Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

[Listar]

West Ham 0-2. Newcastle 0-1. Bournemouth 0-1. Watford 0-2. Burnley 0-2. To name but 5.

Our football in all of those matches was as bad as anything seen under the previous 3 managers. That's just indisputable.

At least with the Fulham fiasco we got the fecking ball in and around the box, and scored 2 goals, and had 31 shots and 75% possession. Like you said, don't rewrite history.

Just because you said so doesn’t make it so. Against Newcastle that we lost to a freak Longstaff goal we had 70% possession too so what?

What make those games worst in your opinion? At least I didn’t go to sleep or pull my hair out. Maybe Watford was very disappointing in terms of what we should be doing, but with key players out it wasn’t end of the world.

Did you remember the outrage after Mourinho’s “heritage” match?

Maybe the last match was the worst match for you because you try to forget the pain we were in during Moyes era, and most of LVG tenure?

 

[James Ward]

I'm still not sure about him but not having a proper number 10 all season has completely fecked him so willing to give him the benefit of the doubt if he gets us into the Champions league. What a fantastic player Bruno looks.

Fred is starting to look twice the player that Herrera ever was which is fantastic to see.

With a couple of good signings in the Summer, particularly a right winger, cover for Bruno and a replacement for Pogba I would be more than happy.

 

[passing-wind]

West Ham 0-2. Newcastle 0-1. Bournemouth 0-1. Watford 0-2. Burnley 0-2. To name but 5.

Our football in all of those matches was as bad as anything seen under the previous 3 managers. That's just indisputable.

At least with the Fulham fiasco we got the fecking ball in and around the box, and scored 2 goals, and had 31 shots and 75% possession. Like you said, don't rewrite history.

You can add Palace loss at OT start of the season terrible rancid performance

 

[Bastian]

No games this season is worse than those 3 worst matches.

Moyes 100 crosses against fulham
Mourinho Sevilla meltdown
LVG putting people to sleep

Name one match that we had this season that was worst. Don’t rewrite history mate.

I think the problem is Ole came in with lots of talk about going back to the United way, playing attacking football, put an emphasis on pressing high and whatnot, and we've been good against offensive teams with a counter attacking setup, and we've been consistently awful against teams who defend deep. The only thing that has changed that in the last few weeks is Bruno - and it's still too early to say (though Scholes seems to have made his mind up).

You can pick out individual games from any manager post SAF. Everton last season under Ole was diabolical. Burnley at home this season was diabolical too. There have been plenty of absolutely dreadful performances under Ole and very few great performances. The main difference between Ole and the others is that we're allegedly building something long-term which remains to be seen and the growing pains are resulting in a worse points tally.

The next couple of months will tell us if he's actually progressing as a manager.

 

[Maluco]

I really like this squad, and I couldn’t say that for a long time. I was sick of pogbas lack of application, sick of Lingard as a number 10. I was sick looking at Jones, and Valencia and Young as full backs. I was sick of transfers not working out.

I actually really like this team and feel an affinity with the players for the first time since Fergie. This feels like Manchester United.

I have been Ole out since nearly the beginning, but these signings and decisions on the squad have been amazing. He could leave tomorrow and it would have been worth it just to get to this stage in the evolution of the squad.

If he goes and beats Everton on Sunday, I will start to waver. I still think he needs better coaches, but he is giving me food for thought. I would love to admit I was wrong on this one.

But keeping hopes tempered for now. There have been numerous false dawns. But I am going to watch Sunday’s game with real excitement and that’s already half the battle won.

 

[Andrew Richmond]

I can’t see the club sacking OGS.

While there is still a lot to play for this season and it would be a very good outcome if he can guide us into the top 4 or finish 5th and qualify for the Champions League if City lose there appeal.

There is no doubt some of the team’s performances have been horrific during the course of this season but I get the feeling it is almost certain he will be manager come the start of the 2020/2021 season.

Who knows a couple of decent signings in the summer to add to further improve the squad, we could have a team capable of challenging for the title.

 

[shaky]

Seems like the kneejerk support is back in fashion. That's until people realise it was another false dawn.

