Top 4 race 2016/17

We really need to start smashing teams.

Another season where GD costs us would be annoying.
 
charlenefan said:
Spurs are hard to beat, I actually think they'll beat Chelsea on Wednesday now as they're in very good form
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They were before they met you in the league too. Or at least they were in MUCH better form than you were then. They still lost 1-0. You want to temper the "in very good form" with: "but they're still Spurs".
 
Dumbstar said:
They were before they met you in the league too. Or at least they were in MUCH better form than you were then. They still lost 1-0. You want to temper the "in very good form" with: "but they're still Spurs".
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I'm not saying we will win Wednesday but we were far from in good form when we went to OT, in fact we were struggling badly.

Truthfully we haven't hit our straps all season so we have done amazingly well to be in the top 4 at the halfway stage. Hopefully we will keep improving our levels.
 
Only 3 to 4 points away from the top 4 places and still everything to play for. My real concern is the effect the Europa league will have on the league performances less than 72 hours later. The other one would be if Ibra or Pogba missed a chunk of games. They are essential.
 
SirHenryPercy said:
I'm not saying we will win Wednesday but we were far from in good form when we went to OT, in fact we were struggling badly.

Truthfully we haven't hit our straps all season so we have done amazingly well to be in the top 4 at the halfway stage. Hopefully we will keep improving our levels.
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If I remember correctly, Utd came to within three points of you by beating you that day. Which implies you were way above them in the league and could have been even further way ahead of them had you won or at least fought for a draw. I do agree you are at the peak of your form now though and obviously I'll be rooting for you on Wednesday.
 
Escobar said:
That's very optimistic if not impossible
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Well, 3 points behind Spurs, 4 points behind City. Liverpool will lose points, I don't see them as a real quality side. Knowing Klopp, he will push his players to the max and break some of them. City, dunno. They did not look great yesterday and it's been an ongoing saga for several games.
 
surf said:
Only 3 to 4 points away from the top 4 places and still everything to play for. My real concern is the effect the Europa league will have on the league performances less than 72 hours later. The other one would be if Ibra or Pogba missed a chunk of games. They are essential.
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These two things are not necessarily mutually exclusive. You are so ridiculously dependent on these two players that the cracks have to show somewhere. One is 35 years old don't forget.
 
Fridge chutney said:
After 6-7 matches I predicted that Liverpool would win the league, and was laughed at by both united and Liverpool supporters on here. I don't think they will win it anymore, I think it will be Chelsea, but I think Liverpool and Chelsea will almost certainly take 2 of the top 4 spots.

If Arsenal have a Feb/march like they usually do, they will miss out on top 4. City are at risk because they've looked poor and of course Spurs and United are currently outside. Positions 3-6 are impossible to predict. Deep runs in Europe and cups may jeopardise league position, and current 3-6 may learn this the hard way. Chelsea and Liverpool have the luxury not to worry about this impacting league form.
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Outside what?
 
Dumbstar said:
These two things are not necessarily mutually exclusive. You are so ridiculously dependent on these two players that the cracks have to show somewhere. One is 35 years old don't forget.
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Totally agree. Pogba is young and rarely injured and might be able to play almost every game at a high level. Not so sure about Ibra. We do have Martial in reserve as a replacement striker, which is not bad at all.
 
Dave46 said:
Well, 3 points behind Spurs, 4 points behind City. Liverpool will lose points, I don't see them as a real quality side. Knowing Klopp, he will push his players to the max and break some of them. City, dunno. They did not look great yesterday and it's been an ongoing saga for several games.
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But to finish second you'd need around 45 points, maybe more. Is your defense good enough for that?
 
I'm confident that Spurs have a very good chance for top 4. The team is beginning to move up gear now, having won 4 on the bounce and scored 18 goals in the last 6 league games.

Kane has found his scoring boots, Alli is hitting his stride again, Alderweireld is back from injury and illness, and surely Lamela can't be too far away from returning also.

I also note that of the 9 away games Spurs have played - only 1 has been against a current bottom 6 team (Boro) and only 3 have been against teams in the current bottom half of the table (Boro, Watford and Stoke). To put this another way, 6 of our 9 away games have been against top half teams.

So we have already played the majority of our hardest away fixtures.
 
