What do we still need? Aka The never ending story

I’d be looking at Pedro Neto for the RW spot, bin off Antony and Sancho.
I’d also be looking at Ollie Watkins for our number 9 position. He’s in form and scoring, he assists too and I think with his attributes would link up very well with Rashford or Nashers and Bruno.
 
We need to get better performances out of the players we have this season or else change the manager. He simply has to be able to get better performances out of this group. We shouldn't invest any more until we show we can do that, which is ok because we have several months until the next summer window.
 
Something we've needed since City, Barcelona and Bilbao all humbled us in the early 2010s.

Press resistant players.
 
Players that need to be gone and potentially replaced(most of them) : Maguire, Lindelof, Martial, McTominay, Van De Beek, Sancho, Bruno(no ball retention), Eriksen(no legs), Casemiro?(probably no legs anymore, even though I love him, might be tempted by Saudis next summer). Maybe we'll need to replace Varane as well because of his fitness issues and he might be tempted by the Saudis as well. Antony is most likely not good enough(plus has off the pitch issues), but I would give him more time, maybe he'll be good enough to at least be a back-up someday, who knows.

Priorities for next summer(or even January) with hopefully new owners:

- Center Back(at least 1, probably 2). We need to buy top talent CB, the young hottest prospect on the market(like Antonio Silva, Scalvini, Bastoni, Hincapie, Todibo, Tapsoba, Inacio...), what Gvardiol was for City last summer transfer market. Maybe add one more, taking into account Maguire and Lindelof not being good enough and possibly (finally)leaving, and Varane being injury prone and maybe tempted by the Saudis(they're looking for players like these).

- Central midfielder who is a press resistant ball carrier(been a priority for ages) who would help in ball retention and possession thus allowing us to better control games. Frenkie de Jong archetype of a player like (Bissouma, Kovacic, Nunes, Camavinga are another examples). Someone like Kouadio Kone, Khephren Thuram...

- Competition/back-up striker for Hojlund. I'm not sure what would be the budget here and what should we aim for. Maybe someone more experienced and proven "veteran" like Watkins or Toney while 20 year old Hojlund develops more in the background and rotates with that new, additional striker when Martial finally leaves.

These three are a must in the next year or so, but there are also other problems(positions) that need to be addressed eventually:

- Both fullback positions(right and left). Dalot and Wan-Bissaka are both good, decent, but we almost certainly need a better starting right back. One of them could be kept as a squad/back-up player, I'm not sure which one. Possibilities: Frimpong, Vanderson etc. - I don't know(I'm not a fulltime scout and don't watch a lot of football).

Taking into account Shaw's age(he'll be 29 next year) and injury history, we might/should look into this department as well. But probably won't at least not for another year or so. Shaw is good enough, but I'm a little bit suspect of his availability/fitness/age. It's a demanding position that requires a lot of running, as we all know here.

- Right winger. I've written shortly my thoughts about Antony at the beginning of the post, so we need an upgrade and Sancho won't ever play for the club again. Pellistri and Amad also likely not good enough. Possible options? I like Olise from Palace, Neto from Wolves, Xavi Simmons maybe...

- Defensive midfielder?. Casemiro is getting old, was a short term fix and his legs are getting gone. Might be tempted by the Saudis(similar to Varane). We have a competent back-up in Amrabat in that position, but he probably isn't good enough to be the starter(maybe he is, who knows). Some see Mainoo as potential successor to Casemiro in that position, but it's too early to tell, even though the kid is visibly talented. There are some other young, talented kids in that position across Europe(Arthur Vermeeren from Antwerpen, João Neves from Benfica etc.)

- Attacking(creative midfielder). Phase off/get rid of Bruno(for reasons I've explained multiple times already on this forum and many members agree with me) with a player who is more like Odegaard, Maddison - maybe slightly less creative, but more comfortable with the ball at his feet and better dribbler/carrier. Maybe Mount is capable of playing that role, we'll see. Possible targets include: Florian Wirtz, Jamal Musiala(not realistic to poach him from Bayern, but worth a mention), Eberechi Eze from Palace, Xavi Simmons(he can play there, I think)...
 
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Sell Rashford / AWB / Maguire / Donny / McTominay / Sancho / Martial
An upgrade on all and we’re title contenders
I’m not asking for much
 
Yagami said:
Something we've needed since City, Barcelona and Bilbao all humbled us in the early 2010s.

