Westminster Politics

The way I see it, I'm not voting for Labour by default, I'm not a Labour member and I never will be a member to any party. I'm not ruling out voting Labour but as it stands I'm leaning against them. For me I'll just look at a combination of the local candidates and what the manifesto's are decide based on that.

I won't vote Tory or any other right wing group but I'll consider all other options. I'm just not going to vote Labour based on greater good concept that they may make things better over the next 10 years, I don't believe in any party that much to be giving them a vote based on that.

Fair enough, but if Labour doesn't get your vote then (and its not clear from your comments what they would have to do to get your vote) it sounds like you may not be voting for anybody...... who actually has a chance of winning overall (that is if you are ruling out the Tories).

I suppose you may have a local candidate who is a good constituency MP and it would not matter what the candidates politics are, you would vote for them. That's your right of course, but for the uncommitted, Labour offers not only the option of 'not being Tory' and of course 'a change is as good as a rest' (my old mum use to say), but also realistically they are the only party with a strong enough potential majority to move the dial in favour of ordinary folk; who after 14 years of Tory rule, desperately need a government that will represent the needs of the majority and not the elite, or the ones that can shout the loudest.

I can appreciate (considering potentially) voting for a party for three consecutive terms, is a bit of a stretch, given the situation the country finds itself in just now. However, realistically an initial 5 years tenure might be something in which a dynamic government could be successful in overcoming the inertia that now seems to grip the country, almost in every facet of our existence; but to make a real difference, to move the dial etc.....starting from where we are now, will take at least 15 years (3 terms).

On a purely personal level, my advice to voters at the next GE would be not to vote on a one term basis only, but to look realistically at whether;
a) the party you are supporting or likely to support, can keep going beyond one term, stamina, will, commitment,
b) does it have the kind of people in post, who can stay the course, i.e. beyond 1 term, possibly up to 3,
c) does its leader, really lead or is there someone else /group in the shadows pulling the strings,
d) is there some one else waiting in the wings for the incumbent to fall from grace,
e) is what is being proposed over the 3 terms work for the majority of ordinary people, e.g. does it contain aims and objectives for improving; health, education, housing and employment and training opportunities?
 
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Im sick of the "you should vote for this to not get the other one". The "useful" vote. Is shitty to guilt-trap you to vote for a party/person that doesn't represent and even go against your values and it only propagates the bipartidism that exist in any big western country

Who ever advocates for this are a big part of the problem that we have shitty representatives because they don't feel threatened. They are all part of the establishment and if they win they will be comfortably in the government and if they lose they will be comfortably in the opposition. Never out
 
Didn’t know MS Paint is still being used.


I would be pretty pissed off if I was King Charles or Aston Martin being used in political campaigning by the Tories

EDIT and the English football team, I didnt spot them initially hiding at the bottom
 
Second most powerful country in the world at what?

Edit: Nevermind, it is a study in soft power produced by the Henry Jackson Society: https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/new-study-ranks-britain-second-powerful-country-world/.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Jackson_Society

Co-founder Matthew Jamison, who now works for YouGov, wrote in 2017 that he was ashamed of his involvement, having never imagined the Henry Jackson Society "would become a far-right, deeply anti-Muslim racist ... propaganda outfit to smear other cultures, religions and ethnic groups". He claimed that "The HJS for many years has relentlessly demonised Muslims and Islam".
 
I would be pretty pissed off if I was King Charles or Aston Martin being used in political campaigning by the Tories

EDIT and the English football team, I didnt spot them initially hiding at the bottom
Chris Nolan there too.
 
Fair enough, but if Labour doesn't get your vote then (and its not clear from your comments what they would have to do to get your vote) it sounds like you may not be voting for anybody...... who actually has a chance of winning overall (that is if you are ruling out the Tories).

I suppose you may have a local candidate who is a good constituency MP and it would not matter what the candidates politics are, you would vote for them. That's your right of course, but for the uncommitted, Labour offers not only the option of 'not being Tory' and of course 'a change is as good as a rest' (my old mum use to say), but also realistically they are the only party with a strong enough potential majority to move the dial in favour of ordinary folk; who after 14 years of Tory rule, desperately need a government that will represent the needs of the majority and not the elite, or the ones that can shout the loudest.
I do generally agree with the premise but I personally don't believe I owe the Labour party anything to have a guaranteed vote from me. I may well decide Labour is the best party for me to vote for but I think political parties relying on certain demographics to vote for them by default is a dangerous game and potentially leaves those groups unhappy that the party doesn't do much for them.
 
