Top 4 race 2016/17

Only way we get this is if we win all remaining games which is very unlikely of course, considering how the other teams are playing. Otherwise, we'd need to get lucky in Europa.
In any case, we'll know for sure after the Christmas fixtures.
 
SwansonsTache said:
It really is amazing, worst part of it is that when you line up our first 11 and compare it to the teams ahead of us only really City can be said to have a better team.

We are simply just cursed. Every 50\50 goes against us, every ball that hits the woodwork or the post goes out, every time the ball drops it drops for the opponent not us, every time there is a dodgy ref decision it is against us, never for us etc.. Never seen a team in top flight football be more fecked over by fortune than us.
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The other teams know their first XI. We still don't.
 
SwansonsTache said:
It really is amazing, worst part of it is that when you line up our first 11 and compare it to the teams ahead of us only really City can be said to have a better team.

We are simply just cursed. Every 50\50 goes against us, every ball that hits the woodwork or the post goes out, every time the ball drops it drops for the opponent not us, every time there is a dodgy ref decision it is against us, never for us etc.. Never seen a team in top flight football be more fecked over by fortune than us.
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I don't agree that we have worse luck than other teams but we certainly have less fluency, which has led to a a long period of below par results, which brings more pressure, which leads to players in the team losing their composure and confidence on the field. The fluency will come, at which point the quality of our team relative to others should hopefully start to shine through.

The club just needs to be patient and everyone keep their heads.
 
Jazz said:
Only way we get this is if we win all remaining games which is very unlikely of course, considering how the other teams are playing. Otherwise, we'd need to get lucky in Europa.
In any case, we'll know for sure after the Christmas fixtures.
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If we win all our remaining games we'll finish on 99 points. Yes that will get us in the top 4. We don't need anything close to that form to get top 4. We just need to be marginally better than 2 or 3 of the teams above us over what is still a very long remainder of the season (28 games!).

Our position now is not the problem. It's form that is the problem. If the form turns around the current gap won't be insurmountable. Not by a long shot. Teams have turned round bigger gaps with less than 10 games of the season left.
 
United won 6 points from the last 7 league games. That's bad. Shades of Chelsea 2?
 
It doesn't look great at the moment but top 4 isn't tat difficult to achieve.

You can afford to drop a lot of points and still get it. I mean we nearly sneaked it last season despite gross incompetence.

Just need to get our shit together!
 
SwansonsTache said:
It really is amazing, worst part of it is that when you line up our first 11 and compare it to the teams ahead of us only really City can be said to have a better team.

We are simply just cursed. Every 50\50 goes against us, every ball that hits the woodwork or the post goes out, every time the ball drops it drops for the opponent not us, every time there is a dodgy ref decision it is against us, never for us etc.. Never seen a team in top flight football be more fecked over by fortune than us.
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Only City having a better team than us is just plain wrong.

Lets just consider our front four today: Ibra (2016 United version), Mata, Lingard, and Rashford.
Lets compare that to our rivals (bar city) considering recent matches.
Arsenal:
Sanchez, Iwobi, Chamberlain, Ozil
Most definitely a better set of players than United. Heck even Walcott, Ramsay, Giroud are much better than our players.
Liverpool:
Firmino, Coutinho, Mane, Lallana.
Only Lallana is over performing and I would have mata ahead of him but rest comfortably better.
Spurs:
Ibra is better than Janssen and Alli is out of form. But Son and Eriksen are comfortably better than Lingard and Rashford and they have Lamela and Kane waiting to come back who are comfortably better than what we have.
Chelsea:
Costa, Hazard, Willian better than what we have. Rest not so much.

Miki doesn't count as he hasn't been tested in EPL at all. Martial badly out of form. Then we have Memphis and Young (Dear GOD we still have him). Pogba is not a number 10 we can all agree on that.

We are a 6th place team in terms of our attacking quality and that is where I expect us to finish.
 
Treble said:
United won 6 points from the last 7 league games. That's bad. Shades of Chelsea 2?
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5 points from games against Burnley (H), Stoke (H), Leicester (H) and Watford (A) isn't great. We've also scored fewer goals than Chelsea had by this point last season (they scored 15, we've scored 13). Fortunately our defence isn't as bad as theirs was.
 
Need 75-77 points to be sure of 4th. Right now we have 15/30 points. We still have to play for 94 more points and need 65 from them. Premier league average for 4th position is 68-74 points depending how shit or good other teams are. It is certainly very doable right now but it depends too much on other teams. We need to stop thinking about city and arsenal results as those two look most convincing to be top two this season. Liverpool will be 8 points ahead of us if they beat palace, chelsea 7 if they win their game and Tottenham are 5 points ahead. We really needed to win this one. I think this will be another tough season for us.
 
