US Presidential Election: Tuesday November 6th, 2012

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Grinner said:
Did you ever have any evidence for that though or was it just your opinion? From the stats I looked at, voting patterns were quite normal.
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Did you watch coverage of the last election? People weren't exactly shy about saying they have never voted before but because Obama was black they voted.

I don't have a problem with that; I would have actually voted for him for teh same reason because of the historical ramifications.
 
mjs020294 said:
Did you watch coverage of the last election? People weren't exactly shy about saying they have never voted before but because Obama was black they voted.

I don't have a problem with that; I would have actually voted for him for teh same reason because of the historical ramifications.
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How many people said that?
 
mjs020294 said:
I counted 1.737 million.
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I'd bet that more people were inspired by his rhetoric than his skin colour. It also helped that McCain/Palin was very unappealing.

You're basically repeating a right-wing talking point that Obama was only elected because he is black, which totally ignores the fact that he had plenty more that was appealing. His youth inspired young people, his charisma probably helped a great deal, his intelligence, his delivery, his ideas. When you factor in the huge disappointment with Bush it's not hard to see why he won like he did.
 
Did a little googling and it seems that roughly 15% of the votes cast for Obama in 2008 were from first time voters (about 15million votes) compared to 6.8% of McCains votes being from first time voters. And over all about 11.5% of all ballots cast in the 2008 election were from first time voters.

So it does seem like it will be important to Obama to get those voters out voting again, especially in the swing states.
 
Grinner said:
You're basically repeating a right-wing talking point that Obama was only elected because he is black,
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No I am not. I am expressing a concern that the new voters (which included a lot of minorities) that might have been motivated by change and historical reasons will not come out in similar numbers.
 
The youth vote was huge. No way they were voting for Crusty McCain. I don't buy that the young just went for a brother.
 
From The Sun, ha ha.

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Grinner said:
The youth vote was huge. No way they were voting for Crusty McCain. I don't buy that the young just went for a brother.
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Well even the demographic breakdown suggest that did actually occur to some degree.

That youth vote was motivated by hope and change, and not much has in the last four years. With only 1.1% separating the candidates now and Romney having a much higher voter enthusiasm this election will get mighty close without continued support for Obama.
 
even Rove is dismayed.

http://2012.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/07/karl-rove-romney-blew-it-in-london-video.php?ref=fpa
Karl Rove said Mitt Romney’s London Olympics gaffe is not “a big deal” in the grand scheme of things, but the veteran Republican strategist is nonetheless one more political observer scratching his head at Romney’s mistake.

The takeaway from Romney’s big blunder seems to be not his knock on London’s preparedness specifically, but that he managed to blow what was seemingly an un-blowable opportunity. Politicos ranging from Charles Krauthammer to Harry Reid have expressed utter amazement that Romney could have blown what was in the end, a glorified photo op.

“I would go there and I would say, ‘They have done a remarkably good job. I know how they have been hurt with the economy. But they have done this. I have done it myself. It’s so hard to do, and they have done a remarkably good job,’” Reid told the Huffington Post. “That’s what they should have done. He would have been cheered and not have the mayor, before 60,000 people, belittle one of our major party nominees.”

On Fox News Friday, Rove became the latest to share in the collective astonishment:

“You have to shake your head. Gov. Romney went to the London Olympics at invitation of the International Olympic Committee. It was a great opportunity for him to talk about his experiences, look, he stepped away from the leadership of Bain Capital for three years in order to step in and save the floundering Salt Lake City Winter Olympics in 2002. I bet there is lots of stories he could be talking about what a wonderful experience that was and how uplifting and inspiring it was. Instead he got stuck making a, somehow or another that the comments the Brits took as insult, and walked it back pretty quickly and walked it back adroitly but nonetheless the damage was done.
 
Sorry but I have not been following the Presidential race really at all. Can anyone give me a low down on this Romney fellow? All I think I know is that he is a Mormon and has been involved in the finance sector at a high level, sounds like a turbo charged cnut already.
 
Jimy_Hills_Chin said:
Sorry but I have not been following the Presidential race really at all. Can anyone give me a low down on this Romney fellow? All I think I know is that he is a Moron and has been involved in the finance sector at a high level, sounds like a turbo charged cnut already.
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You had a typo ;)
 
Red Dreams said:
your pulling stuff out of the arse is what is embarrassing...

that 99% poll you conducted with yourself above...is an example.