Press resistant players.
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This short post deserves some kind of an award. I'm just a Newbie, so I certainly can't give it to you. We desperately need press resistant players.
 
Chicharo said:
Watching Superclassico, and the commentator just mentioned that his release clause is only 15 milion euros. Now if we were to think about the future, we would definitely go for this kid
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It is just an incredibly obvious signing to make, and we don't do those. He'll end up at City, Real Madrid or Barcelona. Some signings are just ridiculously obvious, and he is one of them.
 
zaafi said:
It is just an incredibly obvious signing to make, and we don't do those. He'll end up at City, Real Madrid or Barcelona. Some signings are just ridiculously obvious, and he is one of them.
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All the top teams in Europe after linked with him. We'd have no chance getting him for that price, he's nailed on to go to one of the La Liga teams or City.
 
RB:
- a starter who has more going forward than Dalot

CB:
- a starter to replace Varane due to injury record
- a replacement for Maguire when he eventually slithers out of the club

DM:
- a starter to play next to Casemiro and eventually take over

CAM:
- a starter to replace Bruno, one who’s more calm on the ball and can provide more dominant possession

RW / LW:
- a starter to replace Rashford as he should be gone
- a starter / backup depending on your views of Antony

ST:
- a starter and dominant ST that Hojlund can still learn from

Quite appalling for a club that’s spent more than £1bn in the last decade.
 
The most obvious for me is we are not scoring enough goals. We havent scored enough for years so forwards and suppliers are needed. At the very least we need one proper winger who can beat a man and cross a ball from one of the wings. We could get Garnacho to try from the right or Antony from the left until the transfer window.
Another CF or somone comfortable playing anywhere across the front. Gakpo would have been ideal, but the parasites refused to sanction the signing. Rasmus is on a steep learning curve, so should be given time to get used to the team and the Prem. Maybe start Martial first half while hes fit and Rasmus second.
Watch us sign another CB instead.
 
Yagami said:
Something we've needed since City, Barcelona and Bilbao all humbled us in the early 2010s.

Press resistant players.
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Surely the players we have can navigate their way around a press or at least coached to do so.
 
Waynne said:
Surely the players we have can navigate their way around a press or at least coached to do so.
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Some, but we also missed out on some guys who are good fits for this stuff. In particular, Bissouma was a bad miss. He's a B+ version of Frenkie De Jong and those are really hard to find.

It's probably still the right way for us to play since we've bought Onana and Lisandro. They can play against a high press, as can Shaw. We should probably build around them and give Mainoo, Gore and Hannibal lots of opportunities to improve in that sort of system.
 
Someone who can dictate tempo and dominate the midfield. Bruno Guimaraes if the rumours about his release clause is true.

Right back as well. Frimpong maybe? Dalot is mediocre both ways and Wan Bissaka is stuck in the 90s version of a full back. His few good participations in the attack is mostly a fluke.

And yeah... CB? Honestly we've been buying CBs for a decade, i'm so fed up with this position.

And a right winger... Though maybe Antony could work if we had a really good RB going forward. Right now the right side is totally dead however. We dont create anything there. But if we had like Frimpong, it might be decent having Antony at RW who's dedicated and good at tracking back.

I doubt we'll invest in another striker. Honestly i prefer just giving Hojlund a good run at it anyways. Might as well play young players and develop them at this point.
 
I still believe United and Ten Hag need a top and world class CB or closest to that level as possible.


Link to the thread i start where i mentioned and recommend United shall buy a top CB in the summer.


Mine recommendations : United's top & medium transfer budget to premier league title | RedCafe.net



+ Internal solution :
RW = Antony shall hit a high conistent top level or
+ External solution : A new really good RW in Pedro Neto.
Pedro is really consistent. Super quick and explosive in the first metres

So if Antony doesn't hit a consistent level. To help and solve it. Then you need to activate external solution. To solve it


+ A new top level CB = Only external solution is need here. United current CBs options are not simply good enough.
At top level in football. It require and demand a top level CB. In every top teams in Europe. Not only United and City.


+ The creative cm and nr.8. I am waiting. Before i will make the decision to recommend. Because both Mainoo and Amrabat haven't play in central midfield yet. If they have what it require and demand to play there. Then i will state need or not.


But at this moment. A top CB and RW. In the next transfer window. To rise the chance to get champion league football next season.
 
LuckyScout78 said:
I still believe United and Ten Hag need a top and world class CB or closest to that level as possible.


