Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

[Robbie Boy]

I mean, I'm just trying to get a sense check from the poster here.

Being happy and positive that the team you claim to support has won a game is, according to Foxbatt, a toxic behaviour.

However, nitpicking said result and saying "it's only Newcastle", or saying statements to the effect that Ole is still shit, are perfectly reasonable behaviours?

I mean, if you claim to support a team - you should at least be happy when said team wins, no? Otherwise, what is the point of this forum? Or indeed, the notion of 'support' itself?

Old Trafford, when Utd have just scored with the fans cheering would, if we took Foxbatt's logic to the nth degree, be toxic behaviour, and if we again took that same logic to the nth degree, if those same sets of supporters started booing the players and management, that would be perfectly fine?

Do you not see that inherent contradiction?

If some posters have gone a little doolally in response to the win, then it's a bit weird I agree, but how can something as natural as being happy that the team you profess to support has won a game be in any way shape or form, toxic?

It's both sides mate. There's a-lot of provocation and child like positing from a small minority which is causing shitty arguments and dick swinging contests. It's the manner of how some people post, not necessarily their opinions.

If you give the last few pages an honest unbiased read, you'll see that some posters are posting utter drivel, even ones that you deem to be in your camp.

 

[sammsky1]

Aye, Mata was my MOTM too. He was bloody brilliant tbf to him. We dominated but Newcastle are absolute cowards under Bruce. Still thought we were fairly poor and disjointed for a good portion of the match even though that'll upset Sammybear1.
DvB turned the game for me, and credit to Ole for his subs and the timing of them. We looked genuinely excellent in the last 20 minutes but it's bloody annoying that we only seem to be able to do it in patches. Credit to AWB, Shaw and Maguire who have been under intense scrutiny. I thought all 3 were excellent. Shaw started a-bit nervy but kicked on and looked good going forward. Considering our next 4 games, we needed a win here. That last 20 minutes should be a great confidence builder. Also fantastic seeing Rashford get on the score sheet and now hopefully the silly Bruno rumours can also be put to bed.

Missed this post in my post match excitement!

Its a very good post: it was 1-1 when Donnie came on, and everything clicked once he came on. The extra bit I think needs context is that James did a lot of running and helped tire out Newcastle.

We were much fitter then them in last 20 minutes and that gave VdB and Pogba the time and space to make things look more cohesive and allowed for Bruno and Rashford amazing counter attack goals. And that was probably Ole's game management strategy, to end the game storming, for which he deserves credit /

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

This thread should have been locked months ago. Its a stain on the forum

A forum should be a place for open debate. This one happens to be about Manchester United so a debate about its management & its competence are valid. The stain on the forum is the group think mentality tied to an opinion.

The conversation lacks any nuance. We won today against a rather ordinary side i convincing fashion - this should be celebrated yet we were humiliated 2 weeks back against a league rival that exposed a number of deficiencies that despite today’s result still aren’t solved but the second we won, today’s result seems to have eradicated any issues.

The art of debate on forums is dead which is rather saddening.

In your opinion.
What if people don't care for your opinion? How can your statement then be true?

Top Red

 

[Crashoutcassius]

quiet tonight

 

[rotherham_red]

It's both sides mate. There's a-lot of provocation and child like positing from a small minority which is causing shitty arguments and dick swinging contests. It's the manner of how some people post, not necessarily their opinions.

If you give the last few pages an honest unbiased read, you'll see that some posters are posting utter drivel, even ones that you deem to be in your camp.

I agree that there's been some idiotic posts on both sides, but is that really toxic, or just a natural response to the progressively worse opinions that have been loudly and repeatedly stated by a very select few people on the other side of the aisle?

Those posts aren't exactly being posted in a vacuum, are they? Even when people have been rational and conciliatory in their tone, the posts have either been largely ignored or just pounced upon by those people taking bits and pieces out of context and then proceeding to repeat the same buzz words ad infinitum, or just straight up saying it's bollocks or shit with nary a thought to having a wider debate.

