If the latest reports are true about players refusing to press, Ronaldo threatening to leave because he is not a fan of RR etc, then this club is done. 877m worth of a club just needs to be blown up. I am sure the Glazers will refuse but if the players (the inmates) are running the asylum like this and this team is not worth supporting. This bunch of overpaid coach killers are not worth our support.
"Up to 11 players now want to leave United after becoming disillusioned with life at the club."
- Thread starter sullydnl
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Get in, we get to offload him while looking like the good guys. PR blessing just fell into our laps. No time for inflated personalities.
You’re taking this much better than me mate. I know we have gone through rough patches and all the last 8 years but for me this is just about as low as things can get for me. I have never been more angry and disheartened as a United supporter. With players openly dissing a manager whose sin is to ask them to work hard and press. I feel like can’t support them any longer. I don’t mind if we play kids or average players and finish crap this season as long as they are willing to die for the shirt. I know that’s unrealistic but really can’t accept this group of coach killers any longer.
Re Ronaldo, I originally thought he was a good signing but one must admit that after he came in our form started to dip. He may not be a problem but his presence for a number of reasons have upset the dynamic of the team. So agree with you that if he wants to leave he should. Better for all concerned.
Oh FFS!
That Ronaldo stuff is from the Daily Star. It's made up. Their MO is to piggyback off credible stories and come up with their own spin. Seen it lots of times before.
That may be true but I don’t think you can deny there is a problem with the players from an attitude, effort and application perspective. There clearly needs to be a clear out. Even if you think (fancifully) all of the reports are BS, you really think from a performance standpoint this mix of players is working?
Devil's advocate time - what if the players are right? For years they've been managed and coached by people who have never won a major trophy or top level experience. We sack Ole and can only manage to get an interim replacement. Two of our inexperienced coaches left and we decided to replace them with Fletcher and someone from New York Red Bulls. Some of them are being forced to stay and then never given a chance to play. It's no wonder they're fed up with the situation and resorted to going to the press. These leaks might be a good thing if they make those at the top realise they need to let the unhappy players go and break the bank to get a world class manager and coaches in.
I really don’t get it! What on earth they want more to go out and show motivation and play and work hard for the club? Lesser players with a lot lot lesser salaries play with lesser clubs but the show character and play like one. I really come to the point I don’t understand what is going on! Did Ole spoil them too much the past three years?
Imo this is probably true given how we dropped the pressing since the Palace match. And how out of breath Ronaldo was in the second half of that match. He could barely move by the last 15-20'.
A- Rangnick has only been here since late November. His coaches had joined the club in mid December. During that time we had a Covid crisis when Carrington had to be closed. So how on earth do these players know what they are all about?
B- The likes of Varane, DDG and Ronaldo might have been managed by the very best but most had not. The vast majority of our players were managed by 'geniuses' like Radford, Hodgson, Pioli, Favre and Rodgers. So its not as if their bar is set so high.
C- There is no excuse for players to down tools or to leak information that has nothing to do with them. If they are unhappy then they simply handle a transfer request. If the club refuse that transfer request then the player can publicly state that he wants out.
So from here we can say, another massive clear out and of course expecting some more signings which may lead to another 2-3 years before achieving any desired progress?
To be fair that would have been a mad mad mad thing to say. I think people need to let go of Donny, the bloke has failed here and people seem to not want to put any of that blame at his door and make it about everyone else. We've had players flop here in the last few years, but to this level? He's done astonishingly poor.
I see the original 11 players has now turned into 17 
And people are still lapping it up
And people are still lapping it up
Well, if the players refuse to press, then they should leave.
This is the current prevalent tactics nowaday which make Klopp, Pep etc coach to win that much match consistently.
Also, if the players played like that shit performance and don't try what the manager want because they don't like the tactics, then they should leave too. Take a big money and not to do their professional and lazy to run.
Comparing Moyes era, even the players refused the tactics from Moyes, but they were still executed the plan. Crossing crossing crossing crossing.....
Then if the board are in planning of next manager before RR hire, next manager will be the pressing style too.