Whether it's this year or the next one when top four will be set at 70 points, Ole is not the man to coach this team.

Maybe the kneejerkers are the ones who have a meltdown at the occasional poor result now, because our results have been mostly good since November.

 

[lysglimt]

Seems like the kneejerk support is back in fashion. That's until people realise it was another false dawn.

Whether it's this year or the next one when top four will be set at 70 points, Ole is not the man to coach this team.

I bow to your superior wisdom and argumentation

 

[Saddy]

I've stayed on the "Ole out" side of the fence but the results and more importantly the playing style is starting to swing my thoughts.

I feel that Ole had the best type of "new manager bounce" as a club legend and hopefully we will now experience the "keep the manager bounce!"

If he can get top 4 and wins the Europa Cup or FA Cup he wins my vote to carry on the rebuild and if we get rid of Pogba that would set us up for a serious challenge next season - City (hopefully and deservedly) will take a huge drop back and it will be interesting to see how Liverpool react to winning the league as they might suffer a slight drop in focus - more importantly qualification for the Champions league will give the owners a great opportunity to sign Sancho and a top class DM

I'm not getting carried away and if we fall away - it's Poch for me as we have a highly talented squad of young players that need high quality coaching and i still think Ole is learning his trade in this area.

 

[ReddBalls]

I can’t see the club sacking OGS.

While there is still a lot to play for this season and it would be a very good outcome if he can guide us into the top 4 or finish 5th and qualify for the Champions League if City lose there appeal.

There is no doubt some of the team’s performances have been horrific during the course of this season but I get the feeling it is almost certain he will be manager come the start of the 2020/2021 season.

Who knows a couple of decent signings in the summer to add to further improve the squad, we could have a team capable of challenging for the title.

Thing is, Ole could still make this the arguably best season since Fergie if he guides United to a top four finish and win the EL.

 

[Judas]

The only way Ole starts next season is if he truly deserves it, which means we've turned a corner of sorts, are in the CL and have maybe/hopefully won a trophy. If that's the case, as much as I've had my doubts about his longterm position, you can see why the club would back him further.

Bloody long way to go yet though, this next month is critical, come through it with mostly wins, or all wins and yeah things are looking much better suddenly.

 

[Bobcat]

I‘m happy to assess at the end of the season. If we lapse back into drawing and losing to bottom half teams and looking clueless in attack like we did regularly in the first half of the season then it’s not a good sign.

Although if OGS manages to get us into Champions League football next year, whether it be 3rd, 4th, maybe even 5th depending on that City case... or even winning the Europa League then it becomes more difficult as to stick with him or not. I’m also one of the people who thinks we can do better in terms of getting a better manager. I will say though if we do end up getting the likes of Sancho, Grealish, Maddison and all these names under who have a chance of making us better and then we do have a team that’s clearly the best team outside of City and Liverpool then the pressure should be on OGS next season to really make us progress. If we’re still doing the routine of game raising for the big boys and getting outsmarted and frustrated by the smaller boys with these 3-4 top quality additions on top of this season at the end of the calendar year, then I think OGS would have to go. He would have been here two years at that point and four transfer windows, which to me is a more than reasonable amount of time for any manager to stamp their mark on a team.

I think that goes without saying and even his most staunch supporters have that stance.

The annoying thing is that so many of those losses and draws we've had is games where we have dominated every metric that matters, but have fecked up in key moments and have lost points despite being the "better" team.

 

[Massive Spanner]

The improvement is nice to see, largely thanks to the purchase of Bruno. Anyone who thinks we'll potentially challenge for the PL under him is deluded, though.

I still think we'd be mad to keep him in the summer over a better manager. I don't want another fecking Klopp situation.

 

[simpandenstore]

Is this the proof that we needed a class creative no 10 to break down lesser teams? It had nothing to with Oles tactics, he want to play this way but he had lingard and Andreas to disposal who can't even pass sideways.

 

[Alabaster Codify7]

It's been an awesome few weeks for the team and Ole, but that's all it is at present - a purple patch. It stands out like an outlier in comparison to the abject shite either side of it, since Ole was made permanent. My views are based on around 1-year of performances and results and will not be swayed by 3-4 weeks of good times.