Look, I can understand if people don't think he's the right man to take this club forward. Logically speaking, his record before coming to Utd was never a realistic preparation for it, and those dark days last season were very dark. However, he has done a lot of things right as well. Things which other, more illustrious managers didn't have the brass tacks to do.

He deserves credit for those things, as well as the benefit of the doubt considering where we ended up last season.

At the end of the day, it was 3 bad games and considering where everyone else is this year, those games weren't terminal. So, the question I always come back to is what is the harm exactly, in wanting to support the team and the manager? If it doesn't work out, then fair enough, but we have by no means not got to that point where we can make that judgement - especially now that he hasn't been given a lot of the targets that he initially set out to get.

This negativity and so-called 'realism', is very grating and just makes the experience of being here increasingly unpleasant. Especially when some of the worst offenders for it were MIA when the team was doing well. That doesn't tell me that they are sincere, rather that they have their own agenda and would rather be proven right than actually want the team to succeed. A fan can have legitimate concerns but still want us to do well, and from my vantage point, I just don't see that with a lot of these people. I, for example, thought Bruno wasn't going to be good enough, and right now, I think Cavani was a poor buy and will flop. However, I was absolutely delighted to be proven wrong thus far regarding Bruno, and would be equally delighted if Cavani went and made me eat my words. That, for me, is the difference between many of the Ole outers and those on the Ole in side of things.

 

[Ish]

Agree totally. I have serious reservations and doubts that he's a top level coach but he's left a very good squad for the next manager to work with. Once Rojo, Jones and a-few others are shifted, then we'll have gotten rid of pretty much all of the perceived 'deadwood'.

Good post Robbie. My man.

 

[Robbie Boy]

I agree that there's been some idiotic posts on both sides, but is that really toxic, or just a natural response to the progressively worse opinions that have been loudly and repeatedly stated by a very select few people on the other side of the aisle?

Those posts aren't exactly being posted in a vacuum, are they? Even when people have been rational and conciliatory in their tone, the posts have either been largely ignored or just pounced upon by those people taking bits and pieces out of context and then proceeding to repeat the same buzz words ad infinitum, or just straight up saying it's bollocks or shit with nary a thought to having a wider debate.

Look, I can understand if people don't think he's the right man to take this club forward. Logically speaking, his record before coming to Utd was never a realistic preparation for it, and those dark days last season were very dark. However, he has done a lot of things right as well. Things which other, more illustrious managers didn't have the brass tacks to do.

He deserves credit for those things, as well as the benefit of the doubt considering where we ended up last season.

At the end of the day, it was 3 bad games and considering where everyone else is this year, those games weren't terminal. So, the question I always come back to is what is the harm exactly, in wanting to support the team and the manager? If it doesn't work out, then fair enough, but we have by no means not got to that point where we can make that judgement - especially now that he hasn't been given a lot of the targets that he initially set out to get.

This negativity and so-called 'realism', is very grating and just makes the experience of being here increasingly unpleasant. Especially when some of the worst offenders for it were MIA when the team was doing well. That doesn't tell me that they are sincere, rather that they have their own agenda and would rather be proven right than actually want the team to succeed. A fan can have legitimate concerns but still want us to do well, and from my vantage point, I just don't see that with a lot of these people. I, for example, thought Bruno wasn't going to be good enough, and right now, I think Cavani was a poor buy and will flop. However, I was absolutely delighted to be proven wrong thus far regarding Bruno, and would be equally delighted if Cavani went and made me eat my words. That, for me, is the difference between many of the Ole outers and those on the Ole in side of things.

Very good well thought out post mate.

I agree with your overall sentiment but I do reiterate that it's certain posters from both sides causing the consternation in here. I feel a small minority of posters aren't posting in good faith and have no real desire to have a reasoned debate. They only turn up here when we win/lose so they can gloat and rub their opinions in peoples faces, and act rather intolerable, if the truth be told. The problem with this - as you alluded to - is that rational posts get lost in the mire of petty insults and point scoring. It's a shame, because there's certainly good reasoned debate from both sides and some very good posters, yourself included. But this whole nonsical trend of posters 'calling each other out' for a petty row and making constant smary remarks is getting tedious and needs to be reined in. I saw a fair few minor personal insults in here tonight which is just pathetic.

