Okay so after "young is a human being", we get "this is not football manager. It's real life."
what wonderful arguments against selling young.
what wonderful arguments against selling young.Smashley Young
- Thread starter Red Defence
- Start date
-
In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) are here to discuss three 1-1 draws.
The first got us knocked out of the FA Cup, the next puts us in a good position in our Round of 16 Europa League game, and the latest was an actual decent performance against Arsenal at Old Trafford.
All hopes for the season now rest on the Europa League - does Amorim have the squad to win it?
Okay so after "young is a human being", we get "this is not football manager. It's real life."
Well, the whole point of the comment was the fact that it's not a video game. Young is in fact a real person in the real world at a real club run by experienced personnel who, as their career deal with this stuff day to day..
Not really sure how you could miss it but spectacular effort anyways.
I tried the 'feck it, sell everyone, slash wages, buy fotm signing, reload game' shtick but I think speaking of realism is better suited to football discussions.
Okay so after "young is a human being", we get "this is not football manager. It's real life."
He's ain't heavy, he's our brother.
You should try actually making intelligent and constructive points rather than making statements irrelevant to the topic or initial post. Actually, carry on, I'm finding this highly amusing.
Indeed.
#justice4yung
An exercise in why that is pretty much pointless, right here.
Well, he is a professional footballer so he isn't shit, but he isn't in the level a United player should be (even a squad player) IMO. Does Moyes really have plans for him? He hasn't started in a month or so.
The other problem is that if we didn't have Januzaj and Zaha then ok, but as it is we have Kagawa, Nani, Valencia, Januzaj, Welbeck, Giggs and Zaha to compete for two positions. So his departure would only trim the wages a bit and give some extra games to our young players.
I don't think he is. He offers in most games absolutely nothing. He has some ok performances and some good/very good ones but they are rare. Park for examples was a very good squad player, Young not so.
Does anyone think that Young could be a squad player for the best teams like Bayern, BVB, Madrid or Barca? That is the level we should aim to achieve and with players like Young, Buttner and Ando we won't. We need reliable squad players as much as we need good first team players and those I mentioned aren't.
The other problem of course are his wages. He is one of our biggest earners and isn't that good even for the bench so the entire situation from the beginning seems baffling to me.
He isn't that useless. Yes, he mostly doesn't offer what should be expected from a United player these days but some of the assessments on here are way over the top. In his first season here he was actually a good player and scored some vital goals for us, he's dropped his level since and I wouldn't like him to be a first-team regular, I'm also annoyed by his constant antics and diving but by Premier League standards he's still a solid winger.
Abysmal signing, one of Fergie's huge boobups.
A signing that never really made sense. I thought he might make a step up after his first few appearances.
Nowadays he just goes through the motions, bereft of confidence, initiative and imagination.
Nowadays he just goes through the motions, bereft of confidence, initiative and imagination.
Hopefully he'll only start games in the Capital One Cup/FA Cup from now on, unless we have a few injuries. He's not useless, far from it, but he's not good enough to be starting games that he did at the start of the league season. I'm sure Moyes knows that now.
Anyone writing him off as shite has a seriously short memory. He had a cracking debut season, the only season to date where he's been clear of injuries. Not even close to being one of Fergie's worst.
Provide one fact.
He had a decent debut season, hardly 'cracking' IMO.
I'd say Hernandez had a cracking debut season, for example. Young started well, but faded fairly quickly.
Yeah this. You could say Young had a cracking start, but IIRC he got injured soon after this, and apart from the odd performance (away to Spurs for example), he hasn't really performed to that level since.
He's gotten some pretty high profile games this season. In your opinion he 'isn't at the level', if it was so obvious he'd not be at the club even near making starts. So that's pretty speculative.
Have you ever thought how difficult it would be to offload someone on wages in excess of £100K? I'm confident none of the top six sides would deem him good enough to offer a sizable wage package as we have and it's debatable whether he would start for teams like Everton, Southampton or Swansea, let alone them being able to afford his wages.
Point is, with his age, contract situation, wages and recent form, it will actually be very difficult to find a potential suitor for him irrespective of whether we would want to sell or not.
his first season his notable contribution was the goals. Take those out and he had a poor season. But he didnt because he was a good goal threat on his day
the last season and a half he hasnt even been slightly a goal threat. Thats not good enough
Another poor point - look how long Arsenal have often took to get rid of their deadwood. Even Bendtner is still at their club ffs.
I think he's a mediocre squad player, way below someone like Park but ahead of someone like Anderson. Difference is we don't pay squad players 100k a week, so unless he somehow turns into a very good winger or takes a substantial pay cut to remain with us there's no future for him here. Although he may well be another Malouda and sit on his pay packet until his contract expires.
I'm with Revan on this one. Poor and mediocre players hang around top clubs all the time. Sometimes managers have blind spots, or feel that the player will improve, or that they need the numbers in the squad. Sometimes they want rid but it's difficult to offload an unimpressive player during their contract, especially one who is on wages like Young's.
"We should sell Ashley Young!"
"No way man, this isn't some video game, this is real life yo, finances and shit!"
"... but he's not good enough"
"but he's real man, a real person, you can't do that do him!"
"..."
"No way man, this isn't some video game, this is real life yo, finances and shit!"
