It's a tough one, if we thought he was worth it at the time then it feels rather brash to make a u turn on that because he had 1 injury ridden season where he dropped to 'only' our 2nd most productive player (from first the previous season - scoring 34 goals)... It's up to the club to offer him whatever they currently think he's worth to us and if he accepts ok, if he doesn't then we sell.
Wayne Rooney | 2012-14 Performances
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Most people are falling over themselves to call him all kinds of shit and drive him out of the club at the first opportunity. I am in your camp - don't care. Still has more to offer would rather we keep him and he breaks Sir Bobby's record.
It's fecking weird.
If you take Sir Bobby's record out of the equation, would some of you still care as much? I am curious because it's used a lot as a reason why he should stay.
Is it?
He should stay if he wants to stay and if he remains fit, no other reason.
Breaking Sir Bobby's record might be his motivation to stay but I don't give a shite about that
If he stays or goes
. If he goes then good on him, if he stays I will back him and not moan. Of course reading some of the shite is frustrating.
There are two discussions on the go here. One on the player, one on his attitude.
His failure to reach potential, is overstated, but has some validity(depending on our own expectations).
I made my view early on. and nowt's changed.
He is the class of player we would like to sign, if we didn't already have him.
I never sang his name after his first hissy-fit, and a second one now, has more than convinced me, he should go.
Coming to this conclusion for footballing reasons would be harder to justify, and I'd be doing it as an excuse. The real reason would still be his attitude.
His failure to reach potential, is overstated, but has some validity(depending on our own expectations).
I made my view early on. and nowt's changed.
He is the class of player we would like to sign, if we didn't already have him.
I never sang his name after his first hissy-fit, and a second one now, has more than convinced me, he should go.
Coming to this conclusion for footballing reasons would be harder to justify, and I'd be doing it as an excuse. The real reason would still be his attitude.
This sums it up perfectly.
When I read the story all I was thinking was, 'this is Rooney's camp trying to find any little sliver to make him appear the victim." He's not. He asked for it. SAF wouldn't have said so otherwise.
And....I like Rooney even less now.
I'm starting to see it as a reason for him to leave tbh.
Slightly irrelevant to this discussion, but I have a vague recollection of a player telling the club he wanted to leave but refusing to submit a formal transfer request as it would mean he wouldn't get a payment that would be due to him as part of the transfer. Anyone remember who that was?
Is it? Or is it just me? I personally want him to break it and I want SAF and Bobby to watch as he does so.
I know I want to but I don't really get the feeling that others do. So maybe you've just seen me say it a few times and think it is common knowledge? It would be an amazing achievement and definitely well deserved.
Seems United accepts that Rooney did not hand in any transfer request. So Fergie lied, huh?
Not sure what to think of the mirror article!
Not sure what to think of the mirror article!
Why doesn't he come out and deny it if this is the case?
I don't understand why someone would take the time to address the changing of words in a Twitter bio and not address false accusations that can have quite big implications on how the fans view him. I don't get it.
I don't understand why someone would take the time to address the changing of words in a Twitter bio and not address false accusations that can have quite big implications on how the fans view him. I don't get it.
It has at no point been claimed by either Fergie or the club that he handed in a written/formal/official transfer request. The inference has always been that the player asked to leave verbally.
The Mirror article hardly reflects well on the journalistic trade, for if it was doing its duty by the readership it would make the above fact plain and call into question the angle being pursued against United.
Throughout this sage the Mirror have consistently served as a conduit for Rooney and Stretford to channel their version of events through the media.
Sir Alex didn't actually say that Wayne handed in a transfer request (see video from 1:15), and the club didn't state that either - there was a one-line statement: "Wayne Rooney is not for sale"...so it's a bit pointless Wayne's camp denying that he handed in a request when the implication is the same anyway; damage limitation like this won't work like a total denial might.
Surprising the journo didn't press that. "He's asked for a transfer" could be anything from an "I dunno what I want Gaf' maybe I want to leave" to "feck you SAF I am leaving you cnut.."
Just did a quick google: http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/football-fergie-urges-fans-back-moyes-173523621.html
Fergie confirms that Rooney has asked for a transfer and Rooney confirms that he has not hand in any request. As Nick Ldn points out, it may have been verbal vs written. But seeing the way the mirror article states that he is seeking an apology from United... I am beginning to doubt whether he even requested it verbally.
No sure which camp is playing the word games here.
Denying it is the same as calling Fergie a liar and I don't think any player even considers doing it, esp as Fergie was still the manager at that time. It'd be a career ender at OT and the beginning of a blood feud! Think Roo does not want either :-)
Don't care if he did or didn't. If he wanted to put the issue to bed, he should have come out and said something straight after Fergie announced it.
Whatever the case, if he's going to continuously pull this kind of crap every few years, best player or not, I'd like to see the back of him. I'd take 30 million and buy someone who actually wants to pull on the jersey.
I hope he doesn't break any more records here. He isn't the sort of character that i'd like to see associated with the club, now or in the future.