I don't identify as an 'Ole outer' as I didn't identify myself as an 'Ole inner' when I gave him my unwavering support. Both terms are pathetic if I'm being honest. I want the best manager possible so we can finally compete again. I have serious reservations about Ole being a really top level coach but I can acknowledge he's made plenty of really positive changes throughout the club. I just feel our bottom level is far too low and our form is too patcy. The next 5 games will give us an honest indication where we are.

At the end of the day we all should want what's best for the club. That doesn't entail blind support either though. Ole can certainly be commended for his positive attributes but conversely his negative attributes and shortcomings are fair game to discuss. There's nothing to indicate he can't improve and progress as a manager especially in the coaching department. But I also see no massively clear indication that he has what it takes to have us challenging for top honours, and that's where we need to be again. I'm actually more ambivalent towards him as our manager. He's a huge upgrade on Jose - in the sense that he's not a toxic character - but I also have serious doubts about him. But more so, I have no faith in the Board making a good appointment if he were to be sacked.

I have no issue with the opinions from both sides, but I find if you become too entrenched in either side, you eventually lack any nuance or desire to alter or amend your opinion no matter what. It's how some of the opinions are conveyed that is causing all this needless passive aggressive tension.

 

[Jezpeza]

Not aiming this at any particular person, but anyone who says that people who think he should be sacked are somehow not real fans are seriously self righteous arseholes. And dumber than a bag of rocks.

i think a lot of it hinges on the tone of posts etc. I’m not against anyone making reasonable points about why they doubt his management, but some seem to love to see us lose just to be able to run here and say ‘told you so’. Then anything positive that happens is a fluke or someone elses credit. Its a bit bizarre/unreasonable to stick to a rhetoric no matter what. It never makes any progress anywhere in life, not in business or politics or anywhere. After the positive run at the end of the last season it was obviously disappointing to lose a couple of semi finals but a bit silly for the Ole out brigade to come out of hibernation to celebrate like the loss to Sevilla was Xmas day. The blind negativity gets boring.

personally i think he has learning to do and sometimes fails to engage a plan B in games or make effective subs. But then he made effective subs today. He has the support of the players - they run for him etc. They have never downed tools even in the rough patches. The squad is really on its way as well considering where it was.

theres also more at stake with the board and ownership etc. I think every fan realises we are still in need of about 200m of players for the first 11 or some wonderkids to come from the youth setup to really challenge for anything serious. We should be winning serious trophies but we will need a squad and manager of a level to do that. Given the current work on the squad and that any other manager will have the same holes he deserves a while yet barring any major disasters

 

[Robbie Boy]

Good post Robbie. My man.

At least someone likes my posts

Cheers Ish, hope you're keeping well mate

 

[Robbie Boy]

quiet tonight

Are you having a laugh

It's been like a fecking asylum in here tonight unless you haven't bothered reading any of the previous pages.

 

[Widow]

'it's the hope that kills you'

Good display/result tonight but how long will it last?

'the season starts now'

Great words but fail to perform in our next few games and tonight will be forgotten.

I'm not trying to sound negative, just sharing a few things to ponder

Even at 1-0 down we looked up for it tonight. They'll say the score line flattered as they came late on but in truth, we battered them!

This said, how much is contributed to Ole?

I absolutely love Ole as a person, his attitude and passion towards the club are a bright light BUT I still feel that he is tactically inept. How I'd love to be proven wrong!

Does it even matter if it's Ole at the wheel or some other chump, the board only back them so far anyway!

All things concidered, I don't have a clue!

