Is there rapid exit polling over there?
What are the reasons for Conservatives gaining votes?
What are the reasons for Conservatives gaining votes?
Westminster Politics
- Thread starter altodevil
- Start date
I am not a big fan of Starmer. But this was all about timing and not all down to the leader.
The success of the vaccination programme and to a degree Brexit.
And if people believe that Brexit has come and gone without problems, then they are quite wrong.
Welcome to Culture War Britain.
I think Labour are fecked regardless of the course it takes. Been saying it for months.
I've tuned off politics in this country.
I think Labour are fecked regardless of the course it takes. Been saying it for months.
I've tuned off politics in this country.
I think a lot of it is UKIP votes
Yeah it’s definitely this.
Tories take Hartlepool
Has to be a lot of Labour votes as well.
Self interest and racism. That's all the Tories have ever needed.
Bet she is celebrating hard.
I honestly don’t know what Labour can do? Tories have the money, the media, the narrative. And for some reason everyone clearly loves them. It does feel like their constant sleeve is ‘priced in’.
I really need to evaluate where I live.
As awful as the tories are I couldn’t tell you what Labour have been up to for the last god knows how long and that must play into this. They need to focus on coming across as a coherent political party rather than constant internal power struggles
The let the bodies pile up guy has done well for himself
Agreed I think their ground game has pretty much been "voters will see that we're not corbyn", and we have been told thats its some 5D chess waiting game type of stuff.
She probably hand a wank.
I can't see where Labour go from here. Any direction it takes, it will bleed votes and there's no guarantee it will gain them elsewhere.
Basically I think a sizeable % of the brexit former Labour voters will never vote Labour (at least not for a generation), no matter Labour's message.
Identity is now the driving force in British politics and economic arguments are by the by.
Any attempt to move towards a nationalist message from Labour and they will be slaughtered down south. They are fecked.
Loads of Labour MPs already calling for Labour to turn further to the left and towards woke politics. Naturally from the comfort of their London apartments.
Totally misses the point behind losses like Hartlepool and will ensure even more Northern seats turn Tory.
Totally misses the point behind losses like Hartlepool and will ensure even more Northern seats turn Tory.
I do agree, the only thing I can think to help is installing a charismatic leader who can inspire a message and hold the government to account.
God knows who that might be though.
British people like to suffer, just in case that hasn’t been made clear already.
They’d rather suffer & continue to slide into self-inflicted troubles than vote for left wing policies because that would be an admission that they need help, and their aspirational dreams of becoming a Tory isn’t gonna pan out.
We’re stuck with a delusional &/or ignorant electorate.
I don't think I've seen this. I think its mainly been more bolder policies, more effective communication of said policies, more vociferous opposition as well. And something of an identity for the party.
Woke is a meaningless weasel word. The party has bought into that idea and trying to effectively be non-committal on too many issue trying to play both sides. Whereas I don't think its left, right divide as much anymore. There are a solid lack of political fundamentals that's making the party unable to attract voters back. Its been happening since Ed Miliband/Brown era.
the kidnapping of the word ‘woke’ from its origins is really one of the most bizarre things I’ve ever witnessed.
Labours shift from the party that speaks for towns like Hartlepool to one dominated by Londons upper middle class is pretty bizzare aswell.
But that's the new political world. Labour will maintain an iron grip on the London and Manchester mayoral elections (and of course the all important Twitter trending page) whilst the Conservatives consolidate seats like Redcar and Hartlepool.
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I keep seeing this but what message do you think people from towns like Hartlepool want to hear?
I agree completely.
I once worked in a call centre while studying. There was this lady about my age who worked there full time on £6.48 an hour (can't remember clearly). She voted Tory cause she felt Labour were wrong to tax the rich. I didn't even know how to argue with her and summed she was a lost cause.
Labour was fecked the day Scotland turned SNP.
Only in brexit Britain can the tories do something as disastrous as Brexit and somehow come out smelling like roses. Feck me. 
All the years the North voted Labour. What did it ever get them? Managed decline, no future and and being talked down to by people from London. Pretty much the same as the Tory's.