Link to the thread i start where i mentioned and recommend United shall buy a top CB in the summer.


Mine recommendations : United's top & medium transfer budget to premier league title | RedCafe.net



+ Internal solution :
RW = Antony shall hit a high conistent top level or
+ External solution : A new really good RW in Pedro Neto.
Pedro is really consistent. Super quick and explosive in the first metres

So if Antony doesn't hit a consistent level. To help and solve it. Then you need to activate external solution. To solve it


+ A new top level CB = Only external solution is need here. United current CBs options are not simply good enough.
At top level in football. It require and demand a top level CB. In every top teams in Europe. Not only United and City.


+ The creative cm and nr.8. I am waiting. Before i will make the decision to recommend. Because both Mainoo and Amrabat haven't play in central midfield yet. If they have what it require and demand to play there. Then i will state need or not.


But at this moment. A top CB and RW. In the next transfer window. To rise the chance to get champion league football next season.
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Agreed but it’s not going to happen in the January window
 
What we still need? Patience, hope and a central midfielder with a lot of legs and defensive awareness who can accompany Casimero.
 
I think we need to stop trying to play 4231 and go proper 433 with overlapping full backs. In 4231 the CAM does most of the creating but we don’t have goals from enough places just now that mean we turn the ball over and Bruno ends up out of position. We have wingers who like to cut inside so the full backs HAVE to bomb on that can deliver a cross to what looks like a proper CF. Shaw has proven he can be that LB, so we need someone similar on the other side… I’d say Marty Cash is a good example of the profile of right back we need.

we have to play 3 in the middle who all put a shift in defensively, and press smartly.
 
We need to get heathy and our healthy players need to start acting like professional footballers. Unfortunately, we need a keeper.
 
The title of "never ending story" is very apt on this thread if anybody thinks we are 3/4 signings away from a top team, we have been nowhere near to that figure any summer in terms of needs and we still arent now after this summer.

We simply have failed to move on enough players, sign enough players and for me half the players we are signing each window are the wrong ones and certainly not long term ones.

For all there faults in a poor season Ragnick and ROnaldos words do ring true and this side needs open hert surgery. I do feel that only happens with new owners and ripping out most of this squad that includes Ten Hag signings, players that have been here a while, star players who havent actually consistently been star players.

This is very FM liek but if we had new owners and I was given full control of a transfer window, I would be looking at a DOF like Van der Sar, a head of recruitment like Mitchell and investing in our youth sides for the future, if I was told I had a £150m odd net spend i an ideal world.....


£396m sales

Onana £40m
Dalot £15m
Lindelof £20m
Maguire £25m
Malacia £15m
Williams £5m
Casemeiro £20m
VDB £5m
Fernandes £50m
McTominay £20m
Eriksen £1m
Pellestri £5m
Martial £10m
Sancho £40m
Rashford £80m
Antony £40m
Greenwood £5m

We dont have good attacking full back options, we dont have quality performing cb squad players, we dont have energy or consistency especially technique wise in midfield and we havent had any consistent attacking options despite all the talent we have signed for years, hence I would move all of the above on personally to facilitate what we genuinely need and that is some genuine young potential around the right age with room to become top top players............

GK Diego Costa £50m Bayindir Heaton
RB Vanderson £50m Bissaka
CB Diomande £70m Varane
CB Martinez Scalvini £30m
LB Shaw Valentin Barco £15m A Fernandez
DM Samuele Ricci £45m Aramabat
CM Khephren Thuram £60m Mainoo Hannibal
AM Eze £55m Mount
LW Mitouma £70m Garnacho
RW Neto £60m Amad Lacey
CF Hoijlund Ivan Tony £45m


£550m Spend

£154m net spend

Its spending a fortune, we have already done that though over several windows and even making losses we have value in our squad. In all honesty footballign wise, the only player I would miss is Greenwood, but that is a different story....and Casemeiro could be a reluctant sale if he can get back to form....most of the rest are bang average and over rated or very talented and simply inconsistent and wasteful
 
jesperjaap said:
The title of "never ending story" is very apt on this thread if anybody thinks we are 3/4 signings away from a top team, we have been nowhere near to that figure any summer in terms of needs and we still arent now after this summer.

We simply have failed to move on enough players, sign enough players and for me half the players we are signing each window are the wrong ones and certainly not long term ones.

For all there faults in a poor season Ragnick and ROnaldos words do ring true and this side needs open hert surgery. I do feel that only happens with new owners and ripping out most of this squad that includes Ten Hag signings, players that have been here a while, star players who havent actually consistently been star players.

