Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

Sack or Keep OLE?

  • Sack Ole & appoint new coach ASAP

  • Keep Ole & back him to finish rebuild


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Like what? I've seen people on here saying that, but what good things are happening? He made 3 decent signings, two of which were very expensive, obvious ones, what else has happened? He got rid of some players who didn't want to be here whilst making our squad weaker in the process? Great. He hired some staff? Great, that's nice. Anything else we aren't aware of?

So far we haven't seen any of this lovely new playstyle he promised, or this new fitness regime that was supposed to fix our players being knackered and not working hard enough and constantly getting injured.

In the summer he was talking up Rashford and Martial and saying he's happy going into the season with them as our main strikers and that we won't panic buy, now he's saying we need to sign someone in January, the worst possible time to do so, a complete 360.

Seriously, what's this amazing stuff going on behind the scenes? Tell me.

He probably could be doing a bit better with the personnel he has, but it's not a team built to play fluid football. You are seven games into this season, way too soon for panic. You have old players on the decline and players Mourinho bought in for a completely different style of football. Yes, 2 of Ole's signings were expensive, but frankly before then your expensive signings haven't exactly worked out at all. Your youth players are NOWHERE NEAR as good as most of the cafe thinks, and will be trampled on in first team play. The players that were shipped out needed to be so, and there will be more to come. Both LvG and Mourinho had the opportunity, and failed. More players needed to come in, but this was alwaya going to be a process.


Results aside (admittedly an important factor!), Ole is doing fine.
 
EDIT: Regarding Moyes. Right now we're worse than we've ever been with him in charge.

This is just absolute bullocks... Please take a look at the fixtures from the 2013-14 season. Losing 0-1 at home to Newcastle and Everton in the span of three days. We also lost 0-3 to both City and Liverpool at home just nine days apart. To say that we even are remotely close to the rock bottom we hit under Moyes is just nonsense.
 
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He probably could be doing a bit better with the personnel he has, but it's not a team built to play fluid football. You are seven games into this season, way too soon for panic. You have old players on the decline and players Mourinho bought in for a completely different style of football. Yes, 2 of Ole's signings were expensive, but frankly before then your expensive signings haven't exactly worked out at all. Your youth players are NOWHERE NEAR as good as most of the cafe thinks, and will be trampled on in first team play. The players that were shipped out needed to be so, and there will be more to come. Both LvG and Mourinho had the opportunity, and failed. More players needed to come in, but this was alwaya going to be a process.


Results aside (admittedly an important factor!), Ole is doing fine.
You didn't answer my questions at all, just repeated what I said.

I'll ask again, what's this amazing behind scenes work that's happening?
 
He probably could be doing a bit better with the personnel he has, but it's not a team built to play fluid football. You are seven games into this season, way too soon for panic. You have old players on the decline and players Mourinho bought in for a completely different style of football. Yes, 2 of Ole's signings were expensive, but frankly before then your expensive signings haven't exactly worked out at all. Your youth players are NOWHERE NEAR as good as most of the cafe thinks, and will be trampled on in first team play. The players that were shipped out needed to be so, and there will be more to come. Both LvG and Mourinho had the opportunity, and failed. More players needed to come in, but this was alwaya going to be a process.


Results aside (admittedly an important factor!), Ole is doing fine.
With all respect, how can a non-supporter of the club like you be so adamant of this?

Okay, leaving the results aside for now, please tell me what progress has been made on the pitch with 1) Our style of play (build-up/attacking structure etc) & 2) development of existing players, since he has came in?

He's been here over 9 months now so you must have something to back up your claims right?
 
With all respect, how can a non-supporter of the club like you be so adamant of this?

Okay, leaving the results aside for now, please tell me what progress has been made on the pitch with 1) Our style of play (build-up/attacking structure etc) & 2) development of existing players, since he has came in?

He's been here over 9 months now so you must have something to back up your claims right?

Apart from the titanic is sinking, the band is playing just fine
 
Yeah, I'm sure when Ferguson was finishing 13th three times out of four seasons, despite United finishing 4th or higher 6 out of 7 seasons before his arrival, the fans and the board thought he was going to become the greatest manager ever.