I shall judge the players by their ability to pass to a team mate, to put an effort in on the pitch and to defend their goal
Our standards have dropped so low we are probably afraid to sell Lingard to West Ham in January just in case he helps them finish above us
When is RR's presser? Should be an interesting one
Players refusing to press? Not a fan of the formation? Don't like the manager? Do feck off at the next transfer window if true thanks. I understand how it happened but "player power" and the club being behind the times with the board really have screwed the club up massively.
For those of you slating Ronaldo and saying he’s the problem, watch this and tell me he’s not self aware enough to know when he’s not at his best.
So sabotage the season with sub-par performances and a complete lack of effort? What world class manager do they think will come in if we play ourselves into the lower half after leaking things to the press most of the season. It will rightly be seen as a nest of vipers. 37 days it took. Regardless of Ragnick's actual managerial abilities they should be able to perform better. He has enough about him to at least be considered competent, and since he's only here until May it's not like it's an unbarable situation for them. The bare minimum you should expect from them is to actually try to implement the man's ideas on the pitch, and they don't even try.
We have a recent history of utterly destroying manager careers. If you come here you will probably be destroyed by our players and struggle to rebuild your reputation. LVG spent 5 years in the wilderness before getting back with the Dutch NT, Moyes went from being one of the better "best of the rest" managers in the league to becoming a notoriously weak manager who only recently has rebuilt his reputation, we completely broke Mourinho, and Ole went from being hailed by international media to hung out to dry as totally incompetent in his final season. After he went out the door all the problems from the Mourinho era popped up again.
We are the definition of a poisoned chalice. In how we deal with player power, recruitment and the media we always end up coming across as in complete chaos and disarray, with the manager ultimately having to shoulder the blame. I don't know why anyone who has a choice would want to be our manager at this point. It's embarrassing.
Everything starts from the top. You could say professional footballers should be able to pass the ball regardless of what’s happening above them but we’ve seen time and time again that football doesn’t work that way.
We couldn’t manage to pass the ball forward a month into Moyes’ reign as well. All this talk about us currently lacking leaders and letting standards drop but if a team with the likes of RVP, Carrick, Rooney, Rio, Giggs, Evra etc. looked like they forgot how to play football, what chance do our current lot have?
That is a bit of a random post. Most people are criticising him for his poor play, not because they're under the impression that he doesn't know he's playing poorly. Harry McGuire is cognizant of the fact that he has been subpar. The infective he receives is because of poor he has been.
The worst player at any club can be fully aware he's playing poorly; that has nothing to do with criticism of his play.
The problem is
1) That many players leaving is going to take a big effort to fill, it's half your squad. We're not going to suddenly buy 13 players or promote 13 youth players.
2) Just because they're not playing it doesn't mean they're not good enough, if they're not playing because we have some undroppable players like McTominay and Maguire who aren't good enough it doesn't leave us in a good position to lose all those players AND be left with a bunch of players that themselves need replacing
I would take an axe to both groups, convince a few of the ones that want to leave to stay (Fred, Baily, VDB, Dalot) and ship out some of the star players who's treatment causes unrest.
We wouldn't be where we are without him. Yes he has been poor but so has everyone else. To his credit he gives everything. It's not that he stops trying.
I think one of the biggest problems is that players sign for us thinking that we are still a big club and we are still relevant. We are not, we are a joke of a club and a shadow of our former selves. We are a disjointed, disorganized, mismanaged top 6 team and have been for ages.
When people say the 'biggest club in the world' nonsense I always cringe yet this seems to be how we attract big name players still. A big fat cheque and our history. No wonder players feel like crap once they arrive and see the weight of the problems first hand. Then they realise that they are expected to change things with wonder goals and passes or if they make one mistake then the fans start hating on them rather than supporting them (because he cost X millions, he shouldn't make mistakes).
It's the type of player that we attract too, man, it has happened too many times that top/world class players have come to United on a fat wage and been bang average. Loads of people come to United to semi-retire, I swear. Mercenary United for sure.
The squad needs gutting and rebuilding, again. Hopefully this is where Ralf show his worth. Lets get it right this time and stop this.
When people say the 'biggest club in the world' nonsense I always cringe yet this seems to be how we attract big name players still. A big fat cheque and our history. No wonder players feel like crap once they arrive and see the weight of the problems first hand. Then they realise that they are expected to change things with wonder goals and passes or if they make one mistake then the fans start hating on them rather than supporting them (because he cost X millions, he shouldn't make mistakes).
