Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

Sack or Keep OLE?

  • Sack Ole & appoint new coach ASAP

  • Keep Ole & back him to finish rebuild


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It doesn't matter who the manager is if he is not backed when it matters.

United is purely a cash cow and nothing else. Glazers don't care about taking United back to where they should be.

They're quite happy to spend money (probably earned from United) on their American football team.
So you make the argument all around money?
Let's hire Moyes again and let's see where that takes us.

A manager's job is to also fecking coach his players. Other than Martial, who improved during Ole's time here?
- Shaw still can't make forward runs
- Rashford's 1st touch is worse than Lukaku's and he can't hit a 10 m pass
- Pogba played well for 10 games under him, then he was suddenly switched to a very defensive role
- AWB was decent for Palace, came in, turned into shit
- Lindelof can't jump for a header and is skinnier than me as a professional football player.
- The space between our lines when we have the ball is atrocious

We could go on like this for hours. If you think any manager would do the same because the club doesn't buy Messi and Ronaldo each summer you're drunk.

The only manager we hired in the last 7 years that actually improved players was Van Gaal and, to me, even if it fecking sounds crazy, he's the only one who deserved more than a season at Man United.

Our issue is mostly manager recruitment not manager backing. We should stop hiring buffoons like Jose and Ole and get some managers with a track record of improving players and having a positive style of play.

Remember that we have 3-4 almost 100mil players in the squad and teams like Everton and Southampton play better football than us. Hell even Brighton seem to have a better pattern of play than us. That is all 100% on the manager, not on the players or the owners being cash cnuts.
 
To that I'd say the quality of posts from the other side of the debate needs to be improved above all else. For far too long I've seen posters of a certain ilk being abusive and belittling, not just to other posters but to a club legend and someone who has the best interests of the club at heart.

Without going into all of your post I'll address this part. Absolutely both sides need to improve. If a post starts off with a poster labelling people kids or cultists because they have a differing opinion, chances are, people won't read the whole post. That, or they'll see blind rage and respond with a smart arse post or a rant. This serves no purpose to the debate at hand.

I have no doubt you have the clubs best interests at heart, but we all do mate. The problem is, there are posters on both sides can't convey their thoughts in a rational manner which leads to counterproductive petty squabbling and point scoring. I have zero issue with posters who disagree with me and we should all just try to put forward our thoughts and opinions without having to belittle contrasting opinions. We all want what's best for the club but I guess we all have differing expectations and see things differently. Nobody is right or wrong here, we can only present facts and opinions. The problems arise when people become so entrenched in their beliefs that they believe they're right and everyone else is wrong. This, I find anyway, leads to a lack of perspective, nuance and the ability to be able to rationally debate.

Both sides unfortunately have hate ravaged posters who skew stats and post in a very unpleasant manner. But if the rational posters steer clear from this manner of posting and sly digs, we'll have a far more balanced discussion. There's a-lot of cognitive dissonance and lack of self awareness from both sides and both are feeding into this hot topic of creating a toxic atmosphere.
 
Very loose BS rumors so far. Nothing serious for now.
Yeah looks like hot air to me.

Without going into all of your post I'll address this part. Absolutely both sides need to improve. If a post starts off with a poster labelling people kids or cultists because they have a differing opinion, chances are, people won't read the whole post. That, or they'll see blind rage and respond with a smart arse post or a rant. This serves no purpose to the debate at hand.

I have no doubt you have the clubs best interests at heart, but we all do mate. The problem is, there are posters on both sides can't convey their thoughts in a rational manner which leads to counterproductive petty squabbling and point scoring. I have zero issue with posters who disagree with me and we should all just try to put forward our thoughts and opinions without having to belittle contrasting opinions. We all want what's best for the club but I guess we all have differing expectations and see things differently. Nobody is right or wrong here, we can only present facts and opinions. The problems arise when people become so entrenched in their beliefs that they believe they're right and everyone else is wrong. This, I find anyway, leads to a lack of perspective, nuance and the ability to be able to rationally debate.

Both sides unfortunately have hate ravaged posters who skew stats and post in a very unpleasant manner. But if the rational posters steer clear from this manner of posting and sly digs, we'll have a far more balanced discussion. There's a-lot of cognitive dissonance and lack of self awareness from both sides and both are feeding into this hot topic of creating a toxic atmosphere.
Very good post.
 
