We will sign 7 players minimum this Summer

The only way I'd consider this summer a disappointment is if we don't get 2 CM's, I truly think that would change our attacking and defensive issues a lot. Obviously it would be nice to add another top attacker like Reus and a new LB as that day can't be held off much longer, but neither are as important as the need for two CM's.
 
I'll be disappointed if we don't get a quick winger. At the moment we have Young, Valencia and Nani. I'd gladly get rid of all of them. Even if they aren't proven top talent I'd rather bring in some new young players with potential than stick with Young or Nani.
 
So you think the reason we won't spend it is because we don't want to come across as hypocritical?

The figure I read recently was £120m. We don't have to spend all of it, but I'm confident it's there to be spent. We won't be signing anyone until the European seasons come to a clubs, at least I'd doubt we would until that time anyway.

The "United way", the "United Philosophy", i have heard many times over the season. Play with wingers, attack the best form of defense, hire British managers....rightly or wrongly, spending huge amounts of money on multiple players is not what the club do in one season.

I think we will sign a maximum of 4 players. I dont think we will breach £100m, especially after signing Mata..
 
Do people really see us signing wingers this summer?

I don't disagree with the idea that we could do with a quality winger, but where would another winger fit in the squad? We currently have 5 wingers vying for 2 positions:

Valencia
Nani
Young
Zaha
Januzaj

Add to that Mata, Kagawa & Welbeck will be looking to get games out there, without European football next season we will have 12-17 less games so it will be even harder to give all these players games as it is.

Even if we sold/loaned a few of these players say Zaha & Young thats still 4-6 players for two spots, so its just not realistic in my opinion for us to sign wingers this summer unless we are shipping out 3-4 of these players which i would say is unlikely.

We have priorities in midfield and defence which i think we will concentrate on before we even think about wingers.
 
Do people really see us signing wingers this summer?

I don't disagree with the idea that we could do with a quality winger, but where would another winger fit in the squad? We currently have 5 wingers vying for 2 positions:

Valencia
Nani
Young
Zaha
Januzaj

Add to that Mata, Kagawa & Welbeck will be looking to get games out there, without European football next season we will have 12-17 less games so it will be even harder to give all these players games as it is.

Even if we sold/loaned a few of these players say Zaha & Young thats still 4-6 players for two spots, so its just not realistic in my opinion for us to sign wingers this summer unless we are shipping out 3-4 of these players which i would say is unlikely.

We have priorities in midfield and defence which i think we will concentrate on before we even think about wingers.
Why would we have 12-17 less games? We had 10 CL matches this year.

The plan would obviously be Zaha to feck off back on loan and Nani and Young to feck off too. Valencia can feck off with 42 appearances in all competitions too. Plenty of time would open up from there. Our wingers are straight up shit. They are just as weak if not weaker than Evra, Carrick, Fletcher or Fellaini.
 
Why would we have 12-17 less games? We had 10 CL matches this year.

Well we have only ever really been in contention for a europa league place this year so thats how many games i was thinking we would be missing out on, the finalists this year will have played something like 20 games to get there.

The plan would obviously be Zaha to feck off back on loan and Nani and Young to feck off too. Valencia can feck off with 42 appearances in all competitions too. Plenty of time would open up from there. Our wingers are straight up shit. They are just as weak if not weaker than Evra, Carrick, Fletcher or Fellaini.

Its ok saying all these players can feck off but where to?

Nani recently signed a 5 year contract so unless someone matches our asking price and what we pay him (and that won't be any clubs in portugal) hes going nowhere. Young is rumoured to be on £120k pw with 2 years left on his contract, unlikely anyone who would actually want young could match that kind of money in that scenario hes going nowhere either for at least 2 years. Valencia could leave but that depends on whether the new manager wants to sell him or not. In fact that could apply to the other two also Van Gaal or whoever might want to keep them all 3 of them.

Its easy to say lets just feck 3-4 players off but the reality of it is slightly more complicated, we are probably already going to lose 4-6 players this summer in other areas of the squad so i imagine it would be unlikely we would add another 2-3 wingers to the exodus. That would probably be too much squad upheavel for one summer with a new manager & 4-6 new players coming in.

Ideally i would love us to bring in another quality winger or two but i just can't see it happening this summer.
 
Well we have only ever really been in contention for a europa league place this year so thats how many games i was thinking we would be missing out on, the finalists this year will have played something like 20 games to get there.
Oh right, fair enough that makes sense. Hopefully West Ham beat Spurs tomorrow.


Its ok saying all these players can feck off but where to?

Nani recently signed a 5 year contract so unless someone matches our asking price and what we pay him (and that won't be any clubs in portugal) hes going nowhere. Young is rumoured to be on £120k pw with 2 years left on his contract, unlikely anyone who would actually want young could match that kind of money in that scenario hes going nowhere either for at least 2 years. Valencia could leave but that depends on whether the new manager wants to sell him or not. In fact that could apply to the other two also Van Gaal or whoever might want to keep them all 3 of them.

