So things are not great then
UK General Election - 12th December 2019 | Con 365, Lab 203, LD 11, SNP 48, Other 23 - Tory Majority of 80
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I think its mainly just fatigue with it, they just want a resolution. Not more votes on it.
So the UK signs the WA treaty and probably negotiates an FTA to essentially become like an associate EU member. Still trading etc but not in the EU proper.
I don't think Boris is really interested in a principled stance on independence. He'll do what he thinks needs to to win next time. So keeping economy good v important.
Is it too late for David to make a comeback? I liked him i think he would have done a good job.
Michael Gove's speech is genuinely making me feel nauseous.
It's Friday the 13th btw.
Yep. "Vote for us so we can provide more Brexit negotiations and votes" was never likely to be a popular pitch.
The bigger majority is for the best. He won't be beholden to the ERG on Brexit and it does strengthen his negotiation position with the EU. The noises from the EU are quite positive for the UK, they'll want to avoid a 'Singapore on Thames' scenario. He'll be able to pass an extension to negotiate the FTA with the EU quite easily too.
Just woke up and am delighted to see the results in NI. The DUP can get fecked!
The ERG has just grown in size. I’ve not seen a confirmed figure yet but Amber Rudd suggested last night that it’s as many as 80 MPs now which is over 22% of the Tory vote in Parliament.
Anything they like and it won't be good.
Sterling has gone up a lot. That's about it, really as far as good news goes.
If Scotland leaves, surely that is the end of labour as we know it.
Softer Brexit policies will be backed by other parties though with the threat of the ERG lurking in the background I would have thought. Unless Labour decide on further egregious mismanagement of the issue.
Corbynism is dead in the water anyway. In England and Scotland.
The chances were incredibly slim with Corbyn as a leader (he's not), as I said right from the beginning securing a soft Brexit in a hung parliament should have been main priority for Corbyn and the opposition but instead the hubris in them put their parties before the country interests as they decided to take on Boris after he villainaised them all long as they stood little to no chance of gaining any seats (apart from SNP). Bunch of stupid cnuts.
Aye, for the most part proper anti-Brexit Tory moderates have all been kicked out the party now. Anyone who's still there at this point is all good with a hard Brexit, and is willing to let No Deal happen if it must.
For all the talk of how strong Labour were in Scotland their most impressive victories typically never relied on us to win. And they're pretty much dead up here anyway. Barely of any significance at all now.
I think he’s much more likely to appease those in his own party before looking for cross party support for a Softer Brexit. The ERG is big enough to drop their support for him and leave him with no majority once again.
People obviously saw that
It feels like I read similar posts after the last election. Labour seem to have just gone backwards since then in many people's eyes judging by the result, so don't hold your breath for anything mentioned in your post.
It feels like I read similar posts after the last election. Labour seem to have just gone backwards since then in many people's eyes judging by the result, so don't hold your breath for anything mentioned in your post.
feck this country.
Appease the 25% or the 75%?
I don’t think they don’t care about that. Think they care about getting their way no matter what the cost.
The 75% are not going to stand up to this populist leader. Just like how it was only 20 or so that stood up to him last time and they are all gone now and it’s a party even more aligned with the ERG.
Whatever Boris decides Brexit to be will be whipped and voted along party lines with room for around 40 to abstain or vote against and make absolutely no difference whatsoever.
I'm sad to see the Beast of Bolsover has gone in such an ignominious way, after 49 years as an MP. He was really far too old to be standing again, but he represented the last of a particular era.
Time will tell but I still think the larger majority is better than a slimmer one. The great shame is that under Corbyn the best we were hoping for was a minority government and more political chaos. Our expectations were in the gutter.
Can't believe I'm so out of touch with what my country wants. The NHS is fecked for the next 5years and what will be left will only be in name only.
Yeah, everyone should raise a glass and wish him the best. He’s been a great servant to his constituency over the years. While I’m not directly in that constituency, I’m nearby and he is a real folk legend round here.
The challenge is really how to do it from the outside, because they will only ever try to influence people in favour of a party that they see as good for them, and no party has figured out how to do that yet. It does require people to not be so easily manipulated though, which is going to be almost impossible to sort out.
Honest question and apologies if you've outlined this above, in your view what should Labour have done about Brexit?
