We need a new striker

MJJ said:
Wants to stay in italy.
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Double the wages Juve are offering and he'l suddenly turn into a kid that grew up watching Cantona dreaming of playing with us. I don't think we're interested. Can't believe palermo would not leak any enquiry from us to increase the price.
 
Everything we need in a striker is Cristiano Ronaldo. The ultimate number 9.
 
Uzz said:
In his professional career, Rooney has got more than 20 league goals a season twice. OptaUzz.
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why are you limiting it to league games when we normally play a sh!Tload of other competitions?
To fit your argument better?
 
Uzz said:
I thought we were talking specifically about the league. My bad.

In his professional career, Rooney has managed a 20+ goal season 4 times. OptaUzz.

It's still poor, imo.
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Henry did it 5 times in the league, is that poor too?
 
Uzz said:
No of course not.

What point do you think I'm making? Henry has had 8 20+ goal seasons, including his time spent as a winger in France/Juve/Barca, and his 'retirement' in NY...that's a great return.
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Yeah, it was a bad example, personally I've always seen Rooney as an other 'Tevez', they are both great strikers who primarily play as second strikers and occupy a great zone but they both can lead the attack because of their finishing.
Using stats against them is dishonest because the goals they don't score, are repaid in assists or key passes.
 
Rooney has been by far our best striker this season and I think even then when he's been played up front he's only been average at best. It's been a real problem, we practically had 10 men yesterday for all the good Falcao and RVP did.

I think we certainly need a new striker, maybe even two.
 
Uzz said:
No of course not.

What point do you think I'm making? Henry has had 8 20+ goal seasons, including his time spent as a winger in France/Juve/Barca, and his 'retirement' in NY...that's a great return.
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I'm sorry, I can't let this falsehood go.

He scored 28 goals in TOTAL for Monaco.
He scored over 20 once for a great Barcelona team.

He hasn't scored over 20 in a season in the US.

His 20+ goal scoring seasons were mainly the Arsenal days, in their best team probably in their history.

Noone's trying to compare him v Rooney, but Rooney has had many spells of playing in different positions, sacrificing himself for others.
He might have "Only" 4 seasons of 20 or more, but he's had another 6 in the 16-19 range that would surely have been higher if he'd always played up front, not been Ronaldo's support man, and not had long injury spells
 
Its a toughy, We need somebody who will instantly walk into the first 11 and take the no.9 shirt grabbing 25+ goals a season. We cant skimp out here, this will likely be a massive massive transfer fee due to our wealth and situation. falcao and van persie simply need to go, they just arent productive enough anymore and are on stellar wages. we can clear up 450k a week off the wage bill and fund another 2 mega transfers.

I think we have 2 options from the premier league, Benteke and Kane. Both have the upside of not requiring a league adaptation season, are young enough to get massive long term value, and are both from clubs that would see united as a step up(not from rival clubs), and would not be able to blindly refuse a transfer if a valuation is met.

In Benteke's case, there is simply no way they refuse a bid around 30-35m pounds. for a club like villa that's enough change to guarantee premier league status and add some quality to the squad in other areas. we could also offer them players on loan. He would add Power, pace, holdup play and goals.

Kane is a lot more difficult, but not impossible. He's on a long term deal and the fee would have to be enough to help spurs properly rebuild their squad for another top 4 push (Potchettino has recently said no player is safe at spurs and he intends to rebuild the side with lots of ins and outs to freshen up a squad that currently cant break into the top 4) He's a fan favourite academy product and spurs through and through which is more of an incentive for the club to hold on, HOWEVER from the players perspective, a young english player with ambitions simply does not turn down manchester united when they come calling and offered genuine playing time, and should a large fee be offered its a gamble on both sides to see if he continues his form into next season and beyond and not a 1 hit wonder( i dont think he is) There will be a number that in spurs managements head will trigger "we can use that to improve the squad beyond what can offer, and there is a chance that this is his highest valuation, if we dont sell now and he bombs next season we look stupid for tuning down 40-50m and it will likely put us massively behind in plans to break into the top 4"

Outside the Premier league, your looking at trying to buy players at clubs of equal standing from the players perspective, and the club wont wont to sell.
Benzema, lewandowski, Muller, maybe ronaldo.
 
Sandikan said:
I'm sorry, I can't let this falsehood go.

He scored 28 goals in TOTAL for Monaco.
He scored over 20 once for a great Barcelona team.

He hasn't scored over 20 in a season in the US.

His 20+ goal scoring seasons were mainly the Arsenal days, in their best team probably in their history.

Noone's trying to compare him v Rooney, but Rooney has had many spells of playing in different positions, sacrificing himself for others.
He might have "Only" 4 seasons of 20 or more, but he's had another 6 in the 16-19 range that would surely have been higher if he'd always played up front, not been Ronaldo's support man, and not had long injury spells
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Come off it.

