Thiago Alcantara | Pool bound

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Jim Beam said:
Where is Messi?
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At City or at Barca depending on court ruling

bond19821982 said:
Makes me wonder how people don't get the basics of defending.

With that lineup, we would be slaughtered.
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I see Pogba as playing deep and not going forward just like he did after lockdown, and I see Thiago sitting deep too, the whole point of the line-up in that case is VDB and Bruno are the players who get forward.

Rashford we already know its happy to track back, Sancho is used to running at Dortmund perhaps not as far back as Rashford goes.

4 midfielders is hardly the end of the world, people make the assumption all would go forward, that's not the case.

Matic doesn't go forward either he sits in the back four when the full-backs go forward in the current system, a back 3 doesn't mean that a team is exposed.

Some teams for instance like a Barca of old had Xavi deeper, Busquets sitting in the back 4 but Alves and Alba played like wingers it was a back 2 and a back 3 at times but they had a successful era of football (obviously they had the best midfield in the world and the GOAT) but the point is teams can play a back 3 and a big midfield and it's not as bad as people think it is it depends on the personnel and the system.

A 4-4-2 wouldn't work with some teams either, nor would a 4-2-3-1 if you have the wrong players then the system can be wrong.

I'm certainly not saying I'm right, but I'm saying that football changes even in possession and out of possession it changes.

A player like Thiago and Pogba sitting back is hardly 'not defensive' even if they aren't 'pure CDMs' or destroyers like people seem to want at times.

Matic won't play every game we know that.
 
I'm surprised Bayern are happy to sell for just 30 million. I mean, the value of keeping a player to your CL success should surely be greater than 30 million.
 
croadyman said:
Yeah the sooner they make that offer we can move on to realistic targets although those are looking a bit sparse right now
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Well if the club is waiting on this one to conclude before acting on others, that would be daft as feck. But I doubt that's happening.

I mean, I'd rather just pay up for Sancho than spend a huge chunk of the wage budget on Thiago anyway. The former is a much more crucial signing that's getting away from us.
 
dwd said:
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It makes sense Thiago's camp would entertain discussions with United, even if to show Liverpool what potential wages he could earn elsewhere and incase the deal with Liverpool falls through. The lack of contact between clubs tells me they were just informal discussions.

He will be a Liverpool player soon.
 
Pace Abuser said:
It makes sense Thiago's camp would entertain discussions with United, even if to show Liverpool what potential wages he could earn elsewhere and incase the deal with Liverpool falls through. He will be a Liverpool player soon.
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Yeah pretty sure we will be shutting a thread on this guy soon for the second time
 
hellhunter said:
Basically every report out there under the sun. And probably the sun as well.
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It was the same for VDB, yet he is ours. This year is quite unusual, and given we are no longer in a position to sign some shit players (we have loads already), it’s pretty clear we will only try for good ones. He ticks all the boxes, and it is laughable to think that the choice of Liverpool over Man Utd is an obvious one. Certainly not from a commercial perspective, any player would have earned times more from his image rights being at United (and we can clearly pay higher wage too)
 
It's not about the money I think. Depending on which reports you believe we offered him 15-20M € per year (I think 13-17M€ is more realistic) on a 4 year contract.

People tell me Liverpool's highest earners only make 12M € per year. We definitely offered him more than that.
 
TheNewEra said:
At City or at Barca depending on court ruling



I see Pogba as playing deep and not going forward just like he did after lockdown, and I see Thiago sitting deep too, the whole point of the line-up in that case is VDB and Bruno are the players who get forward.

Rashford we already know its happy to track back, Sancho is used to running at Dortmund perhaps not as far back as Rashford goes.

4 midfielders is hardly the end of the world, people make the assumption all would go forward, that's not the case.

Matic doesn't go forward either he sits in the back four when the full-backs go forward in the current system, a back 3 doesn't mean that a team is exposed.

Some teams for instance like a Barca of old had Xavi deeper, Busquets sitting in the back 4 but Alves and Alba played like wingers it was a back 2 and a back 3 at times but they had a successful era of football (obviously they had the best midfield in the world and the GOAT) but the point is teams can play a back 3 and a big midfield and it's not as bad as people think it is it depends on the personnel and the system.

A 4-4-2 wouldn't work with some teams either, nor would a 4-2-3-1 if you have the wrong players then the system can be wrong.

I'm certainly not saying I'm right, but I'm saying that football changes even in possession and out of possession it changes.

A player like Thiago and Pogba sitting back is hardly 'not defensive' even if they aren't 'pure CDMs' or destroyers like people seem to want at times.

