Why is it always Rooney, its never anyone else in that circus. Its never Gerrard, never Lampard, or Hart or whatever manager it is. Its always Rooney, Rooney, Rooney, Rooney. He's the one who has to step up. Its a team game, and sadly, the England team is a crappily run team with barely any system of play. It says something about him that he is the 2nd or 3rd top goalscorer for England during this dire period.
Wayne Rooney | 2012-14 Performances
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This is rooney thread, it will be about him. I would say the same in gerrard or lampard thread.
He scores the most by virtue of playing the most, not by virtue of playing the best
Well that is just some bullshit right there. So what if this is the Rooney thread, its true, he takes blame that should be assigned to other players. If you are so tired of defending, him why such a 360 degree turn all of a sudden into one of is biggest haters, spouting shite like scoring more because hhe plays the most. Admit it, he will go down as one of the best English strikers. He CLEARLY has the ability, just stop shooting your argument in the foot.
Ridiculous analysis? This is a united forum, he is united supposed fan favorite, when the majority here thinks studge deserves to start ahead of him, it should give you a good picture.
He's just not that good anymore, the way people have yo attribute injury, our of position, not fit, and all other excuses to justify him not delivering.
Rooney just cant do no wrong in ur eyes eh?
England best striker???
He's not even playing as a striker. Because a certain scouse lad is picked ahead of him.
Can you read, I said ONE OF THE BEST.
A certain Scouse lad who isn't scouse. Who also has not produced for England to the extent that Rooney has. Bear in mind, it was Rooney who set him up, not Sterling.
That's just foolish. As i've said you don't really understand tactics. Ronaldo is deployed in the same position and he does not cover for a full back. It's a job for holding players. In a sensible formations that is. Of course you can put Sterling in a goal and tell him to play like Buffon, somehow i don't think he will though.
Mourinho is apparently a fan and wanted him in Chelsea.
He is pretty much selfless, otherwise he would not create so many chances for teammates. And also he was England's leading runner, he run more than anybody else, including Sterling, Hendo and both full backs.
So you can't name three impressive goals scoring chances that Sterling created that day? Hardly unexpected. People who are on about "invisible play" mystical "contribution" can rarely back up their opinion with real facts. They generally think that clever dribbling in the middle of the park is more important than actually creating a goal with a great cross. Well everybody have their own tastes. I personally think that goals are more important.
England playe
Whatever, clearly you just cant accept that some of us are seeing thing as it is, that rooney is just not that good anymore
That's just foolish. As i've said you don't really understand tactics. Ronaldo is deployed in the same position and he does not cover for a full back. It's a job for holding players. In a sensible formations that is. Of course you can put Sterling in a goal and tell him to play like Buffon, somehow i don't think he will though.
Mourinho is apparently a fan and wanted him in Chelsea.
He is pretty much selfless, otherwise he would not create so many chances for teammates. And also he was England's leading runner, he run more than anybody else, including Sterling, Hendo and both full backs.
So you can't name three impressive goals scoring chances that Sterling created that day? Hardly unexpected. People who are on about "invisible play" mystical "contribution" can rarely back up their opinion with real facts. They generally think that clever dribbling in the middle of the park is more important than actually creating a goal with a great cross. Well everybody have their own tastes. I personally think that goals are more important.
Lol. You'd look back at this and realises what a daft thing it is. I'll just quote this one incase you feel the urge to delete this
You clearly can't see, that you haven't said anything that proves that. You are saying everything that all the haters say with nothing to back it up. You have pretty much took all credit that he has for the achievements he has done from him to justify your stance, it isn't debate. Its stupidity.
The person who is going to suffer most in the long run is Rooney himself. The media and fans took a young not too intelligent, not too god-looking teenager with immense potential and gave him the awesome responsibility of returning England to its days of glory.
He has been giving everything fame, fortune and a sense of entitlement.
Each step of the way he has failed to bring expected glory yet the media and fans persist. They make excuses after excuses when he does not deliver what they want most. He buys into all of this due to the fact that since he was child the media has controlled his life.
He is a rock star. a Beatle. He can do no wrong.
However, there will come a time , if he does not finally deliver the holy grail, said media and fans will turn against him.
Years after his career is finished he will feel people's resentment.
They will see him with all his wealth and question what he has done to deserve it.
Of course in the meantime another unlucky sod will take his place and the cycle will continue.
He has been giving everything fame, fortune and a sense of entitlement.