Firstly, what falsehood did I say? Henry has actually had 8 seasons where he returned 20+ goals or more. There's no falsity in that. I don't know the relevance of you pointing out Monaco, Barca, and NY as I didn't ignore them. If anything, they aid my argument.

And another 6 in the 16-19 range isn't 20. In fact, it's less than 20. Your initial assertion, if we go back to page 1 of this thread was that if he played up front he'd get 20 goals a season. Something he's managed to do 4 times in his whole career. Of which, he's spent the overwhelming majority playing up front. I don't think he'd be able to get 20+ goals a season, personally. I think he'll probably get between 11-19. I'd like him to get 20+, but he won't. Which I was pointing out.

'Playing in different positions sacrificing himself for others' - this is the falsehood. You make it sound he spent season after season being shunted around, when that's a clear lie. He played 4 - 6 games as a LW to accommodate Ronaldo. He played probably 3/4 games as a CM for Fergie in his last season, and about 8 games as a CM for LvG.
 
Uzz said:
Come off it.

Firstly, what falsehood did I say? Henry has actually had 8 seasons where he returned 20+ goals or more. There's no falsity in that. I don't know the relevance of you pointing out Monaco, Barca, and NY as I didn't ignore them. If anything, they aid my argument.

And another 6 in the 16-19 range isn't 20. In fact, it's less than 20. Your initial assertion, if we go back to page 1 of this thread was that if he played up front he'd get 20 goals a season. Something he's managed to do 4 times in his whole career. Of which, he's spent the overwhelming majority playing up front. I don't think he'd be able to get 20+ goals a season, personally. I think he'll probably get between 11-19. I'd like him to get 20+, but he won't. Which I was pointing out.

'Playing in different positions sacrificing himself for others' - this is the falsehood. You make it sound he spent season after season being shunted around, when that's a clear lie. He played 4 - 6 games as a LW to accommodate Ronaldo. He played probably 3/4 games as a CM for Fergie in his last season, and about 8 games as a CM for LvG.
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You've implied that he was scoring big sums as a winger, when he wasn't. Only one season at Barcelona could you claim he was a winger, and even that would have been one of the front 3s. And It was at Barcelona.

If Rooney played 40 games up front in this current system of 1 striker, I struggle to see how anyone would think he wouldn't get 20 at least.

Most of this season, he's been playing in 2 or 3 strikers on the pitch at once formation that just didn't work, or even worse that horribly deep centre mid role. He was completely wasted for long spells this year.

Yes 16-19 is less than 20, but it's very close to 20 for the reasons I've stated. It wouldn't take many goals to suddenly hit this arbitrary figure of 20.
 
Keeps It tidy said:
According to whoscored

He has 3 goals in 14 starts in midfield
4 goals in 13 starts as striker
4 goals in 4 starts as attacking midfielder
1 goal in 1 start at forward left.
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Strange how we stopped playing him as an attacking midfielder. 4 goals and 1 assist in 4 starts
 
Sandikan said:
You've implied that he was scoring big sums as a winger, when he wasn't. Only one season at Barcelona could you claim he was a winger, and even that would have been one of the front 3s. And It was at Barcelona.

If Rooney played 40 games up front in this current system of 1 striker, I struggle to see how anyone would think he wouldn't get 20 at least.

Most of this season, he's been playing in 2 or 3 strikers on the pitch at once formation that just didn't work, or even worse that horribly deep centre mid role. He was completely wasted for long spells this year.

Yes 16-19 is less than 20, but it's very close to 20 for the reasons I've stated. It wouldn't take many goals to suddenly hit this arbitrary figure of 20.
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So, if you're going to count 16-19 for Rooney, then on your post on page 1, you should have said

"Would deffo have got 20+16-19"

This wasn't some arbitrary figure I cooked up...this was what you put forward.

If he played as a striker, something he's done in 97% of his games as a pro footballer, I don't think he'd get 20+ goals (over the course of the season). He's not the same forward he was in 2010, or in 2012. I mean, RvP has had 4 20+ goal seasons, which is remarkable considering the amount of time he spent on the treatment table. Rooney, being 2 years his junior, has played almost 100 games more and has 37 more goals. If you want to talk about injuries disrupting players, you'd be better off starting your discussion with RvP.

Now, Rooney is still a good player, but we shouldn't be relying on him next season. Especially, if we're looking for a good goal return.
 
Uzz said:
So, if you're going to count 16-19 for Rooney, then on your post on page 1, you should have said

"Would deffo have got 20+16-19"

This wasn't some arbitrary figure I cooked up...this was what you put forward.

