Top 4 race 2016/17

I just took a look at our fixtures in the coming months. We have three fixtures against top 6 teams till the end of April.

Home game against Liverpool on Jan 15
Away game against City on Feb 26
Home game against Chelsea on Apr 15

The away game against City will also be postponed if we reach the EFL cup final.

So this is the ideal time for us to push on and go on a winning streak with an occasional bad result along the way. We also have the squad strength to keep the players fresh for the EPL while others might struggle to do so. With us being just 6-7 points off the rest except Chelsea, we have every chance to get into the top 4 if we keep playing at our current level.
 
Kentonio said:
I'm not sure when winning by 1 goal instead of 4 or 5 counted as 'running out of steam'. Is it really realistic to expect us to be going goal crazy every week? I'd be more worried by that to be honest, as it'd probably leave us fecked for the second half of the season.
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I think it's more the nature of those wins than the amount of goals you've won by. A few have looked as not being done and dusted until the final whistle.
 
Conte's teams are good at controlling the games. They are never really in danger of conceding.
 
GlastonSpur said:
Spurs are stuttering but United aren't?

In the last 6 matches - including two tough away games against Chelski and United - we have gained exactly the same number of points as United - 12 points - but with a better GD.

Here's another thing the league table doesn't show: United have had an easier fixture list compared to Spurs so far, yet you are still behind us.
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It's always interesting to look at the last 10 matches that the BBC show on their table :
United 4-5-1 (yes, yes we all know you have won the last 3 on the bounce). Last five 3-2-0
Spurs 4-4-2 / 3-0-2
Arsenal 5-3-2 / 3-0-2
Chelsea 10-0-0 / 5-0-0
City 5-3-2 / 3-0-2
Liverpool 6-3-1 / 2-2-1

First and most obvious point (Chelsea aside) is how difficult it is to put together long win sequences.
 
The leagues crazy and last week in Arsenal proves things can change really quickly. With all the negativity from the media about us and the positivity about Arsenal and Spurs, yet we are now only 4 points behind them.

With 5 or 6 games to go if we can get to 6 points of the lead, anything can happen. Also I'd argue our squad is deeper that anyone's when you look at the bench.
 
GlastonSpur said:
Which translates as: had a bucket load of money spent on it ... just like the season before and just like this season. This is a remarkable excuse: we didn't do well because we spent zillions on new players.

It is certainly not "clear" that United are improving relative to Spurs ... certainly the league table doesn't show that.

Nor is it "clear" that Spurs have regressed: we have more points at this stage of the season (week 17) than we did last time ... and what's more the improvement in points is more than that showed by United.
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Nope it means we have made 4 very good signings, only one of whom would be classed as 'expensive' (but who is starting to look worth every penny). But I know you get a little bee in your bonnet over United spending money they've earned. I can't help with your complex I'm afraid.

Spurs' regression is clear to see to anyone with eyes (as is United's improvement). Your standout players from last season are labouring and you are consequently dull as dishwater to watch. Your CL performance was frankly embarrassing for English football. You've picked up points in the league and remain reasonably solid but as with Arsenal up until the last couple of weeks, there's a suspicion that the results are hiding deeper issues.

The table only matters come the season's end though it is of course interesting to check in on it during the course of a season. Given United's weird run of draws I wouldn't expect us to be any higher at this point. To be so close to those above us (excluding Chelsea) despite a substantial winless run is encouraging.
 
Rafateria said:
I think it's more the nature of those wins than the amount of goals you've won by. A few have looked as not being done and dusted until the final whistle.
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Look at those games however. Sunderland we could have won by about 8 goals, but we just werent taking advantage of how utterly dire they were. Despite which we spent most of the match absolutely walking all over them. West Brom was tricky (as they always are) but we still should have had several more. Palace, tricky derby game that's never an easy one for us, but again we could have had several more than we got.

My point being that even though we weren't notching up big goal numbers, the actual performances were fine. West Brom and Palace weren't anything to write home about, but we certainly werent on the back foot for 90 minutes. Sunderland we could have walked away with 4 or 5 if we'd been a little bit sharper and it wouldn't have been a surprise based on the performance.

This isn't to say that I think we're perfect or anything. I wouldn't have been at all surprised if one of the last few had been a draw or even a loss, I was expecting it really. We're currently on the third longest streak of consecutive wins in PL history, and realistically that isn't going to last. No team just goes on hammering everyone, and even the best have plenty of matches where they do just enough to take home some points. It wasn't long ago that playing under form and just doing enough to take the 3 points was commonly referred to as the expected behaviour of potential champions.
 
CG1010 said:
Wow, talk about clutching straws.
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United having had an easier fixture list is a bit more than straw - as you may find when you come to play more of the tough away games later this season.
 