My opinion remaisn the same, if he gets top 4 or CL football via winning the EL, fine, he gets more time. If he fails, having outspent every other manager in England, he goes.

 

[Cliche Guevara]

I reckon at the start of next season we’ll have the best United side since Fergie left. Possibly by far.

I want to see what Ole can do with that. Particularly since he’ll have built it.

I’m actually quite looking forward to it. The squad has been a disjointed mess for years.

 

[Bilbo]

The only way Ole starts next season is if he truly deserves it, which means we've turned a corner of sorts, are in the CL and have maybe/hopefully won a trophy. If that's the case, as much as I've had my doubts about his longterm position, you can see why the club would back him further.

Bloody long way to go yet though, this next month is critical, come through it with mostly wins, or all wins and yeah things are looking much better suddenly.

Ole will be in charge in next season

 

[Bilbo]

The improvement is nice to see, largely thanks to the purchase of Bruno. Anyone who thinks we'll potentially challenge for the PL under him is deluded, though.

I still think we'd be mad to keep him in the summer over a better manager. I don't want another fecking Klopp situation.

Explain why people are deluded for thinking that.

For me if we carry on getting our recruitment right there is no reason why we can't challenge for the title under him.

 

[troylocker]

It is quite obvious that players does matter. Having key players injured have a major impact on the output of the team. Not having a creators available makes it harder to break down teams with a defensive approach, it's not 100% down to managing/coaching and this will show on the results against these kind of teams now with Fernandes here and Pogba coming back.
The program after Spurs away looks perfect for going on a winning spree.

New poll please! The context has changed since the arrival of Mr Fernandes...

 

[InspiRED]

It may have been against ten man Bruges, but I was seriously impressed by that performance. Bruno alongside McTominay in that midfield and then with Fred in the form he's in too... And Ighalo was great too. Lukaku might be a better finisher, probably a much better finisher, but ighalo looks so much better with his back to goal and linking the play than Romelu ever did. There was a sense of spirit too and feeling of early stages of a team coming together, which I have to admit was really promising. I haven't seen every game post SAF but this one sticks out in my mind as one of the most encouraging I've seen.

That being said, ten man Bruges away are the definition of 'cannon fodder' and we need to see how the season goes before making evaluations. Signs are good at the moment you have to say.

To all those getting high and mighty because they've always backed Ole, I would refer you to the league position and also the fact that going into the season with Lingard and Pereira in the AM and no replacement for Lukaku was basically managerial suicide. There is really no excuse for any crowing given how bad some of the performances have been, which have been as bad as I can remember.

There are definitely more than a few promising signs though and might well be the case that Bruno is the missing link that allows us to venture beyond counter attacking. In short if this is kept up for the rest of the season and we qualify for CL then it would be hard, very hard, to argue that Ole doesn't deserve more time. Sterner tests than 10 man Bruges await though.

 

[Tom Cato]

The only way Ole starts next season is if he truly deserves it, which means we've turned a corner of sorts, are in the CL and have maybe/hopefully won a trophy. If that's the case, as much as I've had my doubts about his longterm position, you can see why the club would back him further.

Bloody long way to go yet though, this next month is critical, come through it with mostly wins, or all wins and yeah things are looking much better suddenly.

In a twist that should surprise no one, having the right players available appear to make a difference in how the team performs.

12 clean sheets in the last 17 games

1 goal allowed in the last 7 games. 5wins and 2 draws in that time.

This team is performing very, very well now in the last half of the season.

 

[Massive Spanner]

Explain why people are deluded for thinking that.

For me if we carry on getting our recruitment right there is no reason why we can't challenge for the title under him.

Because we're worse under him than under any of our other post-SAF managers? Because he's never shown anything in his career to suggest he's capable of competing at that level? Because we're still unbelievably inconsistent and we'd probably need to spend a lot to have a squad good enough to compete with such an average manager.

It's simply really, you'd be talking about spending hundreds of millions to even consider challenging under Ole, whereas there are other, more proven managers out there who have, at least, challenged for titles spending far less than that. Which makes more sense?

