I would love Bielsa to come in and have Rashford et al playing murderball for 9 months, then doublemurderball if and when they slack off. We probably need some combination of an ideological fanatic for playing intense, front-foot and possession-orientated football, and allowed to sideline any player not meeting those standards, and then a new DOF to actually oversee recruitment of a squad meeting the requirements for playing that kind of football longer-term under a project-manager who signs up to continue some Bielsa-like approach.
Who replaces Ten Hag?
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Ange has shown what you can do coming into a club losing your best player not sitting a lot and still has them playing great football in no time
There's just no excuse for Ten Hag to be be sitting in his second season and still delivering tumescent losing football.
There is not enough patience from the supporters nor a club structure in place to allow anyone to succeed.
De Zerbi would be tarred and feathered in 6 months by our supporters.
Is 10 years of watching the club fecking around not enough patience?
Except De Zerbi has already done it at Shaktar also, and how do you know he’ll definitely fail if we don’t try? What we’re currently doing isn’t working and people are making excuses for a manager who had the exact same thing you just described at Ajax. So you sack the manager, bring in a new one and see if he can get it right. If he can’t then you move on again until you find one that isn’t going to do massive damage the longer he stays.
The manager at United does two things, how decides on transfers (partially, but clearly has a big influence) and is a coach. Until we separate those two roles, makes little sense to change manager. It will just be another reset, new manager buying his players etc.
Once we do get a DoF though I'd go out to get the best available coach as there isn't much evidence Ten Hag is a good coach.
Once we do get a DoF though I'd go out to get the best available coach as there isn't much evidence Ten Hag is a good coach.
Was it 10 years under the same manager?
We've had the same languid, can't pass a simple 6 yard pass, look uninterested for the most part with no intensity style of play for numerous years now, with various managers. I am so disappointed that after seeing some progression at times last season, we are back to this crap, again. No idea how to fix it, but this is a bigger issue than the manager. We need a DOF that has some fecking vision for a start
This is so naive. We need more than a new manager bounce every 18 months.
Ten Hag is building a squad, a mentality and a culture. We want continued success and it won’t come over night.
So we replace ten Hag and then give our new manager how much time to turn it around? 6 months? Maybe a year?
Well we're not resetting the patience meter with every sacked manager. It will run out eventually.
You come in, you do well. You stay. If not, there will be another pretender.
Get Roy Keane in. It would be pure entertainment no matter what happened. Everything is so dull and boring now.
Sounds like we can be Watford
Whoever it is this place will be calling for their sacking with 13 months.
Surely the conclusion from this thread is that there isn’t a replacement and we should stick with EtH?! Any other answer is fecking stupid.
Or Madrid.
Who haven't sacked a manager for some time.
I wish I had your optimism
It doesn't matter who we replace him with. Not even Pep could come to this team and fix this. The problem is not the manager. It's the people on top of him starting from Murtough all the way to the Glazers
That's a lie and you know it! I'm not wise...
Perhaps we should. On one hand many slam the club structure being inadequate then at the same time demand the manager to be sacked who is trying to work under the inadequate/shite structure. What is it then, do you sack a good manager who is in a bad spell? How does a knee jerk reaction help here? It’s simple, it doesn’t help in this instance. Ten hag will be given a chance to turn it around and rightfully so.
Aye cos he's winning. Or was winning. Now he's not winning anymore he's gone.
OK guys hear me out…
For me, the key issue in the post-SAF era was the lack of continuity. Sir Alex created the template and the foundations for United to dominate English football, and when the competition got richer, there were structures in place and a winning professional culture that enabled us to, at the very least, be conteders. This was in spite of the Glazers austerity and leeching.
I thought Moyes shot himself in the foot by getting rid of the entire SAF backroom staff, especially influential coaches such as Rene Muelensteen and Mick Phelan. Moyes did not achieve enough and have credit in the bank to be given a free reign to shape United in his image. The club should have put some checks and balances on his power and conditioned his acceptance of the job on keeping SAF’s coaches at the club, at the very least for a transitionary period in order to preserve the culture that was cultivated across 26 years.
LvG did have enough credit in the bank to shape the club in his image. We had growing pains with LvG and there were lots of decisions that did not make logical sense, but I feel that we were getting somewhere. In my view, LvG should not have been sacked. While missing out on top 4 was unfortunate, it was more down to that horrible period we had at the end of 2015. Progress is not always linear or chronological and by the end of LvG’s final season, we had a clear way of dominating games and there were emerging talents to build around.
