Top 4 van Gaal stays or no top 4 van Gaal leaves?

Sigma

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Now first this may seem a simple question but then delve it a bit deeper it becomes an intriguing one. We get Champions League football for next season, but with van Gaal, the majority of people on the caf wouldn't back him to go anywhere near winning that competition let alone any other competition. So basically we get into the champions league for nothing, basically wasting a year, and wasting another chance of getting Mourinho. Who's available then, we might be stuck with Giggs who is an extreme risk, which could end up costing us yet more years.

On the other hand we take a year away from Champions League football, get Mourinho in, let him test the waters with the players, give him the money to spend to do what he feels is necessary and based on his extremely impressive history, we should reap the rewards. Leicester came from 20th to 1st within the last year, why can't we go from 5-6th to 1st with arguably the best manager and probably the most hungry and ready manager we could get. The majority of the caf would agree that we have a much better chance of doing something with Mourinho than van Gaal, why delay the inevitable - van Gaal is only here for 1 more year anyway. No brainer for me, I'd rather no top 4 and van Gaal leaves.

What about your choice, poll would be nice.
 
I don't care what LVG does this season I want him gone, we could win the league and that wouldn't change
 
I care about the long term so no top 4 and Jose in, scraping into the top 4 and letting the clown have another season, missing out on Jose and ending up with the puppet manager after him would do more harm than missing CL football next season.
 
Sigma said:
Now first this may seem a simple question but then delve it a bit deeper it becomes an intriguing one. We get Champions League football for next season, but with van Gaal, the majority of people on the caf wouldn't back him to go anywhere near winning that competition let alone any other competition. So basically we get into the champions league for nothing, basically wasting a year, and wasting another chance of getting Mourinho. Who's available then, we might be stuck with Giggs who is an extreme risk, which could end up costing us yet more years.

On the other hand we take a year away from Champions League football, get Mourinho in, let him test the waters with the players, give him the money to spend to do what he feels is necessary and based on his extremely impressive history, we should reap the rewards. Leicester came from 20th to 1st within the last year, why can't we go from 5-6th to 1st with arguably the best manager and probably the most hungry and ready manager we could get. The majority of the caf would agree that we have a much better chance of doing something with Mourinho than van Gaal, why delay the inevitable - van Gaal is only here for 1 more year anyway. No brainer for me, I'd rather no top 4 and van Gaal leaves.

What about your choice, poll would be nice.
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The CL is not simply about having a reasonable chance of winning it. It is about status and getting yourself among the elite for your image as well as your coefficient points. Missing out on it 2 out of 3 years would do us some damage on both fronts.
 
Theonas said:
The CL is not simply about having a reasonable chance of winning it. It is about status and getting yourself among the elite for your image as well as your coefficient points. Missing out on it 2 out of 3 years would do us some damage on both fronts.
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What is the point of just slowly trudging along though? We want to win, we don't just want to be in the champions league for the sake of it. 7th, 4th, 4th and I fear if we keep van Gaal just another 3-5th, the progression is extremely minimal, if not non-existent. And also one of the other major reasons I don't want him to be next year, his football bores everyone to tears.
 
The thread title should be changed.

Top 4 van Gaal stays for 6 CL games in 2016 or no top 4 van Gaal leaves?
 
Sigma said:
What is the point of just slowly trudging along though? We want to win, we don't just want to be in the champions league for the sake of it. 7th, 4th, 4th and I fear if we keep van Gaal just another 3-5th, the progression is extremely minimal, if not non-existent. And also one of the other major reasons I don't want him to be next year, his football bores everyone to tears.
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The point is the long term. Our coefficient matters in the draws. Our status will suffer and with it our finances and ability to attract or keep players. Real Madrid have gone about 6 years without going past the last 16 and if you remember in those years nobody took them seriously to win it. But by simply being there, their status and coefficient did not suffer so when they started getting better, they were well positioned to push. So yes it is very important to be in the CL even if short terms, you don't stand much chance to win it. The other point about LvG competence is something I cannot really disagree with. We have been below the standards and that's putting it mildly.
 
Theonas said:
The point is the long term. Our coefficient matters in the draws. Our status will suffer and with it our finances and ability to attract or keep players. Real Madrid have gone about 6 years without going past the last 16 and if you remember in those years nobody took them seriously to win it. But by simply being there, their status and coefficient did not suffer so when they started getting better, they were well positioned to push. So yes it is very important to be in the CL even if short terms, you don't stand much chance to win it. The other point about LvG competence is something I cannot really disagree with. We have been below the standards and that's putting it mildly.
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Long term is exactly the reason I don't want him next here next year.

Sigma said:
So basically we get into the champions league for nothing, basically wasting a year, and wasting another chance of getting Mourinho. Who's available then, we might be stuck with Giggs who is an extreme risk, which could end up costing us yet more years.
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Sigma said:
Long term is exactly the reason I don't want him next here next year.
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Nobody can be sure whether the next manager will be good for us long term. It is a decision involving a level of risk no matter what. Missing out on the CL 2 out of 3 years is not uncertain, it iS detrimental for us long term.
 
Crashoutcassius said:
Are people forgetting that top 4 would mean city don't get CL in peps first season???? that would be so funny surely ?!?!
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It also means that van Gaal will be sacked anyway, if all these reports with Mourinho are true. So there seems to be no downside for people to get worked up over.
 