A change of manager without changes in the board room is pointless! Same old story going around and around and around

 

[Rado_N]

i think a lot of it hinges on the tone of posts etc. I’m not against anyone making reasonable points about why they doubt his management, but some seem to love to see us lose just to be able to run here and say ‘told you so’. Then anything positive that happens is a fluke or someone elses credit. Its a bit bizarre/unreasonable to stick to a rhetoric no matter what. It never makes any progress anywhere in life, not in business or politics or anywhere. After the positive run at the end of the last season it was obviously disappointing to lose a couple of semi finals but a bit silly for the Ole out brigade to come out of hibernation to celebrate like the loss to Sevilla was Xmas day. The blind negativity gets boring.

personally i think he has learning to do and sometimes fails to engage a plan B in games or make effective subs. But then he made effective subs today. He has the support of the players - they run for him etc. They have never downed tools even in the rough patches. The squad is really on its way as well considering where it was.

theres also more at stake with the board and ownership etc. I think every fan realises we are still in need of about 200m of players for the first 11 or some wonderkids to come from the youth setup to really challenge for anything serious. We should be winning serious trophies but we will need a squad and manager of a level to do that. Given the current work on the squad and that any other manager will have the same holes he deserves a while yet barring any major disasters

Nobody with any sense is “celebrating” defeats or hating it when we win, this is the exact kind of nonsense I’m talking about.

There’s clearly clowns on both sides of the debate, but I’d hope that everyone is motivated by what they believe to be the best thing for the future of the club. Although I could probably name a few exceptions.

I’ve posted in this thread plenty of times to say I’m delighted with x/y/z result but it doesn’t change my mind, and tonight is no different. Of course I’m happy we won, and celebrated every goal, but that doesn’t change my overall view on the matter.

 

[sammsky1]

Dogmatic people with inexorable opinions can’t be reasoned with through cultured or factual debate. It’s therefore unsurprising that they are perceived as self righteous arseholes and are dumber than a bag of rocks

 

[Hernandez - BFA]

Season started today according to Ole so anything that’s happened prior to this is irrelevant.

Let’s go for the unbeaten season!

 

[Wilt]

Nah mate, getting a bit annoyed by posters wanting to be 'Top Reds' attacking posters because we beat Newcastle. Throw all the insults you want when Ole actually wins something. You do realise that most of our rivals love that Ole is in the job?

Yes, in my experience this

 

[Greck]

Season started today according to Ole so anything that’s happened prior to this is irrelevant.

Let’s go for the unbeaten season!

Actually looked it up and he did say so. That we were unfit in the last few games and our season is starting now. As a skeptic it carries a hint of "I wasn't ready, it didn't count" but let's see if he can string some results with this recovered fitness he speaks of

 

[ayushreddevil9]

3 of the next 4 games are at home. We do feck all at home. I am worried for Ole.

 

[Tony247]

Against Newcastle we won the midfield battle squarely. Hope Ole has learned the problem of playing front 3 all the time, compromising midfield balance. Hope he gives up his obsession and put team's balance as top priority.

 

[PitTon]

- We know the two midfielders in his favorite 4231 needed legs and running, Fred and Tommy proved to be a good combo before. Once again I hope he stops that Matic Pogba combination.

- Two positive things today that had to come from his instructions: James positioned himself more in the middle from left side that helped him pick up a lot of passes and have spaces to run. With more awareness and head up look, he may become useful. Another was AWB higher position up the pitch. That really helped the build up and with more composure he can produce more dangerous situations.

Let's see how he sets up the team with coming games. Today shows that Mata, James, so called back up players Fred and Tommy can perform well if the team is set up with right balance.

 

[Tony247]

- We know the two midfielders in his favorite 4231 needed legs and running, Fred and Tommy proved to be a good combo before. Once again I hope he stops that Matic Pogba combination.

- Two positive things today that had to come from his instructions: James positioned himself more in the middle from left side that helped him pick up a lot of passes and have spaces to run. With more awareness and head up look, he may become useful. Another was AWB higher position up the pitch. That really helped the build up and with more composure he can produce more dangerous situations.

Let's see how he sets up the team with coming games. Today shows that Mata, James, so called back up players Fred and Tommy can perform well if the team is set up with right balance.

We are stuffed with many good players. They all may not be world class individually but put them in right place they can make a world class team. It is sad that it took Martial's suspension for Ole to choose a better balanced team. Many were asking to give up front three and utilize midified instead. But Ole as a manager should be proactively seeing how dysfunctional team is and fix the problem, not choose right team by accident. Hence my faith in Ole as a manager is all time low.

