Wayne Rooney | 2012-14 Performances

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Sparky_Hughes said:
And? So do I.......I just want it to be a lot sooner than you do :lol:

Captain....seriously? Get to feck.
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So basically you want him gone because you dislike him even though he's a hugely important player for us? Just curious about one thing, what is your opinion on Ronaldo right now? Do you hate him too for disrespecting Fergie and all the nonsense he pulled off in 2008?
finneh said:
Agreed.

I think Rooney is a top class player, but we also have other top class players in his position, so it wouldn't hurt as much if he left. Wilshere next to Cleverley (with Carrick for a few years as well) could provide the basis of our team for the next decade.

One great player for 5 years vs a great midfield for 10... Only one winner in my view.
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I think it's far easier to find a central midfielder than it would be to find someone to replace Rooney. And strikers of the quality of Rooney are extremely expensive now. And it wouldn't hurt much if Rooney left? He's had a season disrupted by injury and been played in multiple positions all season and he's still got some 13 odd goals and has the maximum assists for us this season. Who do we have at the club to replace that? RvP is 2 years older and won't be playing at this level forever, Hernandez is not someone who'll be a starter or have the influence that Rooney has and Welbeck has well 2 goals all season.
 
Shocking the amount of people that would actually be willing to lose Rooney...really shocking. Its like football manager talk ffs. 'Sell him for x amount and bring in 2 player' - who could we possibly bring in to replace a player of his quality? We've already been out-done in the transfer market for players. Why willingly sell a superstar to chance your arm bringing in another? If we go for Bale, Falcao etc.. how many other clubs do the same?
 
Gaeilge said:
Shocking the amount of people that would actually be willing to lose Rooney...really shocking. Its like football manager talk ffs. 'Sell him for x amount and bring in 2 player' - who could we possibly bring in to replace a player of his quality? We've already been out-done in the transfer market for players. Why willingly sell a superstar to chance your arm bringing in another? If we go for Bale, Falcao etc.. how many other clubs do the same?
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Exactly, it's pretty bizarre. And we'd be extremely unlikely to enter or win any bidding war for the likes of Cavani, Bale and Falcao anyway so selling Rooney to make some cash right now because he's "only" got 5 years of football or so left is pretty idiotic imo. Off all the top strikers in the world who are close to or at a better level than Rooney, we'd be unlikely to get any of them. We have a world class striker, one that any team would love to have and one that loves the club and is English and doesn't want to leave and so many would happily get rid? It's odd
 
wr8_utd said:
So basically you want him gone because you dislike him even though he's a hugely important player for us? Just curious about one thing, what is your opinion on Ronaldo right now? Do you hate him too for disrespecting Fergie and all the nonsense he pulled off in 2008?


I think it's far easier to find a central midfielder than it would be to find someone to replace Rooney. And strikers of the quality of Rooney are extremely expensive now. And it wouldn't hurt much if Rooney left? He's had a season disrupted by injury and been played in multiple positions all season and he's still got some 13 odd goals and has the maximum assists for us this season. Who do we have at the club to replace that? RvP is 2 years older and won't be playing at this level forever, Hernandez is not someone who'll be a starter or have the influence that Rooney has and Welbeck has well 2 goals all season.
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I refuse to discuss Rooney with you in particular because your oppinion is just as far out as mine, just in the opposite direction, he could break into your house on xmas day, piss on your kids, jizz in your wifes hair and you would say please sir may I have another so you and I will NEVER agree on this bloke.
 
Messi has had a couple of disappointing games recently. I wonder if the fans on the Barcelona forums are currently discussing selling him and bringing in a few inferior players to strengthen other positions. No? Just us then?

It's quite ridiculous really and whilst I'm aware Rooney isn't on Messi's level he is still our most important player (imo) and selling him to buy inferior players would be akin to what Wenger has done in selling RvP and bringing in Podolski and Giroud.
 
I'm genuinely curious as to what exactly is so spectacular about Rooney that we just couldn't stand to lose? He's not the greatest finisher, he's not the greatest passer or tackler, hasn't got the greatest technique or the fastest, so what? Is it because he's alright at all of them?

That's hardly unique.
 
Zen86 said:
I'm genuinely curious as to what exactly is so spectacular about Rooney that we just couldn't stand to lose? He's not the greatest finisher, he's not the greatest passer or tackler, hasn't got the greatest technique or the fastest, so what? Is it because he's alright at all of them?

