Our club makes dithering a fine art though
Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)
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Our club makes dithering a fine art though
We are just extremely lucky to have won 3 points in that game vs Brighton that defied all laws of universe. We won with the penalty after the final whistle and they hit the crossbar like 5 times. We got throughly outplayed.
The season is slipping away and there will be plenty of great teams too. Ole better right this ship soon...
If we do not get Poch he is going to go somewhere else and we will get stuck with Ole. It is pointless to keep blaming the players anymore when they are not getting the proper coaching and tactics by the Manager and coaches.
No win against Everton and he must be sacked because otherwise to reach a Champions League place is very unrealistic.
Try to ask all our rival fans and they would all pick keep. That should tell us how bad he is.
Lost against Roy Hodgson , Neil Warnock, Eddie Howe , slaven bilic, steve bruce etc and Did Mourinho just pumped him 6-1 ? With one good manager you can mention 3 shite manager who outclassed him.
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"That good manager didn't work out so let's stick with a shit manager" has to be the worst logic going.
Like going and staying in a 5* hotel, not liking the room then choosing to sleep on a park bench rather than trying another 5* hotel. Some people here then went to tripadvisor and give the park bench 5* review only because it's the park bench they slept on 22 years ago.
Like going and staying in a 5* hotel, not liking the room then choosing to sleep on a park bench rather than trying another 5* hotel. Some people here then went to tripadvisor and give the park bench 5* review only because it's the park bench they slept on 22 years ago.
The thing is, I don't only blame Ole. The manager is clueless right now, but so are our players.
I don't see the quality that everyone else sees. I see quality in some areas, sure, but in others we are so abject, and our players are so toothless.
Its just a culmination of everything bad right now. Again.
I don't see the quality that everyone else sees. I see quality in some areas, sure, but in others we are so abject, and our players are so toothless.
Its just a culmination of everything bad right now. Again.
If that is so is the case then we do not need a top coach or a manager. Clever players would be enough. It is the job of the manager to train the players to be clever and have teeth.
Too true but see him going elsewhere
Yeah quite honestly we should only have a maximum of 5 points on the board
Like I said, it's both ways, but the criticism should entirely directed at Solksjaer.
We have pro footballers worth millions making basic mistakes. A team that collapses under pressure.
Why is it a manager's job to ensure players fight for the team day in day out? It should be a privilege for them to play here, to do what they do.
Look at how we chase games ffs. No urgency. No care. No belief. If the name of this club wasn't Manchester United, you'd think they were firmly midtable and below players.
I think Solksjaer's time is up, but I also cannot stand the vast majority of players we have at this club.
Bad times!It is the manager's job to see that his players work their socks off. When they see their manager just lounging in his chair and watching netflix, they are not going to be bothered about working their socks off when they can see the manager is not bothered about how they play.
There is one player that I cannot stand and that is Pogba. Everyone else seems to be at least trying hard but not able to get going because it is a team game and if in one match they get wrong then the manager should get it right the next time they are on the training ground. Why is it that every other club seems to be able to play better as a team than us? They may have much lesser known or less talented players than we have but have better team work?
Why is that our players when they go and play for their national teams or other clubs they play better football?
It is all down to the manager.
I don't get the feeling the players aren't trying. if that was true it would mean Ole has lost the dressing room which isn't the case. The only player who visibly seems to slack off from time to time is Pogba. The rest give it their best. They just often come unstuck in the final third and that comes across to people as them not trying. People like Neville and Keane see this and mistake tactical problems with a lack of passion. It's always about passion with that lot
I am only supporting the sack of Ole if we have a plan like City did with the structure and Pep and Liverpool with their revamped structure and Klopp. Even Arsenal looks to be rebuilding their flawed structure.
I am not in favour of just sacking Ole, replace with Poch, same old same old, then two years later we are looking at Nigelsmann because we won nothing. At least Ole is all about positivity and not bringing the United's name through the mud. As good as Spurs are now they will implode next year it is almost in the writing.
I am not in favour of just sacking Ole, replace with Poch, same old same old, then two years later we are looking at Nigelsmann because we won nothing. At least Ole is all about positivity and not bringing the United's name through the mud. As good as Spurs are now they will implode next year it is almost in the writing.
If Ole leaves, Will any ex United's player take seat?
Give it to Giggsy. Oh wait, he's getting arrested.
I've heard Paul Ince is available. BLM movement is going strong, Woodward should capitalize on it.
Give it to Giggsy. Oh wait, he's getting arrested.
I've heard Paul Ince is available. BLM movement is going strong, Woodward should capitalize on it.
