Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)
- Thread starter MrSingh2002
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Stay safe mate..So am I mate but on my last warning i'm getting a bit jumpy
Good on you for saying this. Looking through this thread there are loads of people claiming they were actually still right to want him gone (back then), despite all the evidence to the contrary...
I stuck by Ole until the Burnley game then had a weak moment and voted to replace at the end of the season. I could not be happier to be proven wrong, I'm enjoying this period so much.
You're right about Ole and tactics too, he's doing a good job of it. If you look at the posters who claim he is weak tactically, they usually add zero depth to that point of view other than saying "patterns of play" or some shit.
For example, our defensive shape is excellent compared to recent seasons. Even when we concede a silly goal, the team keeps its shape and doesn't panic. Compare that to Mourinho and even Ole's earlier season form and it's like night and day. We also consistently lost our defensive shape and high-line towards the end of games we were winning, usually finishing matches with our backs against the wall. Getting a team to turn that around takes time and consistent practise.
Look at how we finished the game yesterday, coasting. Defensive shape solid. Keeping the high-line. You don't go from where we were two years ago to that without solid tactics and coaching.
Even in the Bournemouth game we kept our shape and plan despite some horror mistakes which would typically unsettle us.
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You know, some football fans have more in-depth knowledge of the game and they understand why sometimes results are not going in the right way, they can see the big picture. There're also many fans who have a view that we are Manchester United, if we are not challenging for the title, the problem must be the manager. With those fans, it's just very difficult to convey that even the best coaches in the world such as SAF, Klop, Pep win titles because they have amazing players. A great coach can only achieve so much with average players. If you takeout Pogba and Bruno and replace them with Andreas and Lingard, we'll go back to our old ways in the beginning of season. It takes amazing players and a great coach to win the league.
I'll try, as long as I don't post when i'm sober or drunk I should be okay
I don't particularly have a problem with anyone being critical about him, or even suggesting that we could get someone else. The problem is when the criticism gets personal, like insulting him on an individual level or making hyperbolic ridiculous statements to describe his ability.
I mean even now, there are people questioning his tactical knowlege even though he has been very flexible with formations and even style of football depending on the players he has available, and generally been very good in big games showing his tactical prowess quite well.
I mean even now, there are people questioning his tactical knowlege even though he has been very flexible with formations and even style of football depending on the players he has available, and generally been very good in big games showing his tactical prowess quite well.
I changed my vote.
I am happy for him to keep proving me wrong.
I think we challenge for the title next season barring a disaster.
I am happy for him to keep proving me wrong.
I think we challenge for the title next season barring a disaster.
Good balanced post
and honest too.I think positive attack minded coach is the word. I think the other three is also attacking but in more negative ways. Mou though at few times no doubt playing defensive football.
Yeah I don't get that second part. Even if Klopp (if the rumour is true) is not available, surely the management team could find someone else that fits more the attacking philosophy that we had.. instead of you know who. LVG is also odd since Holland at that that time WC is playing a boring attacking football. It's really odd but I suppose that says a lot of how the structure at the top is a mess? in terms of football decision making wise/system.
I literally just gave a response to one such hipster about the DoF topic who also happened to be a Dortmund fan, in the Sancho thread.
(Oh how I enjoyed it
)I so wanted to elaborate further but I’m hoping for his sake, I won’t have to.
Any other manager in place of Ole, or the placement of a new DoF could’ve influenced or hampered the progress we have recently made so I’m totally contempt with the strategy we chose and stuck to.
Sure a DoF will optimize our operations in the long term but if anything, by the time we decide to hire one, the timing will be much better. So will the appointment.
Ole!
After round 24 - we were 5th - With 9 wins, 7 draws and 8 defeats and a gd +7
We were 36 Points behind Liverpool, 17 behind City, 14 behind Leicester, 6 behind Chelsea and the same amount of Points as Spurs and Wolves
We had 11 Points down to relegation
After round 34 - we are still 5th - With 16 wins, 10 draws and 8 defeats and a gd +26
We are 34 Points behind Liverpool, 11 behind City, 1 behind Leicester, 2 behind Chelsea - and respectively 9 and 6 in front of Spurs and Wolves
You can always argue that it would have been the right choice to fire the manager after round 24 - but to still think the same thing when we currently are the best team in England both in terms of the football played, and the Points collected - now that is strange.
