I know he's still very young and currently playing in Brazil but my shout would be Thiago Maia at Santos. From the little I've seen he seems to have good passing, be athletic and able to tackle. Would be a gamble as he's so young but I rather go for him early than wait for his stock to rise elsewhere and end up paying over the odds.
The search for a holding/controlling midfielder
- Thread starter bosnian_red
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He is injury prone, Wallyson is a safer bet.
I like the look of Tom Davies (Everton)
Looks like city wants William carvalho
Any Bundesliga watchers tell how Johannes Geis is getting on?
One of Schalke's better players this season, but he isn't ready to move on from there.
Always liked the look of him, what do you think he needs to do in order to be linked with a big club? Haven't watched him play in months
Consistency most of all, I think. His own manager doesn't seem to fully trust him or at least didn't at the start of the season. I also think he needs to impose himself on games more like Xhaka did for Gladbach against the better teams in the league.
Hmm, I guess we will be looking elsewhere for the deep lying playmaker then, who would be your pick?
Xhaka would have been my pick during the summer we bought Schweinsteiger, but that's gone now. I honestly don't know to be honest. Weigl seems unavailable, Danilo Pereira and William Carvalho are difficult to judge. Gonalons and Jorginho aren't good enough IMO. Paredes, Strootman, Cyprien, Tolisso and Koke seem to be the best options in my eyes. Most of them aren't players who are actually holding midfielders rather box-to-box players though. I'd love us to sign any of Koke, Saul, Tolisso and Cyprien.
Do you have somebody in mind?
Yep.
Carrick didn't evolve into this holding DMF beast he is now until his late 20's as well.
For me, Weigl and Verratti are the best like-for-like Carrick replacements out there.
Kroos is another decent option, but isn't as defensively responsible or capable. William Carvalho has the defensive aspects of his game, but isn't as capable a passer.
As for Bakayoko, i'm not too sure why we'd be interested in him, when we have Fosu-Mensah who we could be giving games to.
Kroos is another decent option, but isn't as defensively responsible or capable. William Carvalho has the defensive aspects of his game, but isn't as capable a passer.
As for Bakayoko, i'm not too sure why we'd be interested in him, when we have Fosu-Mensah who we could be giving games to.
I think the key part of the thread title is holding, with a maverick like Pogba and a hustler like Herrera the 3rd CM needs to be a calm, positionally disciplined CM to sit behind them and protect the defense.
The other aspect is passing, we need someone that can circulate the ball accurately and consistently, controlling the tempo, people seem to think Jose only likes athletes but if you look at his last 3 teams he's had one proper midfield organizer in all of them.
Weigl - By far the best option, about as close to a Carrick clone as we could get.
Paredes - Hes a bit of an under the radar option as he doesn't start for Roma, but he's silky on the ball, has a great passing range and excellent mobility, he'd need refining defensively though.
Fabinho - Defensively he ticks the boxes for me, he's just not all that great on the ball and I think we'd need to add a playmaker #8 to compliment him and Pogba.
Strootman - Strong, decent passer and soild defensively, but the injury issues would be a big worry when you see what's happened with Gundogan.
Jorginho - He's got the passing range but I'm not sold on him defensively and he's super slow.
William Carvalho - His passing game is expansive but I think he lacks the mobility for the PL.
Danilo Pereira - Very much in the same mold as Fabinho.
The other aspect is passing, we need someone that can circulate the ball accurately and consistently, controlling the tempo, people seem to think Jose only likes athletes but if you look at his last 3 teams he's had one proper midfield organizer in all of them.
Weigl - By far the best option, about as close to a Carrick clone as we could get.
Paredes - Hes a bit of an under the radar option as he doesn't start for Roma, but he's silky on the ball, has a great passing range and excellent mobility, he'd need refining defensively though.
Fabinho - Defensively he ticks the boxes for me, he's just not all that great on the ball and I think we'd need to add a playmaker #8 to compliment him and Pogba.
Strootman - Strong, decent passer and soild defensively, but the injury issues would be a big worry when you see what's happened with Gundogan.
Jorginho - He's got the passing range but I'm not sold on him defensively and he's super slow.
William Carvalho - His passing game is expansive but I think he lacks the mobility for the PL.
