Thought he was very good. Especially defensively, always hard in a 2 against a team like Arsenal but him and Carrick closed the gaps very well.
Tom Cleverley | 2012-14 Performances
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Tonight he looked a bit more back to the old self. If he can build on this, and improve his attacking ability he might be able to rescue his career here.
Chelsea at home and Sunderland away (league) two very mature defensive performances. Something he's improved on this season, especially re positioning.
Did more defensively today which is a positive but we need more from his distribution.
He was better than Carrick tonight IMO, comfortably.
It was as good a performance from Cleverley as I've ever seen. Which leads me to my next question: Should this be the role we now deploy Cleverley in? I honestly can't think of a better performance from him, although I'm not his biggest fan.
He did alright, like a lot of our players, they were more motivated than normal, imo because they were playing ars, there is a historical thing there engrained, not cos they were suddenly playing for Moyes, he put himself about while making no telling contribution either defensively or while we were attacking.
Fair play to him. He was very good today. I think ut helped that we were more compact than normal so he could play those quick pass and move short passes that he likes.
Decent from Clev tonight.
Chelsea 0-0 at home. Arsenal earlier in the season came on as a sub at half-time when we were 1-0. Now Arsenal 0-0. Each time Cleverley put in a good performance, disciplined, plenty of challenges, passing fine though not particularly adventurous. If a draw is a reasonable result or we already have the lead then Cleverley can do a decent job for us. He was fine in Villa 3-1 and Fulham 3-1 before going off injured but over the last two seasons, the lack of creativity is a major concern. It is telling that when Moyes needs a goal, Cleverley is one of the players that he will typically take-off.
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He seems to always do pretty well in big games. Its just that, he's not actually that great so he's not a difference maker, he just puts in good displays. Also for your central midfielder, you want consistency and somebody who can do it every game. Not sure if its a motivation issue but he always changes his level enough to look like an average/decent player no matter who he plays against. Put him against the bottom side in the league and he'll play like he's just an average player at a lower position side. Put him against a team like Arsenal and he raises his game all the time.
Did what is expected of a CM, nothing more, nothing less.
Im not a huge cleverely fan but on tonight's performance i thought he was ok, didnt do anything that would be considered special. I read the skysports analysis of his performance and it is pretty accurate.
Looks a good player to me, I hope the management aren't as knee jerk as the fans and give the guy time and a good platform to develop. Young players have dips in performance especially when surrounded by more senior players who are struggling.
I'm not sure if he'll ever be someone to run the game but I think he'd provide great foil for another CM to thrive in and do well himself.
I'm not sure if he'll ever be someone to run the game but I think he'd provide great foil for another CM to thrive in and do well himself.
True, he's had some major dips recently, but I think that's down to a lack of confidence in the management, and the lack of a quality midfielder with him.
Does the smart, sensible things well, and from what i saw a couple of seasons ago and at Wigan, has that extra dash of ability to make a difference.
It's fashionable to pick on Tom. For me he's far from our biggest problem and I think it's unfair to expect him to lift our CM while an experienced pro like Carrick has gone into full-on shell/hiding mode.
He's played well in a few games this season. The Arsenal game was hardly standalone. He played well against Chelsea at home, Fulham away (before he hot double vision and was subbed off), Sunderland away and Villa away just off the top of my head.
The criticism he gets is so OTT and I can accept and admit that he's has a few below par performances but I can't think of anyone in our team who hasn't this season. People seem to unfairly judge him on some ideal rather than accepting his qualities for what they are.
One thing I don't think we have done enough this season is play to the strengths of the players we have here atm. We are persisting with a style/system regardless of the fact that it suits very few (if any) of our players. When playing so spread out and far apart there's no way Cleverley short passing and moving strengths will come to the fore. He's able to affect the tempo and get on the ball much more when we play more compact and it's no surprise to me that some of his best games have come with Rooney playing a bit deeper.
I don't think the way we are playing is getting the best out of Carrick either, but that's a separate issue for another thread!
The criticism he gets is so OTT and I can accept and admit that he's has a few below par performances but I can't think of anyone in our team who hasn't this season. People seem to unfairly judge him on some ideal rather than accepting his qualities for what they are.
One thing I don't think we have done enough this season is play to the strengths of the players we have here atm. We are persisting with a style/system regardless of the fact that it suits very few (if any) of our players. When playing so spread out and far apart there's no way Cleverley short passing and moving strengths will come to the fore. He's able to affect the tempo and get on the ball much more when we play more compact and it's no surprise to me that some of his best games have come with Rooney playing a bit deeper.
I don't think the way we are playing is getting the best out of Carrick either, but that's a separate issue for another thread!
Was very good in the second half against City too. Although you can be forgiven for wiping that game from your memory.
Agree that Rooney's apparent reluctance to drop deep is an issue. Seems to have got worse since we signed Mata. Just posted about it in the Mata thread.
I was very pleased with him defensively vs Arsenal. Hopefully in Dubai, he and the team will work on their offensive game as a unit
It is true that Rooney playing 10 like a striker is a big issue if we stick to 4-4-2 with static (as in non rotatable) wingers.
Yeah, I remember making that point at the time, I think we moved to a midfield three when he came on. The rhetoric on here though was that he wasn't particularly good, City just stopped trying
I'm surprised Rooney's recent form hasn't been discussed more. Maybe people are just filing it under one of his slow returns from injury but he does seem to be pushing up more than before.