If the leadership had settled on a more 'Leave' position a decent chunk of their MPs would have defected when Chuka et al did. Had they settled on a more 'Remain' position they'd have lost the bulk of the heartlands seats which they barely clung on to last night. Looking at where the vote share went, it's clear that Brexit was the biggest issue of the election and unfortunately Brexit is the one issue that was guaranteed to split Labour's electoral coalition.
You’re echoing what I said before last night. There is no excuses now, the Tories have to own this. They should get Brexit through with no trouble and it will be whatever Brexit they choose.
Then they’re going to have to start running the country again and will be scrutinised beyond Brexit. Unlike in the rust belt in America where Trump has unwavering partisan support, a lot of Johnson’s new voters have no support for the Tories beyond Brexit so as soon as Brexit is no longer an issue he’s going to have to come up with a lot of other answers if he wants to retain their support.
What the hell happened to leave voters? Brexiteers seem to have multiplied. They may be a lot of things, but they're certainly way better organised than remain.
20 years of Tories. The working class doing the posh and uber-rich's bidding.
20 years of Tories. The working class doing the posh and uber-rich's bidding.
The WA lays the ground for a "softer Brexit", the moment we sign it that's what we're getting:
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/840656/Political_Declaration_setting_out_the_framework_for_the_future_relationship_between_the_European_Union_and_the_United_Kingdom.pd
Read the PD.
In my view the ERG folded before the GE, by standing behind the WA, they've ruled out a Farage style independence day. If they'd wanted to pursue it, they needed to break off and support the Brexit party.
They took the judgement it was better to accept the WA than risk a vote split.
Why? They won what, one seat in Scotland? SNP basically bulldozed everyone up there.
Ridiculous win.
They might not have lost in so many of their heartlands if they'd actually spent time formulating an argument for a softer Brexit for Remain and convincing voters why that was beneficial for them.
If they'd opted for a more Leave position then they'd have lost voters to the Lib Dems - as was evidenced in the Brexit referendum. And ultimately they were - and still are - a solildly pro-European party in many respects.
The problem was Corbyn. If we're going by polling, which seems fair enough in this case, he was just historically unpopular as an individual. People didn't like him. I'm aware this is partly anecdotal, but it's been largely verified now - the vast majority of older voters I know who have voted Labour just did not like him at all, and were contemplating voting for other parties as a result. An opposition leader who's going to win power has to be somewhat popular - it's just a basic requirement of every single election. The fact that Corbyn was just disastrously unpopular seems to have been ignored by so many or pushed aside as a slight inconvenience when it should have been a central concern heading into any prospective election.
Why he's unpopular can be debated. I don't think it's necessarily his policies - a lot of them poll quite well. Nationalisation is broadly popular. Redistribution of wealth is quite popular. But whether it was the anti-Semitism issue, the view that he was weak on foreign affairs matters, or the fact that as an individual he's just a bit devoid of charismatic and not particularly inspiring, he wasn't well-liked at all. And yet Labour put so much faith in him despite that.
They had to settle on a direction of travel one way or another. I'd have said a leave position calling the bluff of the centrists rather than a remain position. Not backing May's deal will go down in history as a major strategic failing. Falling into Cummings's hand and being portrayed as the enemies of the people will go down in history as a major strategic error. Hiding from Brexit in the 2019 GE when it was obviously to all an sundry that it was the core issue at play will go down in history as a major strategic error. I think you're kidding yourself if you're implying that it was only Brexit. Corbyn's brand of politics will not win in this country. His followers need to wake up to that fact.
I expressed those thoughts last night too but got told I was wrong. It will be much much harder for them not to own things now, with 10+ years in government and a large majority.
Anybody watching GMB? Grace Blakely showing exactly the problems the Labour Party is going to have. Incredibly frustrating
Scotland gone, boundaries re-drawn with number of seats reduced (even before factoring Scotland leaving), voter ID requirement introduced and other changes they've mentioned on page 48 of their manifesto. I can't see there being another Labour government in my lifetime.
My constituency remained firmly Labour:
Drop in votes pretty much entirely went to Brexit Party, Green and Lib Dems. Was expecting the gain for Brexit Party as the constituency was hugely leave but I'm annoyed at the amount of votes for people who haven't even stepped a foot inside the constituency, never mind live here.
Other constituencies around mine had same story of drop in vote for Labour, with equal gain for Brexit Party or in some cases a split between Lib Dems and Brexit.
every cloud...
They didn't help either with their pathetic campaign and ricockulous graphs.
![spoiler]](https://i.imgur.com/FKWJPGS.jpg[/spoiler])
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