Its easy to say lets just feck 3-4 players off but the reality of it is slightly more complicated, we are probably already going to lose 4-6 players this summer in other areas of the squad so i imagine it would be unlikely we would add another 2-3 wingers to the exodus. That would probably be too much squad upheavel for one summer with a new manager & 4-6 new players coming in.

Ideally i would love us to bring in another quality winger or two but i just can't see it happening this summer.
Well Nani has talent but is just injured and too inconsistent. Galatasaray and Juventus have been linked with him and I'm sure they'd put out around 12m for him. I guess it all depends how much we'd be wanting. I suppose it all depends on where he is willing to go as I could see a top Turkish or Ukrainian club in for him. I think if we told him he was surplus though he'd be open to moving and we'd find a suitor.

I have my doubts over Young making that much. Again though if the new manager came in and said we don't want you I think he'd have to be open for a move. Someone like West Ham pay high enough wages to the likes of Andy Carroll and Stewart Downing so may go in for him. It could be hard to get rid though.

Personally I wouldn't get rid of Valencia but I'd minimize his role substantially. You're right it all depends on what Van Gaal thinks but that is the case for any position really.

Maybe you're right and it is wishful thinking but I think we could easily fit 1 new winger. Not a Reus level winger but a new young winger with potential. I don't know much about the Dutch league but maybe Depay or Boetius as Van Gaal has brought them into the NT team. 5 signings, a LB, 2 CMs, CB and winger would be what I'd do and I don't think 5 new players would be that much of a overhaul. Especially if as I alluded to the winger and maybe the CB aren't necessarily starters.
 
Oh right, fair enough that makes sense. Hopefully West Ham beat Spurs tomorrow.



Well Nani has talent but is just injured and too inconsistent. Galatasaray and Juventus have been linked with him and I'm sure they'd put out around 12m for him. I guess it all depends how much we'd be wanting. I suppose it all depends on where he is willing to go as I could see a top Turkish or Ukrainian club in for him. I think if we told him he was surplus though he'd be open to moving and we'd find a suitor.

I have my doubts over Young making that much. Again though if the new manager came in and said we don't want you I think he'd have to be open for a move. Someone like West Ham pay high enough wages to the likes of Andy Carroll and Stewart Downing so may go in for him. It could be hard to get rid though.

Personally I wouldn't get rid of Valencia but I'd minimize his role substantially. You're right it all depends on what Van Gaal thinks but that is the case for any position really.

Maybe you're right and it is wishful thinking but I think we could easily fit 1 new winger. Not a Reus level winger but a new young winger with potential. I don't know much about the Dutch league but maybe Depay or Boetius as Van Gaal has brought them into the NT team. 5 signings, a LB, 2 CMs, CB and winger would be what I'd do and I don't think 5 new players would be that much of a overhaul. Especially if as I alluded to the winger and maybe the CB aren't necessarily starters.

Agree mate we could definitely do with a top winger, Reus would be a dream signing but i can't see dortmund letting him go easily, Moura would be good for us i reckon. If it were up to me i would sell Young and Valencia (i love tony but hes just not the player he was and i don't think will be again). Valencia would have planty of takers i reckon, Young we could loan him out and subsidize his wages but i can't remember us ever doing that before so don't know if thats an option. But i just have a feeling neither will leave.

Nani is the most likely to leave i think, but hes such a good player the new manager might want to take a chance on him hoping they can get the best out of him.

Im hoping we bring 4-5 players in and i can see 6 maybe 7 leaving but i wouldn't like to see us lose more than that would be too much change too quickly for me.
 
Firstly, Smalling will not start the world cup next to Cahill unless Jagielka is injured.

I said "most likely", it's not like he will have as much as guaranteed for a starting eleven compare to Cahill. There are two who are fighting for a place to be paired with Cahilll. Between Jagielka or Smalling.

I am not saying Smalling and Jones are bad players, I just think they are not to the standard of what we have had, and if you gave me the option, would I sell Smalling or Jones to buy a Mangala or Hummels?, then yes, yes I would.
(Again, I think they are good players, but good squad players, not particular important players.)
As for rotating CBs. I also never said that. I'd like a back two of one of the 3 we have, plus a top CB, then, the other to, play more bit part roles, filling in so one can be rested, or for injuries etc)

I don't also think you ever said that they are bad. I only remember you said they are not good enough. Why do we need a non good enough player in the team. Well, then you are agree to have 3 (Mangala, Evans and one of Smalling/Jones) Because your first excuse or reason doesn't make any sense. You said we need one more due of injury prone. While clearly I'm trying to told you that we have enough number of centre back. We don't wanna to add more and then end up rotating them. As worry for injury prone for not trusting 3 CB + 1 youth to be fit enough then we can use a defensive midfield as another cover. I don't know how many times I've said the bold sentences.

