Venezuela – socialist paradise on the verge of collapse

Silva said:
it's really not, war is way worse than this
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So the alternative is to leave things as they are? I do not know much about the American left,(and their tweeter stars) but I do not think they are very empathetic with the Venezuelan people.
They are using Venezuela for internal political issues. If it were Obama sending food would they be moaning in Twitter?
 
carvajal said:
So the alternative is to leave things as they are? I do not know much about the American left,(and their tweeter stars) but I do not think they are very empathetic with the Venezuelan people.
They are using Venezuela for internal political issues. If it were Obama sending food would they be moaning in Twitter?
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Obama is roundly criticised by the American left for his foreign policy. He is responsible for turning Libya into a hellscape and he continued the decimation of the middle east in general. If he was instigating a coup in Venezuela he would be criticised for it by the left.
 
Silva said:
it's really not, war is way worse than this
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It's not as if the only two literal solutions are war or starvation. Even if I (again) don't have much faith in the US government's involvement being particularly beneficial. Change can also come from within.
 
Eboue said:
We're not defending Maduro, we're criticizing the neocons in the US. If Maduro needs to go, it should be handled internally and/or with UN involvement. The Trump administration and the CIA should play no part.
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I'm referring to the replies to Bernie's threat - where a fairly reasonable calling out of the Venezuelan government's need to provide its people with aid is somehow seen as him siding with Trump and co purely because he dares criticise Maduro. Beyond bizarre to say the least.
 
Cheesy said:
It's not as if the only two literal solutions are war or starvation. Even if I (again) don't have much faith in the US government's involvement being particularly beneficial. Change can also come from within.
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it's not about can/would/should at this point, american troops are providing support and entering the border of another country to instigate a violent coup and it's being led by two people who have recently committed war crimes in the region

there aren't even options, this is the prelude and it's happening in front of your eyes
 
Silva said:
Obama is roundly criticised by the American left for his foreign policy. He is responsible for turning Libya into a hellscape and he continued the decimation of the middle east in general. If he was instigating a coup in Venezuela he would be criticised for it by the left.
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the coups are made to legitimise governments, which really does not seem right in this case.
Not only for the fraudulent elections but for minor issues of the Venezuelan Constitution that are more debatable.
Dictators fall with coups, the rest is political stubbornness that only serves to improve a dictator's image.
 
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carvajal said:
the coups are made to legitimate governments, which really does not seem the case.
Not only for the fraudulent elections but for minor issues of the Venezuelan Constitution that are more debatable.
Dictators fall with coups, the rest is political stubbornness that leads to whiten a dictator
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somethings lost in translation here
 
Cheesy said:
I'm referring to the replies to Bernie's threat - where a fairly reasonable calling out of the Venezuelan government's need to provide its people with aid is somehow seen as him siding with Trump and co purely because he dares criticise Maduro. Beyond bizarre to say the least.
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Aid is provided, and Bernie knows this.
 
Silva said:
it's not about can/would/should at this point, american troops are providing support and entering the border of another country to instigate a violent coup and it's being led by two people who have recently committed war crimes in the region

there aren't even options, this is the prelude and it's happening in front of your eyes
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And again US influences aren't the only factors to be considered in this conflict. There are plenty within Venezuela clamouring for change - some of them no doubt with bad intentions of their own, but no doubt plenty of them being ordinary Venezuelans who don't want to starve to death. I am (again) extremely sceptical of any US involvement in this conflict but Venezuelans will nevertheless be willing to receive said aid if it leads to even a slight improvement in their quality of life. And again - this isn't a dichotomy between people starving and all-out war.
 
Cheesy said:
And again US influences aren't the only factors to be considered in this conflict. There are plenty within Venezuela clamouring for change - some of them no doubt with bad intentions of their own, but no doubt plenty of them being ordinary Venezuelans who don't want to starve to death. I am (again) extremely sceptical of any US involvement in this conflict but Venezuelans will nevertheless be willing to receive said aid if it leads to even a slight improvement in their quality of life. And again - this isn't a dichotomy between people starving and all-out war.
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now change Venezuela for any other where country America has sided with heroic local forces that love democracy and you might start to see why this is just utter bullshit
 
Silva said:
now change Venezuela for any other where country America has sided with heroic local forces that love democracy and you might start to see why this is just utter bullshit
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So you don't think there are plenty of starving Venezuelans who really want to see regime change that wouldn't mind if the US somewhat helped with that? Even though previous elections demonstrated Maduro was extremely unpopular and that people wanted rid of him?
 