Hope this solid midfield performance doesn't become a glitch.

 

[Flexdegea]

'it's the hope that kills you'

Good display/result tonight but how long will it last?

'the season starts now'

Great words but fail to perform in our next few games and tonight will be forgotten.

I'm not trying to sound negative, just sharing a few things to ponder

Even at 1-0 down we looked up for it tonight. They'll say the score line flattered as they came late on but in truth, we battered them!

This said, how much is contributed to Ole?

I absolutely love Ole as a person, his attitude and passion towards the club are a bright light BUT I still feel that he is tactically inept. How I'd love to be proven wrong!

Does it even matter if it's Ole at the wheel or some other chump, the board only back them so far anyway!

All things concidered, I don't have a clue!

A change of manager without changes in the board room is pointless! Same old story going around and around and around

Ponder this,


The team put a massive performance out tonight for the manager,

Feels like most games when he is down an out, the team show a performance.

 

[Gasolin]

We are stuffed with many good players. They all may not be world class individually but put them in right place they can make a world class team. It is sad that it took Martial's suspension for Ole to choose a better balanced team. Many were asking to give up front three and utilize midified instead. But Ole as a manager should be proactively seeing how dysfunctional team is and fix the problem, not choose right team by accident. Hence my faith in Ole as a manager is all time low.

Hope this solid midfield performance doesn't become a glitch.

We can discuss the merit of stacking up players but we have in Martial a player that has the technical ability to fixate a lot of teams and be the calming pass. Why not use him? He’s almost playing like a false 9 now, so that’s his role. Mata took Martial’s role when in the middle in the last game.

There are food for thoughts but I would trust Ole as he sees fitness, confidence and technical abilities in training, which we don’t.

We play with Rashford and Greenwood because we are looking for certain type of goals. Ultimately, the formation matters not so much in reality. It’s the offensive and defensive intend that we should be looking for and Ole wanted verticality to move the ball quickly and hurt fast. Our best team will still involve Martial and Rashford, and may still involve Greenwood until a Mata like player comes up, maybe this Diallo dude.

 

[CG1010]

Regardless if OGS is sacked or not - look at the state of our club compared to where we were 2 years ago. We are sitting with Cavani, Martial, Greenwood, Wiliams, Tuanzebe, Lingard and Romero not in the squad - we have v.d Beek, Matic, Bailly and Pogba on the bench

Compare that to where we were when we lost to Liverpool 2 years ago and Mourinho got fired.

Maybe OGS wont survive the season - but my God he will have made the next managers job a lot easier than it was when he got the job

Completely agree.. both LVG and Mourinho left us either similar or worse off than before. And in addition gave us long term problems to solve. Like LVG experimenting with how it goes if there are no attacking players or Mourinho deciding to build the team around Pogba and Sanchez.

Ole has been much much better in terms of squad building. Imagine if Woodword had actually backed him, he would have probably ended up strengthening the CB position / got Sancho.

 

[jamesjimmybyrondean]

I don't know what to make of it but it does look like the team is reliant on some external stimuli before they start playing well and motivated. Mourinho getting sacked and Ole coming in was a stimuli, facing big teams is also a stimuli, getting Bruno Pogba and Rashford back for that second half of last season was one as well, getting battered by Spurs is another. We've also seen this reliance on some stimuli in games too when we play sluggishly but once we concede we wake up.

 

[Acquire Me]

Very good well thought out post mate.

I agree with your overall sentiment but I do reiterate that it's certain posters from both sides causing the consternation in here. I feel a small minority of posters aren't posting in good faith and have no real desire to have a reasoned debate. They only turn up here when we win/lose so they can gloat and rub their opinions in peoples faces, and act rather intolerable, if the truth be told. The problem with this - as you alluded to - is that rational posts get lost in the mire of petty insults and point scoring. It's a shame, because there's certainly good reasoned debate from both sides and some very good posters, yourself included. But this whole nonsical trend of posters 'calling each other out' for a petty row and making constant smary remarks is getting tedious and needs to be reined in. I saw a fair few minor personal insults in here tonight which is just pathetic.