Well done all, it looks like the party is truly broken beyond repair.
Well done all, it looks like the party is truly broken beyond repair.
"What about covid? It derailed Brexit and just proved that we need to lock out the EU and China."Only in brexit Britain can the tories do something as disastrous as Brexit and somehow come out smelling like roses. Feck me.
It might have been a few months back but the idiot that said this to me with a smug "I'm such a genius" look on their dumb face probably hasn't changed.
I don't think it matters who was in charge of Labour, they were always going to lose. There is still momentum for the Tories that I am not smart enough to understand, maybe brexit was the ultimate betrayal.
ah man, I am a massive fan of the over confidence of an idiot.For years they've probably thought "maybe I am a little wrong" but on social media they've been emboldened by their theories ("squirrels turn your pee pink and that's the fault of Corbyn") by other like minded fools and now they're at the point where they are confident enough to puff out their chests and vote Tory at the polling station - because the front cover of the Mail told them to.
I think people underestimate the impact of Labour not being anti-Brexit in the medium term. I'm from a labour area and loads of ex-labour supporters round here that I have spoken to won't vote for them again. It feels like they didn't get the Brexit vote initially and now have lost the remainers due to leaving them behind.
Turnout will be interesting, if it's low those people may have ended up voting for no-one. I expected the Green's to take some of that vote, but it doesn't appear to have happened.
Turnout will be interesting, if it's low those people may have ended up voting for no-one. I expected the Green's to take some of that vote, but it doesn't appear to have happened.
Boris is also quite popular. The Tories could have gone full Bolsanaro, Modi, Trump in their handling of covid though but I think even despite the death toll, generalised incompetence, scandals, corruption people still associate them with a generously perceived furlough scheme, vaccination program etc etc.
None of which excuses lack of strong opposition, either in PMQs or general messaging or clearly defined policy stances.
None of which excuses lack of strong opposition, either in PMQs or general messaging or clearly defined policy stances.
I like the Greens but the problem with them is you have to wade through the hippie tie dye policies with all the buzz words like inclusivity to get to the ones that might really speak to ordinary people - tax the megacorporations, UBI, 4 day working week with a higher minimum wage etc etc. The problem is the cerebral policies don't sell and they haven't been good at pushing the ones that do sell since Natalie Bennett stepped down as leader.
What exactly is your understanding of the word ‘woke’
I didn’t mention anything about Labour.
Yep people are scared to ‘punish’ the rich because they too want to be rich, so they’d literally rather continue suffering in the present.
How can you account for ignorance on such a grandiose level? You can’t.
Agreed about the Greens. I've been a supporter for a while and I think they're in an ideal position to be the main left of centre party as they've always put equality first which could pick them up a lot of votes. Especially with environmental concerns having broader support now.
They need to simplify their policies and aim for the Labour / and Lib Dem votes but haven't been good at getting the message across.
Is he running for Crufts?
That's been the result of a turn away from collectivism and community messaging though. It's not a difficult argument, for people to become rich they'll need a strong well funded society so who would they rather pay for it, themselves or have those who already benefited from society pay for it?
What do people in Redcar and Hartlepool want that Labour isn't offering? Until Labour can answer that they're going to continue to lose votes.
I agree, but the problem is the electorate itself is too ignorant (read: dumb) that even if you communicated it clearly and effectively, all it would take is a few Daily Mail headlines to spin the narrative and they'll willingly run with it instead.
This is it in a nut shell for Hartlepool, a strong Brexit vote in 2016 and had Labour on a remain front telling them this for a number of years. The conversion of Brexit voters to Labour is a tall ask in that constituency, certainly one that isn't going to take 5 months after Brexit.
This is a very English political trait. Cutting your nose to spite your face. I might not be rich yet, but i don't want higher taxes for the rich in case i day suddenly i am rich and then i'll be stung by those taxes. Also the order of priority in sympathy...
Ex armed forces > dogs > homeless > > cats > foreigners > foreigners who dare to come here