the next 5 years. We seen how much Arsenal struggled with their new stadium and the market is even more crazy now. Back then, you could still get bargains and top class players for £20-30m, even back-up players cost £20-35m nowadays, so while the inflation of transfers have went up, the revenue of having a new stadium has stayed the same relatively, give or take a few million.

Spurs are going to have to keep hitting lucky in the transfer market which is very difficult to do. They need to keep Poch, he and the board there are very good at identifying talent and giving them a chance.

 

[SwansonsTache]

£400m to be repaid in 5 years sounds like a huge sum. Repaying that debt, while renewing Contracts (increase wages for underpaid stars) and buying new players to further improve will be quite the task.

Debts like those are only a problem when it is United paying them down according to Glaston. He has spoken about the "chickens finally comming home to roost" for years now.

Of course it is no problem for a commercial juggernaut like Tottenham though according to him.

 

[Pexbo]

Spurs fans don't want to accept it.
At some point he will say "feck it, I've taken them as far as I can".

And with debts like that, it’s not hard to believe that Levy would bite someone’s hand off for the best part of £200m from Kane.

 

[Adisa]

And with debts like that, it’s not hard to believe that Levy would bite someone’s hand off for the best part of £200m from Kane.

Yeah. Kane will soon start having thoughts and by that time 200m will seem like a good deal for everyone.

 

[FootyGirl88]

£400m to be repaid in 5 years sounds like a huge sum. Repaying that debt, while renewing Contracts (increase wages for underpaid stars) and buying new players to further improve will be quite the task.

I dread to think how much the interest will be.

 

[Bwuk]

Interesting to see what’s next for this Spurs side.

Personally think they’ve peaked as a side and could do with a few new faces. They need more experienced winners imo. Players who can get them over the finish line.

They have a good enough starting 11 to win the league next season - but does anyone actually see them doing it?

Kane is showing himself to be weak mentally in the fact he’s letting internet memes bother him. If he thinks it’s bad now wait till after the World Cup when England crash out unless he has a stellar tournament. Fantastic player though.

 

[Buchan]

LOL @ Spurs. This move will end up being a catastrophic failure when it's all said and done, IMO (in terms of it impacting the quality of footballers the club will be able to keep and/or attract).

 

[GlastonSpur]

£400m to be repaid in 5 years sounds like a huge sum. Repaying that debt, while renewing Contracts (increase wages for underpaid stars) and buying new players to further improve will be quite the task.

Spurs income has increased 56% in 2 years, as of 10 months ago. It will have increased further since then and will go up much further next season, taking us into the global top 10 income-wise

Moreover, Spurs can if needed either negotiate to extend the repayment period, or else take out another loan to pay off the remainder of the £400m.

 

[GlastonSpur]

LOL @ Spurs. This move will end up being a catastrophic failure when it's all said and done, IMO (in terms of it impacting the quality of footballers the club will be able to keep and/or attract).

Ah, the eternal prediction that arrives as we approach each summer ... but somehow never materialises.

 

[vangagal]

Debts like those are only a problem when it is United paying them down according to Glaston. He has spoken about the "chickens finally comming home to roost" for years now.

Of course it is no problem for a commercial juggernaut like Tottenham though according to him.

Your point has been approved by the man himself :

Spurs income has increased 56% in 2 years, as of 10 months ago. It will have increased further since then and will go up much further next season, taking us into the global top 10 income-wise

Moreover, Spurs can if needed either negotiate to extend the repayment period, or else take out another loan to pay off the remainder of the £400m.

 

[SwansonsTache]

Ah, the eternal prediction that arrives as we approach each summer ... but somehow never materialises.

So what do you reckon as most probable? Spurs losing some stars that want parity of wages with their level of players at other clubs, or these infamous chickens finally coming home to roost for United?

 

[Angry Virginian]

LOL @ Spurs. This move will end up being a catastrophic failure when it's all said and done, IMO (in terms of it impacting the quality of footballers the club will be able to keep and/or attract).

Spurs' revenue is only 53% that of United. How else would Spurs realistically be able to increase its revenue without moving to a new bigger stadium?