As for the Mascherano view. When he was at Liverpool, he was never a defender. Barca put him there because he is good defensively, and can pass the ball. Khedeira can defend just as well, the only reason you are saying he could not play as a backup defender is because Real have never needed to put him there. I am not saying they would, but thats because they have sufficient cover anyway.
Also, I am not saying Gerrard is a good defender, but he could put a decent shift in, if asked, but as I was saying about all these players, I wouldn't play them as a defender, I was just making my point that it's better to buy a proper defender, rather than sign Carvalho who could be used there if needed. Also...Biased how? I am not a Liverpool fan? :lol:

Why would Liverpool putted him as a defender when they have available centre back to play during the game. You are missing the point here. Mascherano is a defensive midfield who can also play as a part of centre back back up. I'm never say Mascherano must play as a defender or any team must play him as a defender. I'm saying we can use them as our back up centre back if needed so we can limit the number of our centre back as minimum as possible so we don't need to rotate them.

I've been saying this a lot of time and yet you seem never read my post clearly. What did I say in the beginning of our conversation? "If we can get a defensive midfield who can defense and pass the ball." That's why those defensive midfield play as a centre back back up. :lol: It's funny that You are just repeating what I said.

Yeah Khedira can defend. But how good he can defend compare to Mascherano and Javi Martinez? Not good enough to be compared because you are trying to push yourself so hard to think that Khedira is a defensive midfield. He's not a defensive midfield. It's like we are saying RVP can defend, but he can't defend if we compared him with Mascherano and Javi Martinez. We are talking about defensive midfield and centre back standard. We are not talking about a centre midfield or more advance role standard like Khedira's position. I would say the same sh!t with Gerrard standard.

It's clear on this topic alone, most people list a CB as something they want, so I am not the only one who would want a defender to come in. Most people see the need for one, and it's not just me.
If you made a topic and asked people, if we signed a LB and CM, would a CB be a high priority, or would you be happy with Smalling, Jones, Evans and Keane, I think most would want to see another CB.

Hey Hey try to read again in my previous posts, Every one want a centre back, I never said I don't want centre back too. I put a centre back as our maximum target list. But that's not the main priority. I'm just saying the minimum target we must get. We have world cup and clearly getting so many quality players are not easy. I prefer us to get midfield quality and left back quality rather than getting a centre back quality and non quality of midfield and left back. Because I'm happy with Evans, Smalling, Jones, Keane/Rio quality left backs, quality right backs and also quality midfield rather than see 5 CB with sh!t quality left back and midfield.

As for Nastatic and Varane, they are better defenders than Smalling.
I also was not comparing Demi to Mangala, but I was saying, here, he would be the main defender, the one that starts every match, at City, that is Kompany, and even with Managala, would still be Kompany

Fair enough that's your opinion. I think Smalling current level is better than Nastasic because I won't compare an injury prone in one season with Smalling. But you said Nastasic is better. That's okay. I can't disagree with that opinion.

It's not like we are trying to win Champion League next season by making our centre backs to be as equal or better than Real Madrid because we won't be in champion league next season. You just never know what will happen next season. There might be another new quality centre back which we can sign in 2015.

As I said in my last post though, we won't agree so might aswell just leave it, we are taking over this thread right now and it isn't helping :lol:

It's just that hmmm.. :

1) You said you want to add more centre back like Mangala due of injury prone and also you don't trust Smalling and Jones. If we do that then we will end up to rotate them. I disagree with rotating paired of centre backs and none of them want just to sit on the bench. Fair enough if we want to sell one of them to sign one. But can you see that happen?
2) I said if we worry about injury prone with 3 current CB and 1 youth we can also use our new signing defensive midfield to be a back up of centre back as well. And you are trying to compare Khedira and Gerrard with Javi Martinez and Mascherano. While clearly I disagree if you compare them because Khedira isn't even a defensive midfield and Gerrard can't even defend like Javi and Macherano. You are trying so hard to compare their role it's like sky and earth. 2 different things.
3) You said Mangala will be more concern in City. It's like you are trying to say that Mangala is concerned with Demi because Demi and Kompany are City current paired defender this season. It's what you are trying to say that Mangala concerned that Demi can challenge his place rather than Smalling and Jones. Obviously I disagree because in my opinion Jones and Smalling are better than Demi. And obviously Mangala will concern on Jones and Smalling rather than Demi. Not to mention Demi is too old already.

Well, you see it's most likely your points are really don't make any sense this time.
 
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I don't think we will sign 7 players but based off today's performance I would say we 100% need to, to have any hope of competing at any level.
 
Do people really see us signing wingers this summer?

I don't disagree with the idea that we could do with a quality winger, but where would another winger fit in the squad? We currently have 5 wingers vying for 2 positions:

Valencia
Nani
Young
Zaha
Januzaj

With any luck we'll only have Januzaj left out of those five.
 
I said a while ago in this thread we don't need 7 players, and I stand by it. We need two central midfielders, one left back, and one centre-half.
 