Each step of the way he has failed to bring expected glory yet the media and fans persist. They make excuses after excuses when he does not deliver what they want most. He buys into all of this due to the fact that since he was child the media has controlled his life.
He is a rock star. a Beatle. He can do no wrong.
However, there will come a time , if he does not finally deliver the holy grail, said media and fans will turn against him.
Years after his career is finished he will feel people's resentment.
They will see him with all his wealth and question what he has done to deserve it.
Of course in the meantime another unlucky sod will take his place and the cycle will continue.
And if Rooney would play like Milner England would have been just shite and lost 1-0 because Hendo and Gerrard did not do their jobs by covering DM zone during free kick. "Milner" would prevent Italy second goal, but he would not be a part of England's goal, as the whole goal hinged on the fact that Rooney was very advanced on the left, while Milner would be closer to a half-line. So Rooney's "poor" positioning made an England's goal possible.
No i just think you are being a pathetic joke of a WUM, that's all.
Jesus christ, go and have a lie down.
Let's not get out of line. I have never be on a wum. It's you who cant keep thing civil and argue on thw substances without thinking i hate rooney.
Oh, sorry, so
"You'd look back at this and realises what a daft thing it is. I'll just quote this one incase you feel the urge to delete this" (с) Sky1981
was actually a substantial argument about Rooney's play, not a pathetic wum attempt. Well, my bad! Surely looked like it though.
I think your argument is daft, just as you think mine is. There's no need to call me a pathetic wum. FYI I'm not the only one to think that Rooney is actually not that good anymore.
At least he's guilty of calling a spade a spade. That's for sure.
I really do think we are asking the wrong questions here.
As much as people here like to hate on him, we cannot deny that he takes a huge chunk of wages and also is one of the best footballers in United.
So getting rid of him really isn't much of an option. We're unlikely to find someone willing to pay the transfer fee, let alone his wages. We're also unlikely to find a suitable replacement of similar quality anytime soon.
Rooney used to be able and willing to pull a Milner after being shunted to the left because he had a high work rate. He did that very well for us during the Ronaldo era. He just doesn't like nor want that anymore. That probably played a role in his fallout with SAF towards the end. (Not to mention his constant contract wrangling.) It could also be that he is aging and so his work rate is declining as well. It happens and that is common.
So since we can't get rid of him, now comes the question of whether to continue playing him out of position? Or to play him in his favored position. If he is played out of position, then how do you motivate him to play well for the sake of the team? If we play him in his favored position, how do we fit him in the team? If we want to save ourselves a huge amount of pain over the next 1 year, those are the kinds of questions that we should be asking. Not whether or not Rooney is shit or great.
As much as people here like to hate on him, we cannot deny that he takes a huge chunk of wages and also is one of the best footballers in United.
So getting rid of him really isn't much of an option. We're unlikely to find someone willing to pay the transfer fee, let alone his wages. We're also unlikely to find a suitable replacement of similar quality anytime soon.
Rooney used to be able and willing to pull a Milner after being shunted to the left because he had a high work rate. He did that very well for us during the Ronaldo era. He just doesn't like nor want that anymore. That probably played a role in his fallout with SAF towards the end. (Not to mention his constant contract wrangling.) It could also be that he is aging and so his work rate is declining as well. It happens and that is common.
So since we can't get rid of him, now comes the question of whether to continue playing him out of position? Or to play him in his favored position. If he is played out of position, then how do you motivate him to play well for the sake of the team? If we play him in his favored position, how do we fit him in the team? If we want to save ourselves a huge amount of pain over the next 1 year, those are the kinds of questions that we should be asking. Not whether or not Rooney is shit or great.
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The difference being that i explained why exactly i think it's foolish to argue that a player should play wherever he is placed and mimic other players with a completely different skill set.
And as i've explained here England would not gain from Rooney playing like Milner. You need to re-watch the game, because England goal was only possible due to Rooney being stuck forward in a very advanced position, that allowed him to attack the space behind Italy's defense. Had Rooney played like Milner England would just lose 1-0.
If Ronaldo plays LM/RM and doesn't defend, then that team will have a weakness. It is down to the opposition whether that weakness is exploited or not. Ronaldo is not a team player, he is an individual player. His priority is himself. So if a manager wants him to have no defensive duties and just benefit from his attacking strengths, they will play some system where his defensive duties are limited.That's just foolish. As i've said you don't really understand tactics. Ronaldo is deployed in the same position and he does not cover for a full back. It's a job for holding players. In a sensible formations that is. Of course you can put Sterling in a goal and tell him to play like Buffon, somehow i don't think he will though.