Best case scenario under Ole is that he leaves a good squad for our next manager, which it currently looks like he could do. And hopefully gets us a top four finish at some point.

 

[Bilbo]

Is this the proof that we needed a class creative no 10 to break down lesser teams? It had nothing to with Oles tactics, he want to play this way but he had lingard and Andreas to disposal who can't even pass sideways.

There just isn't any doubt about it. Look at the things that Bruno has been doing for us. One touch passing, quicker movement, vision. Its several levels above anything that Lingard and Pereira have produced this season, and its no coincidence that four of our goals came from the midfield last night. When was the last time that happened? Having an attacking playmaker has completely opened up the team.

Ironically that was probably the best 15 minutes of Lingards whole season last night, so perhaps seeing what Fernandes is doing has actually opened his eyes a little bit.

 

[Striker10]

What are you talking about? You make it sound as if it was a good call. Rashford ended up injured because we overplayed him since we dont have enough options upfront.

Under that logic we should skin every position since it may benefit us in the long run.

It sounds like its worse then they thought, so who's fault is it? The fact is the player wanted out no? If Lukaku had have stayed, how many minutes would Greenwood have gotten?

 

[lysglimt]

Explain why people are deluded for thinking that.

For me if we carry on getting our recruitment right there is no reason why we can't challenge for the title under him.

Because its easier to insult People for thinking differently, than actually making relevant arguments

 

[Massive Spanner]

Because its easier to insult People for thinking differently, than actually making relevant arguments

Give me arguments as to why we can challenge under Ole, then.

Has he shown he can do it before? Has he improved upon the results of our previous managers? Has he performed well enough with the squad he has? Has he ever gotten us playing consistently well? Seriously, what has he done in his career so far, or here, to suggest he can challenge for the title in the supposed world's most difficult league?

I don't want to criticize him after a few good results, because it was a noticeable improvement on what we saw before, and I'd love if he could challenge, I just don't think he ever will, he's not a good enough manager. He's shown over his 10+ year career so far that he isn't. He wouldn't have been languishing in the Norwegian league all this time if he was. A few good results in a row doesn't suddenly change that.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Ole will be in charge in next season

If he shows progress between now and the end of the season.

If it carries on like between August and 31st Jan he won't, whatever you've convinced yourself, absolutely no chance. If we end up 8th, he's gone.

Man City at home went on open member sale this week and tickets were available to anyone to buy with a £20 membership added, for 2 full days. Loads of hospitality have been returned/unsold for the game and are available for a knock down price still: https://www.eticketing.co.uk/muticketsandmembership/EDP/Event/Index/4753

United care about the bottom line, and if we finish the season as poorly as we started the first 5 months, seasonal hospitality sales will take a massive hit and the club have a quick solution to that, one they've used multiple times before… a new manager and renewed otimism.

Ole has a few months to provide that optimism himself, and since his January window he's started it off very promisingly.

 

[InspiRED]

In a twist that should surprise no one, having the right players available appear to make a difference in how the team performs.

12 clean sheets in the last 17 games

1 goal allowed in the last 7 games. 5wins and 2 draws in that time.

This team is performing very, very well now in the last half of the season.

Very clever. But Bruno was available in the summer, I was really keen to get him then. Based on how the team is playing was it more of a priority to get in Fernandes then or AWB in the summer? And why get a loan striker like Ighalo in January after selling Lukaku in the summer?

The high and mighty tone of some of these posts considering how bad we've been at times and some of the terrible decisions made is really inappropriate.

 

[Bilbo]

Because we're worse under him than under any of our other post-SAF managers? Because he's never shown anything in his career to suggest he's capable of competing at that level? Because we're still unbelievably inconsistent and we'd probably need to spend a lot to have a squad good enough to compete with such an average manager.

It's simply really, you'd be talking about spending hundreds of millions to even consider challenging under Ole, whereas there are other, more proven managers out there who have, at least, challenged for titles spending far less than that. Which makes more sense?

Best case scenario under Ole is that he leaves a good squad for our next manager, which it currently looks like he could do. And hopefully gets us a top four finish at some point.