4th and LvG stays. Then we sack him after a 0-0 in the first CL prelim for not building on the success
 
No top 4 and he goes. One year of LVG CL humiliation is enough
 
Hard choice, I really don't want us to miss out on the CL and I despise van Gaal.

Gun to my head, I'd probably choose top 4 and one more season of the fool.
 
There's enough depressing stuff to talk about without hypothetical depressing questions
 
Just a little bump as recent reports are suggesting that if van Gaal gets top 4 he might be allowed to stay...
 
I just want him and Giggs gone, I don't care about playing 6 extra games next season with dreary away trips to Russia and Turkey.
 
Difficult choice, but I'd go with top 4. We absolutely need to get CL football, our European coefficient has been steadily dropping.

It'll be like Rodgers for Liverpool this season, LVG will likely feck off after 10 or so games.
 
CL with LvG... but with Mourinho as his assistant.

C'mon, there's gotta be some kind of compromise here. :lol:
 
What the feck is going on.

we are Manchester United fans. We want Manchester United to do well. We want to win every game. Of course we'd rather get top four, what kind of supporter would think differently?
 
Twigginater said:
What the feck is going on.

we are Manchester United fans. We want Manchester United to do well. We want to win every game. Of course we'd rather get top four, what kind of supporter would think differently?
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I think my arguments in the OP show that as a Manchester United fan, long term, Mourinho and no champions league this season is much better than van Gaal and champions league.
 
Twigginater said:
What the feck is going on.

we are Manchester United fans. We want Manchester United to do well. We want to win every game. Of course we'd rather get top four, what kind of supporter would think differently?
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Someone who wants a change of manager. I meet people who feel like that all the time. Van Gaal has alienated a lot of fans who want to see him gone.
 
Nuts said:
Someone who wants a change of manager. I meet people who feel like that all the time. Van Gaal has alienated a lot of fans who want to see him gone.
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Why even think like that? There is absolutely no perfect formula in football. Mourinho could come in and get us 16th like he did last seasons champions this year. Why not want your team to do the best in the here and now and leave the worrying about who could be signed and who could be our manager to others.

LVG could do better next year than Mourinho. Since he's been here that's been the case 50% of the time. Poch could be a new Coyle or Rodgers. Klopp could flop, Pep might miss a step in a new league. Who the feck knows. To be so relentlessly depressing and monotonously dull that were making up questions about things going terribly is just so opposite to what football should do to you.
 
Sigma said:
I think my arguments in the OP show that as a Manchester United fan, long term, Mourinho and no champions league this season is much better than van Gaal and champions league.
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I'd rather Van Gaal and champions league than Mou and no champions league but defo no champ league and someone like POchettino, Mourinho is too similar to Van Gaal but I said enough on him in different threads. One think I am in agreement with you is that people shouldn't freak out when someone wants his team to "do bad" in short term to do good in longterm, imagine Moyes finished fourth and every year was out of group stages of champions league never winning anything, it was great longterm us to finish seventh, now it's the same, would take fifth and new manager other than Mourinho. I also believe that there is a chance that we finish fourht and he's sacked anyway, decision had been made hopefully...
 
Twigginater said:
Why even think like that? There is absolutely no perfect formula in football. Mourinho could come in and get us 16th like he did last seasons champions this year. Why not want your team to do the best in the here and now and leave the worrying about who could be signed and who could be our manager to others.

LVG could do better next year than Mourinho. Since he's been here that's been the case 50% of the time. Poch could be a new Coyle or Rodgers. Klopp could flop, Pep might miss a step in a new league. Who the feck knows. To be so relentlessly depressing and monotonously dull that were making up questions about things going terribly is just so opposite to what football should do to you.
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So what, they're entitled to their opinion.
 
Anything that involves LvG leaving.

If he stays i genuinely believe we will finish mid table next season at the very best.
 
Nuts said:
So what, they're entitled to their opinion.
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What has that got to do with anything?

Anyone is entitled to their opinion. That is obvious. I am not going to go around telling people to stop having opinions. No one has remotely suggest that. We are clearly not in some kind of 1984 like state where I want opinions suppressed and RAWK like moderation.

What I think is important though for people to evaluate what is actually happening. As of now there are 91 teams in the English league system out of 96 who would love to be where we are. We are still in with a chance of a trophy which would be awesome. I would LOVE to win the FA Cup. Why not try and support our team instead of being so miserable constantly. Especially as our last two results were fecking fantastic.
 
If we finish top 4 and LVG stays I would rather not finish top 4, he has no future here, at best if he is achieving his targets (which he is failing at) he is retiring next year anyway. He had the debut season to assess, the next season to put it right with every resource that any manager could ask for at his disposal and it has been poxy, he has been a torturous failure. Why the feck are people clinging to the top 4 thing, we got top 4 last season and did'nt even make it out of the group stage with his negative football and contradictory policies.
 
Twigginater said:
What has that got to do with anything?

Anyone is entitled to their opinion. That is obvious. I am not going to go around telling people to stop having opinions. No one has remotely suggest that. We are clearly not in some kind of 1984 like state where I want opinions suppressed and RAWK like moderation.

What I think is important though for people to evaluate what is actually happening. As of now there are 91 teams in the English league system out of 96 who would love to be where we are. We are still in with a chance of a trophy which would be awesome. I would LOVE to win the FA Cup. Why not try and support our team instead of being so miserable constantly. Especially as our last two results were fecking fantastic.
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That's fine, and I agree about VG and last two results. Not everyone will though. If everyone did there'd be no need for a discussion forum...
 
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