And their striker options then being Aguero and Jesus.
Not using anyone listed as wing options we have Ighalo.
So no, initial point stands
With Sancho & Camavinga in, do we soon surpass Liverpool & City's squad?
- Thread starter luke511
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And their striker options then being Aguero and Jesus.
Not using anyone listed as wing options we have Ighalo.
So no, initial point stands
The current team with Bruno and Ighalo in has been the best team in the league over 10 games. What is your assessment of third as a best case scenario based on?
Barcelona are an immense financial trouble and already has tons of star attackers that all want to start. Liverpool has a settled outstanding front three all of whom are supposedly staying, so Sancho can easily come and got benched there. City has a chance, but their main focus would be their defense (and replacing Silva/Fernandinho, which they still haven't done properly). Real is an option, but their long-term target seems to be Mbappé.
Our striker options are Martial, Greenwood, Rashford. The beauty of having players that can play more than one position.. Also I don't think Ighalo will be here next season.
What makes you say that City and Liverpool are not in for him? City will sell Sane this summer and they have first refusal on Sancho. Barca always have this cannot afford, yet stump out £130m plus every summer. Real Madrid if they cannot get Mbappe will go for him.
I understand what you say about what united are offering, yet on the pitch we offer the least. Liverpool, City offer the chance to compete for titles here and now. Sancho can look at the Pogba transfer which was the same thing Sancho is being offered, yet there has been no progress.
Lets face it, whichever prem team he goes to, he will be the face of those teams because he is English.
No it hasn’t.
It’s based on the last year of results. Liverpool have won 27 games this year, we have won 12. You think 2 teenagers are going to make up 40 points?
The fact that we’re even discussing this is crazy.
My brain hurts and I miss football. Why is everyone so sure we wouldn’t compete? If we kept up our pre corona form we’d be right in the mix. Small sample size but does it not seem to any of you that Bruno could be our Silva, the player who ties it all together. If we just add sancho we have a young and potentially world class attack on paper. Pogba Maguire Bruno Fred DDG are all top players and in their prime. Be positive lads. Remember you can win things with a few really good kids after all.
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The 2017/18 season Liverpool finished 25 points behind City, in 18/19 they made up 24 points.
In the 16/17 Chelsea made up 30 points to win the league.
So the fact that it has been done is not crazy at all.
Secondly, Liverpool have won all but 2 games this season, it is a freak season in terms of that, there is bound to be a drop of by them.
Bruno has already improved the team, signings such as Sancho will improve us even more, so I dont get why you would put a ceiling on a team that is beginning to gel?
Why do you keep on ignoring Bruno and Pogba? Two huge players for us.. You make it sound like they're just average teenage footballers as well, they're two of the brightest talents on the planet. They'd be filling in 2 of our weakest positions so I think you're underestimating how much of an impact that can make, look what's happened to our results with just one position being improved with top talent, Bruno.
Agreed. Take off Martial and put in Fred in shift around vs tougher teams.
bench/starter options of:
Greenwood
Igahlo
Williams
Bailly
Tuanzabe
Fred
James
Matic
Romero
Re 1: yes it has. Utd had the best form in the premier league over the last 10 games. You cannot simply say "no it hasn't". 29 goals scored and only 1 conceded in the last 10 games across all competitions, without Pogba and Rashford!
https://www.football365.com/news/fe...ble-man-utd-liverpool-bayern-arsenal-man-city
Now, as you will have noticed, I made no mention of any two teenagers. I simply pointed out that a Utd team without its best two players was the best team in England over the last 10 games. If this same team without any new additions from this point on can keep up this form, why is third place supposed to be its highest aspiration?
We still need a left back, another CB, a new goalkeeper (get good money for DDG if we can), at least one attacking fullback, a new striker, and a new manager.
Camavinga is a world class prospect, not a world class player and City has their midfield filled with world class players in their prime.
Camavinga is not the one. But Sancho and Partey/Ndidi would probably be the 20% of inputs that could give the 80% of output next season.
No, if its next season. Yes, if it’s over 5 - 10 years you’d fancy that team to pick up leagues, cups and the CL.
A couple of qualifications - the likes of Greenwood, Sancho, Rashford, Williams, to keep improving and realise their full potential. Pogba to commit to the club. I feel a new CB would be needed too unless Bailly, Axel or Lindelöf step up. De Gea, older players etc to be adequately replaced if we’re talking past the 5 years.