If he played as a striker, something he's done in 97% of his games as a pro footballer, I don't think he'd get 20+ goals (over the course of the season). He's not the same forward he was in 2010, or in 2012. I mean, RvP has had 4 20+ goal seasons, which is remarkable considering the amount of time he spent on the treatment table. Rooney, being 2 years his junior, has played almost 100 games more and has 37 more goals. If you want to talk about injuries disrupting players, you'd be better off starting your discussion with RvP.

Now, Rooney is still a good player, but we shouldn't be relying on him next season. Especially, if we're looking for a good goal return.
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The problem is, he's captain, and if we did buy another striker, he'd have to play in an even less effective position.

Van Gaal almost stumbled across a good way to play Fellaini, Mata and Herrera together. I'm really intrigued how it'll all shape up next year.

Depay will start. Where will Di Maria fit in. If both start on either wing, where does Mata play?

Am glad I don't have to decide.
 
I don't want to get involved with debate about players from other clubs (Henry), I want to debate United and the need for a Striker (or two) we need
a Benzema, Lewandowski, Muller, maybe even Ronaldo, players that are almost nailed on to perform in the Prem & Champions League AND also another player that could/should do well, Benteke for example. As I see it RVP & Falcao are finished here, James Wilson is another season away from showing his true worth and would benifit from a year on loan, while Rooney simply does'nt perform as a lone striker. So depending on our formation next year (and I do believe LVG will experiment), we need a specialist No 9 and at least 2 players that can play as second striker but also have the abilty to play as a front two pairing. 2 New Strikers please !
 
Sandikan said:
The problem is, he's captain, and if we did buy another striker, he'd have to play in an even less effective position.

Van Gaal almost stumbled across a good way to play Fellaini, Mata and Herrera together. I'm really intrigued how it'll all shape up next year.

Depay will start. Where will Di Maria fit in. If both start on either wing, where does Mata play?

Am glad I don't have to decide.
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If we get a solid defensive midfielder in we could play 4-3-3 with an attacking midfielder sitting behind the front 3, another one of van Gaal's favourite systems.



LW Striker RW
CAM
CM CM
LB CB CB RB
GK
​
 
Lacazette would certainly be my choice, happy dropping off and creating or leading the line and running in behind, he'll dribble at defenders and score bags of goals. Total guess, but I reckon Van Gaal might move for Higuain.
 
I just hate how pundits and commentators say Rooney has carried us this season. Next season we should buy a new striker, take the captaincy of Rooney and give it to Herrera and then hopefully that relegates him to bench. RVP and Falcao hopefully leave.
 
GloryHunter07 said:
I think you are being a bit harsh on RVP. Granted he didnt do much today, but he is just coming back from a lengthy absence.
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He hasnt been good for the past 14-18 months. Or rather not good enough. Injuries are really bringing him down. He is only going to get worse from here on in. Great player and had a great 18 months when he first joined.
 
Hit It said:
I just hate how pundits and commentators say Rooney has carried us this season. Next season we should buy a new striker, take the captaincy of Rooney and give it to Herrera and then hopefully that relegates him to bench. RVP and Falcao hopefully leave.
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Well maybe he didnt carry us from time to time but he was effective when used as a lone striker. Its clearly his best position. LVG knows it.
 
RDCR07 said:
He hasnt been good for the past 14-18 months. Or rather not good enough. Injuries are really bringing him down. He is only going to get worse from here on in. Great player and had a great 18 months when he first joined.
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Uhm no. He hasn't been good for about 8 months. He has fantastic at the WC, less than a year ago. Under Moyes, the whole team was crap and couldn't be arsed.
 
We definitely need a new first choice striker.

Van Persie and Rooney obviously aren't good enough anymore. Van Persie can still put good performance from while to while and in top form he is ideal striker in our system IMO, but he definitely can't do that often enough, not even 1 in 2 from what he's been showing in last year. I would keep him as a second choice since he can still guarantee goals even when he is playing crap.

Rooney on the other hand has showed absolutely nothing as striker this season. Even his goalscoring record is poor this season, I believe he has scored as many goals when played in midfield this season as when played as striker. And as for his all around play, I think even Chicharito would be proud of some of his performances this season. I don't think he had one game where his all around game was excellent when he played as a striker. I still think he has goals in him(even though his record is very average this season), but he is so anti-van Gaal type of striker, at least with this system/style we are playing this season.

Ideally, we need someone like Benzema IMO, who can receive and keep the ball, bring others into play, and I would gladly take him for de Gea if de Gea doesn't want to stay, but of course that would depend on Benzema/Madrid. Of course, Benzema is just an example, but if Madrid are desperate about de Gea and de Gea wants to join them, why not?
 
Amar__ said:
We definitely need a new first choice striker.

Van Persie and Rooney obviously aren't good enough anymore. Van Persie can still put good performance from while to while and in top form he is ideal striker in our system IMO, but he definitely can't do that often enough, not even 1 in 2 from what he's been showing in last year. I would keep him as a second choice since he can still guarantee goals even when he is playing crap.

