No idea. However, I am 99% sure that if ETH joined Brighton 18 months ago and De Zerbi joined us 18 months ago we’d be having the exact same discussion about wanting to swap them. Not convinced we’d have finished 3rd either.
Who replaces Ten Hag?
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Gareth Southgate. You heard it here first.
His Chelsea time is a bit of a grey area. So much going on there, Todd Boehly playing DoF, loads of signings but a very unbalanced squad, unhappy players etc. They've spent loads since he left and still don't look the finished article. So I think there is some context that excuses his time at Chelsea somewhat. It remains to be seen if he's good enough, he was up there as an option when we hired ETH, so he's got to be the best interim option if he would be interested. I think it's a good second chance that he'd be interested in.
There isn't a current successful football manager who doesn't operate in a structure with a Sporting Director/Football Director taking charge of key footballing decisions. It is a pre-requisite now for clubs to have someone behind the scene working on long-term footballing visions.
Managers are now mainly Head Coaches and our setup simply demands too much from our managers. They need to run all the footballing side of the club from transfers right down to matchday planning.
It's not where football is anymore and every single manager currently in the game would fail at our club. That's when you know it's no longer a managerial problem.
Managers are now mainly Head Coaches and our setup simply demands too much from our managers. They need to run all the footballing side of the club from transfers right down to matchday planning.
It's not where football is anymore and every single manager currently in the game would fail at our club. That's when you know it's no longer a managerial problem.
Varane is never fit for more than 2 games in a row. Shaw is part of a long history of players who have been part of some of the worst performances and biggest defeats. We have to rid the club of players who have largely been responsible for repeated failure. That may mean getting rid of players who are also sometimes excellent (Bruno, Rashford, Shaw) because overall, they do not do it week in and week out.
I think this is probably needed irrespective of who manages us
Blimey.. most of those are just your unfounded speculation about what has happened. I'll politely withdraw from discussing it with you from this point onwards.
Yes mate, that is my point. I made another post in which I say that it needs to happen whether EtH stays or goes. Too many players from eras of failure are still at the club and a ruthless root and branch approach is needed.
We clearly dominated the ball in most games and our players could pass. Since then every manager we've had we're not able to string 3 passes together and just hoof it? Like this isn't even a debate?
There a lot of issues at Chelsea but Potter himself looked like a deer in the headlights. If there was ever a manager that reminded me of Moyes at United it was him. Out of his depth.
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We need to do what Fergie did when he came in and get rid of players associated with inconsistent performances and failure, for various reasons from attitude to fitness, despite their popularity with sections of the fans.
He sold on high profile players like Whiteside, McGrath, Strachan, Olsen, Stapleton and Moran by the end of his first two seasons - much to the dismay of some of our supporters. Under the Glazers they would been given huge contract extensions.
For those players now read the likes of Fernandes, Maguire, Sancho, Casemiro, Rashford, Shaw and Martial.
He sold on high profile players like Whiteside, McGrath, Strachan, Olsen, Stapleton and Moran by the end of his first two seasons - much to the dismay of some of our supporters. Under the Glazers they would been given huge contract extensions.
For those players now read the likes of Fernandes, Maguire, Sancho, Casemiro, Rashford, Shaw and Martial.
Exactly. If Chelsea was too big of a job for him he’d never survive at United.
Both his Brighton and Chelsea sides played good football but couldn’t score for toffee.
We are currently shit and, er, can’t score for toffee.
Getting his sides to put the ball in the net seems to be Potter’s one major flaw. I’m not sure that would suddenly disappear if he came to us.
Poor, delightful PotterEmery's the obvious choice.
Alternatively Alonso, De Zebri.
Alternatively Alonso, De Zebri.
In what world?
Because people will say anything to deflect if it helps them look better, especially managers who we've roped in because we are utterly desperate and know they probably won't be there beyond the summer. Imagine Conte comes in and we see the same sort of hilarious ineptitude that we saw for that first goal - do you not think he immediately publicly castigates the team? He can say the squad needs tearing down and restarting because it reframes the scale of the job required and he looks slightly less to blame.
van Nistelrooy isn't stupid enough to leave a PSV side he's got to the top of the table to join a sinking United (which would simultaneously burn any future bridge he might have of managing us in the future). Potter won't risk sullying his reputation further. Gallardo seems to be extremely picky. The only one I see going for it is Vitor Pereira. We are at the Giggs/Ole/Rangnick level of hopeless desperation.