I don't identify as an 'Ole outer' as I didn't identify myself as an 'Ole inner' when I gave him my unwavering support. Both terms are pathetic if I'm being honest. I want the best manager possible so we can finally compete again. I have serious reservations about Ole being a really top level coach but I can acknowledge he's made plenty of really positive changes throughout the club. I just feel our bottom level is far too low and our form is too patcy. The next 5 games will give us an honest indication where we are.

At the end of the day we all should want what's best for the club. That doesn't entail blind support either though. Ole can certainly be commended for his positive attributes but conversely his negative attributes and shortcomings are fair game to discuss. There's nothing to indicate he can't improve and progress as a manager especially in the coaching department. But I also see no massively clear indication that he has what it takes to have us challenging for top honours, and that's where we need to be again. I'm actually more ambivalent towards him as our manager. He's a huge upgrade on Jose - in the sense that he's not a toxic character - but I also have serious doubts about him. But more so, I have no faith in the Board making a good appointment if he were to be sacked.

I have no issue with the opinions from both sides, but I find if you become too entrenched in either side, you eventually lack any nuance or desire to alter or amend your opinion no matter what. It's how some of the opinions are conveyed that is causing all this needless passive aggressive tension.

Well said. This should be the end of discussion tbh.

 

[devilish]

Very good well thought out post mate.

I agree with your overall sentiment but I do reiterate that it's certain posters from both sides causing the consternation in here. I feel a small minority of posters aren't posting in good faith and have no real desire to have a reasoned debate. They only turn up here when we win/lose so they can gloat and rub their opinions in peoples faces, and act rather intolerable, if the truth be told. The problem with this - as you alluded to - is that rational posts get lost in the mire of petty insults and point scoring. It's a shame, because there's certainly good reasoned debate from both sides and some very good posters, yourself included. But this whole nonsical trend of posters 'calling each other out' for a petty row and making constant smary remarks is getting tedious and needs to be reined in. I saw a fair few minor personal insults in here tonight which is just pathetic.

I don't identify as an 'Ole outer' as I didn't identify myself as an 'Ole inner' when I gave him my unwavering support. Both terms are pathetic if I'm being honest. I want the best manager possible so we can finally compete again. I have serious reservations about Ole being a really top level coach but I can acknowledge he's made plenty of really positive changes throughout the club. I just feel our bottom level is far too low and our form is too patcy. The next 5 games will give us an honest indication where we are.

At the end of the day we all should want what's best for the club. That doesn't entail blind support either though. Ole can certainly be commended for his positive attributes but conversely his negative attributes and shortcomings are fair game to discuss. There's nothing to indicate he can't improve and progress as a manager especially in the coaching department. But I also see no massively clear indication that he has what it takes to have us challenging for top honours, and that's where we need to be again. I'm actually more ambivalent towards him as our manager. He's a huge upgrade on Jose - in the sense that he's not a toxic character - but I also have serious doubts about him. But more so, I have no faith in the Board making a good appointment if he were to be sacked.

I have no issue with the opinions from both sides, but I find if you become too entrenched in either side, you eventually lack any nuance or desire to alter or amend your opinion no matter what. It's how some of the opinions are conveyed that is causing all this needless passive aggressive tension.

this

 

[Bobcat]

I agree that there's been some idiotic posts on both sides, but is that really toxic, or just a natural response to the progressively worse opinions that have been loudly and repeatedly stated by a very select few people on the other side of the aisle?

Those posts aren't exactly being posted in a vacuum, are they? Even when people have been rational and conciliatory in their tone, the posts have either been largely ignored or just pounced upon by those people taking bits and pieces out of context and then proceeding to repeat the same buzz words ad infinitum, or just straight up saying it's bollocks or shit with nary a thought to having a wider debate.

Look, I can understand if people don't think he's the right man to take this club forward. Logically speaking, his record before coming to Utd was never a realistic preparation for it, and those dark days last season were very dark. However, he has done a lot of things right as well. Things which other, more illustrious managers didn't have the brass tacks to do.

He deserves credit for those things, as well as the benefit of the doubt considering where we ended up last season.