I don't also think you ever said that they are bad. I only remember you said they are not good enough. Why do we need a non good enough player in the team. Well, then you are agree to have 3 (Mangala, Evans and one of Smalling/Jones) Because your first excuse or reason doesn't make any sense. You said we need one more due of injury prone. While clearly I'm trying to told you that we have enough number of centre back. We don't wanna to add more and then end up rotating them. As worry for injury prone for not trusting 3 CB + 1 youth to be fit enough then we can use a defensive midfield as another cover. I don't know how many times I've said the bold sentences.


I really don't know what you are trying to achieve here? I have clearly said, I would rather have 4 CBs, but if the option was given to me that I had to choose to sell either Smalling or Jones, to bring in a better defender, then yes I would, but I'd rather buy another defender, while keeping them. Look through our past, we have always had 4 CBs every year.
We don't need to rotate them often. Sometimes players have to accept they are playing for one of the best clubs in the world, and their chances may be limited. If they don't like that, then they have a choice to leave. Brown, O'Shea etc did it for many years. It is how a top squad operates.
I did not say they was not good enough, I said, and I will quote
'Again, I think they are good players, but good squad players, not particular important players.'

This suggests in my posts, that I'd keep them, and they could be used as reliable players who can step in when needed. We get plenty of injuries at CB so having 4 defenders is a must.



Why would Liverpool putted him as a defender when they have available centre back to play during the game. You are missing the point here. Mascherano is a defensive midfield who can also play as a part of centre back back up. I'm never say Mascherano must play as a defender or any team must play him as a defender. I'm saying we can use them as our back up centre back if needed so we can limit the number of our centre back as minimum as possible so we don't need to rotate them.

I've been saying this a lot of time and yet you seem never read my post clearly. What did I say in the beginning of our conversation? "If we can get a defensive midfield who can defense and pass the ball." That's why those defensive midfield play as a centre back back up. :lol: It's funny that You are just repeating what I said.

Yeah Khedira can defend. But how good he can defend compare to Mascherano and Javi Martinez? Not good enough to be compared because you are trying to push yourself so hard to think that Khedira is a defensive midfield. He's not a defensive midfield. It's like we are saying RVP can defend, but he can't defend if we compared him with Mascherano and Javi Martinez. We are talking about defensive midfield and centre back standard. We are not talking about a centre midfield or more advance role standard like Khedira's position. I would say the same sh!t with Gerrard standard.

I am also getting a bit sick of you keep mentioning the Gerrard factor here. I probably should have used Lucas as the example.
First of all. I don't ever expect Liverpool to use Gerrard or Real to use Khedira as CBs.
I was using them as examples that, why do other teams not sell a backup CB, and can call upon midfielders to play CB if needed. Simply, because teams do what they should, and that is have 4 defenders in their squad.
Khedira is a defensive midfielder by the way, and is very capable at defending, so I don't know what you think his job is, but if he was called upon to play a match at CB, He'd play it well. If you think he plays as a more advanced midfielder, then I don't know what Khedira you are watching
As for Mascherano, again, he is a CDM player, but Barca never use him their, because they have a system where everybody needs to pass.
If he came back to the Prem, he would never play as a CB. In the world cup, he will never play as a CB....Why? Because he is not a natural defender

My point is, yes, lets sign Carvalho, but sign him as a CDM, and not as a back up defender also.
Why do you think people get sick of seeing Mata out wide, same with Kagawa etc...Because they are not as effective there.
As for your point about Liverpool and Gerrard. You could say the same about Carrick. Why would United play him there? Out of desperation

Hey Hey try to read again in my previous posts, Every one want a centre back, I never said I don't want centre back too. I put a centre back as our maximum target list. But that's not the main priority. I'm just saying the minimum target we must get. We have world cup and clearly getting so many quality players are not easy. I prefer us to get midfield quality and left back quality rather than getting a centre back quality and non quality of midfield and left back. Because I'm happy with Evans, Smalling, Jones, Keane/Rio quality left backs, quality right backs and also quality midfield rather than see 5 CB with sh!t quality left back and midfield.

I agree with you here. A CB isn't as high on the list as some positions, but it is still clearly a priority. Ferdinand should leave, and Keane should stay out on loan.
It's clear that a CB is a priority because most people in this topic are calling for one.


It's not like we are trying to win Champion League next season by making our centre backs to be as equal or better than Real Madrid because we won't be in champion league next season. You just never know what will happen next season. There might be another new quality centre back which we can sign in 2015.