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The way United is structured Woodward doesn't have to choose someone based on a master plan or a football vision. The manager is the one that brings that and therein lies our weakness, you then have to be extremely patient or hope that the manager get it right always because when you sack him you start again.
My thoughts are that the difference between a top manager and a regular one is massive, snd sticking with a regular manager is a huge handicap.
Fergie finishing 1st with 89 points whilst Moyes with the same squad “finished” 7th on 64 points is testament to this.
Does anyone seriously think that if Gerrard took over from Klopp with the exact same squad he’d be getting the same results?
Managers are THAT important and top ones are few and far between.
Fergie finishing 1st with 89 points whilst Moyes with the same squad “finished” 7th on 64 points is testament to this.
Does anyone seriously think that if Gerrard took over from Klopp with the exact same squad he’d be getting the same results?
Managers are THAT important and top ones are few and far between.
I disagree either are clueless. The manager is pretty good and the players are pretty good. But neither are quite good enough if we want to win consistently.
The essence of what you posted is right. The problem is both the manager and the players. It’s still possible that both will improve to the level we need, with experience and a few more signings but I rather doubt it now.
Imo the people saying they are Ole in but results need to improve don't really get it.
Performances and application of tactics philosophy are imo more important when judging if one should carry on with a manager where results are not at the best.
Performances and application of tactics philosophy are imo more important when judging if one should carry on with a manager where results are not at the best.
- Is there any discernable style of play?
- Does the team look like they are progressing towards a tactical and recognisable framework?
- Over a considerable number of games, are performances on average improving?
- Are the players getting better at their roles?
- Then lastly, are results beginning to match performances in a positive sense?
- Manager of Molde
- Getting fired by Cardiff in what would have been certain relegation.
Sporadic wins in big games is simply not a measuring yardstick at this level. That's not our bread and butter. We are once again looking at a points total similar to last season at best. That's simply not good enough.
I asked myself a question, how many premier league clubs would swap managers with us? I don't like the answer.
We're False Dawn FC and I don't see that changing, that's the Ole pattern sadly, has been since day one.
December is a really good time to judge him and take action depending on where we are then. If we are still struggling then he needs to go. I can't handle going back to the Europa especially with this squad
It does look like the Ole pattern. I think the Ole In crowd will realise this soon enough if it keeps in happening and will calm down on calling every win a master class.
Isn't this part of the problem at United? We are not decisive enough as a club: concerning transfers and also the position of the manager. We make emotional decisions. We are not going to find out anything that we already don't know in this period until December.
Our team struggles against two types of teams: those who sit back and those who have a strong pressing game (Leipzig being a rare exception--think back to Southampton last season where they outplayed us for large periods at OT). This is not going to magically change. Why wait to make the change?
Well said, we're going nowhere under Ole. If results go against us this week we'll be 1 place above the relegation zone. People need to stop making excuses for him and realise he's not good enough.
AWB doesn't seem to have any ideas where its going wrong, we have good players but they lack coaching and direction.
We need a brave manager here. Someone who will bollock and then drop them if they don't perform. Ole treats them as they are his besties. Even calling all of them by their first names makes him too friendly to start with. He should be on the touchline harassing cajoling, not sitting feeling sorry for themselves for 90 mins. Get that in a manager and proper coaches who can improve individual and team play, then we can move forward.
This seasons current form guide suggests a win in Turkey for us, and if, (I know it’s a big if) but if Fulham repeat last nights score line at the weekend and we lose 2-0 to Everton, Fulham, yes Fulham, will leap frog us in the table! That should set the sounding alarm bells ringing.
Even if nothing changes till December I think sacking him now will be controversial. It's still early in the season to sack a man that came 3rd in his first season. It's not ruthless as most big clubs will probably sack him if he fails to get a result against Everton but that's the leeway he gets as a club legend. He's also shown he can turn things around
It’s absolutely pointless looking at the table now. The beginning of the season was an absolute farce, we had less of a pre season than virtually any team so it was always likely to be tough.
Add to that we have played three of the likely top five in our first 6 games whilst off-colour doesn’t help.
Games like Everton will define whether Ole can take this team forward. We have no excuses now. The players are fit and the fixtures are very winnable.
My advice to Ole - ditch the diamond and that t**t Pogba, play 4-3-3 or 5-3-2 and you’ll be fine
Add to that we have played three of the likely top five in our first 6 games whilst off-colour doesn’t help.
Games like Everton will define whether Ole can take this team forward. We have no excuses now. The players are fit and the fixtures are very winnable.