Leicester were on 19 points at this stage last season. Them winning it had more to do with the usual top four being shit. I don't think we'll be awarded that luck this year. City, Chelsea, and Liverpool are all doing better than many thought and then you have Arsenal and Tottenham still holding their own. We can't afford to keep dropping points at home and relying on the other teams to slip up. Our cohesion is just awful at the moment and nothing is going right. We're probably going to be without Jose on the touchline for at least 1 match, possibly 2-3 with today's sending off. Then you have Herrera who has been playing well despite our results. Hopefully that card is appealed and rescinded. It looked to be a dive to me. Very harsh second yellow. We should have won for sure with the number of shots we had. Only one needed to go it. Madness.
 
peridigm said:
Leicester were on 19 points at this stage last season. Them winning it had more to do with the usual top four being shit. I don't think we'll be awarded that luck this year. City, Chelsea, and Liverpool are all doing better than many thought and then you have Arsenal and Tottenham still holding their own. We can't afford to keep dropping points at home and relying on the other teams to slip up. Our cohesion is just awful at the moment and nothing is going right. We're probably going to be without Jose on the touchline for at least 1 match, possibly 2-3 with today's sending off. Then you have Herrera who has been playing well despite our results. Hopefully that card is appealed and rescinded. It looked to be a dive to me. Very harsh second yellow. We should have won for sure with the number of shots we had. Only one needed to go it. Madness.
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You can't appeal a sending off as a result of two yellows.
 
SwansonsTache said:
It really is amazing, worst part of it is that when you line up our first 11 and compare it to the teams ahead of us only really City can be said to have a better team.

We are simply just cursed. Every 50\50 goes against us, every ball that hits the woodwork or the post goes out, every time the ball drops it drops for the opponent not us, every time there is a dodgy ref decision it is against us, never for us etc.. Never seen a team in top flight football be more fecked over by fortune than us.
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Each and every fanbase can say this.

You only remember the ones that don't go your way.
 
The bookies are offering higher odds on us finishing top 4 than City winning the league at this point.
 
We will make top 4. No question, today was another bad result but we're seriously pushing the door to overcome our lack of confidence, which has been built up over the last few seasons, once the results start to reflect the performances we will be unstoppable.
 
The positive thing is we are out of this race pretty early. There's not hope so there's no disappointment.
 
I don't think we're out of the top four race, honestly. It's too soon for that kind of talk.

We are basically competing with Chelsea, Everton and Spurs for that 4th spot.

Next 5 PL fixtues for: (6 for Chelsea and Everton, they have a game in hand)

Chelsea(20pts):
Southampton (A), Everton(H), Middlesbrough(A), Spurs(H), City(A), West Brom(H)

Spurs(19pts):
Arsenal (A), West Ham(H), Chelsea(A), Swansea(H), Man Utd(A)

Everton(15pts):
West Ham(H), Chelsea(A), Swansea(H), Southampton(A), Man Utd(H), Watford(A)

Man Utd(15pts):
Swansea (A), Arsenal(H), West Ham(H), Everton(A), Tottenham(H)

Depending on how results go, we could easily cover up the gap, since they play between themselves, and we play Spus and the Toffees.
The title's long gone, I'm afraid, to one of City, Liverpool or Arsenal.
 
All 3 United said:
We will make top 4. No question, today was another bad result but we're seriously pushing the door to overcome our lack of confidence, which has been built up over the last few seasons, once the results start to reflect the performances we will be unstoppable.
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Hard to stay optimistic on days like today when our rivals put four past their opponents while we lose points to a relegation fodder at home. Seems like the gap is growing bigger every week and it's becoming hard to see who can we overtake for a top four spot.
 
Giggs86 said:
Hard to stay optimistic on days like today when our rivals put four past their opponents while we lose points to a relegation fodder at home. Seems like the gap is growing bigger every week and it's becoming hard to see who can we overtake for a top four spot.
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That's the problem for United.
The current Top 4 are all cursing dropped points in the same way that you are and all but Arsenal are out of a competition that you are in.
Overhauling these teams will be tough.
 
Arsenal Liverpool and City are in a totally different class to us. Spurs and Chelsea are our targets but I'm not sure we can overtake both. Spurs are dropping points every game and we're yet 5 behind.
 
All 3 United said:
We will make top 4. No question, today was another bad result but we're seriously pushing the door to overcome our lack of confidence, which has been built up over the last few seasons, once the results start to reflect the performances we will be unstoppable.
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Wish I shared your optimism, I think it will be difficult to pull these point back.
The frustrating thing for me is, we have the players, but what we are seeing from the last few managers is plugging players in where they don't fit.
 