I am not saying break the bank to sign a defender. If one is available, then try to sign them, that is all. We could wait year after year for one to come available, sometimes we have to push to get one though
I also get we are not in the CL, so we don't need as big of a squad, but if we have a decent FA cup run, then all of a sudden we play a similar amount of games next season as this one. Also, you make it sound like after a bad season, your expectation on United is a lot lower. We should still be challenging for the league next season. I just think some peoples standards are slipping on what United should have etc



It's just that hmmm.. :

1) You said you want to add more centre back like Mangala due of injury prone and also you don't trust Smalling and Jones. If we do that then we will end up to rotate them. I disagree with rotating paired of centre backs and none of them want just to sit on the bench. Fair enough if we want to sell one of them to sign one. But can you see that happen?
What I want is. 4 CBs. A pair that are normal starters, and then another 2 who can be called upon due injuries, rest periods etc. You know, like United have done for the last how many years.
What I don't want, is a midfielder put as CB if needed, to save on having 4 CBs
2) I said if we worry about injury prone with 3 current CB and 1 youth we can also use our new signing defensive midfield to be a back up of centre back as well. And you are trying to compare Khedira and Gerrard with Javi Martinez and Mascherano. While clearly I disagree if you compare them because Khedira isn't even a defensive midfield and Gerrard can't even defend like Javi and Macherano. You are trying so hard to compare their role it's like sky and earth. 2 different things.
The two defenders you talk about, Mascherano and Martinez. Please tell me who manage/d them when they where played as CB. Pep... A manager who likes to play players who can pass the ball. Why did Bayern not play Martinez as a CB last season, because this is a Pep thing, not something managers normally do
Also, Khedira is can defend very well, and plays as a CDM, so please stop saying he isn't
3) You said Mangala will be more concern in City. It's like you are trying to say that Mangala is concerned with Demi because Demi and Kompany are City current paired defender this season. It's what you are trying to say that Mangala concerned that Demi can challenge his place rather than Smalling and Jones. Obviously I disagree because in my opinion Jones and Smalling are better than Demi. And obviously Mangala will concern on Jones and Smalling rather than Demi. Not to mention Demi is too old already.
If you read my post, what you will notice is as I kept saying. If Mangala comes here, he would be the main defender. The go to guy every match. Around him, the others would play with him, while hopefully havign a consistent pairing most of the time
At City, Kompany is that go to guy. Of course Mangala would be the next choice to play along side him, but if Pelli wanted to put a defender in for a match, it would most likely be Mangala to be dropped.
I would say at both clubs, he would play most games.

Well, you see it's most likely your points are really don't make any sense this time

And ok...
 
With any luck we'll only have Januzaj left out of those five.

Bit early to write Zaha off without either giving him a chance here or a loan at a decent premier league club, wouldn't you agree?
 
So Giggs wants new contracts for Rio and Evra, I don't know if he just said that off his own bat but if not, then that might mean we are going to hold off another year for a new CB and LB.
 
Do people really see us signing wingers this summer?

I don't disagree with the idea that we could do with a quality winger, but where would another winger fit in the squad? We currently have 5 wingers vying for 2 positions:

Valencia
Nani
Young
Zaha
Januzaj

Add to that Mata, Kagawa & Welbeck will be looking to get games out there, without European football next season we will have 12-17 less games so it will be even harder to give all these players games as it is.

Even if we sold/loaned a few of these players say Zaha & Young thats still 4-6 players for two spots, so its just not realistic in my opinion for us to sign wingers this summer unless we are shipping out 3-4 of these players which i would say is unlikely.

We have priorities in midfield and defence which i think we will concentrate on before we even think about wingers.

Hopefully we'll sell all of them except Januzaj and sign two wingers + Kagawa/Welbeck, but that won't happen.
 
Hopefully we'll sell all of them except Januzaj and sign two wingers + Kagawa/Welbeck, but that won't happen.

You wouldn't like to see us give a young player like Zaha who hasn't played more than 2-3 games for us a chance?
 
Zaha's attitude seems very poor, I think he'll go on loan again next season regardless of who is bought/sold.
 
You wouldn't like to see us give a young player like Zaha who hasn't played more than 2-3 games for us a chance?

I've seen him play for Cardiff instead.

If we have him as 4th/5th choice next season I'm fine with that, but I'll be just as happy selling him on.

He's not shown anything to suggest he has a future at our level, he doesn't even look PL level right now.
 
Yeah a year long loan at a decent team could be the making of him, if hes still erratic and inconsistent then we should think about moving him on.
 
I've seen him play for Cardiff instead.

If we have him as 4th/5th choice next season I'm fine with that, but I'll be just as happy selling him on.

He's not shown anything to suggest he has a future at our level, he doesn't even look PL level right now.


Cardiff are in a mess though not really an environment conducive to a young player finding his feet in the premier league and regaining his confidence.

Would be very harsh to judge him on his time at cardiff in my opinion. The kids got talent i think he just needs an opportunity in the right set up to show it.
 
I'd like to see what Zaha could do under LvG. I think he will give him his chance.

I think he should get a chance - there's nothing to lose by giving him a go.

Lots of raw talent and Van Gaal likes youth.
 