Please point out how Ole (or LvG, or Mourinho, or even Moyes) should be sacked by those standards.

What are you trying to prove exactly? It’s a different era, managers lasted a lot long than they do now. You don’t still call people in a phone box do you? As well as we might have been your viewing a league where which club was at the top was a good guess year by year except for Liverpool. Go look at Everton the finished 1st 2nd then 8th. The standards for clubs were a lot different. There was no demand for top 4 and the money was nowhere near the same.
 
It's like buying Bolasie and expecting him to become Ronaldo given time, because patience paid off with him. It's so daft. Look how impatient fans are with Martial/Rashford and the lack of belief in them being 30 goal a season guys, because they haven't proven it yet these same people expect Ole, who has shown less quality as a manager than they have as potential forward stars, to randomly become a world class manager.

I also don't get the argument that no one can do any better. That's utter rubbish, even if our squad is not amazing that doesn't mean this is the best our team can achieve. If anything, not many would do much worse than Ole!

Exactly, this is what's so weird about fans who want to keep Ole in. There are literally hundreds of managers that would bite your hand off for the United job - that's not an arrogant thing to say because the job is definitely less attractive than it was previously but it's still a huge club and financially robust - there are plenty of candidates with more experience than Ole. He came in and we had such a great rebound because of the negativity and stress Jose put on the team, we didn't play particularly well in most of those games but we were winning and it was great to be on that run which culminated in the PSG game. An awesome night but let's not pretend we weren't lucky over the two legs. From then on it has been horrendous.

Fans on here act as if this group players is awful but the reality is there are some really top players mixed in with a lot of average-good guys + Lingard who is genuinely not good enough. Give them a structure, motivation and try to improve them and we should be beating most of the league comfortably and then looking to minimise damage when we play the teams like City and Pool who are definitively too good for us at this time. We should be able to be in the fight for 3rd or 4th with this squad when you think of how poorly Spurs, Chelsea and Arsenal have started. I can't see that happening with Ole.
 
Apart from the titanic is sinking, the band is playing just fine
I feel like i'm going insane reading this board sometimes! The stuff people come out with, it's totally detached from the reality of what we've been seeing every week.
 
Amazing post. Thank you for calmly analysing and taking apart his wild, ill informed statements. The supposed 'blow up' with Adani was gold. As if a real expert like Allegri putting that disrespectful fool in his place is a bad thing!
If the United board decides to get rid of Ole and doesn't want to take a risk by going left field for an Eddie Howe - just for an example of what would be a bold move - then clearly a manager such as Allegri has to be the obvious candidate.

His teams have won important silverware and when United gets back to qualification for the Champions League, Allegri would alone be a boost to our chances with all that European experience. Pochettino frankly doesn't cut it. Nothing in terms of trophies, he has yet to prove himself. The next United manager must have real success on their cv.
 
Now why do not you take a deep breath and take a closer look at how this debate started? I was just replying to a poster who claimed that I had no idea about real football and coaching. You do not have to have coaching badges to realize that Ole is doing shite, like very badly. And I never ever claimed to be a better manager than Ole, as I am not manager at all. But I do know a thing or two about football and am sure that I have much more hands on experience of the game compared to that condescending person. I repeat once again Ole is out of his depth at United. The results are there for everyone to see. It is getting worse under him and I doubt that the Board will be eager to invest big if the trends continues.

Ok. I didn’t mean to take sides in an argument at all. My point was that one opinion cannot be argued to be worth more than another by reference to a CV - and especially that good footballers who have played under the best managers often appear to learn very little (even the few who have learned a a great deal often disagree with each other).

I gather the poster you were debating with drew his conclusions from the content of your posts which do appear, to me, to contain bluster and supposition.
 
If the United board decides to get rid of Ole and doesn't want to take a risk by going left field for an Eddie Howe - just for an example of what would be a bold move - then clearly a manager such as Allegri has to be the obvious candidate.