That's hardly unique.
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Beacause he runs around a lot, Id be genuinely interested to know how many of Rooneys biggest supporters were also massive fans of Tevez........
 
Zen86 said:
I'm genuinely curious as to what exactly is so spectacular about Rooney that we just couldn't stand to lose? He's not the greatest finisher, he's not the greatest passer or tackler, hasn't got the greatest technique or the fastest, so what? Is it because he's alright at all of them?

That's hardly unique.
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One thing I would say is invaluable is his spirit on the pitch, I saw it last in players like Beckham/ Keane/ Neville. He is very much a 'Manchester United’ style player in the way that he is a fighter who doesn’t give up. I remember when I was younger and foolish and bothered to watch England, hoping they might play a decent game, but despite them letting me down on most occasions, one thing I always remember was Beckham running about doing his hardest, still putting in 100% effort, and it’s not just for the ‘donkey work’, that then had a knock on effect in terms of morale/ effort, you would see the team lifted because of this one individual, anyway, for me that is Rooneys quality that makes him invaluable.
 
LR7 said:
Messi has had a couple of disappointing games recently. I wonder if the fans on the Barcelona forums are currently discussing selling him and bringing in a few inferior players to strengthen other positions. No? Just us then?

It's quite ridiculous really and whilst I'm aware Rooney isn't on Messi's level he is still our most important player (imo) and selling him to buy inferior players would be akin to what Wenger has done in selling RvP and bringing in Podolski and Giroud.
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I am totally against selling Rooney and even for 50 -60 mil but Messi comparison to have a go at people is completely stupid.
 
Sparky_Hughes said:
Beacause he runs around a lot, Id be genuinely interested to know how many of Rooneys biggest supporters were also massive fans of Tevez........
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I loved Tevez. Still like him. Let me guess, you didn't think Tevez is anything great either?
 
wr8_utd said:
I loved Tevez. Still like him. Let me guess, you didn't think Tevez is anything great either?
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I think Tevez was and is a very good player, I think the adoration he got whilst here was completely over the top because of his high workrate which seems to mean more to british football fans in general than an end result sometimes. Teve contribution to us is a lot like Rooneys, underrated by some and ridiculously overrated by others.
 
Jaybezia said:
One thing I would say is invaluable is his spirit on the pitch, I saw it last in players like Beckham/ Keane/ Neville. He is very much a 'Manchester United’ style player in the way that he is a fighter who doesn’t give up. I remember when I was younger and foolish and bothered to watch England, hoping they might play a decent game, but despite them letting me down on most occasions, one thing I always remember was Beckham running about doing his hardest, still putting in 100% effort, and it’s not just for the ‘donkey work’, that then had a knock on effect in terms of morale/ effort, you would see the team lifted because of this one individual, anyway, for me that is Rooneys quality that makes him invaluable.
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Sorry, but being a hard worker doesn't explain why people rate him as one of the worlds best and invaluable to us.
 
Sparky_Hughes said:
Is it really, so answer the question then, what does he provide that cannt be replaced........
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Its about supporting the lad wearing the jersey. Its pretty obvious your opinion is down to a personal dislike.

Every player can be replaced, that goes without saying . A better question might be why would someone want to discuss this at the most important time of the season. His contribution to the side speaks for itself. Theres absolutely no reason to sell him.

This all feels v much a personal thing rather someone thinking rationally.
 
Decotron said:
Its about supporting the lad wearing the jersey. Its pretty obvious your opinion is down to a personal dislike.

Every player can be replaced, that goes without saying . A better question might be why would someone want to discuss this at the most important time of the season. His contribution to the side speaks for itself. Theres absolutely no reason to sell him.

This all feels v much a personal thing rather someone thinking rationally.
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For what its worth I dont advocate selling him despite my dislike for the spud faced biddy fidler. What I take issue with is all this "hes irreplacable" bollocks when he quite obviously isnt.
 
Sparky_Hughes said:
I refuse to discuss Rooney with you in particular because your oppinion is just as far out as mine, just in the opposite direction, he could break into your house on xmas day, piss on your kids, jizz in your wifes hair and you would say please sir may I have another so you and I will NEVER agree on this bloke.
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Given you admit your opinion is equally far out in the other direction, does it follow that if someone broke into your house on Christmas day, pissed on your kids and jizzed in your wife's hair, and then Rooney then ran in, twatted this bloke around the head, grabbed him by the hair and dragged him out the door, you would call the police accusing Rooney of trespassing?
 
