Who had the better season? Arsenal or Man utd?
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You disagree? You'd rather be pinching the odd domestic cup whilst enjoying midtable finishes?
Our transformation to Arsenal post stadium move is complete.
Ignoring how out of context you have used the Ole quote (we are 3 games into a season and have won 1, lost one to a disallowed offside goal, and lost to a generally better team than us)….
If your option is no trophies ever but CL football for the sake of CL football, or picking up a minor cup every year then obviously the latter. I get to go to Wembley or an EL final every summer, you get nothing.
I am sorry for you if you are asking this, I am very sorry for you, heh.
Out of context? How so? No trophies ever? Now that is out of context. Ole was making the point that trophies can mask the fact that a team is actually piss poor. It's far more important to build a side that is capable of consistently competing for the biggest prizes. Which is obviously true.
Bored of seeing Ole's quote re appear after every 6 months. Eth is doing a shit job and I don't think anyone is saying otherwise or is saying there is progress because we won 2 trophies, so not even sure why we keep on hearing Ole's quote.
Similarly, Ole was sacked because we were losing heavily in the league and not because we lost to Villareal in the europa final, although that did show some concerns we may have moving forward with Ole.
Similarly, Ole was sacked because we were losing heavily in the league and not because we lost to Villareal in the europa final, although that did show some concerns we may have moving forward with Ole.
What a weird bump of a thread
Interesting bump. Not that I'd have thought to make it myself, but do disagree with those saying it's odd or weird.
One of the arguments used for those of us who chose Arsenal as having the better season was because their season showed that they were in a healthier place as a club overall even if they won nothing and we did. Early days yet, but that seems to be continuing into this season's performances and form as was largely predictable.
One of the arguments used for those of us who chose Arsenal as having the better season was because their season showed that they were in a healthier place as a club overall even if they won nothing and we did. Early days yet, but that seems to be continuing into this season's performances and form as was largely predictable.
You gave the scenario, not me. You asked the question and I answered, if you want to revise the question, go ahead.
Do you think, if you take a moment, that what you have just said really applies to what’s happened in ETH’s tenure? A third place finish and the Coca Cola and an 8th place finish and the FA cup. Even if he is sacked tomorrow he’s done more than Ole did, doesn’t mean he’s been good enough but he won things.
I don't believe Ole meant that he would happily forego trophies forever. He just questioned the wisdom of judging a teams progress purely based on trophies won. We have won trophies in consecutive seasons under ten Hag, but are clearly miles away from Arsenal.
The issue Ole had is that he achieved neither. He didn't win anything or manage to build us into a consistent title challenging side like Arteta seemingly has.
Yes we won a trophy last season, they didn't. What's happening doesn't change that.
Yeah, I was delighted we won the FA Cup. What a stupid bump.
Not sure why you are bringing current Arsenal into the discussion?
Because they are trophyless but have reached a level of consistency that shows they are capable of challenging for the title. This is where Ole was hoping to take us as that would have shown genuine progress as opposed to merely fluking a cup whilst languishing in no man's land.
It does though. I'd much rather be a good football team.
Okay. So you are another one winning FA Cup finishing 8th playing shit football week in week out was more successful than Arsenal. Whatever rocks your boat.
I said it back in June and it came to fruition. united won an FA cup against probably the best PL team of all time. Their season was better and the mgr was rewarded with at least another year and rightly so according to the new people in charge. He deserves more time. And here we are.
If you offered me £100 now, or nothing and the chance to win £10,000 a later date. I would take the chance to win £10,000
Thats what Man United fans who thought an FA Cup pooled with an 8th place finish and negative goal difference is 'better' than a 2nd place finished with 89 points and a goal difference of 62. You took the instant gratification and opportunity to 'banter' Arsenal fans. In Arteta's third full season we finished 2nd with 84 point and a goal differential of 43+. Ten Hag is now into this third full season
By preferring the United season to Arsenal's, it validated Ten Hag and his methods, and he looks like he has carried this into another season. The way he sets United up seems very unlikely to pay off. It could well be the case its bad before its good, but I just dont think there is a light at the end of thus tunnel. I dont think there will reach a time where his tatics pay off and United can go on long strings of W's. I feel the cluster of bad results and heavy defeats will be a staple under him.