We were 36 Points behind Liverpool, 17 behind City, 14 behind Leicester, 6 behind Chelsea and the same amount of Points as Spurs and Wolves
We had 11 Points down to relegation
After round 34 - we are still 5th - With 16 wins, 10 draws and 8 defeats and a gd +26
We are 34 Points behind Liverpool, 11 behind City, 1 behind Leicester, 2 behind Chelsea - and respectively 9 and 6 in front of Spurs and Wolves
You can always argue that it would have been the right choice to fire the manager after round 24 - but to still think the same thing when we currently are the best team in England both in terms of the football played, and the Points collected - now that is strange.
Might be able take take some of the silly feckers off ignore soon. It's been tough waiting for you to see what's happening.
Edit: Done. Everyone is off ignore. I really hope I can go through a few pages without hearing the words PE teacher, Pochetino or "patterns of play" You can do it lads.
Edit: Done. Everyone is off ignore. I really hope I can go through a few pages without hearing the words PE teacher, Pochetino or "patterns of play" You can do it lads.
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Disagreement or having the opinion that another opinion is dumb is not an attack. People are to precious now days with being confronted on their views.
Changed my vote to Yes. I had been firmly in the Ole out camp for a long time and I am not one to flip flop after each result. However the consistency I am now seeing, and more importantly the style of attacking play means I am as a fan satisfied with the direction we are going. Also happy to see Ole freezing out the likes of Lingard, Jones means that he does have the personality aswell. Ideal summer for me would be Sancho and Upamenco coming in and Jones, Lingard going out
The poll should never have even existed in the first place. This thread and the votes are dominated by those that want him out and and rage votes after losses. It has never reflected the view of all fans.
Click the 'who replied' button and it's a list of posters very quiet at moment after months of telling us how wrong we were. It's fine having an alternate view and some are good posters making valid points but many of them just basically hurled abuse at Solskjaer and anyone who disagreed with them for 100+ posts.
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Fantastic post, but as much as we are praising ourselves, we have to be so glad that Leiscter are having a meltdown and now UCL is on the table. No body would have cared about our progress if we were not in the top 4 race.
They're not having a meltdown, they've just regressed to mean. A team that was massively over performing before Christmas thanks to zero injuries and Vardy being on an unsustainable scoring run.
The most hilarious/best thing about watching the United games since the restart, is how well coached and we'll drilled we look.
Everyone knows their role, everyone knows where they should be,
When I can remember so many posters asking if Ole actually coaches these players, what do they do on the training ground etc etc
Who knew it would just take some time to get there eh!!?
Didn't play great last night, never hit top gear, but had the game under total control from start to finish, couldn't have said that about many games in the first half of the season.
Everyone knows their role, everyone knows where they should be,
When I can remember so many posters asking if Ole actually coaches these players, what do they do on the training ground etc etc
Who knew it would just take some time to get there eh!!?
Didn't play great last night, never hit top gear, but had the game under total control from start to finish, couldn't have said that about many games in the first half of the season.
So how do you tell if a team is having a meltdown or they were just way over performing earlier? Sounds like you're just trying to create a story that fits the narrative.
He's 100% not going to be sacked. The players will probably riot if that happens too
We have a team that we can get behind now and one that actually represents a Man Utd side. Even when LvG and Mourinho had decent runs of form, the United style was not recognisable and good dominant performances with attractive football would be few and far between.
Ole has us playing with an attractive style, some of the 1 touch stuff in the final third is great to watch and it's actually fun to watch United now. Over the last 6 years living in Australia, I have dreaded waking up in the early hours/or staying up to watch us produce some utter dross, most of the time going behind and just knowing we are not going to come back or limplessly getting results that we give it a bit of hope that better days are on there way. Only now, do I look forward to watching United play again, and credit has to go to Ole atm for that.
Ole has us playing with an attractive style, some of the 1 touch stuff in the final third is great to watch and it's actually fun to watch United now. Over the last 6 years living in Australia, I have dreaded waking up in the early hours/or staying up to watch us produce some utter dross, most of the time going behind and just knowing we are not going to come back or limplessly getting results that we give it a bit of hope that better days are on there way. Only now, do I look forward to watching United play again, and credit has to go to Ole atm for that.