Zen86 said:
I'm genuinely curious as to what exactly is so spectacular about Rooney that we just couldn't stand to lose? He's not the greatest finisher, he's not the greatest passer or tackler, hasn't got the greatest technique or the fastest, so what? Is it because he's alright at all of them?

That's hardly unique.
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He might be not the best on the team in a single skill, but it's his overall attribute set that makes him unique. He's a great finisher and passer, he is strong and fast, he has great vision and terrific workrate. His technical skills are good. He can play advanced and he can play deeper, and he has great defensive attributes for a forward. He has tons of experience and is a proven winner. He has also been scoring a lot goals consistly in the prem for a decade now despite often being employed deeper like this season or being shunted out wide.
 
Adebesi said:
Given you admit your opinion is equally far out in the other direction, does it follow that if someone broke into your house on Christmas day, pissed on your kids and jizzed in your wife's hair, and then Rooney then ran in, twatted this bloke around the head, grabbed him by the hair and dragged him out the door, you would call the police accusing Rooney of trespassing?
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No because I am able to recognise his good points and comment on them, unlike the Rooney can do no wrong brigade who get all premenstrual if you dare suggest he might have any flaws what so ever and isnt the greatest player alive today.
 
Zen86 said:
I'm genuinely curious as to what exactly is so spectacular about Rooney that we just couldn't stand to lose? He's not the greatest finisher, he's not the greatest passer or tackler, hasn't got the greatest technique or the fastest, so what? Is it because he's alright at all of them?

That's hardly unique.
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Rooney is one of just three players to score over 25 league goals more than once in the Premier League. The others were Shearer and Henry. Zamorano, Eto'o, Messi and Ronaldo are the only ones to do so in La Liga over the last two decades, Di Natale's the only one to manage it in Serie A and Gomez is the only player to manage it in the Bundesliga.

That's 8 players from 4 leagues over 20 years...and somehow you still come out with this crap. So even if he's "not the greatest finisher" he's clearly a brilliant goalscorer.
 
Sparky_Hughes said:
No because I am able to recognise his good points and comment on them, unlike the Rooney can do no wrong brigade who get all premenstrual if you dare suggest he might have any flaws what so ever and isnt the greatest player alive today.
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So in other words your opinion isnt far out at all, you have the balanced view and it is the majority who are wrong.
 
Adebesi said:
So in other words your opinion isnt far out at all, you have the balanced view and it is the majority who are wrong.
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No Im not balanced because I blow his bad points way out of proportion, but I AM able to recognise his good points.
 
Gaeilge said:
Shocking the amount of people that would actually be willing to lose Rooney...really shocking.
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It's not really shocking though is it. This is Redcafe, getting rid of our best player and one of the best ever to play for the club because he hurt our feelings three years ago isn't even close to the dumbest opinion offered this week.
 
Brwned said:
Rooney is one of just three players to score over 25 league goals more than once in the Premier League. The others were Shearer and Henry. Zamorano, Eto'o, Messi and Ronaldo are the only ones to do so in La Liga over the last two decades, Di Natale's the only one to manage it in Serie A and Gomez is the only player to manage it in the Bundesliga.

That's 8 players from 4 leagues over 20 years...and somehow you still come out with this crap. So even if he's "not the greatest finisher" he's clearly a brilliant goalscorer.
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I don't give a shit about the stats to be honest, Rooney isn't the goalscorer Shearer and Henry were.
 
Sparky_Hughes said:
No Im not balanced because I blow his bad points way out of proportion, but I AM able to recognise his good points.
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... like what he did with that saving your wife and kids from their horrific Christmas ordeal. I really think you should say thank you to him for that. A lot of footballers wouldnt have bothered. But that is the kind of guy Wayne is.
 
wr8_utd said:
I think it's far easier to find a central midfielder than it would be to find someone to replace Rooney. And strikers of the quality of Rooney are extremely expensive now. And it wouldn't hurt much if Rooney left? He's had a season disrupted by injury and been played in multiple positions all season and he's still got some 13 odd goals and has the maximum assists for us this season. Who do we have at the club to replace that? RvP is 2 years older and won't be playing at this level forever, Hernandez is not someone who'll be a starter or have the influence that Rooney has and Welbeck has well 2 goals all season.
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I'd suggest that our track record for the past 10 years suggests it is much more difficult finding a World Class central midfielder than centre forward (or number 10). I think it wouldn't hurt that much if he left because we have got other great players in his position. The likes of Kagawa operate in a similar position and despite having a poor season so far has shown glimpses of the player he could be. Likewise Hernandez/Welbeck and RVP could hardly be described as a poor forward line. However the operative thing is it would be stupid to get rid of him if it wasn't to accommodate the likes of Wilshere.