Wilson Litchmore said:
The leagues crazy and last week in Arsenal proves things can change really quickly. With all the negativity from the media about us and the positivity about Arsenal and Spurs, yet we are now only 4 points behind them.

With 5 or 6 games to go if we can get to 6 points of the lead, anything can happen. Also I'd argue our squad is deeper that anyone's when you look at the bench.
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Crikey what are you reading or watching?
 
GlastonSpur said:
United having had an easier fixture list is a bit more than straw - as you may find when you come to play more of the tough away games later this season.
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I have no qualms in accepting that you have been the better team in the first half since the table doesn't lie but but there is hardly any difference in the fixtures for United and Spurs so its a bit funny how you are using that to unnecessarily comfort yourself.
 
Rafateria said:
Away at Saints, Watford (local derby and Watford will be well up for that) and Chelsea are three very tough matches to call. It could easily be 9 points or Nul Point. I'd guess somewhere in the middle though (WLD - not calling which is which).
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I'd take 5 points, that will keep us in touch with the top 4.
 
Kraftwerker said:
... Spurs' regression is clear to see to anyone with eyes (as is United's improvement). ..
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Sadly for you your claim about Spurs "regression" is just hot air, because it doesn't square with the facts, namely:

1) Spurs have four more points (and a +3 better GD) at this stage of the season (week 17) than we did last season ... and we finished 3rd last time, 4 points clear of United.

2) The gain by Spurs in points at this stage compared to last season is 3 points more than the 1 point gain showed by United.

3) At this stage of last season Spurs were 7 points off 2nd place. Currently we are 3 points from 2nd, and even if Liverpool win tonight the gap to 2nd will only become 4 points.

The posts from some United posters - including yourself - is following a similar pattern to that of last season: a wilful ignorance of the actual facts in favour of pollyanna-esque fantasies ... until reality bites.
 
GlastonSpur said:
Sadly for you your claim about Spurs "regression" is just hot air, because it doesn't square with the facts, namely:

1) Spurs have four more points (and a +3 better GD) at this stage of the season (week 17) than we did last season ... and we finished 3rd last time, 4 points clear of United.

2) The gain by Spurs in points at this stage compared to last season is 3 points more than the 1 point gain showed by United.

3) At this stage of last season Spurs were 7 points off 2nd place. Currently we are 3 points from 2nd, and even if Liverpool win tonight the gap to 2nd will only become 4 points.

The posts from some United posters - including yourself - is following a similar pattern to that of last season: a wilful ignorance of the actual facts in favour of pollyanna-esque fantasies ... until reality bites.
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It's hardly hot air. You know as well as I do that Spurs aren't playing well.

You take a Rainman approach to football, which doesn't account for the performance level evident to anyone with eyes.

United have racked up a similar points total to last year but anyone who has watched the games wouldn't be in doubt about the gap in quality in the performances. Same with Spurs but for the opposite reason.
 
Kraftwerker said:
It's hardly hot air. You know as well as I do that Spurs aren't playing well.

You take a Rainman approach to football, which doesn't account for the performance level evident to anyone with eyes.

United have racked up a similar points total to last year but anyone who has watched the games wouldn't be in doubt about the gap in quality in the performances. Same with Spurs but for the opposite reason.
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If Spurs aren't playing well but have still amassed more 4 points than they did at this stage last season, then if I were you I'd start to worry about what will happen when Spurs hit a run of good form.

Moreover, if United are playing well, but have still regressed by 3 points compared to Spurs after week 17 this season compared to last, then if I were you I'd start to worry about what will happen when United hit a run of bad form.
 
GlastonSpur said:
If Spurs aren't playing well but have still amassed more 4 points than they did at this stage last season, then if I were you I'd start to worry about what will happen when Spurs hit a run of good form.

Moreover, if United are playing well, but have still regressed by 3 points compared to Spurs after week 17 this season compared to last, then if I were you I'd start to worry about what will happen when United hit a run of bad form.
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We already hit a very bad run of form.

Somehow we're still just 3 points behind you despite that run. Watch out...

The recent game between the sides showed a huge gulf in class. It would be a big underachievement for us to finish behind a side that poor and I will be first in line to criticise the team. Confident we won't though.
 
IF and that's a big if, Chelsea win their next 2 games before the Tottenham match, I just can't see past anyone else for the title. A 9 point gap for a team not in Europe is a massive advantage. Even when they inevitably hit a rough patch that gives them a massive margin for error.
 
Kraftwerker said:
We already hit a very bad run of form.

Somehow we're still just 3 points behind you despite that run. Watch out...