It's the type of player that we attract too, man, it has happened too many times that top/world class players have come to United on a fat wage and been bang average. Loads of people come to United to semi-retire, I swear. Mercenary United for sure.
The squad needs gutting and rebuilding, again. Hopefully this is where Ralf show his worth. Lets get it right this time and stop this.
Our squad is too big so we wont need 13 new players. Promote 2 and buy 2.
I hope we do a major clear out next summer. An issue however, is that many of them might need to be replaced by youngsters that might or might not be ready. Expectations will need to be lowered still, like top 4 a major success. We know how the press and even many fans are, so the next manager will have an interesting situation on his hands.
You are probably into something, and it makes me sad.
Ronaldo has saved us many times this season and scored some fantastic goals. He still has fantastic and spectacular individual qualities.
At the same time Ronald’s arrival probably is one of the major underlaying causes to our problems this season. The harmony and cohesion within the squad suddenly disappeared.
Bruno, Rashford, Sancho and Greenwood’s response to Ronaldo reminds me how Martial responded when Cavani arrived.
Last season it seemed like the squad finally had managed to establish and consolidate a functional internal hierarchy, where most players had found their role. The squad was obviously not ready (consolidated and robust enough) to cope with the arrival of Ronaldo. Probably very few squads are.
I think the club had something very positive going on before Ronaldo arrived; the future looked bright. Today I’m not sure if it’s possible to repair things as long as Ronaldo stays.
That would not replace 13 players during covid
I'm not sure that the stats are available from that era but if memory serves, over 150 miscued passes in a match would have had blood vessels popping out all over Ferguson's moosh
i personally dont think so. I think its ridiculous to play a player for 5 minutes here and there and then suddenly give them a start in a game, usually a random rotated fixture with a disjointed side and then point at them and say ‘see, they are really shit for not playing like the next coming of Pele’ and then not playing them again.
the guy has had no chance to find any form, confidence or rythmn here. We've barely seen anything of him. Meanwhile, Pogba will be leaving which we knew when we signed Donny but we have chosen the yesterdays man over the new guy so will probably lose them both
We should start giving the youngsters more games; Elanga, Diallo, Mejbri, have all featured intermittently and I think its time we gave each of them a decent run in the starting 11; lets face it, they can hardly do worse than the regular senior players, can they?The manager should show Sancho and Greenwood faith and play them from the start, with Greenwood playing alongside Ronaldo and Sancho encouraged to be more direct. Elanga can play in midfield so put him alongside Mejbri and McTominay, who I believe still has a great future with us. Playing 4-3-3 could perhaps get the best out of Ronaldo, Greenwood and Sancho, with McTominay, Elanga and Matic or give VDB a run in midfield and a back 4 of Shaw, Varane, Maguire or Lindelof, and Bissaka, with DDG in goal. Bruno seems out of sorts at present so I would use him from the bench for a few games or perhaps interchange him with the front 3. Radical, perhaps, but we've gone radical before with great results!
Totally agree with what’s said here. They literally can’t do any worse can they. What a sad state of affairs our club has become 11 overpaid players wanting out. That’s mainly where we have gone wrong in the Woodward reign paying players too much money, signing mercenaries who wouldn’t choose to be here if they weren’t paid an obscene amount. Give it the youth ralf they can’t do any worse.
The lack of bringing in youth players has been one of my biggest disappointments in the past 18-24 months. It is the perfect time to do it if there are lazy whinges in the first team. I'm sure any of the youth players would press until they dropped rather than the half arsed jogging we've seen.
Its how most businesses work. If you go and work for an investment bank and everyone works 12 hour days and you are expected to be on your game the whole time then that is what you will deliver or you will be let go or leave. If you go and work at a company where everyone mooches around all day and leaves early when the manager isn't in and constantly whinges about the management, what do you think happens to new employees. Some will buck the trend and give their all but most will just adapt to fit into the current culture.