Matic won't play every game we know that.
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Thats not how defending works though. Who will defend the wings ? If it's a 3 man defence you have lot of space on the wings. If the oppositions overloads the wing, you will be left with 2 against 1 with Rashford and Sancho as wing backs which by itself is a laughable proposition.

Please, let's not even compare with that Barca side. That was one of the best teams ever to play the game and both defends quite well. They were actual full backs and not forwards like Rashford or Sancho.
 
Bazi said:
People tell me Liverpool's highest earners only make 12M € per year. We definitely offered him more than that.
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But United may pay more than Liverpool, at least for certain players...
 
Alemar said:
But United may pay more than Liverpool, at least for certain players...
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The question boils down to whether Thiago wants to join Liverpool or the EPL in general.
 
Bazi said:
It's not about the money I think. Depending on which reports you believe we offered him 15-20M € per year (I think 13-17M€ is more realistic) on a 4 year contract.

People tell me Liverpool's highest earners only make 12M € per year. We definitely offered him more than that.
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Yeah that does suggest he is willing to take a pay cut to join Liverpool which proves how much he obviously wants to go there and nowhere else
 
Bazi said:
It's not about the money I think. Depending on which reports you believe we offered him 15-20M € per year (I think 13-17M€ is more realistic) on a 4 year contract.

People tell me Liverpool's highest earners only make 12M € per year. We definitely offered him more than that.
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I think so too, I think the issue is the fee and the wages, the wage structure isn't something Liverpool want to break.

Most of Liverpools star players contracts expire in 2023, meaning next year they'll be having renewal talks, if Thiago is on more they will want to be on more too.

Salah, Mane, Firminho, Van Dijk the majority of the squad are all expiring in 2023, Wijnaldum is next year so obviously he's moving on now.

Thiago doesn't want Bayern because he's won everything, it's the same reason he won't go to Barca. He wants to win the Premier League.

Obviously Liverpool is an instant chance of winning the league, City have other considerations, Chelsea have spent too much now to buy him, Havertz mainly is the player you want to build around.

Thiago obviously Liverpool is the #1 destination, as a United fan too you have to say it it's a really good move. It's also his livelihood, if he can get better money and wages elsewhere (a couple million more a year) then why not go to the place paying you more, especially if they are going to be having a title challenge soon too.

Liverpool just need to pay the player the money he wants.
 
TheNewEra said:
I think so too, I think the issue is the fee and the wages, the wage structure isn't something Liverpool want to break.

Most of Liverpools star players contracts expire in 2023, meaning next year they'll be having renewal talks, if Thiago is on more they will want to be on more too.

Salah, Mane, Firminho, Van Dijk the majority of the squad are all expiring in 2023, Wijnaldum is next year so obviously he's moving on now.

Thiago doesn't want Bayern because he's won everything, it's the same reason he won't go to Barca. He wants to win the Premier League.

Obviously Liverpool is an instant chance of winning the league, City have other considerations, Chelsea have spent too much now to buy him, Havertz mainly is the player you want to build around.

Thiago obviously Liverpool is the #1 destination, as a United fan too you have to say it it's a really good move. It's also his livelihood, if he can get better money and wages elsewhere (a couple million more a year) then why not go to the place paying you more, especially if they are going to be having a title challenge soon too.

Liverpool just need to pay the player the money he wants.
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The issue is definitely not his wages, if he wasn't willing to accept what we offered him we wouldn't be trying to negiotate with Bayern anyway. And reliable journalists have already said that personal terms have already been agreed upon.
 
Mickeza said:
I think Thiago is class but what I would say is they’ve been very different in how they’ve approached the Thiago situation than the Alaba one. They’re almost begging a team to pay the asking price with Thiago but with Alaba they’re trying to offer him a shed ton more money and seem desperate for him to stay.
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Yes I agree but Bayern are very strange when it comes to these deals she sometimes it feels like they like some players more than others but based on talent or performance. They gave Kroos a shit deal back in the days and mostly based on that Kroos openly said he preferred to stay longer on loan at Leverkusen than to come back. Kroos refused to sign the deal won the WC and signed for Real right after that. I have a feeling it's more based on Thiago's wishes to leave that they aren't bothered, Alaba is one of them but Thiago is one of Peps.
 
WIjnaldum rumored to be done pretty much to Barca, they have agreed terms it seem. Probably mean this is done and sealed soon.
 
Bazi said:
People tell me Liverpool's highest earners only make 12M € per year.
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Not if you factor in bonuses, etc. Our total wage budget is not much lower than yours. Probably more incentivised than most though, given the low figures often reported for basic salary compared to our competitors.
 