Perhaps we could look at it a different way and instead of sacking Ole, the club got him better coaches. We have 2 relatively inexperienced (as in coaching a first team premier club) and perhaps we should look to bring some experience in. Phelan couldnt hack it at Hull alone, so perhaps he needed a Mulenstein at Utd as 2 experienced heads were better than one. Carrick and McKenna are not showing any improvement in tactics, build up play etc so a change of coaches and older experienced heads may make some difference.

Isn’t that what Liverpool did with Rodgers before they got Klopp? Pretty sure from memory they forced Gary McAllister and Sean O’Driscoll on him and they lasted like 10 games together.

If I was a manager in that scenario, I’d feel like the club is undermining me and really doesn’t show confidence in me. Typically the manager chooses the coaches he wants to work with, and the only time when a new coach has to be appointed is when another club poaches them, like when SAF lost Queiroz, McClaren and Kidd.
 
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/f...hester-United-eyeing-Mauricio-Pochettino.html

It is loose rumours. I still think the board have made the decision to sack Ole now. Just my feelings on it and not in any way saying its being reported.
Probably as a contingency plan of sorts makes some sense. It would be a true hit job on the Ole authority and reign if anything substantial leaked and was the true case.
Ole is between a rock and a hard place at the moment all things considered. I have mixed feelings on it.
 
I think we're preparing to get rid of him. It's the next phase in a business model we've been following since Sir Alex left.

I'm really disappointed to be honest. He's been fantastic imo. Third place was the best possible outcome last season, especially seeing as Martial and Rashford spent months out each and Pogba borderline sat out the season. We had no creativity in midfield until Jan and he was forced to rely on the likes of Pereira and Lingard. He changed the whole mood of the club, I really think people forget how dire things were at the end under Jose.

Whatever happened in the coming weeks / months he'll have left the club in a far better state than he got it in. He improved some players massively, he brought Greenwood through perfectly, there's more I could say about what I think he's done right but it's an argument I've been having with so many people for so long and its just tiresome at this point.

He's done better than I would have expected. But still, far from good enough. He bears some responsibility for players' fitness last season, being reckless. He also said he wasn't after a midfielder last summer if I recall, so again, no pressure, no pointed word. Was very happy. Pogba gets injured, and we're fecked. Pogba comes back, and Ole plays him for 120 minutes in an Cup game against an EFL team. Injury reoccurs.

He's also spent serious money and committed us to players who may not be ideal for the way he allegedly wants to play.

So, all in all, some good things, some bad things. Just wanted to respond because this presentation was a bit over the top.
 
Probably as a contingency plan of sorts makes some sense. It would be a true hit job on the Ole authority and reign if anything substantial leaked and was the true case.
Ole is between a rock and a hard place at the moment all things considered. I have mixed feelings on it.
Personally doesn't sit well with me. In the past I wanted Van Gaal and Mourinho sacked. This time it isn't right. Before another manager takes the fall Ed Woodward and the board need to go first as that's the main problem. Also this feeling isn't just because it's a former Manchester United legend/player in the firing line. If it was Pochettino in this situation currently I would feel the same. I just think the board have made the decision to sack Ole.
 
Fully agreed mate. But this is the nature of the beast with football fandom these days. Kids who think they know it all when they genuinely do not.

He's done an amazing job with essentially one hand tied behind his back, and condensed 2 seasons of transition into one. He's cleared out so much of the deadwood without getting the chance to replace them, and totally revolutionised the squad with only 4 signings. My worry after the transfer window is that all that progress has been for nought because we're pretty much in the same position as we were at the end of last season and the teams around us have all improved, some significantly so.

I'm hoping against hope that he can turn it around but last season was a minor miracle in my eyes, and this time around it will be even more difficult. Here's to hoping though.
Amazing job! Revolutionised!

You expect not to get a reaction by posting hyperbolic crap like this?
 
So you make the argument all around money?
Let's hire Moyes again and let's see where that takes us.