Since his joined he has only lost 5 out of 20 league and cup matches against the top 6 and Leicester, winning 11 of those, and that with a team very much in transition. If those were my stats, I would be arguing pretty strongly that they showed that I am capable of competing at that level. You would be too.

 

[troylocker]

Because we're worse under him than under any of our other post-SAF managers? Because he's never shown anything in his career to suggest he's capable of competing at that level? Because we're still unbelievably inconsistent and we'd probably need to spend a lot to have a squad good enough to compete with such an average manager.

It's simply really, you'd be talking about spending hundreds of millions to even consider challenging under Ole, whereas there are other, more proven managers out there who have, at least, challenged for titles spending far less than that. Which makes more sense?

Best case scenario under Ole is that he leaves a good squad for our next manager, which it currently looks like he could do. And hopefully gets us a top four finish at some point.

Calling people with a different opinion than you deluded is just the ultimate low and shows the lack of objective arguments to make your point.

In this post you're trying at least.
I disagree of course, but that's just my opinion. I wanna see the rebuild through and see what he can do with that squad. A top striker, a right winger and a replacement for Pogba if he leaves and this might get very interesting. Just seeing the impact of having a creator in the midfield is very encouraging to say the least. Not stumbling every time we meet an opponent that sits low, will have a massive impact on our winrate and point tally. Better times a head!

 

[Bilbo]

If he shows progress between now and the end of the season.

If it carries on like between August and 31st Jan he won't, whatever you've convinced yourself, absolutely no chance. If we end up 8th, he's gone.

Man City at home went on open member sale this week and tickets were available to anyone to buy with a £20 membership added, for 2 full days. Loads of hospitality have been returned/unsold for the game and are available for a knock down price still: https://www.eticketing.co.uk/muticketsandmembership/EDP/Event/Index/4753

United care about the bottom line, and if we finish the season as poorly as we started the first 5 months, seasonal hospitality sales will take a massive hit and the club have a quick solution to that, one they've used multiple times before… a new manager and renewed otimism.

Ole has a few months to provide that optimism himself, and since his January window he's started it off very promisingly.

Ole will still be manager at the start of next season. If he isn't I'll delete my account here.

 

[DFreshKing]

In a twist that should surprise no one, having the right players available appear to make a difference in how the team performs.

12 clean sheets in the last 17 games

1 goal allowed in the last 7 games. 5wins and 2 draws in that time.

This team is performing very, very well now in the last half of the season.

Exactly. You must have an ingrained agenda to not see the progress Ole has made from the beginning of his first season in charge. This is not simply beating a 10 man bruges, it has been slowing evolving over the last few months, of course there has been false dawns and we are still not 'ready' but they wanted progress, they wanted to see a style of play and a plan. They wanted to see goals and clean sheets. I can only wonder what there problem is now?

The knee jerkers are the ones that wanted to replace as soon as he lost a few games. He will get next season unless the team fall apart and then there would be no complaints. We are finally watching a team that are starting to believe, long may it continue.

 

[Random Task]

It's been an awesome few weeks for the team and Ole, but that's all it is at present - a purple patch. It stands out like an outlier in comparison to the abject shite either side of it, since Ole was made permanent. My views are based on around 1-year of performances and results and will not be swayed by 3-4 weeks of good times.

My opinion remaisn the same, if he gets top 4 or CL football via winning the EL, fine, he gets more time. If he fails, having outspent every other manager in England, he goes.

To evaluate Ole's reign fairly, you have to take the rebuild process and the inconsistent results that are a natural by-product it into account. It was always going to be a difficult season with the mass-clearout in the summer and the introduction of new players, not to mention failing to sign a CM and having to rely on Lingard and Periera to provide creativity as a consequence.

Injuries have also been unkind this season, we've lost Martial, Pogba, Mctominay and Rashford for long periods. At no point in the season has Ole been able to field his strongest first eleven. Klopp, by comparison, has had no such troubles. Look where Liverpool are now.