Whatever the case, if he's going to continuously pull this kind of crap every few years, best player or not, I'd like to see the back of him. I'd take 30 million and buy someone who actually wants to pull on the jersey.
I hope he doesn't break any more records here. He isn't the sort of character that i'd like to see associated with the club, now or in the future.
Hate to say it, but the look on SAF's face when he was pressed on the matter, well it looks like he wasn't being 100% truthful. Like maybe there was a heated discussion and Wayne's said something along the lines of ''Well if you're not picking me for the big matches, why don't you just sell me'' or something to that effect and SAF has ued a bit of creative licence in that interview. Up til now there has definitely been no confirmed transfer request and that's 100% fact. Which makes me wonder about the title of the thread...
Why? Does this have some sort of personal grate on you that he physically has to play to your wishes and tell you everything that is going on? Seems like you care a little bit..?
I hope he does. Just for your sake.
As far as a stone cold comment goes then SAF actually did say that. To whatever context I guess it can be interpreted in a different light.
Not sure about all that hate! So non-denial is more damaging that the actual false statement? It is now becoming clear that he has not pulled "this kind of crap" as you readily accuse. Considering the recent articles, did it actually occur that Roo's being made a scapegoat claims may actually be true?
What a ridiculous thing to say. Of course I care about the players who play for the club. Isn't that what being a supporter is about? I also don't think i'm the only one who thinks he could have handled the situation a lot better.
This is really getting into semantics, but the words SAF used "He's asked for a transfer" are important. A "transfer request" tends to mean an actual written document (as I understand it anyway), it's a distinct term that changes the ball-game when it comes to negotiations etc (a loyalty bonus could depend on it, see the Andy Carroll case IIRC), compared to saying "he's asked".
The point I am trying to get across is why stay silent, for so long, if what Fergie said was untrue?
Yeah, you care about the player and the club but you aren't vicariously dealing with this through the information that is in the media and being a supporter is probably showing support for the team/players through thick and thin. Always being able to be arbitrary on matters on the field and off it. The clubs list of players recently with off-field issues that genuinely effect the club itself is pretty short.
Of course the situation can be handled a lot better but I can guarantee you we've only seen about 5% of what is really going on right now. If he's keeping silent then he's doing so for the benefit of whatever he needs to do. It's a bit strange that he would have to personally come out and re-assure every fan around the world of his every move. I just find that somewhat strange.
There has probably been oodles of mishandled transfer requests and contract negotiations we've all never heard of.
Not wanting the guy to break some records at the club for reasons totally unrelated to his on-field pedigree is sinking to a bit of a petty low imo.
Had he so wished Rooney could have in 144 characters or less made it plain that he neither asked to leave nor has any intention of being anywhere other than at United next season.
Instead we've had one tweet about a Nike profile and very deliberate language from his camp so far a denials are concerned.
Maybe he did originally wish to leave however has since changed his mind, this does not necessarily restore the faith of the club in him or determine their response, which could either be to sell Rooney regardless or offer him reduced terms in the upcoming contract negotiations.Despite what wr8 might say in this thread i do believe that there is a financial case for Wayne to seek new horizons and the squad to evolve, time will tell no doubt.
Were he to stay he should IMO begin next season below the other three strikers in the pecking order [Kagawa too for that matter], a visible consequence of his actions and in any event he likely wont' be fit enough come Aug/Sept anyway.
Instead we've had one tweet about a Nike profile and very deliberate language from his camp so far a denials are concerned.
Maybe he did originally wish to leave however has since changed his mind, this does not necessarily restore the faith of the club in him or determine their response, which could either be to sell Rooney regardless or offer him reduced terms in the upcoming contract negotiations.Despite what wr8 might say in this thread i do believe that there is a financial case for Wayne to seek new horizons and the squad to evolve, time will tell no doubt.
Were he to stay he should IMO begin next season below the other three strikers in the pecking order [Kagawa too for that matter], a visible consequence of his actions and in any event he likely wont' be fit enough come Aug/Sept anyway.
The Rooney camp are very careful to get across to the media that he never handed in a official transfer request. When a story comes from the Rooney camp, about the alleged transfer request, it is always proceeded by the word 'official'. Official being the operative word. Thing is Fergie never stated that he requested a official transfer request. He is effectively denying something that Fergie has not claimed.
There is a big difference between requesting an official transfer which means players losing loyalty payments, and informally requesting a transfer like Suarez has done, but in the open. He can only be effectively be calling Fergie a liar,if Rooney denies himself or through the media that he informally wanted to leave the club.
If your boss says something untrue, I doubt you would correct him publicly and still expect to be in his good books!
Wayne would have been unhappy with dropped for RM match, his future role etc and may have sought some reassurances, but I think he still wants to continue and calling Fergie out publicly is not the best way to go about it.
So surely, whatever the club decide to do is ok with you then?
The story came out though a week or two before Fergie even gave the interview and the rumours were appearing throughout the season. We also had the obligatory few ITK shouts that he'd want out, and I definitely got the feeling way before the announcement that he might be gone.