A manager's job is to also fecking coach his players. Other than Martial, who improved during Ole's time here?
- Shaw still can't make forward runs
- Rashford's 1st touch is worse than Lukaku's and he can't hit a 10 m pass
- Pogba played well for 10 games under him, then he was suddenly switched to a very defensive role
- AWB was decent for Palace, came in, turned into shit
- Lindelof can't jump for a header and is skinnier than me as a professional football player.
- The space between our lines when we have the ball is atrocious

We could go on like this for hours. If you think any manager would do the same because the club doesn't buy Messi and Ronaldo each summer you're drunk.

The only manager we hired in the last 7 years that actually improved players was Van Gaal and, to me, even if it fecking sounds crazy, he's the only one who deserved more than a season at Man United.

Our issue is mostly manager recruitment not manager backing. We should stop hiring buffoons like Jose and Ole and get some managers with a track record of improving players and having a positive style of play.

Remember that we have 3-4 almost 100mil players in the squad and teams like Everton and Southampton play better football than us. Hell even Brighton seem to have a better pattern of play than us. That is all 100% on the manager, not on the players or the owners being cash cnuts.

We just scraped the barrel of the transfer market, we're supposed to be the biggest club in the world ffs.

Ole has done a good job, not perfect but he should have been backed after building some momentum at the end of last season.

I agreed about LVG. If there wasn't the rumours of Mourinho for the last 5 months of him being here maybe we could of made top 4 that year. It was only 1 point or goal difference (can't remember and not looking it up).

Support doesn't just mean with money.
 
Personally doesn't sit well with me. In the past I wanted Van Gaal and Mourinho sacked. This time it isn't right. Before another manager takes the fall Ed Woodward and the board need to go first as that's the main problem. Also this feeling isn't just because it's a former Manchester United legend/player in the firing line. If it was Pochettino in this situation currently I would feel the same. I just think the board have made the decision to sack Ole.
Unfortunately, board and Ed are going nowhere and need their fall guy when results halt. It's a very probable scenario to sack for a Pochettino replacement if we dont get results.
Ed is also a substantial shareholder and a lynchpin, best we can hope for is a quality dof so he takes a back seat on player decision or a club sale. Only way for Ole to stay is for him to start winning on the regular I think.
 
Sadly going by the Pochitteno reports today, I think the board have made the decision to sack Ole. You don't have Pochettiono on standby if you aren't going to sack the current manager.

I have a feeling the club leaked this rumour to divert the focus from the owners/Woodward over the botched transfer window. If that is the case, it is a shambolic way to run a football club irrespective of whether, like me, you don’t think Ole is good enough.
 
Back Ole. 100%. It's not even close. The board have undermined the manager. The manager had a happy enough dressing room at the end of the season and the board have messed about all summer. They're a disgrace. All it would have took, is clarity from the club. Clarity. Early On. If you don't want to spend that money? Release a statement early on. Be Pro active. The way they handled is an abomination, that's how bad they handled it. Because it made us look bad as a club and it hurt the spirit in the dressing room. We can talk about certain players who have not met the standard and we can say - some players need to be FINED...to cut out basic errors...but the owners need to be more professional. They've once again, not backed the manager and so this conversation or even topic annoys me immensely.
 
I think we're preparing to get rid of him. It's the next phase in a business model we've been following since Sir Alex left.

What has the club done to bring you to this decision?

Not trying to be combative or anything but just genuinely curious how you think the club are preparing for sacking him? Why not just sack him?

I can’t see anything that the club has done to make me think they don’t want him.

You say prepare, so that must mean there must be concrete evidence of that the club has done to push him towards the exit & you could argue the players he’s targeted? But you dont spend 100M on players if your going to change the manager after a few weeks
 
Not even 2 months ago we were playing some great football, in 3 semi finals and finished 3rd

Have a rocky start and we’re back to booting Ole out the club again?
 
Totally deserved to go too. Fact remains, so far he was more successful than Ole has been. Spin it how you like but it's a fact.

Ole is also nearing the same number of games in charge as LvG and both have a very similar win %. LvG got the boot despite winning a cup, so I see Ole's job being under scrutiny and he'll be gone soon, unless things drastically pick up.