I really don't know what you are trying to achieve here? I have clearly said, I would rather have 4 CBs, but if the option was given to me that I had to choose to sell either Smalling or Jones, to bring in a better defender, then yes I would, but I'd rather buy another defender, while keeping them. Look through our past, we have always had 4 CBs every year.
We don't need to rotate them often. Sometimes players have to accept they are playing for one of the best clubs in the world, and their chances may be limited. If they don't like that, then they have a choice to leave. Brown, O'Shea etc did it for many years. It is how a top squad operates.
I did not say they was not good enough, I said, and I will quote
'Again, I think they are good players, but good squad players, not particular important players.'

You don't even know the main of our conversation. My main point is a left back, a right back and a defensive midfield would be enough to strength our defense. It's simple right? Not really hard to understand. Evans, Smalling, Jones, Rio/Keane. That's 4 CBs right? And you wanted more.
You never say you wanted to sell one of them in the first place of our conversation. The point is you need to remember my first question was what are you going to do now if we sign Mangala? Rotating them? Because I don't think Jones and Smalling want just sit on the bench. That has been my first question ever.
Your answer is you don't like to rotate them.
So I made my 2nd question "since Jones and Smalling don't want sit on the bench, then will you sell one of them or play them out of position (Jones as a DM then forget to sign DM)". And then your answer for my 2nd question was you would sell one of them.
But then my 3rd question is. "Is that even realistic? I'm asking are we really going to sell one of Jones or Smalling? Realistically I don't think we will."

If we are going to sign Mangala with realistically which mean we won't sign defensive midfield and instead we will let Jones to do the job. Because realistically I don't wanna us to rotate our CB.

Oh man you are not playing, you are just watching okay. You don't understand what they feel. They are still young age and can improve with experience. How to get experience? By playing!!! They need to play!! Rather than limiting the number times of their playing game I prefer to limit our CB so we don't need to rotate them and we won't have the same problem as our strikers for crying for games.

You are comparing our former centre backs who can play as a full back really with our current centre back who can't even play as a full back with awful crosses. After we sold Heinze. Brown and Garry Neville played as a right back while O'Shea and Evra were the one played as a left back. The one who play a centre back was only Rio, Vidic and Pique. Since Brown spent his time as a right back in that season most of the time we used 3 CB which make Rio and Vidic got their chances to play together so many times and build a really good connection during the game.

I'm getting tired with your excuse of good squad player or not good enough. How can you judge players like Jones and Smalling when they don't even get their chance enough. Give them chance will ya??!! Let them have enough game to play as a centre back then judge them!! It's not like we need the best centre back just to win a league or get to 4th. We are not going to be in Champion League anyway, we won't meet those huge teams like Barca or Madrid next season. I'm talking a realistically here.

This suggests in my posts, that I'd keep them, and they could be used as reliable players who can step in when needed. We get plenty of injuries at CB so having 4 defenders is a must.

Plenty of injuries? Look Jones played right back since Bayern game even last night, Smalling is available, Evans just got back. Rio and Vidic played almost our recently games. Do you still think we get plenty injuries. Well if we count Jones and Smalling as a right back then yes we get plenty of injuries. Most likely our right back get plenty of injuries which make the manager to push Smalling and Jones to play as a right back. I thought Evans, Smalling, Jones, Rio/Keane are total 4 CBs? I don't mind if we add more. But I don't like to rotate them. And I don't like to waste their talent. And also I don't like to talk unrealistically when clearly our manager and players have their limit of time during summer transfer window due of World Cup competition.


I am also getting a bit sick of you keep mentioning the Gerrard factor here. I probably should have used Lucas as the example.
First of all. I don't ever expect Liverpool to use Gerrard or Real to use Khedira as CBs.
I was using them as examples that, why do other teams not sell a backup CB, and can call upon midfielders to play CB if needed. Simply, because teams do what they should, and that is have 4 defenders in their squad.
Khedira is a defensive midfielder by the way, and is very capable at defending, so I don't know what you think his job is, but if he was called upon to play a match at CB, He'd play it well. If you think he plays as a more advanced midfielder, then I don't know what Khedira you are watching
As for Mascherano, again, he is a CDM player, but Barca never use him their, because they have a system where everybody needs to pass.
If he came back to the Prem, he would never play as a CB. In the world cup, he will never play as a CB....Why? Because he is not a natural defender

Sorry mate, but aren't you the one who talked about Gerrard first. It's not my fault because you are comparing different players and different role. I don't understand your point trying to compare Gerrard with Martinez or Mascherano. Yeah Lucas. So you wanna talk about Lucas now? The injury prone player!! He doesn't even have enough time to play as a defensive midfield due of injury prone with Liverpool so don't expect him to play in other position.
I should be the one who ask you what Khedira you are watching. Unless you never watch Xabi Alonso and him play together.

I never said a defensive midfield must play as a centre back!! You never read will ya?? Please just please read what I said. It'll so much easier for you to understand if you are willing to read.
I said a defensive midfield who can defend and pass can be used as a back up centre back which mean we can use them when all the centre backs are not available. It's not like in the world cup Argentina will get all their centre backs injured at the same time. It's not like Liverpool had all their centre backs injured at the same time. That's why Mascherano didn't play as a centre back. If none available due injury. I'm 100% sure he will go as a centre back.