Another factor will be Pep and Klopp will be leaving the clubs soon so straight away both sides are weaker and would not maintain current levels. Their rebuilds will be crucial which is why IMO signing the likes of Sancho not only benefits us but indirectly weakens a rival. Take CFs Martínez heads to Barcelona, Werner heads to Bayern, Håland heads to Real, Martial and Greenwood develop and go up the gears, who do City bring in to replace Aguero? Now, there’s a drop off. Liverpool?
There’s a real opportunity going to open up in the league and Europe in the next few years and we seem to be building a side that will explode maybe the season after next. We’ve been to Argos, we’ve bought the iron hopefully we will have it plugged in ready to strike in the years ahead!
A couple of qualifications - the likes of Greenwood, Sancho, Rashford, Williams, to keep improving and realise their full potential. Pogba to commit to the club. I feel a new CB would be needed too unless Bailly, Axel or Lindelöf step up. De Gea, older players etc to be adequately replaced if we’re talking past the 5 years.
Another factor will be Pep and Klopp will be leaving the clubs soon so straight away both sides are weaker and would not maintain current levels. Their rebuilds will be crucial which is why IMO signing the likes of Sancho not only benefits us but indirectly weakens a rival. Take CFs Martínez heads to Barcelona, Werner heads to Bayern, Håland heads to Real, Martial and Greenwood develop and go up the gears, who do City bring in to replace Aguero? Now, there’s a drop off. Liverpool?
There’s a real opportunity going to open up in the league and Europe in the next few years and we seem to be building a side that will explode maybe the season after next. We’ve been to Argos, we’ve bought the iron hopefully we will have it plugged in ready to strike in the years ahead!
And while we are at it some new fans to replace many of our entitled and clueless bunch.
Sancho Haaland Grealish keep pogba and a new manager then yep.
there has been progress since pogba came, it just hasnt manifested in results yet. the vibe now is different to the one when we signed pogba, where we still had lots of LVG deadwood as regular players. now the team is younger and fresher looking, and seems on an upward trajectory. in retrospect, that lvg side had become pretty stagnant, aside from martial, rashford and de gea, who are still here in this current team.
He wont be the face of liverpool, right now thats their front 3 and van dijk. speaking of, thats why liverpool wont target him, they already have salah. city admittedly might go for him, but i didnt say these teams arent in for him at all, i just said it doesnt seem like they are, since ive heard literally 0 credible rumours or anything of the sort suggesting that. liverpool have salah, and city dont want to look bad bringing back one of their own academy players for a fortune like we did with pogba. plus, city so far dont ever spend over 60-70M pounds.
we are definitely at the front of the queue. its just whether or not we can agree something with dortmund. if the prem season gets completed i think we'll get it done. if the prem season doesnt get finished then we cant afford sancho.
I agree that we might be ahead in the queue or it might seem that way, but alot can happen.
In respects to vibe is different now, I somewhat agree but I can remind you back to the summer we got Jose in and we signed Pogba, Zlatan, Bailly and Mikhi and there was a real vibe then and we went on to win our first few games until we played City.
The place was bouncing, fans were optimistic, similar to what we are seing now and look how that turned out.
City don't spend that but they will have to if they want to get the players they need to keep competing.
We said this every year.
Sancho isnt coming. Muppet never learns
Sancho isnt coming. Muppet never learns
Think you've over hyped a lot here. Galactico wonderkids? Pogba a leader?
Just say it as it is. We have a good squad in the making, with lots of players still required to leave and be replaced with better quality.
We aint no real Madrid, we are specifically targeting the right kind of player to sign, not just throwing money at "wonderkid galactico" types
Are there 2 more expensive young players on the market to be linked with? Sancho is a potential galactico as far as a young signing goes. Same as Rooney was. I was alluding to the fact that Pogba is a senior player and will be seen as a leader in the squad if he stays. Football can’t come back soon enough, we’ve all the hypotheticals talked to death at this stage.
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The whole plan that Ole is working to implement is not, and never has been, about catching up to Liverpool and City right away. It would be a fools errand and the club know that. Those two teams are (hopefully) at or around the peak of their cycles right now, and yes they will continue to sign other players and may not dip considerably or at all, but the likelihood is that they will not sustain the level that they are currently playing at. Key players will age, coaches will move on, hunger might decrease. They may make some mistakes in the transfer market. It happens to every squad. Those two teams are so strong because they have been outstanding in recruitment, and United have been little short of woeful in this department for too many years.
