Think there should be a wait until the end of season then decide option.
Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)
- Thread starter MrSingh2002
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Think there should be a wait until the end of season then decide option.
We have had some strange results against WBA - I had forgotten how dominant we were in that game. I also remember the game - a year after ? When we lost 1-0 after Juan Mata of all people received 2 cards in the space of 3-4 minutes so we had to play an hour with 10 men.
And that 2-2 game when we were 2-0 up and looking like we were gonna destroy them before Edwin dropped a cross and the game ended 2-2
And a certain 5-5 game with Lukaku scoring 3 in Fergusons last game.
And I might be wrong here - but the last time I recall an opponent getting 2 red cards against us - was when beat WBA 5-0 away. As I recall Robinson got one of the reds, but it was later overturned
Its great to see the improvement in some of our players, i think that tells a great story. I mean, who would have called Martial clearing the ball with 2 defensive headers vs City and put himself on the line to be clattered by Otamendi earlier in the season?! Its not only Martial but the improvement of Fred, Matic, McT, Rashford, Williams, Shaw etc, is fantastic.
I still think there'll be some bumps in the road and a few more disappointing results to come, and i'm sure certain fans will remain unhappy with Ole (not altogether unjustified in fairness) but it definitely feels like we're heading in the right direction.
I still think there'll be some bumps in the road and a few more disappointing results to come, and i'm sure certain fans will remain unhappy with Ole (not altogether unjustified in fairness) but it definitely feels like we're heading in the right direction.
This sums me up completely.
If this continues until the end of the season, I won't complain with Ole getting another shot next season. What I'm dreading, though, is the board using this uptick to excuse themselves from backing him in the summer....I've been burned too many times, in this situation. I hope the talk about 3 new signings is true, but if those 3 signings are a 19yr old GK, Jack Grealish and a Championship squad player, we're in trouble again.
Time will tell I suppose on all fronts.
Apparently there was that one guy called Klopp! Otherwise, he's the second manager to do that, at least in the EPL, but most likely overall.
If every player in every squad is fit, I'd argue we have the third best squad in the league. Quite close between us, Chelsea and Spurs. Wolves and Leicester just behind. A big gap up to Man City and Liverpool.
Cheers bud. Exactly, there is such a good team spirit now, you can tell in the goal celebrations as well, all of the players so happy for Ighalo for example whenever he gets a goal.
Things like that make a huge difference in any job, particularly when there is pressure on a player to perform straight away.
Or think we don’t need to upgrade our structure with a DoF etc. Ed will just continue as usual and we will continue to be mediocre. I wont change my vote just yet, as a whole, the season has been very poor, too many issues with Ole being responsible for most. If we make top 4, I agree he deserves another shot. If we make it....
3rd best team. 3rd/2nd best squad
Thought he was a goner but he seems to have turned things round. Everyone's form has picked up, things looking up for us. If we finish the season strongly, then I have no problem with him continuing so I've changed my vote to keep him and let him finish the rebuild.
Poll reopened after a few good games? But left closed when we were losing to Burnley? Best time to get some unbiased opinions, I guess. 
This is definitely a 'wait and see how we finish the season' debate
It's somewhat sad that this thread is possibly the most updated thread on here on a daily basis and is too influenced by short term be that the last game or only the previous 5.
The Europa League Final is May 27th...not saying we'll be in it but its the latest date our season will go on until.
From there we can can discuss Ole' Management in terms:
- Results: Final League Position, Final Standing in the FA Cup + Europa league - Key Point - Have we qualified for the Champions League?
- Changes to the Squad between Dec 2018 and May 2020 - Key Point - Were Signings a Success? Were Sales Correct?, Are we happy with Youth Promotion?
- Squad Morale - Key Point - Do the players as a whole appear happy/ happier than Dec 2018?
- The 18-Months as a whole - Key Point - Are we happy with our progress, has there been any progress?, have the achievements matched the realistic expectations?
- Prospect for the Next season - Key Point - Has the season end form given us hope of a better season next season with the correct signings? Does it appear we are moving forward? backwards? or staying the same?