My advice to Ole - ditch the diamond and that t**t Pogba, play 4-3-3 or 5-3-2 and you’ll be fine
Every team that dominates and wins titles don't just look like a group of quality players on the pitch, they look like gladiators. Ole will never make us look like that. Not related but I actually think if he was charismatic there would have been a few more that would give him more time. Mourinho seduced fans with his charisma
what about the games like Aresnal?
At big clubs you can only earn the next few weeks or month at mosr. You prove yourself on a flowing basis. Same goes for first team players. De Matteo and Zidane have gotten sacked coming off of CL wins. Ranieri also got sacked coming off of the heist of the century. Jose got sacked coming off a Pl win. At United coming 3rd doesn't earn you squat but the next 3 weeks in charge
Standards are already so low to make anything Ole does look like progress and he still sputters.
Even some of the stuff he stuff says in postmatch interviews sounds like he has low standards himself. He'd draw a game against West Bromwich and say we lost this fixture last season to highlight progress
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Don't know why it took me long but the Arsenal game made me realise we don't really have a defined style of play. Going into games I think most people expect to see a certain result but what style of play are you expecting to see? A style of play is usually defined and consistent even if you don't get results but bring on Istanbul, bring on Everton, bring on West Brom, bring on Southampton, forget results, what style of play are you expecting to see in these games?
The players did not completely jump ship like they did under Jose, and still offers effort despite running around like headless chickens out there.
A good tactical manager would find systems and roles and give clear instructions on how the poorer players would still be usable. A man manager would only give them confidence to try and try and try...
If there already is "institutional knowledge" among the players in the squad and a general style of play at the club, like at Bayern Munich, then having someone to give the players the motivation etc can function. If you lack said knowledge and a style of play at the club, like at MUFC, then someone that brands themself on "go out there and express yourselves" approach will end up with a lot of individualistic efforts in many different directions.
For people saying we should wait till December, by then we will be hoping for europa league spots.
And some people will still say give him 2 more years and another 300 mil to implement his stratagem.
Others will blame the players, Woodward, board, Glazers.
By then, new excuses will come up, like the young players are now getting old, we need newer young players, REFRESH the squad.
Does anyone really want to go through all of that?
And some people will still say give him 2 more years and another 300 mil to implement his stratagem.
Others will blame the players, Woodward, board, Glazers.
By then, new excuses will come up, like the young players are now getting old, we need newer young players, REFRESH the squad.
Does anyone really want to go through all of that?
Yea if you watch those games on livescore but in reality, BHA should have won that game, Newcastle wasnt like we had 4:0 lead after 60 min etc.
Given our sporadic positive performances against top sides, I’ve come to believe that we have a decent level of quality in most positions but there isn’t a fundamental core approach and style to how we play.
Ole’s tactical choices always seem to be based on a gamble of sorts - sometimes it works and at other times it fails miserably. This shouldn’t be the case. Instead, there should be an unspoken sense of confidence (and measured arrogance) that the general style of play and core foundations will see us through most of the time as it did with Fergie.
After vehemently supporting Ole’s appointment, I’ll openly admit that I’ve got it all wrong. A new manager and an overhaul of the coaching team is essential now more then ever, or we risk missing out on European football next season.
Ole’s tactical choices always seem to be based on a gamble of sorts - sometimes it works and at other times it fails miserably. This shouldn’t be the case. Instead, there should be an unspoken sense of confidence (and measured arrogance) that the general style of play and core foundations will see us through most of the time as it did with Fergie.
After vehemently supporting Ole’s appointment, I’ll openly admit that I’ve got it all wrong. A new manager and an overhaul of the coaching team is essential now more then ever, or we risk missing out on European football next season.
Newcastle and Leipzig were both late flurries. PSG was a late goal and Brighton as you say, we should have been spanked in.
You are of course turning a blind eye to our record away win run and our long unbeaten run last season, that wasn't a collection of sporadic wins, that was a long run of consistent form.
It's clear we're in bad form right now though and with games coming every 3/4 days it hurts us. But, we have a run of decent fixtures coming up and that should allow us to build some proper form and get the points on the board. I also think these high pressing teams are destined to collapse fairly quickly in the league, they won't be able to sustain those levels of performance with this schedule and I feel Ole is actually doing a good job right now rotating our players and keeping them fresh with the long term view in mind. We're avoiding injuries too which is something of a miracle if you consider what we used to be like.
I do agree with part of your post though, Ole isn't the real deal and he won't get us a title. He seems like a cup run Manager and someone who knows how to improve the squad but ultimately lacks the skillset to take the team to the final level, I feel the same about the coaching staff and have done for a few years now. I'm ok with that for now though as I feel the squad is still a long way off challenging anyway. It requires actual investment from the owners and that's extremely difficult.
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