Gandalf Greyhame said:
Man Utd(15pts):
Swansea (A), Arsenal(H), West Ham(H), Everton(A), Tottenham(H)

Depending on how results go, we could easily cover up the gap, since they play between themselves, and we play Spus and the Toffees.
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And thats the thing, do you think in our current form we can get 10-12 points from those? We've already played against four of the teams above us and have a grand total of 1 point to show for it.
 
Damien said:
And thats the thing, do you think in our current form we can get 10-12 points from those? We've already played against four of the teams above us and have a grand total of 1 point to show for it.
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Well, one can hope. But we are learning, slowly. Things Mourinho seems to have figured out so far, making mistakes along the way:

- Rooney doesn't have a place in the starting XI
- We need three in midfield.
- Herrera needs to partner Pogba in a deep lying role.
- Mata needs to be further up ahead of Pogba
- Rashford needs to start
- Blind needs to be in defence, either as a LB or a CB
- Smalling is prone to brainfarts
- Bailly is dependable, so is Valencia at RB
- Fellaini works only in limited circumstances
- You cannot always sit back and get a point with this side at major away games
- Carrick is great for dictating tempo, but can be used sparsely
- Zlatan is not as good at finishing as he once was
- The team lacks winning mentality, leadership
- We need to take Europa League seriously
- Lingard is limited, but very handy with his movement
- Refs are fecking us over this season

We're significantly more balanced, more potent going forward, and more settled upon some starters than we were at the beginning of the season. We played some great football last night, once we get good finishing in place, we'll be tricky customers to deal with. Jose is continually learning along the way.
 
Well and truly over. There's no miracle that can happen here.
 
Gandalf Greyhame said:
I don't think we're out of the top four race, honestly. It's too soon for that kind of talk.

We are basically competing with Chelsea, Everton and Spurs for that 4th spot.

Next 5 PL fixtues for: (6 for Chelsea and Everton, they have a game in hand)

Chelsea(20pts):
Southampton (A), Everton(H), Middlesbrough(A), Spurs(H), City(A), West Brom(H)

Spurs(19pts):
Arsenal (A), West Ham(H), Chelsea(A), Swansea(H), Man Utd(A)

Everton(15pts):
West Ham(H), Chelsea(A), Swansea(H), Southampton(A), Man Utd(H), Watford(A)

Man Utd(15pts):
Swansea (A), Arsenal(H), West Ham(H), Everton(A), Tottenham(H)

Depending on how results go, we could easily cover up the gap, since they play between themselves, and we play Spus and the Toffees.
The title's long gone, I'm afraid, to one of City, Liverpool or Arsenal.
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We wont get 15 points from those five games. No chance.

The other thing is Chelsea and Everton dont have european football midweek and as such are fresher.

I think our best bet for getting into europe is the europa cup. I would really concentrate on winning that.
 
Everytime someone posts a list of upcoming games and people start predicting points it never goes well!

We're evolving game by game and it'll take patience, the worst word in football!

The league position does look worrying, there's just such a pack of teams a fair way ahead already. You always think "can we catch them", but most often they get further away.

Roll on Thursday, get that won and we're as good as qualified,
 
Been this way for three seasons now, looking future fixtures thinking "Win those 5 and we're right back in it!"

Then we end up further off.
 
A 7 point gap looks far too big considering the quality of the teams we are chasing.

We have issues in every area of the pitch bar goalkeeper and have no idea what out best side is. Meanwhile our 'rivals' for top 4:

Chelsea: Look strong all round in the 3-4-3 formation, settled 11, Hazard back in form, Costa scoring every week.
Liverpool: Arguably the best attack in the league at moment, settled 11, Coutinho playing outstandingly, only possible weakness at the back.
Arsenal: Strong all round, settled 11, Sanchez playing outstandingly.
City: Strongest squad, minor blip while De Bruyne injured but have still been dominating games, best striker in the league.
Spurs: Settled 11, probably the best defence, weaker in attack than rivals.
 
Sure, situation right now is bleak but to claim top 4 is over for us now, at the end of October, is just laughable.
 
Sandikan said:
Everytime someone posts a list of upcoming games and people start predicting points it never goes well!
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:lol: So true, it usually happens after a succession of bad results and a slide down the table. Someone will make a thread trying to look on the bright side, where with absolutely no basis whatsoever will predict us to win our next 6 games . Inevitably we'll win about 2, then the process starts again.

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/our-next-six-pl-games.422565/
 
One of City, Liverpool, Arsenal or Chelsea will undoubtedly collapse this season. It's just a matter of pouncing on it by winning 5/6 games in a row.
 
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