- Style & Tactics - Key Point - Putting results aside, Do we like the style United play, do we usually set up correctly against opponents i.e Big away game tactics vs Home game vs bottom half clubs?
- Ole's Culpability - Key Points - Of the things that we are happy and unhappy with. Which of these is it fair and reasonable to put on Ole? Good or Bad
Looking at those aspects as a whole when we have a completed season and and half to look back on we should be and removing his legendary player status. Discuss whether Ole deserves to be sack or has done a job good enough that hes earned the right to continue? He wont have ticked every box, he'd have ticked some, it'll come down to whether hes ticked enough of the right boxes.
Although I'm sure some people will have decided already and wont have their Ole in/out mind changed
It's somewhat sad that this thread is possibly the most updated thread on here on a daily basis and is too influenced by short term be that the last game or only the previous 5.
The Europa League Final is May 27th...not saying we'll be in it but its the latest date our season will go on until.
From there we can can discuss Ole' Management in terms:
- Results: Final League Position, Final Standing in the FA Cup + Europa league - Key Point - Have we qualified for the Champions League?
- Changes to the Squad between Dec 2018 and May 2020 - Key Point - Were Signings a Success? Were Sales Correct?, Are we happy with Youth Promotion?
- Squad Morale - Key Point - Do the players as a whole appear happy/ happier than Dec 2018?
- The 18-Months as a whole - Key Point - Are we happy with our progress, has there been any progress?, have the achievements matched the realistic expectations?
- Prospect for the Next season - Key Point - Has the season end form given us hope of a better season next season with the correct signings? Does it appear we are moving forward? backwards? or staying the same?
- Style & Tactics - Key Point - Putting results aside, Do we like the style United play, do we usually set up correctly against opponents i.e Big away game tactics vs Home game vs bottom half clubs?
- Ole's Culpability - Key Points - Of the things that we are happy and unhappy with. Which of these is it fair and reasonable to put on Ole? Good or Bad
Looking at those aspects as a whole when we have a completed season and and half to look back on we should be and removing his legendary player status. Discuss whether Ole deserves to be sack or has done a job good enough that hes earned the right to continue? He wont have ticked every box, he'd have ticked some, it'll come down to whether hes ticked enough of the right boxes.
Although I'm sure some people will have decided already and wont have their Ole in/out mind changed
Good post.
However, these questions should always be asked and then it doesn't matter if the manager has been here for 1 or 20 years. But right now Ole is ticking a lot of the boxes for me so that is why he has my backing.
Spot on. I want him to succeed and want him to be given time however its been a very patchy season and despite the last 10 games we need review things as a whole at the end of the season. Things are looking relatively rosy now with player, taactical and team selection improvements however this also needs to be judge over a longer time frame. If Fernandes is injured are we reverting back to Lingaard and Pereira? Can we consistently break down defensive teams? Can we consistently produce against better sides?
I know people are jubilant because of the result against City but what I saw was us play great in the 1st half and then defend like trojans in the second. We had 28% possession at home. That is a horrific stat and frankly it is not the kind of performance that would lead to long term consistency of results. We saw something even similar with Everton with a great 1st half showing and then we got overwhelmed in the second half and imo were lucky to draw the game.
Overall though I am positive and there are green shoots in performance from the team and from the manager however there is still a long long way to go and nothing concrete yet. If we can get our possession % up and control games and consistently dominate sides then I will know something good has happened, but clinging on to victories and draws is not that. However this might require some more big signings in the off season like Havertz and a controlling and defensive mid.
Maybe its the knee-jerk reactions to such small sample runs of games.
I agree managers should always be held accountable throughout the season and not just given an until end of season to see how it went but I feel at the stage and in our situation with our season be able to go either way, could be bad season, good season or even a great season given what we expected at start of season. Had Ole been sacked in December/January I'd have understood it and not disagreed with it.
For what its worth, I'm far more positive and excited for our future than I was a 12/18 months ago, so he must be doing a few things right
Third isn't good enough for this club. My expectations etc. Falling standards and such.