The point is there are mitigating circumstances that we absolutely must account for if we are to assess Ole's first season in charge fairly. To look at results since he took charge and base your opinion on that would be a blinkered view at best.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Ole will still be manager at the start of next season. If he isn't I'll delete my account here.

Well that would mean that we show progress and don't finish 8th, so I hope so.

You're naive as fook if you think he's staying under any circumstances, as naive some people were thinking Moyes was gonna get all the time in the World. Ticket sales took a massive hit during the last few months of Moyes and seasonal hospitality was not getting renewed, then United pulled the trigger.

Same will happen here.

 

[InspiRED]

Since his joined he has only lost 5 out of 20 league and cup matches against the top 6 and Leicester, winning 11 of those, and that with a team very much in transition. If those were my stats, I would be arguing pretty strongly that they showed that I am capable of competing at that level. You would be too.

Nah, I disagree. The signs are promising now but the smash n grab wins against the likes of PSG and Man City and other top teams didn't show promise to me, any more than Chelsea's backs to the wall smash n grab against Barcelona in 2012 proved they were a 'quality side'. They did win it that year, but it was one of the most pathetic and unmemorable cup wins in living memory.

It's very possible there are good things to come based on current signs, but I really take umbrage with this idea that Ole's made no mistakes and it's all been part of his master plan all player shortages were unavoidable etc.

 

[Danimancer]

Because we're worse under him than under any of our other post-SAF managers? Because he's never shown anything in his career to suggest he's capable of competing at that level? Because we're still unbelievably inconsistent and we'd probably need to spend a lot to have a squad good enough to compete with such an average manager.

It's simply really, you'd be talking about spending hundreds of millions to even consider challenging under Ole, whereas there are other, more proven managers out there who have, at least, challenged for titles spending far less than that. Which makes more sense?

Best case scenario under Ole is that he leaves a good squad for our next manager, which it currently looks like he could do. And hopefully gets us a top four finish at some point.

I respect your opinion, i really do. But i struggle to understand what criteria you are using when saying we are worse under him.
Are you basing it on league position? The season isn't finished yet, but I believe we have placed worse than 5th
Are you basing it on goals conceeded vs goals scored? I doubt this season will be the worst one post-fergie on that count, but hey, the season isn't finished
Are you basing it on transfers? In my books, the ones he has brought in seem to do rather well. And those shipped out... well, I would have preferred Lukaku remaining, but hey, overall seems like the right call to let them go
Are you basing it on subjective opinion of style of play? I guess that is an even harder quantifiable criteria, but I think we haven't played much champagne football under the previous managers

I say we are still challenging for top 4, we are transforming the squad, we are challenging for Europa League.... At this point, we aren't worse in my books

 

[El Zoido]

He’s doing a fine job. People are really hung up on his brief stint at Cardiff and lack of experience. It’s understandable but everyone has to start somewhere. My perspective is to keep the manager in place as long as the team is showing signs of improvement or good consistency, and sack them when it’s clear their management is actively harming the team. Jose was sending us backwards, Ole is not. The team is improving, we should look to replace him when it becomes clear he can’t take this group any further.

 

[Massive Spanner]

Since his joined he has only lost 5 out of 20 league and cup matches against the top 6 and Leicester, winning 11 of those, and that with a team very much in transition. If those were my stats, I would be arguing pretty strongly that they showed that I am capable of competing at that level. You would be too.

Yes, yes, his top 6 record is pretty good, we all know this. But his overall record is really bad. Selective stat picking to try prove your argument is a sign of desperation.

 

[Thisistheone]

One big thing he's done, he's made me like the team again. Unlike the LvG and Mourinho teams

 

[Massive Spanner]

Just seeing the impact of having a creator in the midfield is very encouraging to say the least. Not stumbling every time we meet an opponent that sits low, will have a massive impact on our winrate and point tally. Better times a head!

I hate to break it to you, but we haven't come across an opponent like that in the games we've won. The last time we did was against Wolves, at home, with Bruno, and we drew 0-0 with almost no shots on target.

Our next four games are Everton, City, Spurs, and Sheffield Utd. I would say we need to wait and see how he does in those first before proclaiming we've turned a corner.