Danilo Pereira - Very much in the same mold as Fabinho.
Never seen Cyprien but whoscored makes it seem like he'd make more sense as the 8 we need to cover both Pogba and Herrera.
I wonder if there's a guy at a Europa level side aged 26-28 we could bring in for his peak. Find the next Motta or Cambiasso. Illaramendi was thrown away by Real like the latter (Motta of course by Barca) and he's turning 27. Whoscored says good things. I'm probably gonna watch them against barca since barca-bilbao was so good, so ill comment on how he looks then. I suggested Iturraspe, who is 27. Nzonzi is a year older. I don't watch much Serie A but maybe there's options there too.
Point is, while signing a good but not great late 20s winger or fullback would be stupid, I don't think it's crazy for us to sign someone like that. Schneiderlin's profile as a player was fine, he just wasn't good enough on the ball to be the deep passer we need and obviously Mourinho didn't rate him over Fellaini to run around and tackle so maybe he just wasn't a fan in training or with respect to attitude, or wanted to have the money to throw elsewhere (if that's an issue, probably not).
That's not that exciting a list. I'd look older at a finished product and solve the issue again after 3-4 years of top play, like PSG did with Motta, or overwhelm Dortmund with cash for Weigl, who is excellent.
Who's considered the best 6 in Germany not at Bayern or Dortmund, now that Xhaka is gone? Mught be an answer there.
I try to look for players people don't really mention, IF Javi Martinez wasn't injured every other week he would of been my ultimate Carrick replacement. Seri is quite good as with Cyprien, Camacho has been superb this season, I think he has the most interceptions in the league? I like Rabiot & Illara too, there are options but no like for like replacement for Carrick, but I don't think that will be the problem, Carrick didn't replace Keane but he is now one of if the key player in the team
Well in fairness it's not the most exciting position.
I'm not sure who would be considered the best #6 in Germany outside of the big 2 clubs, Geis at Shalke? but he's still young and I'm not sure he's cut out for the PL. In France outside of PSG you have Fabinho, Gonalons and Diara and in Spain the 2 you mentioned, N'Zonzi and Iturraspe as well as Illaremendhi and Camacho.What about Nainggolan?
Good passer, very comfortable on the ball, physically imposing, offers good defensive contribution, strong in the tackle, great stamina and also chips in with the odd goal and assist. A very good all round player.
At 28 he might be tempted by a final big move.
..... Nainggolan
Herrera ..... Pogba
Good passer, very comfortable on the ball, physically imposing, offers good defensive contribution, strong in the tackle, great stamina and also chips in with the odd goal and assist. A very good all round player.
At 28 he might be tempted by a final big move.
..... Nainggolan
Herrera ..... Pogba
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Isnt he more of a box to box midfielder though? Also he must be extremely strong mentally to make it at Manchester United. Nianggolan is a know smoker if i remember correctly.. 1 bad game and the media, social media and even redcafe will crucify him.
He does predominantly play as a CM/B2B but he has the traits to play the DM role. He has played as a DM four times this season and done so very well. I'm not sure about the smoking but I do know he has very good stamina.
In my opinion, CM will depend heavily on what Mou is planning upfront. If he brings Griezmann then we'll most probably move to a 4-2-3-1 system with Griezmann acting as left inside striker, Mkhitaryan as a right inside striker and Pogba playing behind Ibra. With so much quality upfront the manager would probably move for two powerful and hardworking midfielders capable of covering as much inches of pitch as possible which would then allow the four players upfront to focus on their magic.
If N'zonzi is available, go for him. Hes having a fantastic season and would be reasonable price im guessing due to their release clauses in spain.
For what you are describing Danilo Pereira, William Carvalho, N'Zonzi and Gonalons would be my picks. I understand the notion that a player, who isn't necessarily a star, but those his job quietly and efficiently, is more than good enough for the position, if we surround them with players like Pogba, Martial and so on, but I'm nontheless slightly reluctant on that. I thought Schneiderlin, despite not being the most talented player, would be a definite success. Because of his consistency and the level of performances, but it didn't work out. Camacho, Gonalons and Illarramendi are all good players, but similar to Ashley Young, I think their level is where they currently are at the moment. Iturraspe, if anything, has deteriorated IMO. N'Zonzi always looked a decent player, but again I'm not sure, if he'd be able to play at the same level for United compared Sevilla. I'd definitely prefer Cyprien to Seri. If I had to narrow it down, I'd probably go with either N'Zonzi or Danilo Pereira from those candidates.
