Just your regular moaner, nothing to see. Out of touch with reality and mad at our ‘useless board’ for not being able to sign our targets mid-season.
Toby Collyer
- Thread starter Adnan
- Start date
Just your regular moaner, nothing to see. Out of touch with reality and mad at our ‘useless board’ for not being able to sign our targets mid-season.
Does he join immediately or in the summer?
I think that's the problem. He has a great game. Then will resort to being utter shite for the next 5.
Sorted
So you are unhappy that we have signed one of the most talented midfielders in the country....quite
We already have 2 of the most talented in Garnacho, and Mejbri but will they get their chance.
feck me if he's only half as good as Pogba for Utdcwe need to feck him off straight away. I hope he's a lot better than Pogba is for Utd.
Collyer isn't even an England regular let alone a captain or key player. He only has 1 official appearance at u16 level and might have played in an unofficial training camp game for the u17s.
Garnacho isn’t a midfielder.
Whatever I don't know nothing about him. I was answering someone saying if he's only half as good as Pogba.
I don’t know about being a captain but he was regularly involved in the u16s.
u16s doesn’t have “official” competitions so not sure what 1 appearance you’re referring to, but he has a number of apps in friendlies. Almost exclusively starts.
Official competitions start at u17s but they were all cancelled due to Covid for his u17 year so he can hardly appear in non-existing matches. He was involved in at least a few friendlies for the u17s against club sides.
His coach throughout those levels was Justin Cochrane too, so he wouldn’t be poaching him if he weren’t one of his key players.
Which post-covid u17 or u18 official squads has he been in? I see nothing to suggest that he's a key player for England.
That bit about Cochrane is interesting, hopefully that will help him settle relatively quickly.
Was a lot of good things being said about Cochrane when we brought him in, hopefully this can be another one.
He was in the u19s squad last Summer playing a year up so he's definitely highly rated by England. The games were cancelled though & they just ended up playing a friendly match between the squad, Fish, McNeill & Hugill were all involved in it as well. He also has definitely captained England at his own age level but it probably isn't on the likes of transfermarkt stats because they were u16s games & can be difficult to get proper details from those games.
Imagine Garnacho dyes his hair blonde and Brandon Williams comes back in the 11. With the three of them- the defense would be so confused !
Fair enough. I'm not convinced he's considered a key player for England though so expectations should be tempered. Is there any reason why he wouldn't be selected recently, maybe he was injured or perhaps it was Cochrane alone that really rated him in the setup? That would explain why we've signed him and why he's not been called up recently.
Of course none of that means that he won't be a good player. Jarrod Bowen has no caps for England at any level and has become a better player than most that have.
He hasn't been called up since last summer because he wasn't playing for Brighton & he wasn't playing for Brighton because he turned down a professional contract with them.
I'm looking forward to seeing what this kid can offer. Is he expected to be knocking on the first team door anytime soon or is he strictly one for the U-23s for the foreseeable future?
Unless you have been watching Brighton Academy games behind closed door for the last three years I don't think anyone really knows anything about the qualities of Collyer.
So, from a United perspective, the coaches think he is good enough to join the club and as supporters we will just have to wait and see when he finally features in some games.
All I know is that he played half a game in a friendly against Huddersfield Town in early February whilst on trial which no-one watched as it was behind closed doors and not televised.
So, from a United perspective, the coaches think he is good enough to join the club and as supporters we will just have to wait and see when he finally features in some games.
All I know is that he played half a game in a friendly against Huddersfield Town in early February whilst on trial which no-one watched as it was behind closed doors and not televised.
Garnacho can play on both wings AND in centre.
He’s a forward, calling him a midfielder would be like calling Dybala a midfielder. More to the point I’m not even sure I can remember a game he’s played as the AM since he joined (according to TM he actually has once against Everton), off the top of my head he’s pretty much only played LW/RW. Mainoo, Gore, Oyedele and Hansen are the midfielders in that group.
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In an effort to learn more about Toby Collyer, we spoke to former Brighton academy U18 head coach Mark Beard.
Q. What type of player was Toby Collyer?
A; “An all round midfielder. Has a fantastic engine and is a really intelligent footballer. He reads the game very well and breaks teams attacks up excellently. On the ball he is good and keeps it very simple. Physically he runs 13k a game. Unreal stats from someone so young.
“He’s quick, needs building up a bit physically but that will come with age.”