Revan said:
Liverpool face a quite bad team though, so I think that they are safer than us and you. Bournemouth and West Ham are quite good teams, that can cause problems for any team when they play at home.
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Yep, even if i think as many have already said, Bournemouth's style of play should suit us even more than WBA and Crystal Palace.
 
surf said:
Only 3 to 4 points away from the top 4 places and still everything to play for. My real concern is the effect the Europa league will have on the league performances less than 72 hours later. The other one would be if Ibra or Pogba missed a chunk of games. They are essential.
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You should try to win the E.L. Best way to play in the Champions League next season.
 
GlastonSpur said:
I'm confident that Spurs have a very good chance for top 4. The team is beginning to move up gear now, having won 4 on the bounce and scored 18 goals in the last 6 league games.

Kane has found his scoring boots, Alli is hitting his stride again, Alderweireld is back from injury and illness, and surely Lamela can't be too far away from returning also.

I also note that of the 9 away games Spurs have played - only 1 has been against a current bottom 6 team (Boro) and only 3 have been against teams in the current bottom half of the table (Boro, Watford and Stoke). To put this another way, 6 of our 9 away games have been against top half teams.

So we have already played the majority of our hardest away fixtures.
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Yep, promising fixtures for Spurs but they can bite you in the ass if you get complacent.
 
City will piss fourth. Aguero is back now so they'll put the smaller teams consistently to the sword.

Arsenal also are great at beating the smaller teams - but they normally dip around the January-March period.

Man United's good run of form has coincided with no Europa League. Once those fixtures start again it'll be greater than any hindrance the other top six will face.

Spurs look strong and are starting to score goals.

If I had to bet on it, Man United and Spurs miss out.
 
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While United are in great form, they are not making up much ground on the teams above them. Everyone other than City above them are playing as well or even better. Somebody's form will fall off sooner than later and while I hope it is not United, it could well be. I have said a few times, winning the Europa League is United's best chance of Champions League football next season. Still don't think United are strong enough yet to finish above at least two of Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs or City. Hope I am wrong but think United and City will finish 5th and 6th.
 
surf said:
No way. We have to win 5 ties in a row to win the Europa league, current odds around 4 to 1, against a slightly less than even chance of top 4.
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I think a lot will depend on your position in the league in march. If you were still close to the Champions League spots Mourinho would probably sacrifice the E.L.
 
surf said:
No way. We have to win 5 ties in a row to win the Europa league, current odds around 4 to 1, against a slightly less than even chance of top 4.
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How do you arrive at this? It's a genuine question, since the Alternative League Table shows you effectively 7 points (including GD) off 4th place.
 
GlastonSpur said:
I'm confident that Spurs have a very good chance for top 4. The team is beginning to move up gear now, having won 4 on the bounce and scored 18 goals in the last 6 league games.

Kane has found his scoring boots, Alli is hitting his stride again, Alderweireld is back from injury and illness, and surely Lamela can't be too far away from returning also.

I also note that of the 9 away games Spurs have played - only 1 has been against a current bottom 6 team (Boro) and only 3 have been against teams in the current bottom half of the table (Boro, Watford and Stoke). To put this another way, 6 of our 9 away games have been against top half teams.

So we have already played the majority of our hardest away fixtures.
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The good news for us us that most people are discounting us.

I think we will have a really good idea if we can make top 4 after 11/2, at this stage we will only have 2 games left against the other 5 and they will both be at home against Arsenal & Utd.
 
surf said:
No way. We have to win 5 ties in a row to win the Europa league, current odds around 4 to 1, against a slightly less than even chance of top 4.
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5 ties all against teams we can/should beat, the first of which is about as easy as we could ask for. I think we have a better shot at winning the EL than top 4.
 
Fridge chutney said:
The top 4. The point being, the onus is on our clubs to enter the top 4. I truthfully think that positions 3-6 are too difficult to predict right now.
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I think his point is that for tonight at least Spurs are currently in the top 4.
 
GlastonSpur said:
How do you arrive at this? It's a genuine question, since the Alternative League Table shows you effectively 7 points (including GD) off 4th place.
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We're 3 points off 4th in the actual, real life, reality based table.
 
Lots of chat about fixtures but this year is clearly different to previous in terms of the gap between the top 6 and the rest.

Everton in 7th are only 1 point nearer the top 4 than they are the relegation zone. There is no real drop off in quality Everton down to probably Leicester in 15th and most of the away games against sides in that range are all near enough of equal difficulty (and the order of those teams is constantly changing game by game). I would even argue that Palace and Boro are of a similar level. Their GD's are very good for teams in 16th and 17th, but somebody has to lose. This then causes so called 'Alternative League Tables' to be a bit wonky. You only have to look at RAWKs and see that Swansea is listed as one of the hardest fixtures to see the limitations in these approaches.