At the end of the day, it was 3 bad games and considering where everyone else is this year, those games weren't terminal. So, the question I always come back to is what is the harm exactly, in wanting to support the team and the manager? If it doesn't work out, then fair enough, but we have by no means not got to that point where we can make that judgement - especially now that he hasn't been given a lot of the targets that he initially set out to get.

This negativity and so-called 'realism', is very grating and just makes the experience of being here increasingly unpleasant. Especially when some of the worst offenders for it were MIA when the team was doing well. That doesn't tell me that they are sincere, rather that they have their own agenda and would rather be proven right than actually want the team to succeed. A fan can have legitimate concerns but still want us to do well, and from my vantage point, I just don't see that with a lot of these people. I, for example, thought Bruno wasn't going to be good enough, and right now, I think Cavani was a poor buy and will flop. However, I was absolutely delighted to be proven wrong thus far regarding Bruno, and would be equally delighted if Cavani went and made me eat my words. That, for me, is the difference between many of the Ole outers and those on the Ole in side of things.

Spot on. Not trying to fan the flames here, but i think a lot of people made up their minds about Ole a long time ago and are suffering from a bad case of confirmation bias. No one can deny that the first three league games were abysmal and getting embarrassed 6-1 at home really stung, but it seems to me a lot of people took those as evidence they were right all along. All context got thrown right out the window and the old hits of "bad coaching" and "patters of play" were played on repeat here. Why is it that coaching only gets mentioned when we lose and/or play poorly, where as post lockdown it was hardly a topic in this thread.

Ole hardly has an impressive CV, so i get that people point their fingers at him when things are going badly. Hes never proven he can hack it at a top level so its actually not a big logical leap to conclude hes not up to it when things look grim. That being said, hes done no worse than his predecessors, all of which, had much more impressive CV's so i honestly think that should earn him a bit more rope, because at the end of the day, what a manger has done in the past with another club is inconsequential, its what he does with us now that matters

The thing that bothers me the most is that some people moan about the most meaningless shite like how he sits and looks during matches or something he said during an interview gets taken completely out of context and then picked apart and criticized. Thats a low blow really, because his conduct as manager here has been just fine. Another thing thats a low blow is people who (seemingly) gleefully mock him as "failed Cardiff manager" which is not only disrespectful, its fecking stuipd. Yeah, he got relegated with Cardiff, but they were a complete mess at the time and where heading there long before he took over

As such, a lot of the "realism" is just thinly veiled moaning, and considering a lot of people only show up when things are going badly, its a pretty strong indication that they are not really interested in any kind of debate, they just want to pound their chest and say "told you so"

 

[Mercurial]

Ole did well! He clearly has the team with him and showed some well needed variety in a time of need! Hope we string some good games now and steady the ship. Social aptitude and tenacious 'middle man' skills are his x-factors and he totally helped set the biopic straight for the time being. His coaching staff have evolved also as seen in the display of last night. As a compliamentary coaching unit together they are not giving up so easily and can go places if they manage to survive this tough patch ahead.

 

[matt10000]

I agree that there's been some idiotic posts on both sides, but is that really toxic, or just a natural response to the progressively worse opinions that have been loudly and repeatedly stated by a very select few people on the other side of the aisle?

Show me a public internet forum that isn’t full of idiotic posts, I have never come across one ever.

 

[scudetto_boy]

We have to keep him & give him the rest of the season to turn things around, he did it from July onwards last season. Hey, less we forget it is still the very start of a long season

 

[Dr. StrangeHate]

What's encouraging to see is that the knee jerking is becoming less. The voting percentage hasn't changed much.

 

[Smores]

What's encouraging to see is that the knee jerking is becoming less. The voting percentage hasn't changed much.

Yeah i never got that. I think most ended last season thinking he'd earned the right to keep his job even if their were doubts.

A few poor games is certainly justification for further concern but not for a sacking. He'll get to Christmas minimum unless we really implode.

The Newcastle result doesn't change much, if we beat Chelsea we'll have redeemed ourselves to an okay start on balance. If we lose or draw he'll remain 'under pressure'.