Obviously without Rooney we'd have a worse forward line, but for example 42 points out of 15 games with Rooney starting (2.8 per game), 28 out of 11 games with Rooney not starting (2.55 per game), isn't a terminal difference. I don't think many would say Rooney has been in our top 3 players this season, a season where we are doing better than ever before. Which is my point - our best ever season, with Rooney being probably our 4th or 5th best player illustrates that he is not as important as I think some people believe.

There aren't many realistic players I'd get rid of Rooney to accommodate, but Ronaldo (if you can call it realistic) and Wilshere would certainly be two.
 
Cold_Boy said:
I am totally against selling Rooney and even for 50 -60 mil but Messi comparison to have a go at people is completely stupid.
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Exaggerative I accept but the general point still stands!
 
Adebesi said:
... like what he did with that saving your wife and kids from their horrific Christmas ordeal. I really think you should say thank you to him for that. A lot of footballers wouldnt have bothered. But that is the kind of guy Wayne is.
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He only did it because the mother in law is round and he feels the need for wrinkly meat.
 
Sparky_Hughes said:
For what its worth I dont advocate selling him despite my dislike for the spud faced biddy fidler. What I take issue with is all this "hes irreplacable" bollocks when he quite obviously isnt.
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Name the player who could replace him then.


Zen86 said:
I don't give a shit about the stats to be honest, Rooney isn't the goalscorer Shearer and Henry were.
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And yet when played in their position he matched their goalscoring ratio at their best. But of course when judging goalscorers you don't care about silly little stats like, y'know, goals scored.
 
Chabon said:
Name the player who could replace him then.




And yet when played in their position he matched their goalscoring ratio at their best. But of course when judging goalscorers you don't care about silly little stats like, y'know, goals scored.
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As an attacking Mid, Our very own Kagawa when he gets a run of games, as a finisher, Hernandez is a far more natural poacher and would score plenty, if you are worried about us missing his distribution from deep, Wilshere.
 
Adebesi said:
I reckon we should keep our best players, and try and improve the side by adding new good ones where possible. But then I never claimed to be any kind of master tactician in these matters.
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thats the thing.....I agree with you, I ve not said sell him. I do think that time will come sooner rather than later though, I personally dont see him playing too far into his 30s at the very top level.
 
Good god, I know some people hate the ever-increasing prestige statistics have in the game, but I've genuinely never heard an anti-stats but try and dismiss goals scored. What next, refusing to accept that winning all the time is the mark of a great team...
 
Zen86 said:
He has been in previous seasons, in any case the statistics mean nothing.
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Then you can't lose can you. You're just going to stick to your guns whatever happens. If you can't see what Rooney does for the team then I really can't help you. All our oddest and most bizarre defeats and dropped points (Blackburn at home for example) have all come when Rooney has been out and we have lacked that spark of electricity.

But no, he's crap. Because you don't like facts that don't support your opinion.

Rooney is a game-changer. End of.
 
Sparky_Hughes said:
As an attacking Mid, Our very own Kagawa when he gets a run of games, as a finisher, Hernandez is a far more natural poacher and would score plenty, if you are worried about us missing his distribution from deep, Wilshere.
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Oh, I see, we're going to glue Hernandez and Kagawa together and play them as one player. An ingenious solution.
 
Zen86 said:
I don't give a shit about the stats to be honest
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Sort of sums up your entire argument though doesn't it? "I don't care if he's actually been in great form for us for the last 10 games because that one game against Swansea is all I can remember", "I don't care what the numbers say about Rooney as a goalscorer even though being a great goalscorer is all about the numbers"...it could all be summed up as "I don't like Rooney, I like complaining about him and that's all I have to say".

Adebesi said:
I reckon we should keep our best players, and try and improve the side by adding new good ones where possible. But then I never claimed to be any kind of master tactician in these matters.
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You've obviously never played FM then. Selling your star player and buying one proven player + one with potential and making a profit in the process is always a winner.
 
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