Jose also earned the right to shape the club in his image given all of his achievements. However, the club had changed by then. His demanding nature was not suited to a squad in which the remnants of our last title winning team were both a minority and not key players.
It is no surprise then that our most stable post-SAF period was under Ole. As much as people complained about Ole’s lack of stature as a manager or his (alleged) tactical ineptitude, the feel-good factor was back and it started to feel like we were on the road to being United again. There was the run of wins in his first season, followed by third and second placed finishes, a kick away from a European trophy, we were able to stage those comebacks again and there were times when we won games by large scores.
But it wasn’t just Ole. It was a team effort, and central to this was the continuity. There was Mick Phelan from the SAF era. There was Carrick from the SAF, LvG and Jose eras. McKenna was also kept after his talent was spotted by Jose and he is currently showing his tactical aptitude and studious nature at Ipswich where he is on course for back-to-back promotions.
Of course, Ole could have been stronger in resisting the Ronaldo signing. Ole and his staff should have foreseen that Ronaldo’s inability to press and lack of mobility may have ruined the project they were working towards, but everybody is a genius in hindsight.
Ten Hag bringing in Steve McLaren wasn’t the best move for continuity given that he wasn’t at the club for long and he had departed around two decades ago. In addition, Ten Hag does not have enough credit in the bank to shape the club in his image.
Thus, in my view, the solution would be to try to bring back people from the SAF era so that we can have a semblance of stability again.
It would be difficult for the fans to accept Ole again given that many never gave him the benefit of the doubt anyway.
It would be good to have McKenna or Carrick back but I’m not sure they would take the step back to be coaches again given that they have already started managerial careers, and many fans would not accept them as managers given their inexperience.
The next best possible options in terms of continuity would be Rene Muelensteen, Carlos Quierioz and Mick Phelan. Perhaps they don’t have individual stature in the game, but our greatest manager of all time delegated a lot to them during our most successful period.
If it still fails after this, then we may just have to follow the Chelsea / Real Madrid model of hiring managers and then firing them as soon as their bounce is over. I say this because there was a ship for us to maintain continuity from the SAF era and with 10 years having passed now, it might just have sailed…
For me, the key issue in the post-SAF era was the lack of continuity. Sir Alex created the template and the foundations for United to dominate English football, and when the competition got richer, there were structures in place and a winning professional culture that enabled us to, at the very least, be conteders. This was in spite of the Glazers austerity and leeching.
I thought Moyes shot himself in the foot by getting rid of the entire SAF backroom staff, especially influential coaches such as Rene Muelensteen and Mick Phelan. Moyes did not achieve enough and have credit in the bank to be given a free reign to shape United in his image. The club should have put some checks and balances on his power and conditioned his acceptance of the job on keeping SAF’s coaches at the club, at the very least for a transitionary period in order to preserve the culture that was cultivated across 26 years.
LvG did have enough credit in the bank to shape the club in his image. We had growing pains with LvG and there were lots of decisions that did not make logical sense, but I feel that we were getting somewhere. In my view, LvG should not have been sacked. While missing out on top 4 was unfortunate, it was more down to that horrible period we had at the end of 2015. Progress is not always linear or chronological and by the end of LvG’s final season, we had a clear way of dominating games and there were emerging talents to build around.
Jose also earned the right to shape the club in his image given all of his achievements. However, the club had changed by then. His demanding nature was not suited to a squad in which the remnants of our last title winning team were both a minority and not key players.
It is no surprise then that our most stable post-SAF period was under Ole. As much as people complained about Ole’s lack of stature as a manager or his (alleged) tactical ineptitude, the feel-good factor was back and it started to feel like we were on the road to being United again. There was the run of wins in his first season, followed by third and second placed finishes, a kick away from a European trophy, we were able to stage those comebacks again and there were times when we won games by large scores.
But it wasn’t just Ole. It was a team effort, and central to this was the continuity. There was Mick Phelan from the SAF era. There was Carrick from the SAF, LvG and Jose eras. McKenna was also kept after his talent was spotted by Jose and he is currently showing his tactical aptitude and studious nature at Ipswich where he is on course for back-to-back promotions.
Of course, Ole could have been stronger in resisting the Ronaldo signing. Ole and his staff should have foreseen that Ronaldo’s inability to press and lack of mobility may have ruined the project they were working towards, but everybody is a genius in hindsight.
Ten Hag bringing in Steve McLaren wasn’t the best move for continuity given that he wasn’t at the club for long and he had departed around two decades ago. In addition, Ten Hag does not have enough credit in the bank to shape the club in his image.
Thus, in my view, the solution would be to try to bring back people from the SAF era so that we can have a semblance of stability again.