Do you mean he's not a suitable choice or why would he leave Villa for us?
I don't think there is a quick fix to this mess, so in my view, we need to first look at short term solution, someone like Ancelotti (obviously no him, since he is at Real and getting a bit old), who comes in to steady the ship, get some confidence back into the players and get them playing a system suited to them and the PL, something ETH is clearly failing at (wish he wasn't, but here we are). This should be viewed as short term with rolling contract until start of the 2025/26 season at the most.
Then mid term, until the end of the season, work on overhauling the footballing structure within the club and establishing a clear vision as were we want to be. Bring in a capable DOF, who will oversee the implementation of said vision and first work over the next few transfer windows to bring in and faze out the player in accordance with the vision.
Mid to long term, find a coach that is best in line with the vision of the club, but don't be afraid to chop and change if things aren't working out, this "SAF like god figure manager" obsession has to stop.
And no I don't have any names, I'm (lately) just a casual football fan, and outside United matches and occasional late stage CL tie, I hardly watch football anymore.
Then mid term, until the end of the season, work on overhauling the footballing structure within the club and establishing a clear vision as were we want to be. Bring in a capable DOF, who will oversee the implementation of said vision and first work over the next few transfer windows to bring in and faze out the player in accordance with the vision.
Mid to long term, find a coach that is best in line with the vision of the club, but don't be afraid to chop and change if things aren't working out, this "SAF like god figure manager" obsession has to stop.
And no I don't have any names, I'm (lately) just a casual football fan, and outside United matches and occasional late stage CL tie, I hardly watch football anymore.
Ruud is out of work, PSV sacked him months ago. Potter can’t get a job at a top club as it is, Brighton won’t even touch now they’ve seen how a good manager like De Zerbi improved them when they were using the ‘we don’t have a striker’ excuse under Potter. There’s a mutually beneficial role here for someone who wants it and we want.
Totally agreed. ETH is the first manager since Sir Alex I’d like to see given time to get it right. The chances of him or anyone creating a dynasty while the Glazers are here is about 0%. My only worry with ETH is his ethos that he is trying to make us a totally different type of team To his Ajax one. I think this is a huge mistake and might be his undoing.
Go back 12 months and we actually looked like a good, not great, team. What has happened since the Cup final where we beat Newcastle with relative ease?
I would take someone with Premier League experience, not someone from a foreign land. Managers who has never play English side week in week out will never understand the physicality of English game.
Not being able to use your starting back four shouldn't result in losing half of all games.
He isn't a suitable choice. I don't think Emery has ever been the "obvious choice".
I actually wouldn't be averse to giving him 18 months contract he is actually a pretty good coach and he might have learned a thing or two from Chelsea debacle that experience could come in handy here .
W
Graham Potter being drafted in as a surprise replacement for a widely lauded manager who won a major trophy the season before, even though nobody was calling for him to get the job beyond a newly installed owner, certainly worked out well at Chelsea.
I can see no reasons why it would not be a similar success story here.
Being serious though, have we ever bought a player from Chelsea or hired a former Chelsea manager in the Premier League era who wasn't overpriced rubbish?
Graham Potter being drafted in as a surprise replacement for a widely lauded manager who won a major trophy the season before, even though nobody was calling for him to get the job beyond a newly installed owner, certainly worked out well at Chelsea.
I can see no reasons why it would not be a similar success story here.
Being serious though, have we ever bought a player from Chelsea or hired a former Chelsea manager in the Premier League era who wasn't overpriced rubbish?
Can you also see reasons why it might not have worked out for him at Chelsea? There were multiple threads and discussions on it on here, ie their spending, Todd Boehly, unbalanced squad, no striker, etc. They since spent hundreds of millions of pounds and a lot of these issues still aren't sorted and they're still struggling.
So perhaps it's very safe to say he's not as bad as the Chelsea job made him look.