Rooney on the other hand has showed absolutely nothing as striker this season. Even his goalscoring record is poor this season, I believe he has scored as many goals when played in midfield this season as when played as striker. And as for his all around play, I think even Chicharito would be proud of some of his performances this season. I don't think he had one game where his all around game was excellent when he played as a striker. I still think he has goals in him(even though his record is very average this season), but he is so anti-van Gaal type of striker, at least with this system/style we are playing this season.

Ideally, we need someone like Benzema IMO, who can receive and keep the ball, bring others into play, and I would gladly take him for de Gea if de Gea doesn't want to stay, but of course that would depend on Benzema/Madrid. Of course, Benzema is just an example, but if Madrid are desperate about de Gea and de Gea wants to join them, why not?
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His scoring record is nothing special either, we need someone who can terrorise defences, like a peak van Persie or Falcao...
 
That striker will need more from the supporting players to create more for him. Passing sideways and just banging crosses in ain't going to help that.
 
Rooney was really awful today, and I'm one of his biggest fans. I do think its harsh to judge him on this game, though. That said, he hasn't really looked threatening since Spurs, unfortunately. I do think; however, that if he starts up top for us next season, with good service, he can hit 20 plus goals for us. I wouldn't be surpsied if we were to get a striker in the Summer, though. Falcao and Van Persie look like they're off, Rooney isn't getting younger and Wilson isn't ready. If we can get a good striker that can rotate with Rooney next season, with Wilson as back up, then I think we'll be ok. Question is, who can we get that will be happy being rotated?
 
shaggy said:
His scoring record is nothing special either, we need someone who can terrorise defences, like a peak van Persie or Falcao...
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I know, but I don't think he needs to score goal per game. If he can score one in two that would be more than good, especially with his other abilities. Roughly, he is scoring one in two over his entire career in all competitions, and around 100 assists in 400 games.
 
If we buy a new striker, what do we do with Rooney? I definitely do not see us selling/benching him and we all know that playing him in midfield is a non starter too!
 
Any slightly above average striker, with good service, can score 20+ goals over a season. Surely we need better than that.
 
matherto said:
We should go all out for Benzema to be honest.

He'd be perfect.
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I don't rate him that highly. I think Falcao and RVP should leave and then we need a quick young striker that can develop here to provide competition with Rooney.
 
itso 7 said:
If we buy a new striker, what do we do with Rooney? I definitely do not see us selling/benching him and we all know that playing him in midfield is a non starter too!
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I can see him on the bench next season but I doubt we'd sell him. As for this season, he's just not been good enough and shouldn't be a guaranteed starter next season
 
We could get the second coming of Pele and it wouldn't do any good with the style of play we have.

We seem to have only one purpose which is keeping the ball. This has meant that we barely put in a cross/pass to our forward players and has led to us scoring 3 goals in the last 6 games. That's bloody relegation club statistics..
 
itso 7 said:
If we buy a new striker, what do we do with Rooney? I definitely do not see us selling/benching him and we all know that playing him in midfield is a non starter too!
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Rooney would play instead of fellaini, we have to get a new striker this summer to inject some pace/skill/power. It's great news falcao won't be coming back and hopefully we find the right player to come in.
 
Isotope said:
Any slightly above average striker, with good service, can score 20+ goals over a season. Surely we need better than that.
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I definitely see us benching Rooney if he keeps this up, scoring 4 goals in 14 starts as a striker is unacceptable for a top 4 team let alone for a team that is aiming to win trophies. I think van Gaal will most definitely look at signing a top striker with Hernandez, Falcao gone and RVP looking likely to follow.
 
Roboc7 said:
Rooney would play instead of fellaini, we have to get a new striker this summer to inject some pace/skill/power. It's great news falcao won't be coming back and hopefully we find the right player to come in.
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If we do our summer business like ee are supposed to then Fellaini will be upgraded on by someone better and more fitting to the style Van Gaal wants to imprint on the squad, so Rooney won't be getting that spot. If by next season we are still seeing Rooney in midfield then it would mean that we have wasted money and time again in the summer.
 
I can actually seeing us go for Muller and I wouldn't be disappointed with that, he's an absolute work horse and Ive always liked him, he's not your glamorous
sweetheart striker but he's Clinical and effective and gets the job done. I don't know what his relation is like with Pep but I know him and LVG have a good amount of respect for each other, 4 years left on his contract though, Ouch
 
We need to sort out the service to the strikers first. There is a reason why every one of our strikers looked shite when playing this season, including Hernandez and Welbeck. The team is too interested in keeping possession instead of getting the ball in areas where they cam do some damage. Only player who looks remotely capable of creating chances is Young.
 
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