We are currently a toxic workplace where the players know that most fans blame the owners for everything and that if they mooch around they will just get the manager sacked. A new guy has come in with new ideas that require them to actually listen and learn for the first time and years and they don't seem to want to know. They would rather mooch around the pitch barely phoning in a performance than say "hey, lets give this guy a chance, he wants us playing a modern aggressive style of football that most of the successful teams play".
They have no desire to win. No hunger. Its pathetic.
I guess it is depressing. I wasn't an Ole guy, always thought the rebuild was snake oil but I would still like to see the group at least win something if they're getting disbanded. 5 years without a trophy would be absolutely humiliating. Thought the term rebuild had become an excuse to justify underperforming in the interim but if this many players are to go we will legit be facing a large scale rebuild from scratch and winning nothing in the foreseeable future. It's a lot of players so yes it's kind of worrying. Replacing players is harder than we make it sound here.
The DVB signing never made much sense.
DVB was on a shortlist of players for the AM/No 10 role. We then fecked up the first window under Ole - and then Bruno arrived (he was also on that shortlist) in January. And then - it seems to me, at least - we ended up buying DVB anyway (even though he was essentially some kind of back-up for Bruno in terms of what we needed), maybe because he was already on the radar and we had talked to him/his/people/Ajax...and maybe also because we couldn't get anyone else. Feck knows what they all thought.
But I don't think DVB was ever intended as a Pogba replacement. Ole never fully abandoned the idea of using Pogba in a deeper role and at the point where DVB first became interesting for him, his idea was obviously to partner Pogba with someone in the middle - and then add a No 10 of some description.
They're not right. I sit and watch these feckers jog about every week and look disinterested. I know what effort looks like. They've (some of them) had LVG, Jose, Ole and now Rangnick. The only one that didn't seem to get any pushback from players was Ole (even when we were in many of our ruts under him) and, guess what? He's possibly the worst coach of the lot and protected them after every poor performance, allowing them to put in minimal effort. He retained so many average players, in turn giving out new contracts and more money to reward their mediocrity. He turned a blind eye to Pogba and his shenanigans. I could go on all day.
It is no coincidence that they are kicking off now that somebody is here that is probably giving them a few home truths and not accepting their mediocrity.
Worrying thing with our transfer record is we'd also bungle their replacements. It's pretty poor for a club that spends this much. If anything we might be even better with less, or rather the incompetent ones spending the money might be better if they didn't get to spend 150m every summer. Who the hell gets that much and comes back with AWB and Maguire level of talent. Total downgrade, Jose wanted Maguire because he was a lowblock fanatic. What happens when we push up against a top side in the CL KO stages?
How can you call him a failure when he's basically had feck all games to prove what he can do.
Exactly. I think Ole has just made the problem even worse. I think Mourinho is a manager out of time these days. He thrived in a time before players had all the power and when giving your all for the manager and team was the norm not something that had to be carefully cultivated. He suggested many times that the players just weren't doing what they were told and there is only so much you can do when players ignore you or do stupid things on the pitch. I don't think Mourinho was the right man for the job but he sure as hell was thrown under the bus by the players as usual.
Ole comes in and the players are given even more power and Ole is their mate. Christ, they even came second in the league. Wow. Proves that Ole and the players have something about them. Ignore the consistently awful and disjointed performances for probably 60-70% of our games under Ole. Ignore the fact that we are consistently outplayed by the minnows of the league, its OK because we are winning. Ignore the fact that Liverpool had half their first team out for chunks of last season and Chelsea had as bad a manager as us.
I felt borderline insane for the past 3 years under Ole as I watched people on here shout down anyone that suggested we didn't play well if we won. When people suggested that Ole was going nowhere and wasn't coaching the players or building any sort of recognisable system that any other top team would consider viable. When people suggested that a title challenge this season was a pipe dream if you added Ronaldo to a dysfunctional outfit or that perhaps Sancho wouldn't thrive in a team that is almost the complete opposite of the Dortmund side he excelled in.
As others have said. I would issue an edict from the top that no one is safe. If Rangnick needs to bin off 6 of our first team then go for it. I think that his style of football would be better with youth players who are willing to work their asses off than the current bunch who barely move. Rangnick clearly abandoned the press after the first half of the first game because the players were so unfit and incapable of maintaining it for any length of time. They have now seemingly downed tools. Pathetic from the players.