Managers take charge of around 50-60 games per year. They should be judged on the majority of those games, as when it comes to trophies, the margins can be so small. A team could win 50 of thier 60 matches and win nothing, another team could win 30 of thier 60 matches and nick a cup. If I was a chairmen of a football club, im taking the manager who wins 50 out of 60 football matches. For reference the FA Cup is a 7 match campaign. Its 11% of a 60-match campaign. We won the FA Cup and finished 8th and ill tell you know, we were not a good team. As we found out the next season when we finished 8th again.
It was always a stupid argument to make. Regardless of which club you support.
Thats what Man United fans who thought an FA Cup pooled with an 8th place finish and negative goal difference is 'better' than a 2nd place finished with 89 points and a goal difference of 62. You took the instant gratification and opportunity to 'banter' Arsenal fans. In Arteta's third full season we finished 2nd with 84 point and a goal differential of 43+. Ten Hag is now into this third full season
By preferring the United season to Arsenal's, it validated Ten Hag and his methods, and he looks like he has carried this into another season. The way he sets United up seems very unlikely to pay off. It could well be the case its bad before its good, but I just dont think there is a light at the end of thus tunnel. I dont think there will reach a time where his tatics pay off and United can go on long strings of W's. I feel the cluster of bad results and heavy defeats will be a staple under him.
Managers take charge of around 50-60 games per year. They should be judged on the majority of those games, as when it comes to trophies, the margins can be so small. A team could win 50 of thier 60 matches and win nothing, another team could win 30 of thier 60 matches and nick a cup. If I was a chairmen of a football club, im taking the manager who wins 50 out of 60 football matches. For reference the FA Cup is a 7 match campaign. Its 11% of a 60-match campaign. We won the FA Cup and finished 8th and ill tell you know, we were not a good team. As we found out the next season when we finished 8th again.
It was always a stupid argument to make. Regardless of which club you support.
Ok, I still don’t get why you have brought them up though?
Also the argument you are making is terrible the more I think of it. United have won two cups in two seasons, the FA cup having an incredibly hard run to win (we beat Pool and City) and yet it doesn’t mean anything? I’ll tell you what it means, it means, so far, we’re decent in knock out games. That is a fact, we’re 1 from 2 in both the Coca Cola and FA cup. That is a big part of football, it’s essential to win everything but the league.
What you’re saying is it doesn’t matter, domestic cups are just luck, they’re meaningless, the league means is the only barometer of progress. You’re saying guys like Brendan Rodgers, who played ‘nice’ football and came 2nd once are what you’d prefer to see than lifting trophies?
I brought Arsenal up due to the thread title but also because they typify what Ole was referring to. Building a team that is capable of challenging consistently in the hope that trophies follow, as opposed to being a poor side and winning a cup here and there.
Winning cups are all well and good. However, unless those cup wins act as a catalyst towards a level of sustained excellence, then they simply mask over the fact that we are a very average side.
Brenden Rodgers couldn't sustain that one season with Liverpool. Trophies should be a by-product of consistent excellence year after year. Not viewed as a 'get out of jail free card' to paper over the cracks. At least not for a club of our standing.
It was never a better season, I don't even know how one arrives at that conclusion. The league is where our bread is buttered, which it seemed like the entire fanbase agreed upon until last season for some reason.
Are there actually people here that would chose to re-live our record breakingly bad season last year over a copy of Arsenal's season?
Are there actually people here that would chose to re-live our record breakingly bad season last year over a copy of Arsenal's season?
Anyone who would prefer to watch our shit football week in week out and finish close to mid table but scrape the odd second tier trophy now and again needs their heads examined.
I like watching my footballl team win trophies.
What is our club standing, because we’ve been nowhere near the league since SAF left? We’re signing kids, we aren’t winning a major trophy for at least two years, likely more and Ineos are clearly planning for that.
That’s not true on cups, you’re saying unless they’re a catalyst (so you then win the PL or CL) they mask over the fact we’re not good enough. Cups are cups, they’re there to be won and I will gladly keep winning them even if our team is average.