His teams have won important silverware and when United gets back to qualification for the Champions League, Allegri would alone be a boost to our chances with all that European experience. Pochettino frankly doesn't cut it. Nothing in terms of trophies, he has yet to prove himself. The next United manager must have real success on their cv.

We just had 2 of the most successful managers ever in LvG and Mourinho. That didnt exactly work out. We have far greater problems than simply who manages the team.

For the FIRST time since SAF left, we've had one transfer window with 3 successful purchases who look like they will be club players for a long time. Let that factual tidbit set in.

Our recruitment has been absymal. For once it has been great. Lets build on that. With this manager.
 
Results aside (admittedly an important factor!), Ole is doing fine.

Apart from the money, I'm a Millionaire...

Apart from the vehicle, I own a black Lamborghini

Regarding Moyes. Right now we're worse than we've ever been with him in charge.

This is just absolute bullocks... Please take a look at the fixtures from the 2013-14 season. Losing 0-1 at home to Newcastle and Everton in the span of three days. We also lost 0-3 to both City and Liverpool at home just nine days apart. To say that we even are remotely close to the rock bottom we hit under Moyes is just nonsense.

This is our worst PL start in THIRTY YEARS - so yes, factually, this is worse than Moyes. End of.
 
We just had 2 of the most successful managers ever in LvG and Mourinho. That didnt exactly work out. We have far greater problems than simply who manages the team.

For the FIRST time since SAF left, we've had one transfer window with 3 successful purchases who look like they will be club players for a long time. Let that factual tidbit set in.
Our recruitment has been absymal. For once it has been great. Lets build on that. With this manager.

I agree with you. I'm on the Ole should stay side especially as we haven't been able to replace players and so have a thin squad which some blame on Ole but I know United couldn't get what they wanted and they were not going to sanction players who were playing hard to get and made it clear their interest was conditional.

If the board did decide to get rid of Ole, I think Pochettino is inadequate. Allegri would seem a logical choice.

However, I've noted some of your posts and you seem to have some inside info at times. Hopefully the United board realizes another managerial musical chairs will be counter-productive. United desperately needs a highly confident clinical striker and an effective midfielder to say the least. It seems to me the United strategy is to focus on those younger England players such as Sancho and have them as the successful backbone along with the two top lads we've recruited already in Aaron and Harry.

Ole needs at least this season and the next to be assessed fairly. If the board doesn't act prematurely then United fans owe it at least some respect.
 
Is every manager we sign is a potentially Fergie if given time?
Are we the same club we were back in the 80’s financially? Have we not become a giant thanks to the same Fergie?

It’s in the past, we’ll never have Fergie again, we’ll have other managers.
This - a thousand million times. The idea that every manager deserves time because a genius (and past League and European trophy winner) like Fergie deserved it is the most inane and insane and stupendously stupid arguments going.
 
For the FIRST time since SAF left, we've had one transfer window with 3 successful purchases who look like they will be club players for a long time. Let that factual tidbit set in.

Our recruitment has been absymal. For once it has been great. Lets build on that. With this manager.

WTF are you talking about? We're in early October FFS.

Romelu Lukaku was viewed as a great signing for the first 4 months of his time here.

Pogba was viewed as a great signing for his first season back here.

Zlatan too.

Bailly was viewed as a great signing for the first 3/4 months.

FFS, even ADM for the first few months looked absolutely great!

You're not dealing in facts - far from it.

We have no idea how these 3 signings will be viewed next season, so knock it off with the 'first successful window since SAF left' rubbish.

Also, the most expensive of these signings, was wanted by Mourinho for less than we just paid for him ffs.

Laughable stuff.
 
I think oles last roll of the dice is to develop some of the top young Norwegian talent out there. Odegaard, Ajer, Haaland and possibly Berge? Get them while they are still learning and get them to play their socks off for him. I think we are in for a very rude and very expensive awakening if our long term strategy is basically just to sign English players for 40-80 million once other smaller clubs have given them a season or 2. I’m really starting to think that ole in charge of this squad rebuild plus Ed and the owners we have equals mid table for the next few seasons at least.
 
