You don't know for a fact whether or not TFM or Tunazebe are good enough to play in our first team.
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You don't know for a fact whether or not TFM or Tunazebe are good enough to play in our first team.
It is strange, especially when you consider that this guy has won league titles with Benfica.
He has also played for his country.
He is already doing very well for his age.
The moment he put on our shirt (even in the friendlies) as you stated, he plays like an 18 year old.
The whole thing makes no sense.
Portuguese league is terrible. Actually more players signed from the Portuguese league in recent years have turned out to be flops than successes. International football is the same. Scouting is an art not science. It's hard to interpolate how a player performs against a weaker opponent and gauge how he will do against a better one. The function is extremely non linear. A striker that can score 25 goals a season in a weak league may struggle to get even 5 against stronger defences.
That said we should stop signing players from Portugal. Just isn't worth the risk these days
I agree.
Maybe he's a Liverpool fan
On a serious note though, I just don't think he's anywhere near ready for the league. Possible Bebe Mk. II
Unnecessary signing. Potentially a waste of time.
Give me Axel. Or at least Blind.
Give me Axel. Or at least Blind.
Not of the standard required, you can say give him time all you want but the likes of Evra (pace/athleticism), Vidic (strength/aerial ability), Pallister (knew the league, strength, aerial ability) had something going for them. This guy looks small, slow, poor in the air, poor at reading the game and uncomfortable on the ball and at passing.
Lovren copied Lindelof just now
Lindelof defenders are worse at defending Lindelof than Lindelof is at defending.
If you think he's got qualities that mean he will succeed at United then fine, talk about those qualities. Just saying 'Player X was not great at first either' is such a weak argument. You might as well go into the Matic and Lukaku threads and predict they will flop because 'Di Maria had a good start to his United career'. It's illogical bunk.
If you think he's got qualities that mean he will succeed at United then fine, talk about those qualities. Just saying 'Player X was not great at first either' is such a weak argument. You might as well go into the Matic and Lukaku threads and predict they will flop because 'Di Maria had a good start to his United career'. It's illogical bunk.
Honestly would cut the losses and sell him in Jan. No idea why Tuanzebe has not been given a chance. Another young player we will most likely end up losing
Actually, I'm a little shocked at the level of impatience that seems to be happening with this kid.
He isn't even that young. He's 23 not 19. He has been dodgy since preseason with very little progress save against his old team (who were extremely poor). He doesn't have a strong body of work that can justify patience like miki had with his amazing performances and numbers for dortmund. He doesn't even have most of the attributes one would want from a centre back. Has no pace, no strength, no great vertical jump, no reading of the game, no tackling ability, 1 v 1 marking ability, just nothing. He doesn't even have the long passing ability of rio or hummels so he isn't even that good on the ball.
Mitten is right.
I think his head is the problem. It seems like mentally he wasn't prepared for such a big challenge and such a big jump in his career.
The only thing I'd agree with you about is his age. New life, new league, new languages, new coach. Absolutely nobody is defending his performance yesterday. I just think the coach and the scouts would most definitely disagree with your scouting report and give the guy some time and another chance.
So I'll wait some more as well.
I want him to succeed, but anyone who watched him in EURO2016 wouldn't surely have paid that money for him, as he does not look like a defensive talent, no matter how much you watch him.
Shamelessly quoting myself from his transfer topic and December 2016.
"Pointless signing if it were to happen. From what I've seen from him, he doesn't have any ability to make him good enough. I honestly think we already have five better CBs. I actually hope we don't sign any new CBs right now."
Shamelessly quoting myself from his transfer topic and December 2016.
"Pointless signing if it were to happen. From what I've seen from him, he doesn't have any ability to make him good enough. I honestly think we already have five better CBs. I actually hope we don't sign any new CBs right now."
I must repeat what i wrote when we bought him. I trust jose in transfer market but this transfer is something that i just can't understand. Just can't.
We had 4 central defenders, 2 young central defenders and one who can play that and who played it well( blind). So the logic for me was either you splash money which you have and go for world class defender like bonucci or van dijk or boateng , who will go straight in first 11 and form strong partnership with bailly or buy short term fix in some cheap experienced defender and prepare tfm or tuanzebe for that role.
But no; we decided to splash 35 mil on a player who will be maybe man utd material. With him we didn't even get a good cover for this season. And he closed the door for axel and tfm. We have two talented defenders and we decided to throw money on another one. Who is not even that young. Classic example of throwing money away. No wonder why english clubs( except spurs) doesn't have own players in squad. Because they don't trust them. Buying young talented player for position where you don't have your own player is a good business but buying player for future in position where you have two(!!) players is the most stupid thing that you can do. And we do it.
We had 4 central defenders, 2 young central defenders and one who can play that and who played it well( blind). So the logic for me was either you splash money which you have and go for world class defender like bonucci or van dijk or boateng , who will go straight in first 11 and form strong partnership with bailly or buy short term fix in some cheap experienced defender and prepare tfm or tuanzebe for that role.