Cheesy said:
So you don't think there are plenty of starving Venezuelans who really want to see regime change that wouldn't mind if the US somewhat helped with that? Even though previous elections demonstrated Maduro was extremely unpopular and that people wanted rid of him?
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no i love maduro and desperately want to lick his bumhole

jesus feck dude no i don't care what happens to him, i'm not gonna shed a tear if he has a heart attack and dies tomorrow but it's pretty obvious from not even decades of american history - just glancing at the news over the last 7-8 years that every time america backs local opposition with aid the country goes to war and the people go from starving to dead
 
Everyone - Donald Trump is a white supremacist racist

Also everyone - Maybe American can help all the staving poor brown people.
 
I forgot how awful that Qadhafi video was, made me feel sorry for the mad cnut.
 
carvajal said:
So the alternative is to leave things as they are? I do not know much about the American left,(and their tweeter stars) but I do not think they are very empathetic with the Venezuelan people.
They are using Venezuela for internal political issues. If it were Obama sending food would they be moaning in Twitter?
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As opposed to the American right, renowned for their empathy.

I wonder what their intentions are?
 
Just a question. If humanitarian aid is the sole purpose of USA, why don't give such aid to the red cross anonymously?
 
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Guaido is dispensible to the US. They were probably hoping he would be jailed or dead by now. They never thought this guarimbero frat boy would be able to rally people surely?
 
Blodssvik said:
Guaido is dispensible to the US. They were probably hoping he would be jailed or dead by now. They never thought this guarimbero frat boy would be able to rally people surely?
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Hilariously Maduro could have killed/jailed him at any point if he truly wanted to (as the media would have you believe he does).

He's actually played it well in just allowing him to do his thing. Even if the people of Venezuela want change they're not going to ally themselves with a US lackey.
 
Irish Jet said:
Hilariously Maduro could have killed/jailed him at any point if he truly wanted to (as the media would have you believe he does).

He's actually played it well in just allowing him to do his thing. Even if the people of Venezuela want change they're not going to ally themselves with a US lackey.
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Guaido's with the Americans in Columbia he's not getting shot any time soon. Political assassinations are also very rare there
 


Obvious from day one, but the big majority of newspapers and media, even governments, went with the fake story anyway. Time to ask for forgiveness.
 
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Bobcat said:
I honestly think the UN needs to intervene. Maduro wont step down voluntarily, there is no hope for a peaceful democratic takeover and a coup will just end in a bloodbath
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Problem is you'll have certain major powers on the UN who are determined against intervention.
 
Bobcat said:
I honestly think the UN needs to intervene. Maduro wont step down voluntarily, there is no hope for a peaceful democratic takeover and a coup will just end in a bloodbath
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In the end the military decides and if they change sides, the transition doesn't have to be bloody. The opposition is trying to encourage it by giving the military a way out (e.g. amnesty). It could happen tomorrow or not at all.




obviously thats just speculation and nobody knows.
 
PedroMendez said:
In the end the military decides and if they change sides, the transition doesn't have to be bloody. The opposition is trying to encourage it by giving the military a way out (e.g. amnesty). It could happen tomorrow or not at all.




obviously thats just speculation and nobody knows.
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I think we'll be waiting a long time if we expect the Venezuelan military to back someone like Guaido who is so unambiguously aligned to the US and their interests.
 
Silva said:
no i love maduro and desperately want to lick his bumhole

jesus feck dude no i don't care what happens to him, i'm not gonna shed a tear if he has a heart attack and dies tomorrow but it's pretty obvious from not even decades of american history - just glancing at the news over the last 7-8 years that every time america backs local opposition with aid the country goes to war and the people go from starving to dead
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It all starts with embargo's and guess who starts those and everyone follows.
 
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