Its a very suprising stat , but it seems we’ve lost very many as well then.
Just shows you why he wanted to shore up the defence, and if that works (as it looks like), we are going places.
That stat is mad when you think how rubbish we've looked so often. The league really is in the pits.
He got a bit of a silly new manager bounce which skews things.
This season for wins in the league we are 5th and we sit 5th in the table. 1 win more than Sheffiled United, Spurs and Burnley. And 2 more than Wolves, Everton, Crystal Palace and Southamptom.
We have in truth come from a pretty dire place and the recent trend is positively upwards but any rose tinted analysis right now is absurd. We have been a couple a very tight VAR decisions away from being in the shit. So lets keep faith and support everyone trying to build strong foundations at the club and salvage the season with a very tight battle for clubs 4-11 in the table.
Very well summed up, but I want to add one point: Organisation moral: Is the manager contributing to the feeling of togetherness in the organisation as a whole?
And Ole seems to agree with that, although he got bashed for asking if United are happy with being second (cf. Mourinho 2 seasons ago...).
There's no doubt he's remaining until the end of the season. His position should be assessed then. If he gets CL he will get another year and will deserve to stay, if not he deserves to go and if better options are available the club would be stupid to overlook them.
Our form is excellent at the moment and we need to capitalise on Chelsea and Spurs being inconsistent. Ole has given us a great chance of nicking top 4 (5). I hope Solskjaer has learnt from his mistakes in the early in the season because I do want him to succeed, I'm just not convinced he will.
Our form is excellent at the moment and we need to capitalise on Chelsea and Spurs being inconsistent. Ole has given us a great chance of nicking top 4 (5). I hope Solskjaer has learnt from his mistakes in the early in the season because I do want him to succeed, I'm just not convinced he will.
You cannot be that categorical about it. In theory, United could play fantastic football, win all the remaining matches (except the EL final), and still miss out on CL. Then he should be sacked?
Some good questions in there.
Key Point - Have we qualified for the Champions League?
N/A ( but I think we will for what that's worth)
Were Signings a Success?
Yes, every single one.
Are we happy with Youth Promotion?
Couldn't be happier.
Were Sales Correct?
Yes, to a degree. Herrera and Lukaku chose to leave of their own volition, the rest were deadwood who we all wanted out - Smalling being the one exception here, but then again, we were well-stocked at CB anyway. Not signing a CM in the summer was a huge mistake, though.
Do the players as a whole appear happy/ happier than Dec 2018?
Unequivocally yes. Apart from Pogba who does his talking through his agent, there has been barely a murmur from the squad since Ole took charge.
Has the season end form given us hope of a better season next season with the correct signings? Does it appear we are moving forward? backwards? or staying the same?
The signing of Bruno has elevated the team to a competitive level. More signings of his caliber will have us challenging for the title before long. That applies to any manager under similar circumstances though.
Putting results aside, Do we like the style United play, do we usually set up correctly against opponents i.e Big away game tactics vs Home game vs bottom half clubs?
There were very few complaints when Jose had us challenging City in his second season in charge, proving that results come first, style of play is a distant second. Ole's excellent record against the top six is well documented, as is his significantly poorer record against the smaller teams. The signing of Bruno, along with Sancho (yes, please) in the summer may go a long way to rectifying the issues we have with low-block teams.
Of the things that we are happy and unhappy with. Which of these is it fair and reasonable to put on Ole? Good or Bad (this is a particularly good question)
The good: Player morale, the signings, no media bs ala Jose Mourinho, the squad improving as individuals, doing what needed to be done with the deadwood despite leaving the squad short for the upcoming season, promoting youth.
The bad: his in-game management is appalling and needs serious work, somewhat indecisive, doing what needed to be done with the deadwood despite leaving the squad short for the upcoming season. I believe he has improved tactically as the season progressed.
Key Point - will we qualified for the Champions League?
I hope so, but more important to me is do we look like we're moving in the correct direction.. So yes.
Were Signings a Success?