I take Romney at his word....unless you claim to know what he is thinking...

'unamerican' 'foreign'

'does not understand our anglo-saxon heritage'

race is the elephant in the room that even the media find uncomfortable to address.

' the blacks are all on welfare'

'the hispanics want to take your job'

while certainly all conservatives are not racist. The current republican party is racist...thus them feeling totally comfortable with using such derogatory terms.
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You seem to have a broad definition for racism, which apparently extends to any entity whose political views differ from yours.
 
West Virginia is an odd place. My wife is from there so I've visited and met her extended family. I'm not at all surprised with that video and unfortunately ignorance like that is rife. They are good people but just need a bit of educatin'...I'm sure if you sat down with those women and patiently explained to them why a vote for a republican would be a very bad idea then they might change their mind.

There are people like that on both sides. I'm sure some nutty christian righties won't vote for the Mormon.
 
Red Dreams said:
not at all.

The GOP is not going to come out and use the N word are they.

we all get code words.
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That's a very shallow analysis of the Republican Party. In truth, its the traditionalist/conservative movement within the GOP who seek to maintain the older, homogenous American identity that's the issue. Calling the GOP racist is just a lazy, copout for lack of substantive debating points. There are plenty of black Republicans who would chuckle at such a claim.
 
Raoul said:
That's a very shallow analysis of the Republican Party. In truth, its the traditionalist/conservative movement within the GOP who seek to maintain the older, homogenous American identity that's the issue. Calling the GOP racist is just a lazy, copout for lack of substantive debating points. There are plenty of black Republicans who would chuckle at such a claim.
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When you are the party of the southern strategy, it takes a long time to reinvent yourself.

Calling Obama a foreign, unamerican Muslim who 'doesn't understand what it means to be an American/ doesn't understand the american system' and has 'anti-colonial' sentiments and doesn't understand the 'anglo-saxon heritage of the country' might be suspicious.

Does that appeal to all Republicans? no, but it seems to be the go to line of attack from some republican politicians that are looking to throw some red meat to their base.
 
Raoul said:
That's a very shallow analysis of the Republican Party. In truth, its the traditionalist/conservative movement within the GOP who seek to maintain the older, homogenous American identity that's the issue. Calling the GOP racist is just a lazy, copout for lack of substantive debating points. There are plenty of black Republicans who would chuckle at such a claim.
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correct.

but even if not for all the race baiting they do, their trickle down economics nonsense is something I could never buy into. Its simply propaganda.
 
Grinner said:
West Virginia is an odd place. My wife is from there so I've visited and met her extended family. I'm not at all surprised with that video and unfortunately ignorance like that is rife. They are good people but just need a bit of educatin'...I'm sure if you sat down with those women and patiently explained to them why a vote for a republican would be a very bad idea then they might change their mind.

There are people like that on both sides. I'm sure some nutty christian righties won't vote for the Mormon.
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very true. misinformation and disinformation have taken their toll.

many vote against their own interest. Obama's 'race speech' really got to the heart of the issue.
 
Red Dreams said:
very true. misinformation and disinformation have taken their toll.

many vote against their own interest. Obama's 'race speech' really got to the heart of the issue.
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My MiL is one of those who wanted to vote for HRC but would have voted McCain when Obama won the primary. She gets those crazy chain emails and people at her church convinced her that he was a muslim. I managed to set her straight on a lot of it but never told her who to vote for.
 
Drainy said:
When you are the party of the southern strategy, it takes a long time to reinvent yourself.

Calling Obama a foreign, unamerican Muslim who 'doesn't understand what it means to be an American/ doesn't understand the american system' and has 'anti-colonial' sentiments and doesn't understand the 'anglo-saxon heritage of the country' might be suspicious.

Does that appeal to all Republicans? no, but it seems to be the go to line of attack from some republican politicians that are looking to throw some red meat to their base.
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Yeah the GOP has a lot of growing up to do, but there's no need to tar the entire party with the race card when it's a minority faction who are instigating it. Nearly every GOP member of Congress has no issue with Obama's background.
 
Grinner said:
My MiL is one of those who wanted to vote for HRC but would have voted McCain when Obama won the primary. She gets those crazy chain emails and people at her church convinced her that he was a muslim. I managed to set her straight on a lot of it but never told her who to vote for.
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the GOP prey's on fears of many of these people.

keep them from 'opening their eyes' and seeing what the GOP has done for the country.
 