"... but he's not good enough"
"but he's real man, a real person, you can't do that do him!"
"..."
Sounds like a terrible Rap song.
My point is that he's not good enough for a squad player regardless of his wage. Even if he is on 50k/week still he wouldn't be good enough. I would prefer to see everytime Kagawa, Januzaj, Nani, Welbeck and Valencia before him and likely even Zaha and Lingaard. (Giggs too but let's assume he will retire). That is a lot of players for only two positions so we won't lose anything by offloading Young (if we find a club who would be willing to get him).
He isn't ahead of Ando in any way (except in wages). Both are pretty much injured for half of season, are very inconsistent and usually play bad with some decent performances between poor ones.
I would think a team like Everton, Southampton, Swansea or Newcastle would like to have Young, he could help them cement a top 8 finish.
But yeah, I'd also rather see Valencia, Januzaj, Zaha, Giggs, Welbeck or even Lingard ahead of Young at this point.
Other than that demolishing of Arsenal he never looked the part.
But yeah, I'd also rather see Valencia, Januzaj, Zaha, Giggs, Welbeck or even Lingard ahead of Young at this point.
Other than that demolishing of Arsenal he never looked the part.
I have no problem with people saying he's not good enough but slagging him off after games he was far from the worst is frustrating. City at home last year comes to mind. Apart from City away this season, he's been pretty useful in most of the big games he's played for us. (e.g.Arsenal at home, Chelsea away, City away last year)
That's not true. SAF always loved players with versatility and a British winger who can play on both flanks and as a striker gave him options. Unfortunately Young proved to be a bit cack + the emergence of versatile (+quality) young players like Januzaj and Jesse made him a bit redundant.
It made good sense at the time, just hasn't really worked.
Januzay ok but Jesse ?
Reading Fergie's book it looks like planning the personnel is based around experience and players coming up the ranks, even the vastly inexperienced ones. If he deemed Lingard as a good potential then I could well see his reasoning. That's a big if obviously as we know zilch about it. I do remember Sir Alex highlighting Jesse's skill more than once or twice, though.
5 goals in 5 games. Ok its the Championship. However with our flanks already well stocked with wingers who are better then Young, then it wouldnt be such a bad idea to let Young go and give more playing time to Zaha and Jesse.
I didnt say he had to leave or be made to leave, I like many have said I don't think we need him, its an opinion, what this or any forum irks ultimately about. I know I don't have power to change anything but doesn't mean I can't express my thoughts otherwise what's the point of any of us being here?
I've also not said januzaj is a "messi-ah" or anything like that, simply that he's more than good enough to replace young in the squad, thankfully he doesn't even have to run out as a particularly good player to do that. But ultimately its about in januzaj, welbeck, kagawa, zaha and others I think we have players who if we can give them as much game time as eel can will give us more than young on the short term and more so long term.
I really don't know what you're trying to say. If you think we should keep young then fine, I don't agree but you're entitled to say it. Like I said I accept he's good enough to be a squad player at a big club and is capable if excellent performances I just don't think we see the latter enough and with the players we have coming through he's not needed as a squad player.
I don't deny what he's accomplishing for Birmingham but it's not directly affecting Ashley Young unlike Januzay's performance at Utd. That was what I meant by my question. If/When Jesse comes back and Utd and outperforms Young then yeah it'd make sense to let him go then.
Someone who is shit at his job should not be fired because he has feelings? Cry me a river.
I disagree. We currently have 2-3 players who are ahead of Young in the pecking order (Valencia, Nani and Januzaj). One can also debate whether to put Kagawa (as winger) and Zaha's name on that list too. That means that Young is nowadays a squad member. Now what would people and the club as a whole prefer. Do we need a rumoured 100k a week player to cover the role of 3-5th choice winger or would a much cheaper (less experienced) and younger option do the trick?
I didn't explain it clearly, I ain't saying Young has to stay, right now I don't care about him as a player at all, he's hurting nobody, preventing no one from playing time and if the club was uncomfortable with his wages, they would never have given them to him. When Jesse comes back then Young will have to go then IMHO. As of now, whether he stays or leaves isn't that different to me. If the likes of Zaha can't get playing time ahead of Young then he wasn't good enough to begin with, so his current presence isn't an issue.
No, at the pathetic posters falling over themselves to put shit on him.
It's pretty funny to me, that is for sure. I don't really care, he's pretty shite, and doesn't look match fit. There is absolutely zero any of us can do change how much game time he is getting and how shit it is.The lengths people go to in putting shit on a player is hilarious.
I'm not having a go at you in general, but: Nobody knew that Januzaj would make this much of an impact at 18. That is pretty much why Young is still at the club, that and the club sees that he has something else to offer still..
Zaha has made one appearance, Januzaj is just taking off and nobody could have predicted his meteoric rise. Kagawa has not looked comfortable on the left and the fan bias in wanting him to play regularly means he'll have more advocates for it, Valencia and Nani have been just as inconsistent as Young. Even if they haven't just plain old been 'shite'.
Does a bloke playing football earning money really burn you that much? Because honestly, who cares how much people are reporting his wage. fecking deal with it. You can't change it, nobody can until he's gone.
You still defending this heap of shite?