We just had 2 of the most successful managers ever in LvG and Mourinho. That didnt exactly work out. We have far greater problems than simply who manages the team.

For the FIRST time since SAF left, we've had one transfer window with 3 successful purchases who look like they will be club players for a long time. Let that factual tidbit set in.

Our recruitment has been absymal. For once it has been great. Lets build on that. With this manager.

Steady mate... success needs to be judged over more than 6-7 games.

Jose's signings looked quality in the short term. Similar with LVG.
But over time that perception changed.

Fingers crossed they actually are quality signings this time! Great early signs.
 
Ok. I didn’t mean to take sides in an argument at all. My point was that one opinion cannot be argued to be worth more than another by reference to a CV - and especially that good footballers who have played under the best managers often appear to learn very little (even the few who have learned a a great deal often disagree with each other).

I gather the poster you were debating with drew his conclusions from the content of your posts which do appear, to me, to contain bluster and supposition.
I fully agree that it takes some really special talent to be a top manager. I have come across only one in my life personally, others were meh. As fot the start of that stupid debate: when a poster talks in a condescending way to others he needs to be fully ready for a pay back.
Now back to the main topic: I do not see a top manager in Ole, and I am praying to God to be proved wrong.
 
I would sack him, but Woodward needs to first or at least removed from making football-related decisions. Ole is fine trying to bring back the Fergie era discipline, but what I want to see is an improvement in the playing style.

We are no better 10 months after he started apart from running around a bit more. There is zero creativity for the strikers. Pogba and McTominay's roles should be reversed with MvTominay using his energy and tackling ability to play as a shutdown midfield enforcer. We pissed off a perfectly good striker who was able to score and keep someone who is turning out to be another Welbeck. Great decision making that was.

We are recruiting as a mid-table team now and that's where we will be for a while. It's a repeat of the 70's and 80's
 
We just had 2 of the most successful managers ever in LvG and Mourinho. That didnt exactly work out. We have far greater problems than simply who manages the team.

For the FIRST time since SAF left, we've had one transfer window with 3 successful purchases who look like they will be club players for a long time. Let that factual tidbit set in.

Our recruitment has been absymal. For once it has been great. Lets build on that. With this manager.

No factual tidbits for us to allow to sink in. Just your subjective opinion that they've done well.
But I'd counter that and say Maguire hasn't been all that, and definitely not what I'd want from an 80m player. AWB has looked solid but has also had injuries and James has been the bright spark but can we rely on him maintaining form all season.

I've been guilty of eulogising Ole but it's becoming apparent that he isn't of the standard we need to get us back to the top. Ultimately he sanctioned the sale of two strikers and signed no replacements, same with the midfield. If funds were not available for the signings he should have kept at least one striker until he could replace them. It's pure negligence to place all our hopes on Mason.

Woodward is clearly inept but Ole is not blameless. It's all well and good saying the right things and raising morale in the fans early on, but now it's clearly just lip service. I know he wants what's best for the club but that doesn't make him qualified for the job, if that was the only requirement for a manager I'd throw my name in the hat.
 
It wasn’t really a good post at all. There wasn’t a single point on football as a trade. People keep harping on about this and that. Sentiment this and sentiment that. Football management is actually a trade, and there is a science behind it. The only difference managing a small club and a big one is handling expectations, that’s it. It is so obvious many posters on here never kicked a football in their life, and certainly never going through a transition in football philosophy. It is not as easy as some people think. It’s like having a wank with your left hand, it will take some getting used to. How about doing just like Ferdinand said, let this unfold and run it’s course? You either get to play football exerts at the end of it, or looking like complete idiots.
I fully agree that it takes some really special talent to be a top manager. I have come across only one in my life personally, others were meh. As fot the start of that stupid debate: when a poster talks in a condescending way to others he needs to be fully ready for a pay back.
Now back to the main topic: I do not see a top manager in Ole, and I am praying to God to be proved wrong.
This was a condescending post? Fecking hell.. You trying a comeback with some junior football isn’t really on me. It’s the truth, and like I said, just let it play out. Or, Ferdinand said it. There are a lot of good things happening on the pitch, but it’s not good enough yet. Let’s see what happens with a fit first 11 and with a couple of more signings. If you can’t see that either, that one is on you to.
 
