Barren
We are an awfully coached team
- Thread starter bond19821982
- Start date
Putting aside the Solskjaer issue, we may have appointed big name managers - but that's all they were at that point. big names, who were no longer big managers.
We still haven't gone down the road of appointing great managers.
That makes it worse!
Im not really having a go, i just think a lot of people criticising where we are now forget what their pre season predictions were.
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/would-you-sack-or-keep-ole-poll-reopened.450911/page-799
Thats not a match day thread and youre flat out saying we arent getting top 4 because so many teams are better than us. Its strange to go from that to we should be closer to City and doing well in Europe. Especially when we are sitting on 1 defeat in 19 games and City are only above us because of a record breaking win streak that has literally come out of nowhere.
All in all its progression. If the board fecks over Ole again saving a penny or Ole falls back after getting his targets them we should re-evaluate where we are as a club. I just think Ole has earned a bit of leeway as we stand
Correct.
[Insert Grammar Police Meme Here]
You’re going to want to check your last paragraph for punctuation before pointing fingers though.
Regarding the bolded part, there's a video or an animated gif somewhere showing how Pep players take up positions and make runs and feints to manipulate defenders' field of view to open up blind sides. I can't believe I never bookmarked it.
32 goals conceded in the league says we aren't being coached well at all
What about the 53 goals scored?
And defence is probably our quickest route to success considering the way we play. We have enough individuals to sneak games out.
Forget the name, just some definitive coaching will do. It's actually a credit to Ole because I believe he's got a damn good base to work with considering our fortunes post Fergie. This isn't some incomprehensible mess he is marshaling.
We've got some quality in attack, particularly Bruno Fernandes.
I don't think it is a problem with coaching, but more of player recruitment and selection. No one could account for the drop-off in form from Martial and DeGea. Lindelof has peaked and is never going to become a commanding playmaker. He is not especially good at anything. Maguire is decent but not more than that, which means that his mistakes are highlighted. DVdB looks like it was not money well spent.
It is fantastic that we have this focus on bringing our youth players through from the academy, but we can't be relying on 18/19 year old kids to turn us into world beaters.
It all screams lack of Director of Football to me.
It is fantastic that we have this focus on bringing our youth players through from the academy, but we can't be relying on 18/19 year old kids to turn us into world beaters.
It all screams lack of Director of Football to me.
We can definitely improve defensively but just highlighting goals conceded doesn't mean anything, Liverpool and Everton have conceded more and I don't think anyone believes their teams have bad coaches. I think problem lies more with on field leadership, I think maguire definitely deserves his place in team given our other options but he isn't the great on field leader and organiser we wanted
That is what you call wrecked.
These people can't be real. Emotions run wild..........just constant until they think we are winning Europe cups. Seems should a brutal way to support a team.
In before someone tells us we not winners or have that winning mentality
15 of them came in 2 games.
Its quite weird because I agreed initially with us being awfully coached. Last year especially there was nothing - no pattern of play, and no creativity. No understanding of how to create space in the final third and we looked dead in the water except on the counter attack as a result. There has, in my opinion, been a MASSIVE improvement in that area - much of it the result of Fred and McTominay working so well in the double pivot - when one of them runs from deep it makes the guy picking up Bruno give one of them space, and when you hug the touchlines on either side with our full backs (something Shaw and Wan Bassaka are excelling at recently - Telles signing lit a fire under Shaw's arse I think) that accounts for a lot of the improvement (along with Rashford developing into a really world class talent).
But....do we give credit to Solksjaer? Is this down to patience, working on shape and pattern of play on the training ground? I hope so. But when you look how awful we are defensively (and how mentally slow they seem to be at times - we're so vulnerable at times indicative of poor concentration/morale - just before half time, just before full time, and just after scoring) that I can't help feel we're still awfully coached. Yes - we need better personnel at CB (I can't help feel Lindelof and Bailly are our best pairing), but they're also pretty poorly coached I think.
But....do we give credit to Solksjaer? Is this down to patience, working on shape and pattern of play on the training ground? I hope so. But when you look how awful we are defensively (and how mentally slow they seem to be at times - we're so vulnerable at times indicative of poor concentration/morale - just before half time, just before full time, and just after scoring) that I can't help feel we're still awfully coached. Yes - we need better personnel at CB (I can't help feel Lindelof and Bailly are our best pairing), but they're also pretty poorly coached I think.
And 11 of the 32 conceded came in the first 3 games (34%).
We definitely need a defensive coach, I'm not sure who in this current set up is responsible for that. If not a full time one then just temporary pointers from someone like Rio or Neville could sort it out. We have definitely regressed in this regard compared to the previous season.
Been hoping for Ole to bring some hands to his technical staff but each new hire seems to be in the direction of forming an old boys club.
What is your point here?
14 of City's goals came in 3 games.
Teams that score a lot of goals have some games where they score more than others. If you were thinking about making a zinger, you missed the mark.
I can’t see anything wrong in that page. People moaning about our crap performance and complaining about us not getting a valid pen and Palace getting an invalid one. Fair enough.
One funny bit there though, where the last poster in the page says Werner will have more goals than our entire squad by Christmas. Aged well
I can’t see anything wrong in that page. People moaning about our crap performance and complaining about us not getting a valid pen and Palace getting an invalid one. Fair enough.
One funny bit there though, where the last poster in the page says Werner will have more goals than our entire squad by Christmas. Aged well
It's mad all it. Either Ole is doing a good job or we are a squad of world class players with brilliant defenders, as there is not a hope in hell he fluking over a year undefeated away from home in league and improved again on last season.