Mourinho is apparently a fan and wanted him in Chelsea.
He is pretty much selfless, otherwise he would not create so many chances for teammates. And also he was England's leading runner, he run more than anybody else, including Sterling, Hendo and both full backs.
So you can't name three impressive goals scoring chances that Sterling created that day? Hardly unexpected. People who are on about "invisible play" mystical "contribution" can rarely back up their opinion with real facts. They generally think that clever dribbling in the middle of the park is more important than actually creating a goal with a great cross. Well everybody have their own tastes. I personally think that goals are more important.
In this specific game, England v Italy, Rooney didn't care what happened. He completely abandoned his defensive duties and the left flank was exposed over and over again. So in this specific game he was selfish. Maybe throughout his career a lot of people would agree he is a hardworking player, but this specific game, England v Italy at the World Cup, he didn't care.
Why? Doesn't care about WC? Doesn't care about England? Sulking because he was played out of position? There must be some reason.
It wasn't just Rooney either. They made the change at HT and Welbeck played LM. But Welbeck did exactly the same as Rooney. He just completely abandoned his defensive duties. Rather than run back and help Baines against Candreva and Darmian, he just pointed.
Do the England players care whether they win or lose? DEEP DOWN INSIDE do they care? A player who cares would bust a gut to get back and help Baines, because they would fear the attack could lead to a goal. A player who doesn't really care that much, would just pass the responsibility onto someone else.
As i've mentioned above Rooney run 11,223 m, England's average was 9,165 m.
10,587 - Gerrard
9,487 - Baines
10,326 - Johnson
8,688 - Sturridge (82 minutes, which translate to approx 10,277 had he played the full match and run in the same tempo as in 82 minutes)
So Rooney actually put in the best shift from England's players. The reason why he was not back as much could be actually purely tactical. Because our goal is a result of Rooney being left in attack. He was ready to go behind Italy defense quickly. If he tracked back like Milner, England simply would not create that goal.
Wow, that's some great numbers there. Thanks for the info!!
I didn't watch the game so I can't really comment. I was mostly referring to his public comments about his "best position", etc over the last few years. Hence why I said, "he just doesn't like nor want it anymore". The work rate comment was purely speculation as an alternative explanation, which you have clearly proven to be wrong. So thank you for correcting me.
Honestly, I'm not in the Rooney is shit camp. I still think Rooney is one of our best players. I don't see any point in people arguing Rooney is shit when he obviously is still one of our best players. I mean, he did score 17 goals and make 10 assists for us last season in the BPL alone.
The question we should be asking ourselves should be how to fit Rooney in the team. If we play LvG's favourite 4-3-3, Rooney might not like being shunted to the left again. I really do think 4-2-3-1 might be the best option with Mata, Rooney and Kagawa/Januzaj rotating behind RvP. That helps keep all our existing players happy and reduces the amount of rework needed to rebuild the team. But that's just my own speculation there.
And that is also a question England should be asking themselves. Where and how to fit Rooney. How to make better use of Rooney. Not whether or not Rooney is shit and should be dropped.
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See England's goal again
Notice Rooney's position in the start of the move. Had he played deep into midfield this move would not happen.
He also covered more distance than any other English player (number are above). Why is that?
Baines was not overplayed by Candreva and Darmian, no that's not true. He was simply beaten by Candreva one-on-one. He was piss poor that day actually.
I'll repeat it, Rooney had a below par game, every England player did. But his work rate was not compromised. It was never a problem. The problem was mostly tactics. You can't expect a quick breaks and forward tracking back like a midfielder. It just won't happen. Hodgson needed to balance a team better. For example play Hendo closer to the left, so he would cover both left DM are and held on the side. While also putting for example more defensive Milner on the right so that the team can shift and Gerrard could play in the center, not worrying about the right side. That's one option, there are many others.
Aye, Phil Neville got a lot of grief for his commentary but he made a very good point early on. Chiellini was never going to pose a threat on the left, so why stick Henderson on that side of midfield and expect Gerrard's aging legs to cope with Italy's threat down the right.
Rooney ran himself into the ground up and down that left wing in the first half, in horrendous conditions. Covered more ground than any other England player apparently. Not a very clever way to use such an important player
Rooney ran himself into the ground up and down that left wing in the first half, in horrendous conditions. Covered more ground than any other England player apparently. Not a very clever way to use such an important player
All players make demands on the manager. There's no disparity as he doesn't pay or pick himself. If the club or country don't think he's worth it, then don't pay it or don't play him, its that simple.