We are not worse than Moyes until we overcome the most crosses per game!

That's not true.

Like it or not we are currently having the worst start in 30 years, Moyes oversaw a more successful start of the season than Ole has managed.

You can't add an arbitrary condition for success or in this case, failure.
 
That's not true.

Like it or not we are currently having the worst start in 30 years, Moyes oversaw a more successful start of the season than Ole has managed.

You can't add an arbitrary condition for success or in this case, failure.
Moyes was the manager of the reigning champions and we ended up finishing 7th. We finished 6th last season and if Mourinho had stayed, I can bet we would have barely even been in the top 10, just like his last Chelsea season.
 
That's not true.

Like it or not we are currently having the worst start in 30 years, Moyes oversaw a more successful start of the season than Ole has managed.

You can't add an arbitrary condition for success or in this case, failure.
You missed the joke Pal.
 
Well their not wrong? If results go against us this weekend we could be a point off the relegation zone. We haven’t even had a tough run of games.

We could. I've said before that due to the club's poor planning and apparent lack of vision risking relegation is a problem.

I'm saying the media has a big spin on the reality. Always does. As I was coming away from the ground on Monday, I said I wasn't going to look at the media reports. It happens with Radio 5 as well. What said often isn't a good reflection of what you've just seen. So the "worst in 30 years" is a spin on a draw against a top 6 team, one where we played better than we have in the last 3 or more games. There were positives in the game, overall and from specific players. This is good. That game wasn't the "worst start in 30 years", that was the most recent game of that run. We were sh*t against West Ham, for example, but better against Arsenal. The bottom line is that an honest headline, which might have said it wasn't a great game for neutrals and that United were better than they have been for a few games is too nuanced for the press these days.

Or put another way, we could have got beaten by Arsenal and been totally sh*t, the same headline could be written, but the situation would be worse.

It's hard for fans to have patience, it can be frustrating. The ramping up of pressure by the press in this way makes that even harder for fans. Right now things aren't great for Spurs of Chelsea, we're at an earlier building stage than them really. But it seems having a young team, some of whom are academy players now counts for nothing, because we're doing it. Meanwhile City's squad cost a £Billion a very occasionally Foden get's 5 minutes on the field.

I'm frustrated too. We should have signed that extra 1 or 2 players were now clearly missing. But this feels like progress compared to before. A clearout can't be done in one window, nor can a rebuild.
 
Keep Ole, he deserves time to change the mentality of the squad and implement his ideas.

He's had ONE transfer window only bought 3 quality players for a combined 145ish million and sold Lukaku and Darmian for 60ish million. 85ish net spend (nets spends important to some fans).

We are at or close to our lowest since Sir Alex retired, and some fans say we had to world class managers in LVG and Mourinho but LVG was at the end if his managerial career. And Mourinho had never adapted his management and was getting outdated when compared to Pep, Klopp, Favre and Tuchel etc.

We all want success and we want it yesterday but being realistic it takes time, money, more than one transfers window, direction and again time.

I think we are slowly heading in the right direction but so far lack the correct type of players to play the way Ole wants.
 
I feel like i'm going insane reading this board sometimes! The stuff people come out with, it's totally detached from the reality of what we've been seeing every week.

I'm not sure what it is. I think it's mainly down to the fact that it's Ole. If we didn't have a player legend as a manager people wouldn't be that deluded.
 
Keep Ole, he deserves time to change the mentality of the squad and implement his ideas.

He's had ONE transfer window only bought 3 quality players for a combined 145ish million and sold Lukaku and Darmian for 60ish million. 85ish net spend (nets spends important to some fans).

We are at or close to our lowest since Sir Alex retired, and some fans say we had to world class managers in LVG and Mourinho but LVG was at the end if his managerial career. And Mourinho had never adapted his management and was getting outdated when compared to Pep, Klopp, Favre and Tuchel etc.