Not to mention the Twitter bio thing, which was bizarre. He released a statement denying something as insignificant as his Twitter bio while several papers were printing that he had asked to leave.
For me, there's seemingly too much smoke for Fergie too have manufactured the situation himself. It doesn't make sense for Fergie to do it either, he'd just announced his retirement and it's one of the biggest changes the club will go through - the last thing the club and David Moyes need is question marks to be over arguably their best players head. On the other hand, it's a perfect time to rock the boat if you're looking a new contract.
Fair enough, the original statements felt a bit 'personal outrage' and I bit. Apologies.
Let me play the devil's advocate here...
The rumours started immediately after Roo was dropped for the Madrid match. He was the point man till then, suddenly finds himself upstaged by RvP and then dropped for the biggest game of the season...ofcourse it is a cause of concern and a hotpot for rumours!
If Fergie has decided to drop Roo off, what better excuse can he provide Moyes?
If you look at the latest articles about Roo asking for a apology for the untrue statements....and United hasn't yet commented on it. It looks like United who will be bcking off this confrontation.
But either way, think we will know better when United reacts!
Those of you believing Rooney here have a very low opinion of SAF.
You're saying he lied about this. Why? Spite? What would be Fergie's reasoning?
This is Rooney's camp trying to save him after he's thrown a fit and now regrets it.
You're saying he lied about this. Why? Spite? What would be Fergie's reasoning?
This is Rooney's camp trying to save him after he's thrown a fit and now regrets it.
If Rooney's gonna stay, then he should be punished somehow. If anything, his salary should go down! A 30-40% cut ought to do the trick. He doesn't deserve those high wages anyways. First of all, he's not that good. Secondly, he's been acting like a c-nt. He wants a fresh start? Hah! We'll give him a fresh start, in the sense that he has to build up his reputation from scratch again.
He'll have to move heaven and earth and single-handedly win us tons of trophies now, in order to ever become a United legend in my book.
He'll have to move heaven and earth and single-handedly win us tons of trophies now, in order to ever become a United legend in my book.
Not sure if serious.
Every time you have a bad day in work or a disagreement with your boss you get a pay cut, I like your style but you would struggle to get away with that in Victorian times.
So we're seriously considering taking Rooney's word over Fergie's then? Is that what I'm reading? Please tell me that's not the case.
Let's say you have a very important position for a big company. Your work is crucial to the company, and your resignation would be a disaster. Then, one day, you say that you're not satisfied with your position, even though you're already very high payed and the "star" of the company. Everyone loves you, and there is no reason for you to leave. The company is also doing well, so it's not like you're escaping from a sinking ship. Nevertheless, you start flirting with the company's main rivals. Your coworkers are shocked and your bosses are pissed off. But most of all: people are concerned. They shouldn't have a reason for this, but they all start begging for you to stay. They let their pride and dignity take a massive blow, but it's worth it. It's worth it, because the company needs you. You then "gracefully" agree to stay, after getting a massive pay raise, cementing your position as "God" even further.
2 years later you hold a speech in front of all your coworkers and say the following: "I don't know what I was thinking 2 years ago. I was acting like a fool. I now realize that this is the only place in the world for me, and hopefully I will be able to retire here. I love this company." The coworkers nod approvingly, a bit shocked that you chose to take this up now, when we've gotten past the shock a long time ago. But we consider these statements graceful, and are happy that you acknowledged your stupidity.
8 months later you refuse to come to show up for an important meeting. You're virtually never gone from important meetings, so people get a bad feeling about this. Then the big boss say the following words: "He has asked for permission to quit". The situation is totally different now. First of all, several coworkers have made the step up, becoming even more of an asset to the company than you. New workers have also entered the company, some of whom are better than you, others just waiting for a chance to surpass you.
You've taken a shit at your company 3 times in 3 years, in one of the worst manners possible. You've treated us like your bitch. There's this Argentinian c-nt in the rival company who took a really long vacation without even applying for it. You're almost as cnutish as him. Now, despite this, you expect us to not do anything about your situation? You expect to not only stay, as if nothing as happened, but when it's time to sign a new contract, you want us to give you a raise?
No, just no... In the real world, you would have been fired at this stage. It's a matter of integrity. For me, it's a no-brainer. To let you stay now, without even receiving a slap on the wrist, is just absurd. If I was working for that company, I'd have no more respect left for my bosses. If I was working for a rival company, I'd laugh my ass off and think your company is weak.
So yeah, I think a pay cut is perfectly justified now. Call me old-fashioned or ruthless. I'm a social-democrat who believes in second chances and is willing to make compromises, but this situation is just too much for me.
Get real man, we all know you love Kagawa and we all know that Rooney, in a way, prevents him from playing in his best position. How do you measure if this or that player deserve those wages anyway ? The only way Rooney would accept a pay cut would be if he was on his late 30s and wanted to absolutely stay at the club.
It's about we stop comparing what would happen in our daily jobs if we were to behave like some of the most arrogant and cnut players because it's pointless. Pro footballers in the top leagues live in a very much different world than most of us.
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