But no; we decided to splash 35 mil on a player who will be maybe man utd material. With him we didn't even get a good cover for this season. And he closed the door for axel and tfm. We have two talented defenders and we decided to throw money on another one. Who is not even that young. Classic example of throwing money away. No wonder why english clubs( except spurs) doesn't have own players in squad. Because they don't trust them. Buying young talented player for position where you don't have your own player is a good business but buying player for future in position where you have two(!!) players is the most stupid thing that you can do. And we do it.
Clowns like this guy is why the likes of Tuanzebe don't progress.
I've seen enough. He's shite.
I've seen enough. He's shite.
How long are we supposed to put up with him being shite then? We paid £30m for a work in progress defender, not having it. I don’t want him anywhere near the first team squad in any competition, frankly.
Aye he is pretty s(it to be fair
This is just hilarious. Why are our fans like this now? We used to take the piss out of this level of hysterical whinging, moaning and impatience. He’s 22/23 years old, and he’s had a couple of good games for us. Yes, he made some bad mistakes yesterday, but the reactions on here are embarrassing. You’d think we’re doing as badly as 13/14.
£30m is feck all for a player now, let alone a promising young centre back.
Actually if I was tuanzebe or tfm i would be gaining confidence on the inside because anything lindelof can do they can too and probably better so they probably will get a chance.
If you want to win titles you can't afford to field deadwood. Victor cost us 3 points yesterday. In his few appearances he has directly cost us 3 or 4 goals. We don't need to nurture babies especially ones who aren't the least bit special like lindelof, we can afford to buy players who are ready from the get go.
My biggest worry. The few times Tuanzebe played he looked ready for the first team squad. He isn't even getting a look in. We really need Mourinho to trust our youngsters more. Apart from Rashford he seems extremely reluctant to give young players a regular chance. Tuanzebe is going to br a class player and he looks better than Lindelof currently.
I'm positive that he'll come good. Let's give him time.
I agree.
The problem isn’t his ability, 99% of what’s going wrong starts inside his head.
Without confidence he will never make it in this club, that’s the simple truth. Hopefully his teammates and coaches will help him, the rest depends on support from the crowd and a little bit of luck.
Without confidence he will never make it in this club, that’s the simple truth. Hopefully his teammates and coaches will help him, the rest depends on support from the crowd and a little bit of luck.
Are you a new fan? One of these new generation, spoilt fans?
Some of our best players over the past 15 years started terribly. Just because he’s not hitting the ground running and setting the league on fire after a move to a completely different country, doesn’t mean we should get rid. Once Bailly is back he’ll start ahead of Lindelöf anyway.
Exactly this. It would be one thing if he was showing potential but making silly mistakes. He just doesn't look like he's a very talented player. He hasn't shown himself to be more than average at any aspect of defending. Most of the things he struggles with like pace and 1 v 1 defending are not things you would really expect much improvement on for a young player, never mind a 23 year old. I struggle to see how Tuanzebe could not perform at least as well and likely better if he was actually given the opportunity. He seems like he is at least equally good on the ball if not better, he is great defending 1 v 1, and extremely quick for a center back.
Lindelof s though start expected but once he gets into his groove in English football he will come good.
The lad must be backed to start against Swansea in the cup game again.
The lad must be backed to start against Swansea in the cup game again.
Just because Evra and Vidic came good doesn't mean every player will...
... is the argument of the typical red cafe geniuses that are better talent scouts than mourinho
Just trust the people to do their job and to cut their losses when they're wrong
... is the argument of the typical red cafe geniuses that are better talent scouts than mourinho
Just trust the people to do their job and to cut their losses when they're wrong
He looked really nervous in the pre-season games. Lindelof just needs to be eased in and that's what Mourinho has been trying to do with him. I want to see him get plenty of minutes in the cup games so I would like him to start on Tuesday and start the rest of these CL group games. Try not to play him in the league yet.
Perhaps we could try him in midfield, so as his slip ups don't turn into goals immediately.
You dont makejudegemtal decisions over 2 games or 2 months about a 22 year old potential because he made mistakes. Jeez. Players take time to adapt to english football.
I don't think people are saying he's going to succeed. They're saying it's fine to judge his performances as beyond awful thus far, but to not give up on him yet until there is more evidence that he is crap. He's been awful thus far. That doesn't mean I'm going to say he should get out of the club. I'm going to wait 3-4 more months personally. If he continues being bad well then you can't blame people for giving up on him. However, it's only been 2 months. Not enough time for me to make an overall judgement on a defender.
Young lad, bags of talent but just looks a bit overwhelmed at the moment. Give him time to settle in and find his feet. Remember Evra and Vidic were not at it right from the start at United either. John Stones needed time to settle at City and he seems to be doing the business now. Let's give this lad time.
Lovren copied Lindelof just now
Yeah, but he was even worse, and he's been in the league for quite some time. Liverpool's defense is shambolic.
Lovren copied Lindelof just now
He probably watched Lindelof on the telly last night and thought, "I gotta try that!"
Some cracking comments in this thread.
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