LR7, to be fair to Rooney, he does take few games to get going after injury. Me thinks he, Mata and RVP will benefit massively from the break we will have from league football. They can use it to work on their understanding with each other, plus fitness
This is true. And encouraging. We've all been tearing our hair out about how on earth we can look so blunt in attack with Rooney, RvP and Mata in the same team. Sometimes it's the most simple explanations that make the most sense. Rooney and RvP are feeling their way back into the team after a longish stint out injured and Mata's only been training with his new team for a few weeks, after spending most of the season playing very little football at all. So we shouldn't really be surprised that the three of them have not looked very sharp.
I don't think he's been nearly as bad as a lot of people have made out, but equally he hasn't really trained on that much either. If he was at another club I doubt very much that we'd be interested at the moment. But I think he can improve an awful lot in the next couple of years, given the chance.
What I like the most is they've still done the most damage as unsharp as they've been. Surely they can get better
He only started to look really poor for me when he was being overplayed at the beginning of the yaer... he played a stupid amount of games in a really short period of time - and it showed.
To that end, it's no surprise he looked decent agaainst Arsenal after having a good rest... hopefully he kicks on from here.
To that end, it's no surprise he looked decent agaainst Arsenal after having a good rest... hopefully he kicks on from here.
Whenever he does ok I can't help but think back to the Sunderland semi in the cup, one of the worst performances I have ever seen from a United player it was unbelievable. Lacks composure, strength, shooting and even alot of his passing over 10 yards is poor. For me hes had 2 good games the first was against chelsea early in the season and the second was against arsenal. Both games were 0-0 games where neither team was particularly going for the win all out and they were nice games for him to perform in. They were against top clubs which isnfsir enough.
The problem I have with cleverly is whenever the pressure is on (away games or vital must wins) he hides and gets his head down every time or just has a shocker (ala sunderland) its just not good enough at all. Squad player at the very best but there are such better options out there.
The problem I have with cleverly is whenever the pressure is on (away games or vital must wins) he hides and gets his head down every time or just has a shocker (ala sunderland) its just not good enough at all. Squad player at the very best but there are such better options out there.
The abuse he gets from United and opposition fans is ridiculous IMO. I think the hatred comes from the fact he got in the England side for so long, I agree that he isn't worthy of that yet. He is a decent player, with potential to be good, I'm happy with him as a squad player
It was a competent display. Nothing praiseworthy. Moyes' tactics require midfielders to stay deep and pass it to the widemen. I'm sure he will be happy playing under those circumstances. Nothing to test him as a player.
Short passing and moving with a good tempo is what Cleverley is good at so those tactics won't get the best out of him at all.
Based on his last interview he is quite happy passing it sideways. And anyway he is the only midfielder in the world who is praised for the 5 passes and movement whilst having no other ability. At least Busquets, De Jong, Barry, Martinez are good to great defensive midfielders.
Maybe if we played through the centre of the pitch more we'd see more variability from our CMs. Even Carrick who's forward passes were a highlight last season is hardly making them anymore and that can only be to do with how we are playing.
He's been poor in general this season. He was good against Arsenal though and as has been said, has shown glimpses of what he's capable of on a few occasions. Not enough yet though. Needs to really step up if he's going to be a part of the future here.
Potentially the best midfield player in Britain. So said SAF
Clearly you havent taken in to account the quality of the Arsenal midfield he was competing with.
Arteta, Wilshere, Ozil. Good but not scary midfield. Praise should be reserved for when a player does something exceptional or at least shows significant improvement.
Cleverley said he watches Spanish football but, have to wonder if he watches his own performances.
As the above article points out he himself is saying his work goes under the radar, he isn't dribbling and scoring then there is something quite big missing for a player that should be at the center of everything good about United's play. Unless absolutely restricted by the staff then he needs to now before it's too late for him here, start taking more risk. Those Spanish players don't just pass sideways and get applauded, they also make some very incisive plays to go along with that possession safe football. He has it in his locker, either he actually gets above the radar or he will never ever be backed by his own fans the way he wants or expects.
A home grown talent but, at the moment is very lacking in a department the team really need someone to step up in.
As the above article points out he himself is saying his work goes under the radar, he isn't dribbling and scoring then there is something quite big missing for a player that should be at the center of everything good about United's play. Unless absolutely restricted by the staff then he needs to now before it's too late for him here, start taking more risk. Those Spanish players don't just pass sideways and get applauded, they also make some very incisive plays to go along with that possession safe football. He has it in his locker, either he actually gets above the radar or he will never ever be backed by his own fans the way he wants or expects.
A home grown talent but, at the moment is very lacking in a department the team really need someone to step up in.
Its important for him to try and run the ball and to be a threat from outside the box. This is what opens up the opportunities to slot a teammate in. Cleverley isnt very strong protecting the ball when he takes it forward into space so he needs to improve that too. He does need to chip in with a couple of goals but that isnt the main thing hes lacking.
He hasn't got the courage of the spanish players or the ability to control the ball in tight situations. He's only happy to receive the ball when he's in acres of space and then he will play a sideways pass.
Most top CM's-AM's are happy to receive the ball with a man close by or in a tight space, when Cleverely does receive it in these situations, his control and footballing brain aren't quite good enough and he surrenders possession most of the time.
Most top CM's-AM's are happy to receive the ball with a man close by or in a tight space, when Cleverely does receive it in these situations, his control and footballing brain aren't quite good enough and he surrenders possession most of the time.
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