I love what the club are doing now, and Ole is a huge factor in this, but this squad are still in their infancy as a unit. If we get our business right again this summer, then we close the gap, but its too soon to expect us to compete with Europe's elite next season. The goal is to be the best placed team to capitalise when the current cycle of dominance by those two teams comes to an end, and right now we are doing everything right. I'd say we are a year ahead of schedule.
I love what the club are doing now, and Ole is a huge factor in this, but this squad are still in their infancy as a unit. If we get our business right again this summer, then we close the gap, but its too soon to expect us to compete with Europe's elite next season. The goal is to be the best placed team to capitalise when the current cycle of dominance by those two teams comes to an end, and right now we are doing everything right. I'd say we are a year ahead of schedule.
This is a very well put summary. The way we have been going about business for the last 6 years has been about now now now. This doesnt work as well, unless you are Chelsea.
This is why I was not critical on Ole getting rid of Lukaku, Smalling, Rojo, Herrera, Sanchez etc and yes in the short term we have struggled but I would rather struggle for one year and get the right players in.
There was no point panic buying for a CM and ST, it would have been detrimental to Martial, Greenwood's development. He has given the chance for everyone in the squad to show what they can do, some have taken the chances some haven't.
The recruitment and plan was never to catch liverpool and city this season, there was no way we would have done that, rather it was to have squad peaking when they drop and we can take advantage of this.
Looking at the squad now, in 2 years we will have the core players in their prime, with couple more players it can grow into something special.
City will have to replace Silva, Aguero, Fernandinho and still haven't replaced Kompany.
Liverpool in 2 years will have Salah, Mane, Bobby, VVD, hendo all 30 plus so will need a revamp.
Caught one!
Yeh where??
Check the first page
Add any third player to your list and the answer would still be a resounding "No". City and Liverpool squads quality and depth wise are still miles away. Don't let their recent failings trick you.
Am I psychic?
Camavinga is 17 ffs. Even 17 year old Rooney or Messi wasn't good enough to make our squad the best in the league.
It's not just Camavinga though 'ffs', the added balance of Sancho in attack and the combination of Bruno and Pogba in midfield makes a big difference. If we're thinking in squad terms then yes, buying Camavinga definitely contributes towards getting us closer to that level as he's the world's best talent in a position we're looking to strengthen. He's a Rooney equivalent in his own position, and you can't say an 18 year old Rooney didn't make help close the gap at the time? regardless of his age? To be fair you can swap Camavinga with any strong CDM link at the moment, and I still think the gap becomes very close between us and the top.
Worth remembering the +1 on the very young average squad age as well adds a lot of value.
Do you do free consultation?
I knew you would ask that...
I don't know who Camavinga is but you are putting a 17 years old who just got his first full Ligue 1 professional season in a very important role and expecting us to surpass Liverpool. It seems you underestimate a holding midfielder role. Never mind surpassing Liverpool & City, I don't even remember the last teenagers who play regular holding mid in PL title contender. I can understand if your choice is Ndidi who has good season recently or Partey or even using Fred/Scott. A 17 years old really?
Sancho won't even take either Salah & Mane spot right now which is why he prefers to join us than Liverpool. The idea of signing Sancho is for long term and make us getting closer to both Liverpool & City. The three Rashford, Martial & Sancho are still not in the stage of to be called on the same level or better than what City & Liverpool got. May be next season you never know what they will become, but in order to make this type of judgment we need to see player's current level & recent years performance.
I'm also amused to see Dean & DDG in the same squad. It's better for Dean to continue to play regular week in week out so he can be one day replace DDG, best way is letting him go on loan. He would never be at his current level to begin with if we hold his development.
Fecking hell you don't even know who the guy is yet you're completely writing him off because of his age.. Idiotic. I've seen plenty of him for Rennes to make the judgement that he'd be a very valuable asset to our squad. He managed to put in a MOTM performance as CDM vs PSG when he was 16 so you can't bring up the quality of the league, and he's made the most tackles out of any midfielder in Europe. So long story short, wind ya neck in.
As I said in the post you've quoted, I don't think Camavinga alone would help us surpass Liverpool. Swap Camavinga with any top quality CDM we've been linked with and I still think we're in very good shape to at least match Liverpool and City.
A title with "do we soon surpass Liverpool and City's squad?" fits my point in the OP more. didn't mean for it to sound as instant.