Well I disagree, it was clear to me and my friends that Ole was building a system which was greater than the sum of its parts. Individually players like Martial and Rashford, alongside Fred and Mctominay were playing well but we were seriously hurt by injuries in key positions. So many of our attacks were breaking done in that midfield and in the final third so it was always going to be difficult to get consistent results. However, it didn't take a rocket scientist to see that if we replaced a few key positions (I.e. Bruno in 10) then we had the makings of a decent team. People also conveniently forget that we had a series of unfortunate results like Wolves (missed the pen), Liverpool we were the better team, and many more.
Its so easy to just sit there as an armchair manager and say the results aren't good enough but for me it was still obvious progress and most importantly I haven't felt down at any point this season, when in comparison I had given up any hope in year two under Mourinho.
Some of us had a feeling Leicester would have a drop off in form.
I said before Christmas I thought they'd drop out of the top 4 and it's a possiblity now. They were over-performing while we were under-performing.
Vardy was scoring at an unsustainable rate with a limited number of chances and teams weren't taking their chances against them.
The only real challengers for 3rd and 4th were always going to drop points.
I'd also have to disagree with the top 4 thing. If were completely out of the race for top 4 in some alternate universe, where Leicester had a stronger squad and Chelsea could defend, the run we've gone on and the performances are enough to prove the manager knows that he doing.
They also didn't take into account that he'd replaced around half of Mourinho's starting XI and was missing some of his best players.
Who knew it takes time to integrate new players and for a team to gel?
is your bag packed ?
I literally just gave a response to one such hipster about the DoF topic who also happened to be a Dortmund fan, in the Sancho thread.
(Oh how I enjoyed it
First of all, you don't know what hipster actually means. Second of all, you don't understand what DoF actually does. Third of all, DoF wasn't the criticism thrown at the club at last 7 years. It was plainness direction about it.
DoF is merely a guy who tries to execute a club vision, no more, no less. And vision was changed on the daily bases.
And yes, Ole still needs a help there or I want a guy who will (after you start moaning we are not in a title race next season) try to continue what we are doing right now.
There's no way that Ole is going anywhere. He's already the best post-Fergie manager we've had. Nobody is bantering United anymore and we are getting back to being feared and hated by everyone again.
The important thing is that even if the staunch haters still can't acknowledge the magnificent job he has done overall, I'm pretty sure the board are very happy with him and will back him all the way in the summer.
People just need to accept he's staying and enjoy the ride.
The important thing is that even if the staunch haters still can't acknowledge the magnificent job he has done overall, I'm pretty sure the board are very happy with him and will back him all the way in the summer.
People just need to accept he's staying and enjoy the ride.
I think you mean, many of the Ole-Outers wouldn't have cared about our progress if we weren't in the top 4 race. Plenty of us have been looking at the bigger picture all season long.
The myth that we sack managers if we don't finish in top 4 needs to end.
Yes, Moyes was sacked a day after it got confirmed that we wouldn't be playing CL, but he would have been sacked then or end of the season in either case. It might have been cheaper based on clauses in his contract to wait for us to wait till we were mathematically out of CL places rather than sack him after Fulham or Olympiakos.
LVG was headed for the sack in the 2nd seasons either way. Even if we would have managed a draw against WHU at Upton Park, it was quite clear that LVG was to be sacked. Additionally, based on how quickly Mou became our new manager, I wouldn't be shocked if the decision was taken as early as March or so.
Mou finished 6th in his 1st season, but we played decent football. Had that Celta Vigo player scored off the last kick in the EL Semis, we wouldn't have qualified for CL in 2017/18. But no one in their right mind would have sacked Mou that season because everyone saw some improvement in our game up to that point and acknowledged that we've been unlucky to have gotten those many draws.
Similarly, while we're getting CL football next year it would have been stupid to have sacked Ole despite this form in 2nd half of the season. Mangers getting a lifeline or the sack should be based on whether we've improved over the last year In case the answer is yes, which it is in case of Ole , they deserve to stay on irrespective of whether they finish 2nd or 6th.