My point is, yes, lets sign Carvalho, but sign him as a CDM, and not as a back up defender also.
Why do you think people get sick of seeing Mata out wide, same with Kagawa etc...Because they are not as effective there.
As for your point about Liverpool and Gerrard. You could say the same about Carrick. Why would United play him there? Out of desperation

The only thing I can see us to sign a new centre back is by converting Jones as a defensive midfield (which mean we won't sign Defensive mid). I can't see him and Smalling to leave because I'm sure the manager want to give them chance. They are young and deserve chances. I'm talking realistic here. Do you want a centre back and forget signing a defensive midfield or a defensive midfield but forget signing a centre back? Pick one of them because as I said before above (If you read, I suggest to read), realistically there is no way we will sell Jones or Smalling this summer. And there is no way we will have enough time to sign a lot of players due of world cup. Well if we can sign a lot of quality then I'll give my massive applause to Ed Woodward to be able making deal with many players in such a short period of time. United played Carrick as a CB once only this season when we have none available. And Carrick did really well.

I agree with you here. A CB isn't as high on the list as some positions, but it is still clearly a priority. Ferdinand should leave, and Keane should stay out on loan.
It's clear that a CB is a priority because most people in this topic are calling for one.

I am not saying break the bank to sign a defender. If one is available, then try to sign them, that is all. We could wait year after year for one to come available, sometimes we have to push to get one though
I also get we are not in the CL, so we don't need as big of a squad, but if we have a decent FA cup run, then all of a sudden we play a similar amount of games next season as this one. Also, you make it sound like after a bad season, your expectation on United is a lot lower. We should still be challenging for the league next season. I just think some peoples standards are slipping on what United should have etc


So you are changing your target now? I thought You wanted Mangala since City wanted him and we can't let City to sign him. He is about 30 million. Which mean really expensive for a centre back. 30 million for our owner for a centre back which hasn't be a real world class is like break the bank. Don't compare our owner like City, 30 million is nothing for them. Well unless if we can get a quality one with cheaper price like Vidic, I would say lucky.
That's why I said this already in my previous post if we want to sign CB, we could wait another season. It's not the main priority. We don't need to break the bank for CB this season unless if we don't sign defensive midfield then another CB is a must to improve the defense. Liverpool is probably an example we can take as a club from 7th to 1st or 2nd.. It's not like that they have world class centre back to get this far compare to last season.

1) You said you want to add more centre back like Mangala due of injury prone and also you don't trust Smalling and Jones. If we do that then we will end up to rotate them. I disagree with rotating paired of centre backs and none of them want just to sit on the bench. Fair enough if we want to sell one of them to sign one. But can you see that happen?
What I want is. 4 CBs. A pair that are normal starters, and then another 2 who can be called upon due injuries, rest periods etc. You know, like United have done for the last how many years.
What I don't want, is a midfielder put as CB if needed, to save on having 4 CBs
2) I said if we worry about injury prone with 3 current CB and 1 youth we can also use our new signing defensive midfield to be a back up of centre back as well. And you are trying to compare Khedira and Gerrard with Javi Martinez and Mascherano. While clearly I disagree if you compare them because Khedira isn't even a defensive midfield and Gerrard can't even defend like Javi and Macherano. You are trying so hard to compare their role it's like sky and earth. 2 different things.
The two defenders you talk about, Mascherano and Martinez. Please tell me who manage/d them when they where played as CB. Pep... A manager who likes to play players who can pass the ball. Why did Bayern not play Martinez as a CB last season, because this is a Pep thing, not something managers normally do
Also, Khedira is can defend very well, and plays as a CDM, so please stop saying he isn't
3) You said Mangala will be more concern in City. It's like you are trying to say that Mangala is concerned with Demi because Demi and Kompany are City current paired defender this season. It's what you are trying to say that Mangala concerned that Demi can challenge his place rather than Smalling and Jones. Obviously I disagree because in my opinion Jones and Smalling are better than Demi. And obviously Mangala will concern on Jones and Smalling rather than Demi. Not to mention Demi is too old already.
If you read my post, what you will notice is as I kept saying. If Mangala comes here, he would be the main defender. The go to guy every match. Around him, the others would play with him, while hopefully havign a consistent pairing most of the time
At City, Kompany is that go to guy. Of course Mangala would be the next choice to play along side him, but if Pelli wanted to put a defender in for a match, it would most likely be Mangala to be dropped.
I would say at both clubs, he would play most games.