If you only look at %s and trophies, then sure. The football was awful during that final season under LVG though, and the fixtures were very forgiving in that cup run. People who say we look clueless now, obviously don’t remember our back four under LVG endlessly passing it sideways because they didn’t know what else to do.
 
If you only look at %s and trophies, then sure. The football was awful during that final season under LVG though, and the fixtures were very forgiving in that cup run. People who say we look clueless now, obviously don’t remember our back four under LVG endlessly passing it sideways because they didn’t know what else to do.

I agree with most of that. I don't rate his time with us but what can we look at? Not win % or trophies?

For me, both done some good things: LvG brought through Rashford, signed Martial, had Smalling playing amazing, won the FA Cup, got us CL football, had some good wins over big sides etc. Ultimately we were streaky under him and went through spells of looking decent and then shite. His transfer record was overall quite poor too.

Ole is similar in many regards and both are untimely not good enough while both made some positive impacts. Certainly the football under LvG was the worst of the lot though, but he did have a clear identity for us. He just never managed to instill it properly much like Ole.
 
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I have a feeling the club leaked this rumour to divert the focus from the owners/Woodward over the botched transfer window. If that is the case, it is a shambolic way to run a football club irrespective of whether, like me, you don’t think Ole is good enough.
Doubt it. Not everything is a malicious briefing. If they are in contact with Poch he will have to get his team of assistants and coaches or whatever staff ready. The amount of people involved in a midseason takeover increases the possibility of leaks. The leaks could be innocent
 
It's prudent that they talk to him and maybe other managers too.
But no Board is going to buy all the players but the fecked up big time in this transfer window. I think our scouting is also a huge issue.
But Ole needs to get this team playing better. These are much better players than what they are showing on match day.
He is going to go if we keep losing our next few matches.
Is Poch a better manager? Probably from his record he is.
 
Doubt it. Not everything is a malicious briefing. If they are in contact with Poch he will have to get his team of assistants and coaches or whatever staff ready. The amount of people involved in a midseason takeover increases the possibility of leaks. The leaks could be innocent

Possibly but this Board has previous - Mourinho was not a surprise.
 
My patience is running out with Ole. He is playing players out of their position for far too long. It was okay as a stop-gap solution but that cannot be a permanent solution, I am suspecting he has tinkered with the defense which was not needed, he picks up wrong players until disaster happens, his in game management is questionable, he has got full season yet the team is not playing like well oiled machine and when you see Ancelotti's Everton this season it makes a huge difference how a good coach can influence the team. This is not Ole's team. They are like 11 disfunctional players he is picking up based on their fan popularity.

I will wait for next couple of matches. Not like I am expecting miracles but I need little bit of time to make my mind up.
 
I really hope that Giggs doesn't get the gig even if Ole is sacked. Now some people are pushing that line in the newspapers.
 
I have a feeling the club leaked this rumour to divert the focus from the owners/Woodward over the botched transfer window. If that is the case, it is a shambolic way to run a football club irrespective of whether, like me, you don’t think Ole is good enough.

Is it a botched transfer window though?

VDB - the guy is at the cusp of being WC. He's young, he's hungry, he's hardworking, he's class and he's more suited to our game then Pogba is
Telles - Brazilian LB. He's the epitome of a modern wingback. He's got a wicked cross, he's fast and he's quite good with his feet. His defensive is a bit meah but so are most attacking wingbacks
Traore - he's the finest winger of his age group coming out of the Serie A. Papu Gomez state that when Amad is with the ball he's unstoppable. He reminded him of Messi and no Argentinian would EVER make such a statement likely
Pellistri - he's a very promising winger as well.
Cavani - that's a high risk signing as he's been out for months. If things doesn't work out he's just on a 1 year contract.

Is Grealish really worth the extra 40m we would have needed to top VDB's deal? We're talking of a reserve here. Did we need to spend 100m on Sancho when we already had Greenwood + we were able to sign two extremely promising wingers? If you ask me I'd rather see us buy 2 CBs which is silly considering that Ole had already spent 145m in 3 players there (Maguire, AWB and Telles)

Ole should focus on coaching this squad properly. It's ridiculous that the performance of all players he signed had tanked.
 
He's going to be the scapegoat for the failure to land players, in order to take the heat off the actual problems with the club, however he is actually not a very good manager from a tactical and technical point of view so does need replacing.
 