Raoul said:
Yeah the GOP has a lot of growing up to do, but there's no need to tar the entire party with the race card when it's a minority faction who are instigating it. Nearly every GOP member of Congress has no issue with Obama's background.
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Like I said, many of them aren't afraid of exploiting those that do in order to get their vote. When McCain stood up to that bigoted woman during the campaign, it was a rare moment of class.
 
Raoul said:
Yeah the GOP has a lot of growing up to do, but there's no need to tar the entire party with the race card when it's a minority faction who are instigating it. Nearly every GOP member of Congress has no issue with Obama's background.
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if they want to be seen as a mainstream party, they need to distance themselves from such statements.

Certainly not support the Voter ID laws that disenfranchises minorities.

Whether they believe minorities are inferior or not is not the issue. The fact they are willing to do such things to pursue their goals makes it worse.
 
Grinner said:
Like I said, many of them aren't afraid of exploiting those that do in order to get their vote. When McCain stood up to that bigoted woman during the campaign, it was a rare moment of class.
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You heard about the recall effort against McCain at the moment? Some crazy teaparty people are apparently upset that he had a go at Bachman and Gohmert over their attacks on a muslim american woman whos an aide to Clinton.
 
Red Dreams said:
Cantor is staying classy though...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/27/eric-cantor-michele-bachman_n_1709341.html
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:lol: you'd hope he'd say that since shes on the intelligence committee (ironic, since she's severely lacking in that department)

Wasn't Cantor *allegedly* abused by a Republican Congressman for being Jewish? nah, there's not an intolerance problem amongst republicans problem, its also democrats who want freedom from your religions that are intolerant.
 
Raoul said:
That's a very shallow analysis of the Republican Party. In truth, its the traditionalist/conservative movement within the GOP who seek to maintain the older, homogenous American identity that's the issue. Calling the GOP racist is just a lazy, copout for lack of substantive debating points. There are plenty of black Republicans who would chuckle at such a claim.
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Calling the GOP racist is not lazy at all. It's a big part, but obviously not all encompassing. Look how many southern democrats went over to the Republicans after civil rights was passed. When the civilized world had morally had come to grips with the immorality of slavery, this fecking country had to have the bloodiest of bloody civil wars to get over it. When the troops need rallying, you'll get Willie Horton, you'll get illegal immigration, you'll get Reagan's phony welfare queen, you'll get gun talk to protect you from the thugs. I mean, what the feck with all this birtherism bullshit? Did you see how many fund raising dollars came in when South Carolinian sons of the confederates Joe Wilson stood up and called Obama a liar on national TV. You see all the racist intentions of the tea party. Anti-affirmative action love, disingenuously disguised. Voter repression jim crowish movements. Republican talking points are filled with coded minority speak. Ever notice how them Republicans love that confederate flag, or at least have no problem with it?

How can you say it's lazy to mention the racist part of the Republikan party. Like I said, it's not all encompassing, but it's a solid part. Not all repuplicans are racists, but you can be sure 99% of racists are republicans. How is this lazy to recognize this. More like lazy, disingenuous and dangerous not to.

Of course there are black republicans, and you can bet they love money more than anything, and have very little soul. There's anti zionist jews as well. And self loathing white people. Have you seen all these conservative anti gays freaks who turn out to be schlumping men in public bathrooms and picking up boys on the internet?

And go back and look at the conservative old school homogenous values many conservatives harken back to . . . they're racist and white as feck. Just go look at what was taken for granted in the 50s and 60s concerning "coloreds." Racism was a simple accepted fact back then.

¿¿¿Lazy???
 
Drainy said:
:lol: you'd hope he'd say that since shes on the intelligence committee (ironic, since she's severely lacking in that department)

Wasn't Cantor *allegedly* abused by a Republican Congressman for being Jewish? nah, there's not an intolerance problem amongst republicans problem, its also democrats who want freedom from your religions that are intolerant.
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yeah.. that religious freedom bollox has got me pissed with my church.

I normally give for the annual archdiocese requests. This time I did not...they called of course.

I told the caller I am unhappy with these political issues cropping up in the homilies.

waiting to be excommunicated :nervous:

Mind you I gave the money I would have to another prgram that works with very poor children all over the world.
 
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