The recent game between the sides showed a huge gulf in class. It would be a big underachievement for us to finish behind a side that poor and I will be first in line to criticise the team. Confident we won't though.
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Oh dear!

It was a very dull and drab game, we are the first to admit that we played poorly and have been doing so, but to be honest you hardly looked like a top 4 side yourselves, it looked like a mid-table encounter.

The whole game lacked quality.
 
SirHenryPercy said:
Oh dear!

It was a very dull and drab game, we are the first to admit that we played poorly and have been doing so, but to be honest you hardly looked like a top 4 side yourselves, it looked like a mid-table encounter.

The whole game lacked quality.
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The game wasn't amazing but we certainly were a lot better than Spurs. Based on our recent performances we look every bit a top 4 side - I'm confident of finishing in the top 4 now. Hopefully at the expense of Arsenal! Wenger deserved it for the shit he serves up every season. I feel sorry for their fans!
 
GlastonSpur said:
Sadly for you your claim about Spurs "regression" is just hot air, because it doesn't square with the facts, namely:

1) Spurs have four more points (and a +3 better GD) at this stage of the season (week 17) than we did last season ... and we finished 3rd last time, 4 points clear of United.

2) The gain by Spurs in points at this stage compared to last season is 3 points more than the 1 point gain showed by United.

3) At this stage of last season Spurs were 7 points off 2nd place. Currently we are 3 points from 2nd, and even if Liverpool win tonight the gap to 2nd will only become 4 points.

The posts from some United posters - including yourself - is following a similar pattern to that of last season: a wilful ignorance of the actual facts in favour of pollyanna-esque fantasies ... until reality bites.
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It's worth noting that overall in 2016 we've been fairly consistent despite chucking the towel in at the end of last season.

Only Chelsea have won more games than us in 2016 and only Chelsea have lost fewer games than us in 2016. A year in which for large parts we've not played at our level.

If we do find our form we could still have a very good season.
 
It's Liverpool we need to hit a rough patch imo, Arsenals upcoming fixtures look pretty winnable, and history tells us they are unlikely to fall out of the top 4, just a shame City beat them yesterday.

If Everton could get something tonight, then it'd be game on over the Christmas period for really closing in on them.
 
fergieisold said:
The game wasn't amazing but we certainly were a lot better than Spurs. Based on our recent performances we look every bit a top 4 side - I'm confident of finishing in the top 4 now. Hopefully at the expense of Arsenal! Wenger deserved it for the shit he serves up every season. I feel sorry for their fans!
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For me it lacked quality all over the pitch, thought it was just a poor game of football played out by 2 sides who look out of form.

As for top 4, Cheksea obviously now look nailed on and then Liverpool and as much it pains me to say it Arsenal look the 2 next best.

The 4th spot I think will be between City, Spurs & Utd and I still think City hold the upper hand with the players they have to come back.
 
SirHenryPercy said:
Oh dear!

It was a very dull and drab game, we are the first to admit that we played poorly and have been doing so, but to be honest you hardly looked like a top 4 side yourselves, it looked like a mid-table encounter.

The whole game lacked quality.
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That happens when one side offers nothing going forward and thinks kicking our players off the pitch offers enough compensation for lack of creativity.
 
SirHenryPercy said:
Oh dear!

It was a very dull and drab game, we are the first to admit that we played poorly and have been doing so, but to be honest you hardly looked like a top 4 side yourselves, it looked like a mid-table encounter.

The whole game lacked quality.
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Nah, there was a clear gulf in class. It was obvious.

A 1-0 defeat was kind on Tottenham, should've been much greater.

I can see why you wouldn't have enjoyed it, we made you look like a Championship team, resorting to kicking and fouling in frustration. Did you have a single chance?
 
Chelsea look certain to be in the top 4 - Outside of them right now you could make an argument for and against Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs, City and Utd for the other 3 spots. Liverpool, Arsenal and City have the edge right now and Utd and Spurs are playing catchup. It's going to go right to the wire.
 
Kraftwerker said:
Nah, there was a clear gulf in class. It was obvious.

A 1-0 defeat was kind on Tottenham, should've been much greater.

I can see why you wouldn't have enjoyed it, we made you look like a Championship team, resorting to kicking and fouling in frustration. Did you have a single chance?
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We actually missed the easiest chance, anyway it encourages me that quite a few of you guys think that you are playing well, you watch more than me so it makes me confident that your levels are pretty low which is what I thought when I watched against Everton and West Ham (I think it was), which I thought were equally as low in quality as the Spurs game.

As for kicking and fouling I didn't realise that you lot were so soft, surprises me that.
 