 

[Sean_RedDevil]

quiet tonight

He was lucky because i was ready for a new thread "Our coaching staff and players are stupid"

I mean Darlow was injured for the last 20 minutes of the match and we only managed one shoot on target (And it was Maguire) til the goal of Fernandes.

 

[JohnnyKills]

Good post Robbie. My man.

Yeah that's my view too. Whatever happens he's done a great job shifting so many players. The squad is so much better now.

 

[JohnnyKills]

Yeah i never got that. I think most ended last season thinking he'd earned the right to keep his job even if their were doubts.

A few poor games is certainly justification for further concern but not for a sacking. He'll get to Christmas minimum unless we really implode.

The Newcastle result doesn't change much, if we beat Chelsea we'll have redeemed ourselves to an okay start on balance. If we lose or draw he'll remain 'under pressure'.

Agree with this. Still think he'll go as soon as we start drifting away from the CL spots.

Everton's start has made things much more complicated. It's going to be a major fight to get top 4 this year and maybe we need a more experienced man to get us there.

 

[Mainoldo]

He was lucky because i was ready for a new thread "Our coaching staff and players are stupid"

I mean Darlow was injured for the last 20 minutes of the match and we only managed one shoot on target (And it was Maguire) til the goal of Fernandes.

I was thinking the same thing! Rashford.. Bruno.. let a couple fly or atleast feed balls where the keeper would be favourite coming off his line, he clearly isn’t going to leave his box. But oh well, we got the goals in the end.

 

[Gabagoo]

I am one of the most objective and cynical United supporters you will find, and I have been teetering between wanting Ole to stay or go, but after yesterday I saw enough positives - not counting the scoreline - for me to be happy with him staying the course and building a team in his vision.

I hope he replaces Carrick and McKenna with decent attacking coaches because they're letting him down, big time.

And I hope that youth players like Elanga can be brought through during Ole's time here because that will strengthen the manager's cause for overseeing this rebuild.

 

[Forevergiggs1]

That's a tad silly tbh. It's like if we beat PSG, people will rightly laud the fact that we beat a top side that made it to last seasons CL Final. Just like saying beating Newcastle - who had 6 shots on target all season prior to tonight- is a decent result but nothing more. Let's be honest, it's a game that most expected us to win.

Why can people no longer discuss context around wins/defeats and strengths/weaknesses of the opposition. Our last 20 minutes tonight was brilliant football and I feel VdB played a huge part in that. Overall, the performance was a-bit sloppy and disjointed for a lot of the match. Newcastle had zero attacking intent and let us have the ball. They were content with trying to counter using Saint Maxim as that outlet. We weren't great at all in the first half and again, struggled a-bit in the second half until the final 20 minutes. Ole made some positive subs that worked and there were some very pleasing overall player performances. But yeah, let's not pretend this Newcastle side aren't a poor enough side. They have a striker who is inept and a woeful midfield. They rely on their defence and a counter attacking system. I expect them to finish lower mid-table.

Overall, we finished the night on a positive note and that's great given we have a tough fixture list coming up. Good nights work in the end but plenty to be worked on. People aren't going to pretend we played swashbuckling football for ninty minutes, because it's far from the truth.

Just about sums everything up perfectly without resorting to insults and without over exaggerating yesterdays performance. It's really not that hard if you're a rational poster without agendas.

Other than the win what pleased me most about yesterdays performance was the fitness issue can now be put to bed and Rashford looking a lot more sharper than he has in a long time. Also even though Newcastle played awful we in the end got the balance right which shows we're not as bad a team as many make out. So just because we didn't get Sancho it doesn't mean that, "we'll be lucky to get top 6 with this team."

A lot of positives but there's bigger tests on the way.

 

[Untd55]

Dogmatic people with inexorable opinions can’t be reasoned with through cultured or factual debate. It’s therefore unsurprising that they are perceived as self righteous arseholes and are dumber than a bag of rocks

Nice to see you have self-awareness.

 

[Stepney73]

it would be better to judge ole(or any future manager)in half season blocks rather than wanting him sacked or backed every month or so depending on 2-4 results.