I do generally agree with the premise but I personally don't believe I owe the Labour party anything to have a guaranteed vote from me. I may well decide Labour is the best party for me to vote for but I think political parties relying on certain demographics to vote for them by default is a dangerous game and potentially leaves those groups unhappy that the party doesn't do much for them.

Yes, I can understand that, I was a member of the Labour party (in my Youth) and even then didn't vote blindly for the party (even though my father did). I do think Starmer is trying to harness voters who would not be natural labour people and in so doing is risking the left leaning element, because he can see maybe once in a lifetime opportunity to move the dial.... A 'super majority'at the next GE, that would get reduced over two or three terms, but keep his government in power long enough to change the course of history of the British working populace, as did the post WW2 labour government with the NHS Act and the Education Act, that empowered millions of ordinary folk, me among them.
 
Yes, I can understand that, I was a member of the Labour party (in my Youth) and even then didn't vote blindly for the party (even though my father did). I do think Starmer is trying to harness voters who would not be natural labour people and in so doing is risking the left leaning element, because he can see maybe once in a lifetime opportunity to move the dial.... A 'super majority'at the next GE, that would get reduced over two or three terms, but keep his government in power long enough to change the course of history of the British working populace, as did the post WW2 labour government with the NHS Act and the Education Act, that empowered millions of ordinary folk, me among them.

Literally all of this only exists as your gut feeling though. You're constantly in this thread explaining the 4D chess that Starmer is playing, based on nothing but your say so and what a party did decades ago.
 
Didn’t know MS Paint is still being used.


"According to Brand Finance's 2024 Global Soft Power Index, the UK has retained second place behind the US and has increased its score since 2023."

I gave up digging up info on this Brand Finance lot but before I did I found out that their "secretary" is a guy called David Edward Bickerton HAIGH. This guy also happens to be the "secretary" or director for two dozen other think-tanks, including Royalty Relief Limited (who champion how the Royal Family are Britain's biggest asset), and a bunch of shady groups that don't seem to have anything of note online but appear "dormant" and only have accounts that total £1 according to their public statements on the government website.
 
The way I see it, I'm not voting for Labour by default, I'm not a Labour member and I never will be a member to any party. I'm not ruling out voting Labour but as it stands I'm leaning against them. For me I'll just look at a combination of the local candidates and what the manifesto's are decide based on that.

I won't vote Tory or any other right wing group but I'll consider all other options. I'm just not going to vote Labour based on greater good concept that they may make things better over the next 10 years, I don't believe in any party that much to be giving them a vote based on that.

Worth a go just once though, right? What’s the worst that can happen? Can always take it back next time.

Anyone not voting explicitly anti-Tory at the next election is certifiable.
 
Im sick of the "you should vote for this to not get the other one". The "useful" vote. Is shitty to guilt-trap you to vote for a party/person that doesn't represent and even go against your values and it only propagates the bipartidism that exist in any big western country

Who ever advocates for this are a big part of the problem that we have shitty representatives because they don't feel threatened. They are all part of the establishment and if they win they will be comfortably in the government and if they lose they will be comfortably in the opposition. Never out
I subscribed to that myself a year or two ago. I knew Starmer wasn't as left leaning as I am or wanted a Labour leader to be, but I was willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

However, since then there have been so many red lines that he's crossed that I've lost count. He can no longer benefit from the doubts. I'm just not giving his version of Labour my votes. It shouldn't be too idealistic to want to give my vote to a party who oppose genocide and favour peace.
 
One is definitely the Stars and Stripes.
They both use this same photo, or at least photos from the same session. It's a union flag.

Liz-Truss-1024x538.jpg
 
Literally all of this only exists as your gut feeling though. You're constantly in this thread explaining the 4D chess that Starmer is playing, based on nothing but your say so and what a party did decades ago.

Not strictly true, Starmer is keeping his cards close to his chest, certainly pre 'the GE kick-off'.

If the polls are to be believed Labour could be heading for over 400 seats, unheard of in modern day times.

With such a majority a Labour government could realistically hope for three terms, (even with some moderate losses) if it can set out a realistic programme for term 1 and demonstrate its ability to deliver, by consolidation in terms 2 and 3.