It's been quite amusing to see how Fjortoft has reported this move compared to how he has the Sancho > United one. Such a biased little cnut.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Is there a bit overrating of Thiago happening? I mean, he was clearly excellent in the knockout rounds of the CL but has he been consistently brilliant year in year out to put him up with the best of the generation? Or has he completely fulfilled his potential only the last year or so, and before that injuries etc held him back. As I know he has always been very talented but Barca did let him go and this is the first time you can say that Bayern have had the best midfield in Europe. Can't remember anyone thinking their midfield was better than that of Madrid for example, before this.
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Nope, he's always been this brilliant. One player doesn't make a midfield unit. One player doesn't make a team win or lose. A player should be judged on their own merits and if anyone has bothered to do that and concluded that he's anything less than a brilliant player than there's something wrong with them.

Fact is Bayern is seen as an irrelevant club on a week to week basis because of their dominance. Same applies to Juve and PSG. No one really pays attention to their games all that much. It's not like the prem where players get blown up for dictating games against the likes of Norwich.
 
croadyman said:
Feintest flicker of a muppet hope is still there until he agrees deal with them
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One can hope. He'll give us vital Champions league experience. I think he knows his chances of winning the premier league are far higher at Liverpool so it's a sensible decision in that respect.
 
Trophy Room said:
One can hope. He'll give us vital Champions league experience. I think he knows his chances of winning the premier league are far higher at Liverpool so it's a sensible decision in that respect.
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Yeah much as it pains me to admit it I can understand his decision
 
Bayern is just using us to get Liverpoolto pay their stated price. The media latches on because it generates clicks.

We are looking for players under 25. If we were to break that rule, it would be a Henrik Larsson or Van Persie type, not a 29 yr old midfielder.

Move on.
 
TheNewEra said:
I think so too, I think the issue is the fee and the wages, the wage structure isn't something Liverpool want to break.

Most of Liverpools star players contracts expire in 2023, meaning next year they'll be having renewal talks, if Thiago is on more they will want to be on more too.

Salah, Mane, Firminho, Van Dijk the majority of the squad are all expiring in 2023, Wijnaldum is next year so obviously he's moving on now.

Thiago doesn't want Bayern because he's won everything, it's the same reason he won't go to Barca. He wants to win the Premier League.

Obviously Liverpool is an instant chance of winning the league, City have other considerations, Chelsea have spent too much now to buy him, Havertz mainly is the player you want to build around.

Thiago obviously Liverpool is the #1 destination, as a United fan too you have to say it it's a really good move. It's also his livelihood, if he can get better money and wages elsewhere (a couple million more a year) then why not go to the place paying you more, especially if they are going to be having a title challenge soon too.

Liverpool just need to pay the player the money he wants.
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People always say this but I have never really heard the reasoning behind it. Does every player in a team know what everyone else is making? why would Thiago walk in to the dressing room and start telling everyone how much he makes?
 
RedStarUnited said:
People always say this but I have never really heard the reasoning behind it. Does every player in a team know what everyone else is making? why would Thiago walk in to the dressing room and start telling everyone how much he makes?
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They can find out. I think it’s divulged to the PFA. I remember Neville saying when he didn’t have an agent all he would do is just call up the PFA see what the best paid right back in the league was on and say ‘pay me that’. Also agents talk to each other, they ask the club etc.
 
RedStarUnited said:
People always say this but I have never really heard the reasoning behind it. Does every player in a team know what everyone else is making? why would Thiago walk in to the dressing room and start telling everyone how much he makes?
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He might not ask the whole dressing room but he might ask in private. It's a smart thing to do in any job, really. Especially when you're expecting to be playing a similar role and want to know you're not underappreciated financially. Or at least know the difference in pay is pretty much negligible, like a few thousand off, for example. Of course, in a normal job, there isn't any such leeway - you would be expect to be earning exactly the same as coworker who does the same job.
 
It’s a bit mad that this is dragging on. What’s up with Liverpool this summer, passing on Werner and finding a deal for Thiago problematic.
 
DSG said:
Bayern is just using us to get Liverpoolto pay their stated price. The media latches on because it generates clicks.

We are looking for players under 25. If we were to break that rule, it would be a Henrik Larsson or Van Persie type, not a 29 yr old midfielder.

Move on.
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I wish the club can come out with a statement to rubbish these rumours just like what Bayern alway does. Sick of clubs and agents using our name to bring up the market value.
 
DarkLord said:
I wish the club can come out with a statement to rubbish these rumours just like what Bayern alway does. Sick of clubs and agents using our name to bring up the market value.
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Maybe we haven't done that because there is a slim possibility we can step in if Liverpool mess this up which won't be happening in my opinion
 
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