Apparently Potter would do the same job
Which particular coach do you want to join us?
Are people who are anti this thread debating that we are in fact a well coached team or are they just defending Ole the manager for the overall management job he has done since taking over?
We can’t be held accountable for content of match day threads. They are the on line equivalent of shouting at the TV during a match. There’s nobody here who hasn’t posted something ridiculous on the match day.
Am I supposed to host the recruitment drive?
I just assumed by your comment you had a good insight into who we should hire.
Nah I don't need to have anyone in mind. I'd need a six figure salary and all the resources available to the manager to consider it
My issue with this thread is that no one really knows whether our coaching is good or bad (myself included). It's just people saying stuff like 'patterns of play' when I'm pretty confident most could not give a decent explanation of what succesful 'pattern of play' any PL team was showing this weekend.
For me, the keep or sack Ole thread was the worst one. So many knee jerkers there who would either argue that Ole is the perfect man for the job who would win us loads of titles or that he’s nothing more than a Championship manager. Absolutely no in between to the point where when someone made a constructive post, it would be applauded as it was an exception.
It's mad all it. Either Ole is doing a good job or we are a squad of world class players with brilliant defenders, as there is not a hope in hell he fluking over a year undefeated away from home in league and improved again on last season.
Apparently Potter would do the same job
In my view, he’s doing a decent job at the moment as we are on course for 77 points, 11 more than last season. If we get something like that, come 2nd or 3rd and win a trophy, then I’d be glad for Ole to stay one more year to fight for a title and a new contract. Quality and style of football isn’t a concern for me, which I’m happy to say as it has been from Moyes to Mourinho’s years. We’re top scorers and play good stuff a lot
of the time.
Tbf though, I think you are doing Potter a disservice. If he had better strikers, Brighton would be 7th now based on XG. I’m actually one of those who think Potter could make the step up to a big club and while he wouldn’t outperform Ole as that would mean fighting neck and neck with City, he wouldn’t be doing a much worse job than Ole. Might even equal him. Brighton, with one of the lowest budgets in the league, have been excellent all season and really ought to have comprehensively beat us and Chelsea, and beat Pool with ease at Anfield. He needs better players, but that’s for the Brighton thread.
Pep and Klopp didn't magically make their defence amazing. They invested heavily in GKs and Defenders.
Considering a large portion of our conceeded goals come from errors too, I don't think coaching is our issue.
I think playing DDG is and having Lindelof and Maguire as a partnership, which unfortunately is forced on him at the moment.
Considering a large portion of our conceeded goals come from errors too, I don't think coaching is our issue.
I think playing DDG is and having Lindelof and Maguire as a partnership, which unfortunately is forced on him at the moment.
All the goals scored says we’re being coached really well
Sounds like really entertaining games those!! We must have smashed the opposition
Read it and find out
Tbh any armchair fan can assess the end product. That much doesn't need qualifications. Like you don't need coaching badges to know a guy like Pep has his teams playing different from the average team. What needs coaching badges is designing such a system. The patterns of play people struggle to explain imo just refers to synchronized passing and movements and how teams execute complex moves without breaking the rhythm of their attack E.g You know the give and go or the 1-2? The most basic play in all of sports. That's a singular pattern of play in its most basic form. Advanced coaching will exhibit itself in how teams blend all of the above but on a teamwide scale
Bloody ell, it’s crystal clear that certain teams are very drilled in their play, Leipzig, City, Liverpool, Leeds are obvious examples.
United are not drilled in the same way, at all, there’s no fecking debate there.
That said, Real Madrid won the CL 3 times in a row with a none drilled team, so absolutely the more individualistic approach can actually be more successful depending on the quality of those players. Brazil 1970 were sublime, even when you watch highlights today, they weren’t extensively drilled.
This should be a debate about those two contrasting approaches and their merits, not some bullshit denial thread.
I’d say the two best arguments are the following:
• SAF had an incredible team in 2009 which wasn’t heavily drilled, but Pep’s extensively drilled Barca side really did take us the cleaners and are lauded by many as the best side in history.
• Zidane’s individualistic Real Madrid won more CL’s in 3 years than Pep has managed in his entire career.
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Fair argument to make that Ruben Dias is the biggest factor of why Manchester City's defense has gone from poor at the start of the season, to rock solid. The players any team has available always matter. Do we have the right players at the club in every position?
We are scoring more than anyone. Obviously something is working right.
We're allowing goals at a very dissapointing rate. How many goals are down to bad setup, and how many are down to glaring personal mistakes?
The difference this season doesn't come from the losses, it comes from the several matches we've drawn. Points lost for various reasons. We need to identify those. Is it as simple as dropping De Gea? Henderson debuted by giving a goal to Sheffield away. Maybe we'd have won against Everton with Hendo in goal.
We have the same players in the backline as last season, but they are allowing far more goals. Why is that? The coaching team is the same. The players are the same. What's different?
I thought we were all shit at the start of the season due to no pre-season Tom?
I’ll ignore that your post has nothing at all to do with what I posted.
My post comments on your post. If you for some reason want to get all defensive and moderately hostile about it, that's on you.
Not being drilled to play a particular extreme style doesn't equal 'awfully coached' though.
Players are always the key. Liverpool's style is nowhere near as convincing now they have a few injuries. The quality of coaching hasn't changed.