We all want success and we want it yesterday but being realistic it takes time, money, more than one transfers window, direction and again time.

I think we are slowly heading in the right direction but so far lack the correct type of players to play the way Ole wants.
I just realized we actually did sell Darmian. Had forgotten he even existed.
 
Keep Ole, he deserves time to change the mentality of the squad and implement his ideas.

He's had ONE transfer window only bought 3 quality players for a combined 145ish million and sold Lukaku and Darmian for 60ish million. 85ish net spend (nets spends important to some fans).

We are at or close to our lowest since Sir Alex retired, and some fans say we had to world class managers in LVG and Mourinho but LVG was at the end if his managerial career. And Mourinho had never adapted his management and was getting outdated when compared to Pep, Klopp, Favre and Tuchel etc.

We all want success and we want it yesterday but being realistic it takes time, money, more than one transfers window, direction and again time.

I think we are slowly heading in the right direction but so far lack the correct type of players to play the way Ole wants.

How in this universe or any other one are we ‘heading in the right direction’

I’m still shocked daily at the massive delusion on show from our fans while in every passing day with Ole in charge we become less & less relevant or a rival to other big clubs .

Other top teams look at us as a joke tolerating crap & that’s exactly what are are until we show some ambition & standards
 
Also those steadfastly supporting Ole despite all the evidence in front of you that he’s not good enough are playing right into the Glazers hands.

Do just enough to ‘attempt’ to get into the Champions League. Keep profits high as we’re still a hugely marketable club. Hire a patsy of a manager who’s just happy to be there & won’t cause a fuss over transfers, spend minimal amounts on the squad.

I bet they can’t believe their luck if they saw polls like this where 62% of people are happy with Ole.
 
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How in this universe or any other one are we ‘heading in the right direction’

I’m still shocked daily at the massive delusion on show from our fans while in every passing day with Ole in charge we become less & less relevant or a rival to other big clubs .

Other top teams look at us as a joke tolerating crap & that’s exactly what are are until we show some ambition & standards

I never said we are heading in the right direction. I said I think we are slowly heading in the right direction.

Got rid of two experienced managers who Failed. Who spend lots of money on poor players and played boring possession football or parked busses. Mourinho is a cheque book manager who drove the wage bill up.

We now target young talented players on supposedly resonable wages on long contracts (resale value).
Shipped out some deadwood.

Trying to change the way we play, fitter, pressing more and I would say more exciting at times than before.

Yes we need more midfielders, a right winger and a stricker imo. Plus some decent squad players.

If we sacked Sir Alex when he was changing the squad, playing style and mentality in his early days who knows where we would be now.

My thoughts and opinions in a football forum but not necessarily correct ones.
 
I never said we are heading in the right direction. I said I think we are slowly heading in the right direction.

Got rid of two experienced managers who Failed. Who spend lots of money on poor players and played boring possession football or parked busses. Mourinho is a cheque book manager who drove the wage bill up.

We now target young talented players on supposedly resonable wages on long contracts (resale value).
Shipped out some deadwood.

Trying to change the way we play, fitter, pressing more and I would say more exciting at times than before.

Yes we need more midfielders, a right winger and a stricker imo. Plus some decent squad players.

If we sacked Sir Alex when he was changing the squad, playing style and mentality in his early days who knows where we would be now.

My thoughts and opinions in a football forum but not necessarily correct ones.

I’m actually sick of people comparing Ole to Sir Alex- he actually had proven he was capable of being a good manager up in Scotland .

We’ve hired one who no one else in the Prem would touch.

If you look at Leicester with less of a budget Rogers has already created an identity there (& not languishing in mid table either)

Either our fans are blinded by the fact it’s a legend in charge from the reality, or they’re stupid.

Either way we’re the laughing stock of the league for sticking with a horribly failing manager
 
I can look past results if there's progression in the style of play. This is honestly the most clueless we have ever looked as a club, its almost as if we are being instructed to play shite its that dire.
 
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