This is very FM liek but if we had new owners and I was given full control of a transfer window, I would be looking at a DOF like Van der Sar, a head of recruitment like Mitchell and investing in our youth sides for the future, if I was told I had a £150m odd net spend i an ideal world.....


£396m sales

Onana £40m
Dalot £15m
Lindelof £20m
Maguire £25m
Malacia £15m
Williams £5m
Casemeiro £20m
VDB £5m
Fernandes £50m
McTominay £20m
Eriksen £1m
Pellestri £5m
Martial £10m
Sancho £40m
Rashford £80m
Antony £40m
Greenwood £5m

We dont have good attacking full back options, we dont have quality performing cb squad players, we dont have energy or consistency especially technique wise in midfield and we havent had any consistent attacking options despite all the talent we have signed for years, hence I would move all of the above on personally to facilitate what we genuinely need and that is some genuine young potential around the right age with room to become top top players............

GK Diego Costa £50m Bayindir Heaton
RB Vanderson £50m Bissaka
CB Diomande £70m Varane
CB Martinez Scalvini £30m
LB Shaw Valentin Barco £15m A Fernandez
DM Samuele Ricci £45m Aramabat
CM Khephren Thuram £60m Mainoo Hannibal
AM Eze £55m Mount
LW Mitouma £70m Garnacho
RW Neto £60m Amad Lacey
CF Hoijlund Ivan Tony £45m


£550m Spend

£154m net spend

Its spending a fortune, we have already done that though over several windows and even making losses we have value in our squad. In all honesty footballign wise, the only player I would miss is Greenwood, but that is a different story....and Casemeiro could be a reluctant sale if he can get back to form....most of the rest are bang average and over rated or very talented and simply inconsistent and wasteful
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Van Der Sar had never been a DoF and not sure he’d want to jump into that stress at United after his recent illness
 
what kills me or more so annoys me the most was that going into the summer EVERYONE knew we need to revamp the midfield and we needed a CF. We got what appears to be a quality young CF in Hojlund but we didn't address the midfield properly and solidify the one area of the pitch that controls a match. That is a massive mistake from Murtaugh and EtH. You can't control a match, you can't defend or attack properly when you are playing with subpar midfielders with no legs against racehorses

on the flip side....EVERYONE knew the Dippers needed to revamp their midfield so what does Klopp do, he brings in not 1 not 2 not 3 but 4 bloody CM's and completely refreshes the engine room back to rolls royces from the old warn down sputtering pintos
 
bosskeano said:
what kills me or more so annoys me the most was that going into the summer EVERYONE knew we need to revamp the midfield and we needed a CF. We got what appears to be a quality young CF in Hojlund but we didn't address the midfield properly and solidify the one area of the pitch that controls a match. That is a massive mistake from Murtaugh and EtH. You can't control a match, you can't defend or attack properly when you are playing with subpar midfielders with no legs against racehorses

on the flip side....EVERYONE knew the Dippers needed to revamp their midfield so what does Klopp do, he brings in not 1 not 2 not 3 but 4 bloody CM's and completely refreshes the engine room back to rolls royces from the old warn down sputtering pintos
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Well we did sign two midfielders and we have two youngsters coming through so it has been addressed, I would argue not well though. DO think we have more legs in midfield now.

What we lack in midfield still and in our team as a whole though are ball carriers. With the possible exception of Mainoo we really only have Rashford to carry the ball and that is more a pace thing rather than technical ability to take the ball in a tight space and move with it.
 
bosskeano said:
what kills me or more so annoys me the most was that going into the summer EVERYONE knew we need to revamp the midfield and we needed a CF. We got what appears to be a quality young CF in Hojlund but we didn't address the midfield properly and solidify the one area of the pitch that controls a match. That is a massive mistake from Murtaugh and EtH. You can't control a match, you can't defend or attack properly when you are playing with subpar midfielders with no legs against racehorses

on the flip side....EVERYONE knew the Dippers needed to revamp their midfield so what does Klopp do, he brings in not 1 not 2 not 3 but 4 bloody CM's and completely refreshes the engine room back to rolls royces from the old warn down sputtering pintos
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Mount, Amrabat, and the 2 young lads introduced this season. There’s your 4. Maybe think about what’s annoying you a bit more
 
golden_blunder said:
Mount, Amrabat, and the 2 young lads introduced this season. There’s your 4. Maybe think about what’s annoying you a bit more
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ok...Amrabat our midfielder playing at LB and the reliance on 2 young lads who really haven't been introduced or made any sort of impact. Mount, a midfielder who isn't a midfielder in the true sense of the word.