Yes, Keane and Carrick aren't the same players, but like it was said before in this thread with their passing and the way they play/ed their game without the ball comes a certain kind of control, which is the objective of this thread.
This is the biggest priority this season, even ahead of Griezmann.
God no, prio number one has to be getting more goals into this team. Absolutely no question we'd be at least 2nd now with another regular source of goals.
I think both can be bought in the budget, but I don't really think United can compete in a league without a destroyer or controlling midfielder.
Stoke, Burnley, Hull, West Ham.... 8 more points from these hugely one-sided games is what more goals provides.
That puts us just behind Chelsea & with a great chance of the title.
That's not to say we don't need a replacement for Carrick, we do, obviously, but goals is what this team is lacking most.
To be fair, the destroyer/controlling midfielder isn't for the kind of games you mentioned, it's for the big games against rivals and tough, high-press opponents. For the games against lower-table premier league sides, we're probably better off playing the system we did for most of the Leicester game (Pogba part of a midfield 2, with a Mata or Miki ahead of them).
Did anyone watch Valencia vs Eibar 0-4?
Gonzalo Escalante is really freaking good. He shields the back four superbly and is a very good passer of the ball.
He even nutmegged Ronaldo twice in three seconds. That should surely count for something:
Gonzalo Escalante is really freaking good. He shields the back four superbly and is a very good passer of the ball.
He even nutmegged Ronaldo twice in three seconds. That should surely count for something:
Lads, Darmian has the solution:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-4201894/Pirlo-perfect-Man-Utd-says-Darmian.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-4201894/Pirlo-perfect-Man-Utd-says-Darmian.html
It might not work but surely it is worth it to try Blind behind Herrera and Pogba for a couple of games. I mean we already have him, try him there for a couple of games. I can't imagine he would be worse than a 35 year old Carrick and he might actually be good.
And no, his performances there two seasons ago under a different manager and in a very different team are not indicative of much. His passing range is excellent, has good positioning, and is excellent defensively. I'm really surprised Mourinho hasn't been tempted yet to try a CB at CDM. That was one of his signature moves (Zouma, Pepe).
I know it is not the sexiest of answers especially to Woody who seems to be a transfer muppet himself but surely you try what you have before you go out and throw millions at the problem?
Edit: I would say the same logic applies to Mensah, although I have no idea if his passing is any good.
And no, his performances there two seasons ago under a different manager and in a very different team are not indicative of much. His passing range is excellent, has good positioning, and is excellent defensively. I'm really surprised Mourinho hasn't been tempted yet to try a CB at CDM. That was one of his signature moves (Zouma, Pepe).
I know it is not the sexiest of answers especially to Woody who seems to be a transfer muppet himself but surely you try what you have before you go out and throw millions at the problem?
Edit: I would say the same logic applies to Mensah, although I have no idea if his passing is any good.
Nainggolan?
He isn't a holding midfieder and he isn't someone who is controlling games with his passing.
Southampton offers good options, regardless of the profile of holding mid Mourinho wants. Romeu, Ward-Prowse and even Hojberg are players worth considering.
I want Radja. Him and Ander next to Pogba.
Missing piece of the jigsaw.....
How is Hojbjerg doing? Have lost track of him since he left Bayern.
Not getting much of a chance. Usually comes on as a sub, if at all.
A return to Bundesliga might be on the cards. Also, sorry for the spelling mistake
Not getting much of a chance. Usually comes on as a sub, if at all.
A return to Bundesliga might be on the cards. Also, sorry for the spelling mistake
He's started 10/25, that's not that bad considering his age and he's new to the league. They have a lot of competition in his position, but I still reckon he could make it there.
I want Radja. Him and Ander next to Pogba.
I think Paredes or Strootman would be more suitable to partner Pogba and Ander. Nainggolan and Ander are somewhat too similar in what they bring to their teams.
I wouldn't mind a raid on Romas central midfield myself though. Nainggolan and one of Strootman or Paredes please.