1) I don't I need to response this since everything already been writen above.
2) Martinez ever played as a centre back with Atl Bilbao. So it's not only Pep played him as a centre back. As for Khedira I mentioned him above already.
3) We were talking about which one Mangala will feel more concern and which one he will prefer. We never talk about who's going to be the main one. Mangala would probably be the main one in both of team if he's that good. But the problem is we have Smalling and Jones which are more quality than Demi. Obviously more players wanted a first team choice CB in our team. I don't see Demi as their first choice if City have Smalling instead.
 
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From the Daily Mail today. Looks far too offensive but if anyone can make it work :drool:
 
We need a winger, CB, LB and two CM's.
5 signings really.

We're not even being linked with any wingers, which is worrying.

We're being linked with Reus, I suppose.

But I completely agree with you. I also think 5 signings in the same positions, with the winger being able to offer genuine pace, something we lack badly.
 
Five world class players plus maybe some two great youngsters... I don't care about the cost... My name is Kermit.

Seriously, we could use some overhaul of that kind. It will surely help more rather than lower the quality of this team.
 
We don't need anywhere as big a squad next year. Can't see us signing 7 unless we sell about 11/12 players.
 
We don't need anywhere as big a squad next year. Can't see us signing 7 unless we sell about 11/12 players.

Just playing Devil's Advocate, players who I could see leaving: (those already leaving/most likely listed first)

Vidic, Anderson, Ferdinand, Young, Cleverley, Buttner, Evra, Nani, Chicharito, Fletcher, Carrick, Valencia, Fellaini.

There's 13 there. Obviously we won't let all of them, but I certainly think we can expect at least 8 to leave. Because we are not in Europe and will only be focussing on the league and cups next season, we don't need to replace everyone we sell. What we do need is quality additions. Which is why I can't see 7 additions.
 
Just playing Devil's Advocate, players who I could see leaving: (those already leaving/most likely listed first)

Vidic, Anderson, Ferdinand, Young, Cleverley, Buttner, Evra, Nani, Chicharito, Fletcher, Carrick, Valencia, Fellaini.

There's 13 there. Obviously we won't let all of them, but I certainly think we can expect at least 8 to leave. Because we are not in Europe and will only be focussing on the league and cups next season, we don't need to replace everyone we sell. What we do need is quality additions. Which is why I can't see 7 additions.

I agree, no chance of us signing that many players. Not sure its the right thing either. I think we have to possibly accept 2-3 signings per transfer window over the next 2 seasons, and its going to be a steady rebuilding process. I'm not sure whether some of the players are in decline or whether a new manager with the right mentality will rejuvenate some players careers. I personally think Eva is still one of the best LB's in the league, he's just not had the under study which would enable the position to be rotated better.
 
I really think 4-5 signings is a possibility.
Yes it's a world cup year, but 2-3 players could be done before that even kicks off.
I share the opinions of a lot in here: 1 LB, 1 CM, 1CB, 1LW, 1CM. For me, in that order also
Shaw, Carvalho, Garay, ??? (I'd love to say Reus, maybe Grizemann, Fabregas or Kroos)

Looking at that list, I personally think the first 3 are people that are deals that could be wrapped up quickly. I think maybe Carvalho could have price issues, but that would be the only stumbling block.

I understand that signing too many players at once can be a hindrance, rather than a positive, but I use Chelsea as an example. The season Abramovic took over, he bought 17 players, and they finished 2nd in the league. The next season, he then added a lot few numbers, but still, 5 more players, then ended up winning the league for the next 2 seasons.

5 players won't be a huge hindrance on the team. The change of style of play will be just as much of one
 
I really think 4-5 signings is a possibility.
Yes it's a world cup year, but 2-3 players could be done before that even kicks off.
I share the opinions of a lot in here: 1 LB, 1 CM, 1CB, 1LW, 1CM. For me, in that order also
Shaw, Carvalho, Garay, ??? (I'd love to say Reus, maybe Grizemann, Fabregas or Kroos)

Looking at that list, I personally think the first 3 are people that are deals that could be wrapped up quickly. I think maybe Carvalho could have price issues, but that would be the only stumbling block.

I understand that signing too many players at once can be a hindrance, rather than a positive, but I use Chelsea as an example. The season Abramovic took over, he bought 17 players, and they finished 2nd in the league. The next season, he then added a lot few numbers, but still, 5 more players, then ended up winning the league for the next 2 seasons.

5 players won't be a huge hindrance on the team. The change of style of play will be just as much of one

I hear you but I never like to use anything Chelsea as an example. LVG might have different opinions on the very players were are taking about signing or moving on. Its hard to say, and might think some players have lost their way here. Interestingly he might have other players in mind from other leagues beyond the obvious ones mentioned. its really difficult to second guess anything at the moment imo
 
Whenever I hear these massive figures being thrown around as our summer transfer budgets I find it over the top. But when you think about it, if we want to we could free up quite a large chunk of what we spend on wages by letting some players go. If we have a summer where vidic, rio, young, Anderson, Nani and buttner go, then you have to factor that into our summer spending too. Suddenly, spending a 100 million isn't a big deal given the spending that's reduced on wages.