It would be difficult for the fans to accept Ole again given that many never gave him the benefit of the doubt anyway.
It would be good to have McKenna or Carrick back but I’m not sure they would take the step back to be coaches again given that they have already started managerial careers, and many fans would not accept them as managers given their inexperience.
The next best possible options in terms of continuity would be Rene Muelensteen, Carlos Quierioz and Mick Phelan. Perhaps they don’t have individual stature in the game, but our greatest manager of all time delegated a lot to them during our most successful period.
If it still fails after this, then we may just have to follow the Chelsea / Real Madrid model of hiring managers and then firing them as soon as their bounce is over. I say this because there was a ship for us to maintain continuity from the SAF era and with 10 years having passed now, it might just have sailed…
We need to replace 75% of the people at the club, from the Glazers, to the person who tweets the team in numerical order (made worse by the fact they omit Onana from this).
Brian Kerr
Last year I feel EtH showed us what he can do with limited resources, there’s only so long you can continue to pull rabbits out of a hat though & his signings simply haven’t raised the levels enough collectively.
That said, I find his start to this season alarming & think we’ve gone backwards since the League Cup Final so I wouldn’t say he’s ‘nailing’ the coaching, no.
We don’t have continued or short term success. Naive is thinking that the longer you keep someone in a job the more it will payoff in the end. The reality is we’re already £400m worth of fecked with these signings and people won’t be happy until we’re £800m fecked instead.
The funny thing is I've read a lot of these posts before when Jose was about to be sacked, or Ole was about to be sacked. 'whos better?' Or 'its not the manager it's the Glazers'
The only thing that changes is the names of the posters that supports the incumbent manager.
The truth is there are always replacements, and no the replacements are not guaranteed to do well either.
The only thing that changes is the names of the posters that supports the incumbent manager.
The truth is there are always replacements, and no the replacements are not guaranteed to do well either.
It’s been 10 years of different managers, spunking money away on the wrong players due to no strong leadership at the top.
It’s an old tired line at this point but feck all will change until new ownership is in place and it will only change then if they adapt the structure of management above the manage. It’s a fecking shambles.
Ten Hag and any other manager is seriously up against it here. The common theme is a decent start and then fizzling out, to utter dross.
It’s an old tired line at this point but feck all will change until new ownership is in place and it will only change then if they adapt the structure of management above the manage. It’s a fecking shambles.
Ten Hag and any other manager is seriously up against it here. The common theme is a decent start and then fizzling out, to utter dross.
Ssshhh….. I won’t tell if you don’t!
The recruitment structure is what needs to change before anything else. Get rid of Murtough and bring in a proper DoF with a top team of scouts. If Ten Hag still fails after that then he can go.
No point doing anything until the club is sold. The problem is the owners and the toxic shit around the club. Sacking Ten Hag now is just the rinse and repeat shit that we keep on getting that provides nothing but blue balls. Might as well bring in big sam and let him run with it for all the good it will do to the future of the club.
If anything goes right now, it's the coaching staff that have been here for 5 to 10 years. Because it's been clear for a very long time that the basics are being forgotten by a lot of players over the years.
If anything goes right now, it's the coaching staff that have been here for 5 to 10 years. Because it's been clear for a very long time that the basics are being forgotten by a lot of players over the years.
So then why isn’t the answer to back him and give him time to build?
Sacking managers every 2 years isn’t naive of course. It will fix our problems, it’s worked so well the last 10 years.
Ten Hag isn’t the problem here.
The fact is you won’t find one that can get it right until the Glazers feck off. The environment at this club sets managers up to fail not succeed. Any success a manager has had post SAF is limited and short lived, they all go the same way in the end. We’ve never mounted a proper title challenge in 10 years despite burning through numerous managers and over a billion spent and we never will under the Glazers, how can you, their ambition begins and ends with securing CL football and doing the bare minimum to achieve that, not how can we be the best club in the world. Any manager will struggle under those conditions, especially when the pressure from the fans and the rest of the outside world to be the best club is so great.
Mate, we’ll be fine but we have to stop trying to solve everything and focus on the things that can be fixed, like the way the team play. The best thing that can happen to us is that we stop giving managers free will to piss away £400m on shite. Now the money is gone so the next manager and the board are going to have to get creative in trying to fix things, which in all honesty is where we need to be.I wish I had your optimism
Stop sacking the manager and get competent people around the club including owners
Yeah they're ruthless, that's why they are at the top. They know how to keep things from becoming stale. We always wait too long to let things go, whether it's players or managers.
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