maybe think of a better response a bit more if you consider that 4 an equivalent to my initial statement.
 
bosskeano said:
ok...Amrabat our midfielder playing at LB and the reliance on 2 young lads who really haven't been introduced or made any sort of impact. Mount, a midfielder who isn't a midfielder in the true sense of the word.

maybe think of a better response a bit more if you consider that 4 an equivalent to my initial statement.
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It’s 4 midfielders
 
Redivy said:
If Bruno Guimaraes does have a release clause in the new contract I’d be tempted to see if we can bring him over.

Tobido or Antonio Silva in at center back.

Vanderson in at right back.
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Going from Newcastle to United would be a step down at this point. Sad times.
 
bosskeano said:
haha...yes but in our case it's quantity over quality not the same on the other side of the coin as it's quantity and quality
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I actually think Mount and Amrabat are quality signings, especially Mount. Who are the other two? Mianoo and one of Hannibal/Gore? They're all at least decent as well.
 
we need to replace bruno as soon as possible, he has so many passes that goes wrong, so many times he wants to do the "cool" stuff instead of just passing the ball.

i would even consider go to mount just the bench him untill we have a proper replacement.
 
It really is wild how bad our signings have been.

Not really sure you can say anyone but Bruno, Shaw and Lisandro have been bought since Ferguson left and been at the level of a top 8 or 9 player (you can get by with a great manager - we haven't had those either - and a patchwork solution who fits tactically at one spot or 2 as we saw under Fergie and we've seen with Liverpool midfielders) you pencil in for 30+ games of quality player for multiple seasons. Pogba and Di Maria and probably even Lukaku as clunky as he was, and probably someone else I'm forgetting were good enough, just didn't work out here.

We've really stopped being able to identify and bring in or produce via the academy truly top level players. We just seem to have no idea which players in their early 20s are going to blow up like Salah, Mane, De Bruyne, Walker, Guimares, Davies, Robertson, Romero and others we all could have signed if we'd identified them one window before a team that signed them did. That's the real problem.

It would be nice if we'd signed Haaland, Gvardiol and Enzo Fernandez as teens, but I think that's very difficult to identify. Though Cristiano and Rooney (and I think we've cost ourselves the ability to sign a Rooney who everyone wants like Bellingham by being mediocre).

Our problem is we seem to have no idea who the best players in 2028 will be, whereas once upon a time we got a good share of them.

Cristiano, Rooney, Van Nistelrooy, Ferdinand, Vidic, Evra and Van Der Sar were all signed in a 5 year period from 2001-2006. That's 7 really quality players who gave us at least 4 quality seasons where they were world class. It's too early to say about the guys signed this past summer or the year before, but in the 5 years before that the best performing players we've brought in, that you could see being included in that list if they'd played for a well managed side like those guys got to is composed of literally only Bruno unless one of Garnacho or Amad or a late bloomer like Dalot gets there or Varane shockingly stays healthy for another 2 seasons (4 seasons of 20+ league games probably just gets over the barrier). 7 vs 1. No wonder the team isn't very good. It's missing 5 or 6 signings who should be anchoring our defence.

I guess my takeaway is that it doesn't really matter so much what specific types of players we sign. At gunpoint I'd bet on Hojlund, 1 LW (Garnacho or Rashford), Lisandro and Bruno playing well for the next 3-4 years. Every other spot could badly use a signing if that player can get to world class quality and perform that way for us.

So basically, I'd look at the team like this if I were making signings:

Garnacho/Rashford-----------Hojlund--------------------RW
-------------------------------------------Bruno----------------------------
-------------------------------DM--------------------CM-------------------
LB-----------------Lisandro-------------------RCB-----------------RB
----------------------------------------------GK--------------------------------

and if you want to give Antony some runway because he's young and works hard and Amad is a talented insurance option there then fine.

But otherwise, I'd give almost no bearing to the types of footballers. We need players in their early 20s who are going to be top 3 at their position in the world (or top 5 like the guys who signed elsewhere I listed), whether or not they fit anything we're doing tactically, which changes every week anyways, and while I think Ten Hag was the logical hire, it's not like we have any idea if he's going to last the season, never mind 3 or 4 of them.
 
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