Lets start then with first half and first 20 minutes where Mitoma could and should have 15 cards for diving. Nothing given.
VAR, Refs and Linesmen | General Discussion
- Thread starter Samid
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Sky have just showed the angle that clearly shows Dunk’s arms on Shaw’s shoulders, the angle that var didn’t show. Anyone with half a brain can conclude that being pulled down from your shoulders your arms are going to be pulled up. We’ve been done there.
When Martial was set up by Fred and shot straight at the keeper he was absolutely wiped out by Dunk, long after the ball was gone. Anywhere else on the pitch and that’s a freekick and a yellow card. Can someone explain why Nketiah earned a penalty for Arsenal against City when he was clattered after getting a shot off but this incident didn’t get a second look?
Marriner did what he did when he sent Casemiro off. He literally walked up to the screen and started taking backwards steps almost immediately to give the pen. I genuinely think he couldn't wait to give it.
So that’s a no, then?
They showed a brief shot of the VAR check and it looked like a still picture, not a video replay. If it was indeed a still picture of his arm up and hitting the ball then it looks like a penalty, but it removes all context from the incident.
Same as the doctored two second, one angle loop used to send Casemiro off for touching a players collar.
Original reaction was same. Watched replay and it’s not a penalty for me
I asked in the match thread. The ball went straight back to the shot location too, so the foul-rebound comes into play, similar to the Nketiah incident.
It's completely inconsistent refereeing. The precedents and ambiguity mean they can pick and choose how they want laws to apply. There's so much room for manoeuvre for the refs, especially on things that are fouls but are never typically given. They make a choice rather than having an obligation by the rules, and it feels for a while like we've been far down the negative tail of the decision distribution. It's easy to give a decision against United.
I'm in favour of the ref being king (preferably with better training) and accepting their flaws, but now we've got the worst of both worlds - shit refs and shit VAR ruining the game.
Was hoping things would look better when the likes off Moss, Atkinson and Dean retired.
The referees look even worse now. Absolutely appalling and it just gets more and more angering that they are never questioned or held accountable. They feel like a group of lads with their own agendas where they protect eachother.
As shite as domestic Swedish football is, referees do occasionally come out and explain their decisions after the game. Same in ice hockey.
The referees look even worse now. Absolutely appalling and it just gets more and more angering that they are never questioned or held accountable. They feel like a group of lads with their own agendas where they protect eachother.
As shite as domestic Swedish football is, referees do occasionally come out and explain their decisions after the game. Same in ice hockey.
Yeah, exactly. This specific decision wouldn’t have bothered me at all pre-VAR. But now we’ve been inflicted with VAR and other teams benefit in very similar scenarios, so…
It’s another incident to add to the long list of VAR having the exact opposite effect it was supposed to have. Refereeing decisions feel more, rather than less, unfair and inconsistent than they have in any previous season. Going back as long as I can remember. Absolute fecking shambles, the whole thing.
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Couldn't believe he wasn't at least sent to the monitor for that. As you say that's a foul and a yellow anywhere else on the pitch.
Yesterday was just a really poor refereeing performance, of course Brighton will be able to dominate and sustain pressure if they are allowed to foul all game and get away with it. No wonder Anthony lost it, because there were so many little decisions going against us last night. The Shaw 'foul' and yellow card just topped it all off, basically killing our chance of a last counter attack and meaning we could effectively only draw at best.
Not sure what his hand was doing there for the penalty, but we weren't even shown a proper angle and the ref looked at a still image for about a second before making his decision.
Fouls after shots are the most inconsistent decisions these days imo. Most of the times it doesn't even get mentioned in commentary, as if it's widely regarded as fair game to wipe out the striker as long as he got the shot off. As you say, anywhere else on the pitch, if it's a pass rather than a shot, then they give foul every time. It's as if the refs don't know what the official line is.
You never ever get fouls for getting clattered after getting a shot away. It's always been like this and shouldn't really be news/a surprise to anyone.
It's daft but that's just how it's always been.
It's daft but that's just how it's always been.
Unless your name is Saka.
But you always get a foul if you get wiped out right after passing the ball, which just further highlights the inconsistency.
Bournemouth denied a clear penalty after the check. Joke of a system.
It's how its always been is no defence for a bad refereeing decision.
It happens all the time, and it makes zero sense. It definitely needs to be rectified. Defenders should not have free reign to flatten a striker because he's managed to take a shot.
It happens all the time, and it makes zero sense. It definitely needs to be rectified. Defenders should not have free reign to flatten a striker because he's managed to take a shot.
Good question. I’ll take a stab at it.