Easier to name a failure, one is the captain, one tackles more than all of our defence put together, one is still learning and when he remembers to look up will get goals / assists, one is a loan that was needed and the last is Bruno.
Are we happy with Youth Promotion?
Would have liked to see more of Garner, but over all very good. Where is Blackett and McNair hey..
Were Sales Correct?
Oh, yes.. Young, my god I miss them down the line balls to no one.
Do the players as a whole appear happy/ happier than Dec 2018?
Matic is an example of this, didn't have a good start but is seemly happy.
Jose on Shaw.
"He had a good performance, but it was his body with my brain,” Mourinho said.
"He was in front of me and I was making every decision for him.
"The communication was possible because we were very close. I was thinking for him, when to close inside, when to open, when to press the opponent, I was making every decision for him."
Jose you bellend.. This was to the press.
Has the season end form given us hope of a better season next season with the correct signings? Does it appear we are moving forward? backwards? or staying the same?
Moving forward, I've enjoyed watching us this year, apart from Watford away..
Putting results aside, Do we like the style United play, do we usually set up correctly against opponents i.e Big away game tactics vs Home game vs bottom half clubs?
Our counter attacking is good, low block isn't as good but - Mata and Bruno have the skills to unlock that low block.
Of the things that we are happy and unhappy with. Which of these is it fair and reasonable to put on Ole? Good or Bad.
I think he cut too deep shipping players out, maybe the thought players would step up like Pereira and Linshit. But alas he has now realised you can't polish a turd.
I hope so, but more important to me is do we look like we're moving in the correct direction.. So yes.
Were Signings a Success?
Easier to name a failure, one is the captain, one tackles more than all of our defence put together, one is still learning and when he remembers to look up will get goals / assists, one is a loan that was needed and the last is Bruno.
Are we happy with Youth Promotion?
Would have liked to see more of Garner, but over all very good. Where is Blackett and McNair hey..
Were Sales Correct?
Oh, yes.. Young, my god I miss them down the line balls to no one.
Do the players as a whole appear happy/ happier than Dec 2018?
Matic is an example of this, didn't have a good start but is seemly happy.
Jose on Shaw.
"He had a good performance, but it was his body with my brain,” Mourinho said.
"He was in front of me and I was making every decision for him.
"The communication was possible because we were very close. I was thinking for him, when to close inside, when to open, when to press the opponent, I was making every decision for him."
Jose you bellend.. This was to the press.
Has the season end form given us hope of a better season next season with the correct signings? Does it appear we are moving forward? backwards? or staying the same?
Moving forward, I've enjoyed watching us this year, apart from Watford away..
Putting results aside, Do we like the style United play, do we usually set up correctly against opponents i.e Big away game tactics vs Home game vs bottom half clubs?
Our counter attacking is good, low block isn't as good but - Mata and Bruno have the skills to unlock that low block.
Of the things that we are happy and unhappy with. Which of these is it fair and reasonable to put on Ole? Good or Bad.
I think he cut too deep shipping players out, maybe the thought players would step up like Pereira and Linshit. But alas he has now realised you can't polish a turd.
Key Point - Have we qualified for the Champions League?
We’ll see we have two avenues but the league is always the best option in.
Were Signings a Success?
Yes.. all fill an important role
Are we happy with Youth Promotion?
Not really if I’m going off what we was told. Chongy, Gomez are ready etc. But I understand steaks are high.
Were Sales Correct?
Yes except for Smalling. We have a redundant defender in Phil Jones. Smalling would have been perfect for rotation.
Do the players as a whole appear happy/ happier than Dec 2018?
I don’t think you get much happier than being relieved of Mourinho for two years so no.
Has the season end form given us hope of a better season next season with the correct signings? Does it appear we are moving forward? backwards? or staying the same?
We are on good form and it’s very positive but we beat Spurs and City and it felt just like this, with better team performance.. I have no faith to think things have changed. Everyone can talk a good game after a win.
Putting results aside, Do we like the style United play, do we usually set up correctly against opponents i.e Big away game tactics vs Home game vs bottom half clubs?