Q. Were you playing him as the holding midfielder?
A; “Defensive midfield. He needs to work on his tackling, that’s one weakness, can sometimes not be aggressive enough and won’t win enough 50/50 duels. But his anticipation of play is very good.“
Q. Which players was he modeling his game at or which player does he have the same profile with?
A; “It’s hard to describe who he is similar to. He’s one of them players that you don’t realise how good he is until when he doesn’t play in a match. You realise he does all the stuff other players don’t like to do, so in a team he’ll always be effective as he is so important to the team.“
Q. In terms of playstyle, who would you say he resembles from past midfielders? Can we say a young Sergio Busquets or Michae Carrick, or is he different?
A; “He’s more like a Carrick. If he improves his tackling could easily become a Busquets.“
Q. What type of character does he have?
A; “Very quiet but such a lovely lad. Commands respect from all of the players by the way he conducts himself. He’s the perfect pro.“
Q. He was the England captain on the youth ranks, what type of leader was he?
A; “Silent leader, leads by actions rather than words.“
Q. Would you have been able to convince him to stay ata Brighton if he was going to leave last year?
A; “No, Manchester United is the best club in the world and you can’t pass up opportunities like that.“
Q. If Toby was regarded as one of the best talents in England, why did he chose to go to Manchester United, when there are some questions about their current development process?
A; “I know Chelsea and West Ham were also interested. He trained for two weeks at United and he loved it. I think he trusts himself enough of his own ability and he will show them what he can do. The rest will take care of itself.“
Q. Which player impressed you the most when you played against Manchester United?
A. “Hannibal Mejbri.”
Q. What message do you have for Manchester United fans regarding Toby Collyer?
A; “Toby is a fantastic player with an unbelievable attitude. He will be fantastic for Man United as he is a winner and has the high standards you need to be a Manchester United player.“
We don’t want to put too much pressure on Collyer, but if he continues on the upward trajectory under Neil Wood, Neil Ryan, Justin Cochrane and Travis Binnion – all we can say is Manchester United have got a very good first team quality prospect in Toby Collyer.
Q. What type of player was Toby Collyer?
A; “An all round midfielder. Has a fantastic engine and is a really intelligent footballer. He reads the game very well and breaks teams attacks up excellently. On the ball he is good and keeps it very simple. Physically he runs 13k a game. Unreal stats from someone so young.
“He’s quick, needs building up a bit physically but that will come with age.”
Q. Were you playing him as the holding midfielder?
A; “Defensive midfield. He needs to work on his tackling, that’s one weakness, can sometimes not be aggressive enough and won’t win enough 50/50 duels. But his anticipation of play is very good.“
Q. Which players was he modeling his game at or which player does he have the same profile with?
A; “It’s hard to describe who he is similar to. He’s one of them players that you don’t realise how good he is until when he doesn’t play in a match. You realise he does all the stuff other players don’t like to do, so in a team he’ll always be effective as he is so important to the team.“
Q. In terms of playstyle, who would you say he resembles from past midfielders? Can we say a young Sergio Busquets or Michae Carrick, or is he different?
A; “He’s more like a Carrick. If he improves his tackling could easily become a Busquets.“
Q. What type of character does he have?
A; “Very quiet but such a lovely lad. Commands respect from all of the players by the way he conducts himself. He’s the perfect pro.“
Q. He was the England captain on the youth ranks, what type of leader was he?
A; “Silent leader, leads by actions rather than words.“
Q. Would you have been able to convince him to stay ata Brighton if he was going to leave last year?
A; “No, Manchester United is the best club in the world and you can’t pass up opportunities like that.“
Q. If Toby was regarded as one of the best talents in England, why did he chose to go to Manchester United, when there are some questions about their current development process?
A; “I know Chelsea and West Ham were also interested. He trained for two weeks at United and he loved it. I think he trusts himself enough of his own ability and he will show them what he can do. The rest will take care of itself.“
Q. Which player impressed you the most when you played against Manchester United?
A. “Hannibal Mejbri.”
Q. What message do you have for Manchester United fans regarding Toby Collyer?
A; “Toby is a fantastic player with an unbelievable attitude. He will be fantastic for Man United as he is a winner and has the high standards you need to be a Manchester United player.“
We don’t want to put too much pressure on Collyer, but if he continues on the upward trajectory under Neil Wood, Neil Ryan, Justin Cochrane and Travis Binnion – all we can say is Manchester United have got a very good first team quality prospect in Toby Collyer.