Instinctively the Nketiah one feels like more of a penalty to me. I reckon there’s two related reasons for that. Firstly, Martial gets a clean uninterrupted shot away, whereas Nketiah can only got a sclaff away because he’s about to get wiped out. Secondly, the defender for the Martial incident slides alongside Martial and there is more of a natural coming together after the shot takes place. It’s not quite as obvious a foul as the Ederson one. For example I think it’s awarded a penalty if the defender steams through the back of him from behind. Especially as that would have been a clearer cut prevention of Martial getting onto the rebound.
Right or wrong it is simply the convention of how the game has been refereed for generations. It’s always been judged by the advantage gained from the challenge - if it hasn’t affected the outcome it tends not to get called. There is more latitude given to defenders and goalkeepers going to ground to desperately defend a goal than there is in midfield. There is also a slightly higher threshold for a foul in the box than outside where it is less consequential. And going back to the advantage point, usually in midfield when you are taken out in this manner you are prevented from getting on the return pass and can’t participate in an ongoing move. In comparison the shot in the box is almost always the end of the move so the wipeout is usually inconsequential. (Different with the Martial incident as he had a good chance of getting the rebound if he wasn’t challenged).
VAR bottled it again with the Lindelof hand ball. Clear penalty.
The more I see that the more I think it's not a pen. Hits his hand but his hand against his body. He moves his arm sort of to it but the part where it hits him is against his body.
100%. West Ham have been screwed.
The rules are all over the place when it comes to hand ball but in this case Lindelof has raised his arm and handled it. I reckon it's a clear cut pen.
I think the fact that the ball was going to hit his torso saved Lindelof there. Barely. Clearly he wouldn't have wanted to handle it there, and it was unfortunate that his reaction moved his arm into the ball, so they concluded it wasn't delibarate and his arm was tucked in. But if it was given, nobody could have complained. A very lucky escape.
I also think it was a pen
Im not convinced it was a clear penalty, it looks to me like he saw the ball coming and was trying to move his arm out of the way and had the arm not have been there it would have hit his chest anyway.
Don't think the Newcastle pen is a good overturn. It hits the hand I think, not the thigh, at worst it hits both but its not a deflection. Watched it a few times. No reason for VAR to get involved, not a clear error. Ref has seen it and should stay on the pitch.
Lindelhof, don't know what he's doing. He doesn't gain an advantage with his hand, ball is going slow and will hit him even if he didn't have an arm. Ref sees it, no need for VAR. Can also stay on the pitch.He's lucky as with how handball is enforced now ref doesn't give it.
Lindelhof, don't know what he's doing. He doesn't gain an advantage with his hand, ball is going slow and will hit him even if he didn't have an arm. Ref sees it, no need for VAR. Can also stay on the pitch.He's lucky as with how handball is enforced now ref doesn't give it.
Let's see the injury time after what looks like a long stoppage here.
It takes ridiculous long
Give over. It’s as blatant as it comes
If the ball is on the floor and there’s an equivalent challenge on Wan Bissaka , that’s a penalty. Yet no penalty when it’s on his head despite being more dangerous .
Lindelhof is one of the most baffling penalties to never be given. Every week I inch closer to full ref-conspiracy tinfoil hat territory.
Lindelof one wouldn’t have been overturned had it been given on the pitch. I wasn’t convinced it was a penalty, handball needs to be more clear cut for me.
Fecking hilarious seeing the meltdown from the ABU's screeching it wasn't given because it was United. Blatently ignoring Brighton getting one on Thurs night. 
Guaranteed to be more uproar over this than the media darlings one against Fulham
Guaranteed to be more uproar over this than the media darlings one against Fulham
It's also one of the most baffling pieces of defending I've ever seen.
My theory is that they never wanted VAR and have been sabotaging it from day one. It's the only possible explanation because there's no way so many referees can be this bad on such a regular basis at this level.
Tonight’s VAR, Stuart Attwell, was in the middle of our infamous game away to Spurs just a few weeks ago. He presided over arguably the worst officiating display in the modern era of Premier League football.
It was a clear cut, stone wall penalty tonight that he somehow missed as VAR. Huge question marks as to his integrity and fitness to officiate matches involving the top six.
Deeply concerning refereeing tonight from a neutral perspective.
It was a clear cut, stone wall penalty tonight that he somehow missed as VAR. Huge question marks as to his integrity and fitness to officiate matches involving the top six.
Deeply concerning refereeing tonight from a neutral perspective.
As much as I think we’ve been screwed over this season that Lindelof pen is 100%. The dopey Cnut moved his arm towards the ball.
You might be related to Alan Shearer then. The ball clearly hit his thigh, you can see both his quad moving and his short going up from the contact. Even without that, the trajectory of the ball alone tells you there must have been contact with a "hard" surface to go upward this fast.