It is clearly Starmer's intention to show, though he doesn't have the charisma of Blair, that he has command of his ship (so to speak) there is no second in command 'waiting in the wings' to become PM after Starmer (at least not one yet visible).

From a purely personal point of view the establishment of both the NHS Act and the Education Act in the post WW2 period did improve the life chances for me and millions like me. Nothing any government has done since has had that same overall improvement impact on the life chances of millions of its people.
That needs to be the test/proving-ring for the next Labour government.
 

Just on this -

Everything about this story / headline is so batshit insane and hypernormal:

William Wragg: Jeremy Hunt praises MP's apology over dating app incident - BBC News

The chancellor has praised a Tory MP for apologising after he admitted he gave other MPs' personal phone numbers to a man on a dating app.

Some had been sent naked images, and two MPs are reported to have responded by sending images of themselves.

Mr Wragg, who is vice chair of the influential 1922 committee of backbench Tory MPs, told the Times said he had sent intimate pictures of himself to a man he met on gay dating app Grindr.

"They had compromising things on me. They wouldn't leave me alone," added the 36-year-old, who has been MP for Hazel Grove in Greater Manchester since 2015.


The country is a shit show.
 
Just on this -

Everything about this story / headline is so batshit insane and hypernormal:

William Wragg: Jeremy Hunt praises MP's apology over dating app incident - BBC News

The chancellor has praised a Tory MP for apologising after he admitted he gave other MPs' personal phone numbers to a man on a dating app.

Some had been sent naked images, and two MPs are reported to have responded by sending images of themselves.

Mr Wragg, who is vice chair of the influential 1922 committee of backbench Tory MPs, told the Times said he had sent intimate pictures of himself to a man he met on gay dating app Grindr.

"They had compromising things on me. They wouldn't leave me alone," added the 36-year-old, who has been MP for Hazel Grove in Greater Manchester since 2015.


The country is a shit show.
Considering Wragg is one of the main complainers about Cultural Marxism and the woke agenda, I have zero sympathy. Probably explains why he announced he wasn't standing again.
 
How about this cnut Braverman just remains in Israel permanently if he loves them that much? Win, win for all.

I thought it was Patel who sold her arse to Israel? Two thick peas in an evil fecking pod.
 
Just on this -

Everything about this story / headline is so batshit insane and hypernormal:

William Wragg: Jeremy Hunt praises MP's apology over dating app incident - BBC News

The chancellor has praised a Tory MP for apologising after he admitted he gave other MPs' personal phone numbers to a man on a dating app.

Some had been sent naked images, and two MPs are reported to have responded by sending images of themselves.

Mr Wragg, who is vice chair of the influential 1922 committee of backbench Tory MPs, told the Times said he had sent intimate pictures of himself to a man he met on gay dating app Grindr.

"They had compromising things on me. They wouldn't leave me alone," added the 36-year-old, who has been MP for Hazel Grove in Greater Manchester since 2015.


The country is a shit show.
Even the statement that a 36 year old who has been an MP for 9 years is described as a 'Senior' Conservative.

It really shows up how bottom of the barrel things are in this government.
 


Oh Dear, 'pip-squeak' Britain indeed..... based on this Chinese perspective we won't be saving the planet, even if we do achieve net-zero targets.. we are a "dimple on a pimple on a fly's left..whatsit' ...as far as they are concerned.
 
Oh Dear, 'pip-squeak' Britain indeed..... based on this Chinese perspective we won't be saving the planet, even if we do achieve net-zero targets.. we are a "dimple on a pimple on a fly's left..whatsit' ...as far as they are concerned.

We are pip-squeaks now without a colonial empire. We had far more clout as a leading member of the EU, which as a collective competes with China and the US. But we threw that influence away, and if the architects of Brexit have their way, we'll throw away any reminants of soft power we have too.

We have nukes that may or may not work though. So at least we won't be invaded by [insert enemy].

The only thing we have left is to stand up and set an example. Hopefully we'll do that one day.
 
Oh Dear, 'pip-squeak' Britain indeed..... based on this Chinese perspective we won't be saving the planet, even if we do achieve net-zero targets.. we are a "dimple on a pimple on a fly's left..whatsit' ...as far as they are concerned.

We're pretty tiny on a global scale by most metrics. In your example, we produce less than 1% of the worlds carbon dioxide although that's just as important to sort than the other 99% and we need to do our job in helping.

For context China are around 30%, but of course their population is many, many times bigger.