We've managed to give ourselves a slim chance of top 4 thanks to the last 3 results. For me Chelsea and Liverpool are certainties. City will probably do enough, leaving us as outsiders with Arsenal and Spurs for the last spot, which could be interesting given the fixtures at the end of the season.
 
SirHenryPercy said:
We actually missed the easiest chance, anyway it encourages me that quite a few of you guys think that you are playing well, you watch more than me so it makes me confident that your levels are pretty low which is what I thought when I watched against Everton and West Ham (I think it was), which I thought were equally as low in quality as the Spurs game.

As for kicking and fouling I didn't realise that you lot were so soft, surprises me that.
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Regardless of your narrow perspective from a couple of games, we're playing much better than Spurs, Arsenal and City currently. I don't think that's controversial. Those are the sides we're looking to supplant so that's all that matters.

I don't like to see players being injured but I wasn't unhappy to see your players lose their cool. It hammered home the gulf in class, that you saw that as your only way to 'compete'. Think our players handled it well. It doesn't take a hardman to start kicking out at opponents at the end of game, it takes a coward who has lost their cool from being outplayed, and doesn't have faith in their footballing ability to restore parity.

If you were a good side you'd have stopped kicking out and tried to actually create more than a single chance.
 
I expect us to finish ahead Spurs now that they'll be playing EL games too. And if a team is to drop out of the top 4, I think it will be either Arsenal or City.
 
GlastonSpur said:
United having had an easier fixture list is a bit more than straw - as you may find when you come to play more of the tough away games later this season.
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Except we haven't really. Both have played 2 of the top 4 at home and two away. Should Liverpool win tonight as expected we'll have played each of the top two away from home. Spurs have played one more home game than United and given Spurs wretched away form that should be a concern for Tottenham. You've also played every team in the bottom 7. Utd still have two of those teams coming up. Your opinion boils down to the fact Spurs have been to Old Trafford. Which is strange given you're at pains to tell us all how bad Utd are.
 
I'm encouraged by the recent form of City, Tottenham and Arsenal. They are all showing signs of being off the pace.

We do at least have an opportunity to capitalise - now that we ourselves are showing form.

If I was an Arsenal fan, I'd be deeply concerned by the second half performance against City. If that wasn't simply the result of fatigue, then they're at risk of doing what everyone expects of them. I couldn't quite believe how bad they were - genuinely one of the poorest 45 minutes from a top PL team that I can recall.
 
acnumber9 said:
Except we haven't really. Both have played 2 of the top 4 at home and two away. Should Liverpool win tonight as expected we'll have played each of the top two away from home. Spurs have played one more home game than United and given Spurs wretched away form that should be a concern for Tottenham. You've also played every team in the bottom 7. Utd still have two of those teams coming up. Your opinion boils down to the fact Spurs have been to Old Trafford. Which is strange given you're at pains to tell us all how bad Utd are.
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Spurs haven't played at Anfield like us.

Essentially he's talking shite, not that it needs to be said.
 
Kraftwerker said:
Spurs haven't played at Anfield like us.

Essentially he's talking shite, not that it needs to be said.
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I know, I was just referring to Utd there though probably didn't make it that clear. Utd actually have more points away from home than they do at home anyway. Spurs away form would be cause for concern.
 
Rooney in Paris said:
What the hell has noting that Spurs players were trying to foul their way through the match got to do with being soft, exactly?
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You should remember that this is the poster who was trying to defend Spurs behaviour last season after we cost them the title and they spent the game kicking lumps out of everyone in sight.
 
Leftback99 said:
We've managed to give ourselves a slim chance of top 4 thanks to the last 3 results. For me Chelsea and Liverpool are certainties. City will probably do enough, leaving us as outsiders with Arsenal and Spurs for the last spot, which could be interesting given the fixtures at the end of the season.
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A slim chance? I'd be very disappointed if we don't finish 4th now.
 
So the gap between us and 4th is now just 4 points. It's at the point where we don't need to worry about the teams above us. Just do our thing and we will secure 4th comfortably.
 
The playing in Europe thing is a complete load of horse sh1te. Its neither a pro or a con. Its an excuse if a team playing in Europe gets beat, that's it.

Have a look at league title winners over the last 20 years in England, Spain, Italy, Germany and Portugal.....the league title winners are usually semi-finalists in the champions league too.

We wont be far away.

It goes without saying that Sunderland and Middlesbrough need to be put away with out much fuss. Equally, West ham. Hopefully Pogba picks up a couple of yellows and serves his suspension against Reading / Hull.

I am hopeful, no confident in fact, that come the afternoon of January 15th we'll be in the next round of the cup, up in a two legged semi final and positioned top 4 in the league.

February and March are "on paper" easy months and we need to cement that position, win the league cup and go into Spring and the run in full of confidence and momentum.
 
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