No it’s basically Jose Mourinho football without him. If you watch Chelsea’s title winning team under him that is exactly the best we will get. It’s okay for a season If you win the league but we won’t be doing that under Ole and it’s not what our club is about.
We set up currency against opponents for now.. as we aren’t the better team. But believing in your style also means no plan B whilst you are trying to perfect it. Klopp and Guardiola have shown us this even if it means losing the big games. In the long run it pays off.
Of the things that we are happy and unhappy with. Which of these is it fair and reasonable to put on Ole? Good or Bad (this is a particularly good question)
The good: Hate the word cultural reset.. just sounds like a racial undertone (I’m quite aware this is not the case) but he has set a president of what it requires to be a Manchester United player and that is very important and underrated by previous managers.
The bad: He has no style and would really benefit from hiring a coach to do this for him whilst his decision making within games is a joke. Taking Williams off was smart. Taking Martial off and leaving Dan James on.. only to make the Ighalo substitution that should have been made anyway was bizzare and this always just makes me believe this guy is just winging it. I had the same feeling against Spurs away last year but unfortunately we gave him a permanent job.
Overral. I hope he does well until the end of the season but we should really count our lucky stars if he does and do what we set out to do in December 2018. Hire the right man to take us to the top.
We’ll see we have two avenues but the league is always the best option in.
Were Signings a Success?
Yes.. all fill an important role
Are we happy with Youth Promotion?
Not really if I’m going off what we was told. Chongy, Gomez are ready etc. But I understand steaks are high.
Were Sales Correct?
Yes except for Smalling. We have a redundant defender in Phil Jones. Smalling would have been perfect for rotation.
Do the players as a whole appear happy/ happier than Dec 2018?
I don’t think you get much happier than being relieved of Mourinho for two years so no.
Has the season end form given us hope of a better season next season with the correct signings? Does it appear we are moving forward? backwards? or staying the same?
We are on good form and it’s very positive but we beat Spurs and City and it felt just like this, with better team performance.. I have no faith to think things have changed. Everyone can talk a good game after a win.
Putting results aside, Do we like the style United play, do we usually set up correctly against opponents i.e Big away game tactics vs Home game vs bottom half clubs?
No it’s basically Jose Mourinho football without him. If you watch Chelsea’s title winning team under him that is exactly the best we will get. It’s okay for a season If you win the league but we won’t be doing that under Ole and it’s not what our club is about.
We set up currency against opponents for now.. as we aren’t the better team. But believing in your style also means no plan B whilst you are trying to perfect it. Klopp and Guardiola have shown us this even if it means losing the big games. In the long run it pays off.
Of the things that we are happy and unhappy with. Which of these is it fair and reasonable to put on Ole? Good or Bad (this is a particularly good question)
The good: Hate the word cultural reset.. just sounds like a racial undertone (I’m quite aware this is not the case) but he has set a president of what it requires to be a Manchester United player and that is very important and underrated by previous managers.
The bad: He has no style and would really benefit from hiring a coach to do this for him whilst his decision making within games is a joke. Taking Williams off was smart. Taking Martial off and leaving Dan James on.. only to make the Ighalo substitution that should have been made anyway was bizzare and this always just makes me believe this guy is just winging it. I had the same feeling against Spurs away last year but unfortunately we gave him a permanent job.
Overral. I hope he does well until the end of the season but we should really count our lucky stars if he does and do what we set out to do in December 2018. Hire the right man to take us to the top.
Great if this persists. However we have seen enough false dawns to not get carried away by this.
As mentioned in my earlier post, I have a good feeling this time around but would still be a good idea not to get carried away by a 10 game run.
Hoping it doesn’t go like last season with a purple patch followed by a precipitous fall. Let’s see if he can actually bag a top four and even a trophy.
What if the season gets cancelled? We can't judge him until well into next season then.
I was definately Ole out, the team has gained form in the last games but we've seen this before how the team suddenly plays in a good level and the progress seems tangible and suddenly it all goes to shit and we enter a 2-3 month period of dull football.
Right now I would prefer another manager, but I wouldn't sack Ole right now. Let him finish the season and we can take the decisition in the summer depending on the team's progress.