Is it a botched transfer window though?

VDB - the guy is at the cusp of being WC. He's young, he's hungry, he's hardworking, he's class and he's more suited to our game then Pogba is
Telles - Brazilian LB. He's the epitome of a modern wingback. He's got a wicked cross, he's fast and he's quite good with his feet. His defensive is a bit meah but so are most attacking wingbacks
Traore - he's the finest winger of his age group coming out of the Serie A. Papu Gomez state that when Amad is with the ball he's unstoppable. He reminded him of Messi and no Argentinian would EVER make such a statement likely
Pellistri - he's a very promising winger as well.
Cavani - that's a high risk signing as he's been out for months. If things doesn't work out he's just on a 1 year contract.

Is Grealish really worth the extra 40m we would have needed to top VDB's deal? We're talking of a reserve here. Did we need to spend 100m on Sancho when we already had Greenwood + we were able to sign two extremely promising wingers? If you ask me I'd rather see us buy 2 CBs which is silly considering that Ole had already spent 145m in 3 players there (Maguire, AWB and Telles)

Ole should focus on coaching this squad properly. It's ridiculous that the performance of all players he signed had tanked.

The Sancho pursuit was too publicised to be described as anything other than botched. As for the players we actually bought, I don’t know enough about them to express an opinion, although it has been a long time since one of our promising punts paid off. Anyway, I am not trying to defend Ole - just querying why there are these stories appearing in early October. Either fire him pre-season for scraping 66 points and bombing out of cup competitions or back him with the players he wants. As usual, we seem to be between two stools.
 
If City are moving for Poch we need to absolutely start moving for him before them and secure him at least if not now then from next season. Can't think of a better choice for us post Ole currently.

The only problem that will be here with Poch in charge is that I'll have to block Amadaeus as he'll be worse than Ole in group here in dealing with criticism for him.
 
Pep has another 12 month left on his contract and city are desperate to renew his contract. Don’t believe all the crap you read in the gutter press.
 
Pep has another 12 month left on his contract and city are desperate to renew his contract. Don’t believe all the crap you read in the gutter press.
Yeh, if city wants Messi then keeping Pep is the key.
 
Not even 2 months ago we were playing some great football, in 3 semi finals and finished 3rd

Have a rocky start and we’re back to booting Ole out the club again?

All those semi finals were lost, some to lesser teams than our own. Players were played into the ground and momentum was lost. And while he did well to recover, it was only because he started the season so badly that a miraculous recovery was needed.

This isn’t the first slump either, in only two years. The condition, confidence and organisation of the players should all look better after two years and it doesn’t. A few losses at the start of the season wouldn’t have been the end of the world, but the manner of the performances, after two years in charge, are extremely worrying. Literally, all over the shop, three games in a row.

If Newcastle score 3-4 and it’s another defeat, I think he has to walk.

He will have had ample time to breed consistency and a certain level of performance should be required this far into his tenure.

He is Ole and we love him, but admitting he isn’t good enough to be manager of one of the biggest clubs in the world doesn’t make anyone an inferior supporter.

It comes out of love for the club and the need to separate sentimentality from what’s best for Manchester United.

I will be watching against Newcastle and supporting him, I will never abuse him or call him childish names, but if he loses heavily, people need to start to think about what’s best for the club.
 
I posted a while ago that Poch will probably already committed to City. Why do I think that? Firstly, Poch is still out of work which means he is either crap, which he isn’t, or he has a sure fire job lined up. Secondly, Guardiola is fading at City, the CL has been a disaster for them:boring: and he hasn’t shown any interest in doing another few seasons after his contract is up Third, City have form in signing up new managers whilst the current one is in post. Of course, that may all be bollocks, but sacking Ole is just a media storm. Sack a few players first.
 
I posted a while ago that Poch will probably already committed to City. Why do I think that? Firstly, Poch is still out of work which means he is either crap, which he isn’t, or he has a sure fire job lined up. Secondly, Guardiola is fading at City, the CL has been a disaster for them:boring: and he hasn’t shown any interest in doing another few seasons after his contract is up Third, City have form in signing up new managers whilst the current one is in post. Of course, that may all be bollocks, but sacking Ole is just a media storm. Sack a few players first.
You can turn everything you said to United as well. There is absolutely nothing in your post to suggest he's more likely an option for City than us. We sack managers when they are still in the role, our manager's star is fading at a far quicker rate, and we might not even make the Champions League if we continue with him in charge.