He's a footballer, not the PM of the country or Nelson Mandela. He gets paid to kick a football as a employee of the club. How he's developed? Has he score big goals in big games and significantly contributed to the success of the club? Yes. Just because he's not Messi or Ronaldo doesn't make his career a failure.
Similar stats can be found for Adam's time at Liverpool. These metres covered stats are bobbins.
His status is high because he's one of the best in the world. His ability gives him that status and thats what he's benefiting from. People can argue whether they rate him or not, but three of the biggest companies in their respective fields thinks he's worth it....Sony, Nike and Utd.
Do you think your judgement is better than those three?
I watch CR play yesterday, world best footballer struggle cause no matter how great a player you are, how much your being paid or how high the expectations are of you, you are still reliant on 10 other players. Despite the hooray of that England team, it might be an improvement but still doesn't make it any good.
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No they aren't. Especially when they're backing up his point. Find the stats though, intrigued none the less.
Owners look at success differently, especially the Americans. Its all about the bottom line. Rooney makes money. We look at trophies. They look at revenue.
Yes trophies bring fan support and thus money but Rooney is the most marketable player in the UK.
See England's goal again
Notice Rooney's position in the start of the move. Had he played deep into midfield this move would not happen.
He also covered more distance than any other English player (number are above). Why is that?
Baines was not overplayed by Candreva and Darmian, no that's not true. He was simply beaten by Candreva one-on-one. He was piss poor that day actually.
I'll repeat it, Rooney had a below par game, every England player did. But his work rate was not compromised. It was never a problem. The problem was mostly tactics. You can't expect a quick breaks and forward tracking back like a midfielder. It just won't happen. Hodgson needed to balance a team better. For example play Hendo closer to the left, so he would cover both left DM are and held on the side. While also putting for example more defensive Milner on the right so that the team can shift and Gerrard could play in the center, not worrying about the right side. That's one option, there are many others.
Interestingly, with Rooney at #10 that move wouldn't happen either, which is why it should be a case of playing either he or Sturridge at #9. Rooney picks that ball up where Sterling was before the clip begins, turns out to the right and plays it to Johnson. With that said, I don't mind the formation you have outlined. A true three in midfield with Henderson in his Liverpool role, possibly Barkley or unfortunately Wilshere on the other side of Gerrard and Sterling, Sturridge and Welbeck up top. I think there's a lot of balance there.
OptaLFC Opta LFC
6.81 - Charlie Adam has the highest average distance covered per game with 6.81 miles, ahead of Leiva Lucas with 6.78 miles. Work-Rate.
These are international companies that markets are worldwide. Rooney's probably more marketable aboard than in this country, where the general consensus is quite negative towards him especially cause he plays for the most hated club in the country.
Rooney internationally makes money without the benefits of his looks and personality, not playing for the CL winners or wearing the the most famous and recognized international jersey in football, he makes it cause he's one of the best players in the world for the last 10 years.
What is that?
It's a tweet.
It's not in a blank box.
Simply No.
The Prem is the biggest league in the world. Utd has a massive fan base as we are the most successful club. The prem is English. Rooney is England's best and most popular, therefore he is a cash cow.
Even his contract is based on said marketability
The only way distance stats can be misleading is when you have a player who keeps moving constantly but very rarely sprints. Which must be how Adams racks up big distances. Fellaini is the same. Rooney put in loads of sprints against Italy. No comparison really.
http://www.football365.com/news/21554/9351564/Neville-England-Chuffed-With-Rooney
Good job Gary. Rooney needs backing of the staff amidst this crazy hysteria.
Also, Carragher's point of playing Sterling on wing now that there is a backup fullback on wing and putting Rooney at no. 10 makes sense.
Good job Gary. Rooney needs backing of the staff amidst this crazy hysteria.
Also, Carragher's point of playing Sterling on wing now that there is a backup fullback on wing and putting Rooney at no. 10 makes sense.
Completely. In the wankfest over Sterling/hating on Rooney it's kind of got lost that Sterling did his best work when they swapped positions and he attacked Italy from wide areas.
Speaking of England scapegoats, has any English journalists picked up on how awful Gerrard was? Seems as though all the fussing about Rooney has ignored the worst English player on the pitch, by a margin. Gerrard has been getting it in the neck from all the best Irish journalists but seems to be getting a free ride across the pond.
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