Right now I would prefer another manager, but I wouldn't sack Ole right now. Let him finish the season and we can take the decisition in the summer depending on the team's progress.
Team overall is in much better shape than we are last season and I'm seeing real progress in the team. Ole is still not the title winning manager at the moment but I'm backing him to grow into one together with the squad he is rebuilding. He is not a tactical revolutionist by any means but he has shown that he can beat top teams. If he can consistently deliver the results he could be the manager who uniquely brings to the table the identity and romanticism of Man Utd, which is to me more attractive than the Chelsea and Man City model of buying their way to success.
The question is is he as good as some of the managers who may come to manage United? If not then he should be replaced at the end of the season. I personally don't think he is half as good as Rose or Nagelsmann.
I'm not liking the options. Wish option 2 can be wait to the end of the season before deciding to sack or keep. That would be my option. Right now, I'd keep him, but he could lose all last games and end up 8th or something, then I'd want to replace.
Of course I can because that's the standard by which all previous managers have been measured and the same needs to be applied here. Not that your suggestion will happen, it never will under Ole. While we will have good performances a Pep side we will never be and I don't expect Ole will ever have us playing consistently fantastic football.
Yes, this is the more salient point. If we could easily upgrade on one of our players, most people wouldn't have any qualms about doing it.
Solskjaer has been given a decent crack at it (18 months and £200m transfer spend). Results have generally been poor in his time here (1.7 points per game across his 50 games, which is the same as Moyes) and we're on course to miss out on CL (again) and record our worst ever points total in the Premier League era. All this, while playing stodgy, counterattacking football - it's time for an upgrade.
Waiting until the end of the season before reviewing his position is a cowardly reaction to the current state we find ourselves in.
Doing this ensures the season is viewed through a lens of "Well we were three points off 4th and we didn't get it so he should be sacked" or "We only got to a semi final of a cup".
The reality is that many people in here would have taken 5th and a semi final at the start of the season when you looked at the state of the squad and how we were playing. Solskajer deserves major credit for getting us back into the CL conversation in his first full season. I was worried we'd be further adrift for at least 2 seasons.
Doing this ensures the season is viewed through a lens of "Well we were three points off 4th and we didn't get it so he should be sacked" or "We only got to a semi final of a cup".
The reality is that many people in here would have taken 5th and a semi final at the start of the season when you looked at the state of the squad and how we were playing. Solskajer deserves major credit for getting us back into the CL conversation in his first full season. I was worried we'd be further adrift for at least 2 seasons.
My main argument in support of Ole in spite of some of the results have been that lack of options has resulted in problems in midfield, lack of creativity forward and a strained squad over the christmas period. He has also integrated two new players in the back 4 and one attacker, and put a lot of responsibility on players that earlier could (should) rely more on senior players (Rashford, Martial, McTominay). These things take a little time.
I am fairly confident that the good string of results will continue because the back 4 has gelled, the younger players have found their role, the creativity issue has been solved with Bruno, and the squad depth is a lot better (Ighalo and Bruno added, key players returning from injury).
There will be bumps in the road and the squad still needs 2-3 additions to be a title contender, but I think a major corner has been turned.
I am fairly confident that the good string of results will continue because the back 4 has gelled, the younger players have found their role, the creativity issue has been solved with Bruno, and the squad depth is a lot better (Ighalo and Bruno added, key players returning from injury).
There will be bumps in the road and the squad still needs 2-3 additions to be a title contender, but I think a major corner has been turned.
I still feel we should wait until the end of the season. If we go deep in the Europa league, get fourth, and crucially, look like a functioning team with some semblance of style of play by the end of the season, I'm prepared for Ole to stay on. On the other hand, to not get fourth given how poor our rivals have been this season is for me a sackable offence.
This is definitely a case of the grass not always being greener. The mood around the club seems as positive as it has done since Ferguson retired. The team are playing well. There is planning and good execution behind our recruitment. I think its extremely dangerous to assume that this would all continue with another man in charge, just because we missed out on 4th place.
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