Contrary to most people I don't think Liverpool are a shoo in either, they're only in the top 4 by 4 points, although they're more likely than the rest given the current points they've racked up.

It will be interesting to see if all the top 6 can sustain this pace as we've not really seen anything like it before.
 
I'm starting to worry for our chances. We may be fifth and on the same points as Spurs in fourth but we're probably the worst team in the top six as it stands. We just aren't at it. The players are struggling to do what Pep wants and Pep is too arrogant to change his ways. It's hurting us and needs to change soon.

You guys (United) have won what, six on the bounce now? Only three points separate us, that's pressure we could do without. Interesting to see what happens now that Fernandinho and Aguero are off their suspensions.
 
ForlansHair said:
It will be interesting to see if all the top 6 can sustain this pace as we've not really seen anything like it before.
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That's what concerns me as I think some certainly can, Spurs have very consistent and have been now for a season and a half, Arsenal have pretty much got beating the lesser teams down to a tee very rarely dropping points against anyone other than the top teams and even traditionally tough away games for them (Swansea, Southampton, Stoke) don't look like they'll provide too much of a test for them. Chelsea are too far ahead to drop out of the top 4 completely and then there's Liverpool

Wouldn't it be ironic that the two teams who were most people's picks for 1 and 2 in the table be the sides that actually finish 5th and 6th (City and us)
 
cyberman said:
We're 3 points off 4th in the actual, real life, reality based table.
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In the current league table, yes. But the point of the ALT is that it claims to better reflect the underlying reality, taking into account fixtures and so on.
 
GlastonSpur said:
In the current league table, yes. But the point of the ALT is that it claims to better reflect the underlying reality, taking into account fixtures and so on.
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So nonsense then since it can't predict form and injuries and so on.
No alt table could reflect this season, the top 6 are so strong that its pointless really. A top side would need an off day to drop points and that could happen away to Palace or at home to Burnley. The opposition are almost redundant when it relies so heavily on one team playing poorly.
 
GlastonSpur said:
In the current league table, yes. But the point of the ALT is that it claims to better reflect the underlying reality, taking into account fixtures and so on.
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What on earth is an alternate league table and why are you referring to it? In this table I assume Spurs came to Old Trafford and weren't played off the park and beaten?
 
charlenefan said:
What on earth is an alternate league table and why are you referring to it? In this table I assume Spurs came to Old Trafford and weren't played off the park and beaten?
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We were beaten but played off the park? You can't get played off the park in a poor game.

This is what worries me about us, we have poor days at the office in our locker, we've seen it this season at OT, home to Leicester, at WBA, home to the Spammers although we ground out a win. 19 games is a lot for us to remain consistent and limit those poor days in a season when I think 4th might require 78 points.
 
God this thread is made boring by rival fans.

Wait till the end of the season and see where we are, utterly pointless looking at the fixture list.
 
charlenefan said:
That's what concerns me as I think some certainly can, Spurs have very consistent and have been now for a season and a half, Arsenal have pretty much got beating the lesser teams down to a tee very rarely dropping points against anyone other than the top teams and even traditionally tough away games for them (Swansea, Southampton, Stoke) don't look like they'll provide too much of a test for them. Chelsea are too far ahead to drop out of the top 4 completely and then there's Liverpool

Wouldn't it be ironic that the two teams who were most people's picks for 1 and 2 in the table be the sides that actually finish 5th and 6th (City and us)
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I'm taking some heart in that we haven't been outplayed in a game of football since our hammering against Chelsea, 10 weeks ago to the day, our last poor performance. We should be able to improve in the second half given we have drawn at least 3 games this half we absolutely deserved to win but I fear we have too much to do. I'm hopeful but not confident.
 
SirHenryPercy said:
We were beaten but played off the park? You can't get played off the park in a poor game.
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You were comfortably beat and 1-0 flattered you such was our dominance. Granted we didn't have Stoke/Burnley/West Ham levels of chances ourselves but it was an exact repeat of our game with Arsenal without the opposition getting an underserved late equalizer
 
cyberman said:
So nonsense then since it can't predict form and injuries and so on.
No alt table could reflect this season, the top 6 are so strong that its pointless really. A top side would need an off day to drop points and that could happen away to Palace or at home to Burnley. The opposition are almost redundant when it relies so heavily on one team playing poorly.
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I wouldn't myself call it nonsense, even if it can't obviously predict injuries and so on. It attempts to take into account the difficulty of fixtures played .. and so has some merit in my view.
 
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