Yes, Moyes was sacked a day after it got confirmed that we wouldn't be playing CL, but he would have been sacked then or end of the season in either case. It might have been cheaper based on clauses in his contract to wait for us to wait till we were mathematically out of CL places rather than sack him after Fulham or Olympiakos.
LVG was headed for the sack in the 2nd seasons either way. Even if we would have managed a draw against WHU at Upton Park, it was quite clear that LVG was to be sacked. Additionally, based on how quickly Mou became our new manager, I wouldn't be shocked if the decision was taken as early as March or so.
Mou finished 6th in his 1st season, but we played decent football. Had that Celta Vigo player scored off the last kick in the EL Semis, we wouldn't have qualified for CL in 2017/18. But no one in their right mind would have sacked Mou that season because everyone saw some improvement in our game up to that point and acknowledged that we've been unlucky to have gotten those many draws.
Similarly, while we're getting CL football next year it would have been stupid to have sacked Ole despite this form in 2nd half of the season. Mangers getting a lifeline or the sack should be based on whether we've improved over the last year In case the answer is yes, which it is in case of Ole , they deserve to stay on irrespective of whether they finish 2nd or 6th.
It was pretty clear from the beginning that there was a plan. And the way to execute a plan properly is to have some patience. But a lot of people live in some sort of football manager/fifa land and think that getting a collection of people with their own minds, wants etc to all pull in one direction is a simple job. I still think that we are still capable of having a long period of bad form (Arsenal would often have a bad first half and go on a big run to get top 4 only for the same thing to happen the next year). However Ole is the ONLY one who came in and tried to put a real foundation down and he deserves all the praise he gets right now. Still work to do but maybe people will leave the toxic stuff next time there is a dip in form (for example if Bruno gets injured and we take some time to learn how to adjust)
You're a braver man than I.
I'll consider it when we get top 4, mainly because I want to see them try and defend their short-sightedness when we get CL football and possibly win something.
This pole should never have existed in the first place?? After awful tumescent performances & results for a consistent period of time? So you’re just Ole in no matter what, ok then. Proving that many on here just can’t look at the manager objectively
Proud to say I was 'Back Ole' before the close
But I'd still be 'Back Ole' now if he'd lost every game by 3 goals since the restart
Sticking with him to the end. He has the right ideas, tries to get the club playing like Manchester United should. Puts the club first. And a very likable character which is important too.
But I'd still be 'Back Ole' now if he'd lost every game by 3 goals since the restart
Sticking with him to the end. He has the right ideas, tries to get the club playing like Manchester United should. Puts the club first. And a very likable character which is important too.
Given the multitude of circumstances surrounding our squad earlier in the season; injuries, new signings, very young players, getting rid of the deadwood etc, I'd certainly agree that some people were incapable of looking objectively at things.
Unless you've been kipping posts by others, I think close to every loss/draw to a lesser team can be attributed to us not having the desired level of fitness/ injury problems/ personnel problems. If you decide to look beyond the results, you'd notice that there has always been a style of play - from atleast the start of this season. It has changed based on opposition, but it hasn't been that it didn't exist.
There wasn’t a style of play before Bruno’s arrival- it was just counter attack.
Now we can actually play a bit really well & have threats all around the pitch but don’t try & re- write history as we had no style or pattern of play previously
He was never at risk of being sacked, especially 6 months after signing the contract when this thread started. Results were worse than performances with many mitigating factors people refused to see.
Fun fact: Counter Attacking is a style of play.
Additionally, arrival of Bruno has just accelerated our progress. At team can't learn a play style over night if you haven't noticed.
Also, a team can't beat City at Etihad (played them out of the park), Chelsea X2, Poch's and Mou's Spurs, Draw with Pool, beat PSG over 2 legs if they don't have a play style or a plan. Unless of course you regard Pep, Mou, Poch and the likes as some of the worst football managers who would lose to a team that does not know what their role is.
Yeah then it will be a case of him only just meeting their high horse standards, regardles of where we have actually been for 7 years, and they'll reluctantly hold fire until the next opportunity to stick the boot in.
Some of these people are too invested in his failure.
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