It's clear that Ole will more likely get sacked before Pep refuses to renew.
 
You can turn everything you said to United as well. There is absolutely nothing in your post to suggest he's more likely an option for City than us. We sack managers when they are still in the role, our manager's star is fading at a far quicker rate, and we might not even make the Champions League if we continue with him in charge.

It's clear that Ole will more likely get sacked before Pep refuses to renew.
Er, check points one,two and three again. In fact , read it all again. Ole was a game away from being sacked last season, Poch was available but had a clause that he couldn’t join another PL club for x months. When that expired, we still didn’t hire him. He’s not gone abroad nor been in the media touting himself, which means, to me anyway, he’s comfortable and a job lined up. Guardiola signed for City whilst he was at Munich, Pelligrini was signed whilst Mancini was still at City and he was signed weeks before they sacked Sparky. Replacing a manager that has won nothing with another that has won nothing is folly. If Ole goes, we need a big hitter.
 
City will never really sack Pep, but he might be the one interested in leaving. He's not really someone who's interested in long term at any club if you ask me.
 
All those semi finals were lost, some to lesser teams than our own. Players were played into the ground and momentum was lost. And while he did well to recover, it was only because he started the season so badly that a miraculous recovery was needed.

This isn’t the first slump either, in only two years. The condition, confidence and organisation of the players should all look better after two years and it doesn’t. A few losses at the start of the season wouldn’t have been the end of the world, but the manner of the performances, after two years in charge, are extremely worrying. Literally, all over the shop, three games in a row.

If Newcastle score 3-4 and it’s another defeat, I think he has to walk.

He will have had ample time to breed consistency and a certain level of performance should be required this far into his tenure.

He is Ole and we love him, but admitting he isn’t good enough to be manager of one of the biggest clubs in the world doesn’t make anyone an inferior supporter.

It comes out of love for the club and the need to separate sentimentality from what’s best for Manchester United.

I will be watching against Newcastle and supporting him, I will never abuse him or call him childish names, but if he loses heavily, people need to start to think about what’s best for the club.

Very fair assessment.
 
Er, check points one,two and three again. In fact , read it all again. Ole was a game away from being sacked last season, Poch was available but had a clause that he couldn’t join another PL club for x months. When that expired, we still didn’t hire him. He’s not gone abroad nor been in the media touting himself, which means, to me anyway, he’s comfortable and a job lined up. Guardiola signed for City whilst he was at Munich, Pelligrini was signed whilst Mancini was still at City and he was signed weeks before they sacked Sparky. Replacing a manager that has won nothing with another that has won nothing is folly. If Ole goes, we need a big hitter.
I've checked all your points. Not a single one of this suggests he's set for City. It's a weird conspiracy based on nothing.
 
I posted a while ago that Poch will probably already committed to City. Why do I think that? Firstly, Poch is still out of work which means he is either crap, which he isn’t, or he has a sure fire job lined up. Secondly, Guardiola is fading at City, the CL has been a disaster for them:boring: and he hasn’t shown any interest in doing another few seasons after his contract is up Third, City have form in signing up new managers whilst the current one is in post. Of course, that may all be bollocks, but sacking Ole is just a media storm. Sack a few players first.
I for one hope Guardiola doesn't renew and Poch is lined up to replace him. Which might be a blessing in disguise because it might force us to think outside of the box.
 
Come 10pm on Saturday night the pressure on Ole will be huge. I don’t see him turning the Spurs result around so quickly, especially with players away on international duty too. He just doesn’t have the managerial clout to do it - tactically and man-management he is weak.
Ole ball relies too much on key players producing moments of brilliance rather than a collaborative team effort and hard work. We have no style or method in our play.
His appointment is a joke with every other fan of football. I work with fans of so many other clubs and even the Rangers fans wouldn’t have him as manager. If he wasn’t an ex United player I doubt his support from our own fans would be so high.
 
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