Can he play as a number 9? Or, has he played as a number 9?
It happens at every club that when a youth player (or first team player more often than not) is about to leave then they don’t get played. That’s likely the situation Collyer has been in so I wouldn’t count that against him. You don’t captain England at youth level (a successful age group for that matter) without being a very good player.
This is quite worrying though from a first team perspective - I hope we still buy a DM and don’t wait a year or 2 to see if Collyer can step up.
This is quite worrying though from a first team perspective - I hope we still buy a DM and don’t wait a year or 2 to see if Collyer can step up.
I'm tipping this lad to have a good season (injury permitting). Very classy player who can pass very well with both feet and has a good engine.
In the Bundesliga Cup in Germany over the weekend, he started two matches in midfield and came on at half-time in the other, playing as a centre-half.
Did ok without standing out.
I really rate this kid. We never seem to bring through defensive or holding midfielders though and don’t really set up to allow those types of players to thrive in the younger teams. We like two central midfield all rounders rather than one disciplined and one with more freedom. It’s been a big reason why Oyedele hasn’t played much despite his obvious ability in a holding role IMO.
Maxi Oyedele played the most minutes of any midfielder in the 18s last season, he played virtually every match.
He is also very much well rounded too. He covers loads of ground and joins in attacks with driving runs (scored doing it just yesterday), he doesn’t just sit deep like Collyer.
Yep. Oyedele was noticeably playing much further forward in the competition. He looked really good in that role.
Thanks for that, but I have now watched a few of his games whilst he was playing for Brighton where he was excellent and displayed a very broad range of passing ability with both feet and a engine to match.
Preaseason is also a way of building up fitness for the new season and I personally don't pay much attention to those games as far as performance goes.
@Davie Moyes
I've only watched Collyer play about 3 or 4 times but he stood out every single time I watched him play. To some people the performances of Collyer may not have been stand out, but for me he stood out due to his ability to play as a deep lying playmaker and exhibit his technical ability which was very obvious imo. He's comfortable on the ball and pings passes with both feet with consumate ease and is very capable of taking the ball on the half turn superbly well. He comes across as a very talented young midfielder who is also very intelligent on the pitch.
Who does he remind me off? There's a long way to go for him, but for me there's a bit of Carrick and a bit of Scholes in his game. A bit of Carrick due to him being a deep-lying playmaker and a bit of Scholes due to his ability to play on the half turn and advance play through the thirds.
The video below gives a glimpse of what I'm talking about.
I've only watched Collyer play about 3 or 4 times but he stood out every single time I watched him play. To some people the performances of Collyer may not have been stand out, but for me he stood out due to his ability to play as a deep lying playmaker and exhibit his technical ability which was very obvious imo. He's comfortable on the ball and pings passes with both feet with consumate ease and is very capable of taking the ball on the half turn superbly well. He comes across as a very talented young midfielder who is also very intelligent on the pitch.
Who does he remind me off? There's a long way to go for him, but for me there's a bit of Carrick and a bit of Scholes in his game. A bit of Carrick due to him being a deep-lying playmaker and a bit of Scholes due to his ability to play on the half turn and advance play through the thirds.
The video below gives a glimpse of what I'm talking about.
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Thanks for that Adnan, really interesting. The young man seems to have a really nice weight of pass on him and also decent physicality. From that short video, he looks to have something about him…
Thanks Adnan. Appreciate the detailed analysis.
Wow a hybrid of Scholes/Carrick would be a dream for us if he could develop into a decent player. I appreciate we are talking style of player here and not talent. Like you say though deep lying playmakers are crucial in today's game and the good ones cost a bomb.
What took him so long to make his debut? 9 months since we signed him is that correct?
Made his debut in April this year against Wolves for the u18s a month or so after signing
Don’t wanna burst the weird hype on here but he’s like our 5th choice CM at U21s level so I think you guys do need to manage your expectation.
He has qualities to build on and I would love to see him play more but I would rate Oyedele higher before talking about the likes of Mainoo.
He has qualities to build on and I would love to see him play more but I would rate Oyedele higher before talking about the likes of Mainoo.
Trained with the first team today:
Get down The Tony Collyer and load up that plate!
That’s weird. Has he been featuring for the U21s at all this season?