I wouldn't say we looked good, we looked ok defending deep countering and scrapping for second balls. Very pragmatic. After the easiest cup run ever, in the final against a Newcastle side that didn't turn up we scored early from a set piece then a GK error gave us a two goal cushion, then we just sat deep and let Newcastle see if they could break us down.
We didn't do anything particularly special or good. We just defending well and deep and rode our luck.
We have struggled to create chances and score throughout ETH's reign as much as our inability to keep clean sheets can be put down to some key defensive players missing, our inability to create chances and score goals can't.
Ultimately ETH is being shown IMO to not be able to coach a good attacking side in the PL. And that is what will get him sacked.
Going to be another ex player.
Maybe carrick or Rooney
ir won't matter bc Ralph was the only who with the balls to tell the truth about the whole situation that we need top to bottom structural changes.
Maybe carrick or Rooney
ir won't matter bc Ralph was the only who with the balls to tell the truth about the whole situation that we need top to bottom structural changes.
Tell that to Ferguson, Wenger, Mourinho, Ancelotti, Mancini, Conte, Guardiola, Klopp....
Every PL winning manager did it with their first club in England apart from Ranieri. And even then he was someone "from a foreign land".
It isn't the 1940s anymore chuck.
Agreed. An archaic structure created by a one off in Fergie but never moved on in a decade. It puts way too much onus and responsibility on one person, the manager, who should be a head coach figure rather than the role our current managers seem to be asked to carry out.
We need Monchi from Aston Villa not Emery.
Shows how much I know. Although from his Wiki it says he resigned? Still, not sure a man that struggled to last in the Eredivisie would fair much better than ten Hag, who made mincemeat of it. I understand why literally anyone or anything might feel better than ten Hag right now, but I've not quite reached that place yet. Potter might take it, but according to reports Ratcliffe likes him. If so it would very much be in his best interests to wait until the summer and go from there, rather than tarnish himself with the feckpie of this season.
Agree that ETH would have probably been a success at Brighton. Who knows how De Zerbi would have done 18 months ago.
We know though that De Zerbi has a years experience in the league now, so would be better equipped than Ten Hag was when he joined.
Based on what?
Emery flopped at Arsenal and was unable to deal with a club in disarray post-Wenger. He'd completely lost the dressing room by the end. Arsenal's problems back then aren't much different to the ongoing problems at United now either. A squad full of overpaid prima donnas, aging stars and expensive flops, chaos in the boardroom and no direction above him on the footballing side of things. Yes, he's turned Villa around, but everybody knew they were criminally underperforming thanks to that useless chump Stevie Me, and he took over a relatively stable club with few expectations. I'm not saying he'd clearly be a disaster at United, but I don't see how he's clearly the man to turn it all around either.
Hansi Flick would be good choice … he’s available, strong character, very experienced and has a football plan, his Bayren Munich in 2019 was one of the most dominant sides I’ve ever seen … yes our situation is different but at least the players would know that they are facing tough man who achieved something recently … failing in the national team doesn’t mean anything in my opinion
but again having very tough character in this position isn’t very appealing for the Glazers as they want someone who doesn’t speak up in public and his United job would be the biggest in his career so he wouldn’t complain but that won’t be the case with a CL winner so they will go for Carrick or Potter
but again having very tough character in this position isn’t very appealing for the Glazers as they want someone who doesn’t speak up in public and his United job would be the biggest in his career so he wouldn’t complain but that won’t be the case with a CL winner so they will go for Carrick or Potter
Based on the fact that Brighton have a solid footballing structure - scouting, DoF, analytics dept, recruitment, low pressure environment.
Can you also see reasons why it might not have worked out for him at United? There were multiple threads and discussions on it on here, ie their spending, Joel Glazer, unbalanced squad, no striker, etc. They since spent hundreds of millions of pounds and a lot of these issues still aren't sorted and they're still struggling.
So perhaps it's very safe to say he's not as bad as the United job made him look.
Being a smart arse aside, he's probably a great coach but the volatile nature of our set up would suggest he might not be the one turn it around, given the high profile collapse at Chelsea with not dissimilar problems
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