The RedCafe Boxing Thread

Yeah not heard anyone say Whyte would do anything do Joshua really. I'm sure he wants a rematch as it's a big day pay and would do good numbers but I don't think people think he would really do much against him.

Crawford P4P Number 1 for me at the moment I'll hold off on the Lomachenko debate until he fights Rigo personally.
 
Not really.

If anything, Whyte is gunning for the Bronze Bomber.

Wow if that happens, will be something to watch. Pretty sure Whyte can cause problems for Deontay with his body shots. The trouble with Wilder is he has that one punch KO power and i can see Whyte walking into a big right. Never know though!
 
It'd be interesting cause Whyte has a chin and has better overall skills. Wilder has more power than Joshua though.
 
Funny fight the Whyte one. He was clearly going to win and seemed like Tann didn't want to know yet he kept beating the count. Well conditioned, DW's a threat for anyone.
 
Carl Frampton has left the McGuigan's - didn't see that coming.

He's not really got anywhere to go in the UK having burned his bridges with fast Eddie.
 
Carl Frampton has left the McGuigan's - didn't see that coming.

He's not really got anywhere to go in the UK having burned his bridges with fast Eddie.

Wow . Hope he goes to the states. He's an amazing talent. Would love a 3rd fight with LSC at some point. I think he's the best British boxer out there.
 
He may come to LA. I know Quigg is working with Roach but could perhaps see him with Roach. I think that would be a bad move as Roach is getting gigs purely on reputation now. The sparring in LA will be best for him especially around that weight class.
 
He may come to LA. I know Quigg is working with Roach but could perhaps see him with Roach. I think that would be a bad move as Roach is getting gigs purely on reputation now. The sparring in LA will be best for him especially around that weight class.

Yeah I was wondering that tbh. I always had a feeling he was too invested in Manny to be of much use to others - dunno, even though Manny has been effectively retired for years (caring about boxing) if you know what I mean.

I thought Frampton fought a naieve fight Vs LSC instead of using his brain and counter punching which I feel is his strength. Mind you LSc fought a perfect fight that night but I was really disappointed with Frampton.
 
Yeah I was wondering that tbh. I always had a feeling he was too invested in Manny to be of much use to others - dunno, even though Manny has been effectively retired for years (caring about boxing) if you know what I mean.

I thought Frampton fought a naieve fight Vs LSC instead of using his brain and counter punching which I feel is his strength. Mind you LSc fought a perfect fight that night but I was really disappointed with Frampton.
Yeah, literally if you look at his record with every fighter the last 8-10 years he's pretty much only taken on established fighters and either they got worse or at best they stagnated. Think he got very lucky with Pacquaio and has made his name off of that.

Frampton should train out of Manny Robles' gym in Carson IMO. Abel Sanchez would also be a bitter fit than Roach. I think it's all about quality sparring and solid game plans at this point in his career. The Santa Cruz fight, LSC figured he couldn't just go wade in like normal because Frampton picked him off first time so Frampton sort of played into his hands second time around by being the hunter. I'd like to see a third bout but perhaps see Frampton face Selby and LSC-Mares II to happen in the meantime. Usually not a fan of re-matches but fair is fair they are 1-1 and both were entertaining.
 
Stylistically I think Canelo's coach would fit well for Frampton, but I don't think Eddie Reynoso will take on any other fighters.
 
Frampton is staying with Shane McGuigan as his trainer.
I can't see this to be honest especially as there's rumours of a contract in the US.

I can't say i blame him really as he's been bankrolling the McGuigan's who've failed to deliver him the big money fights he needs to be having at this stage of his career.

It was a right feck up going back to the States for the Santa Cruz rematch - it should have been part 2 in Ireland or no fight. Frampton could have walked away 1-0 up in the series and onto bigger and better. As it is, Santa Cruz drew level and now he won't come to Ireland and Cyclone lack the cash to make him an offer he can't refuse.
 
I can't see this to be honest especially as there's rumours of a contract in the US.

I can't say i blame him really as he's been bankrolling the McGuigan's who've failed to deliver him the big money fights he needs to be having at this stage of his career.

It was a right feck up going back to the States for the Santa Cruz rematch - it should have been part 2 in Ireland or no fight. Frampton could have walked away 1-0 up in the series and onto bigger and better. As it is, Santa Cruz drew level and now he won't come to Ireland and Cyclone lack the cash to make him an offer he can't refuse.
Yeah, they really dropped the ball on the Santa Cruz thing. Santa Cruz cried foul (even though he was beaten clearly) because it was in NYC, so gets the fight in Vegas which is very close to home. For them not to have clause in place for a third fight was a joke since you knew Santa Cruz being an Al Haymon fighter (further up their food chain than Frampton) wasn't signing off on a third especially in UK or Ireland. There may be more to it than that but on paper it looks bad.

Frampton also didn't make weight last time out which isn't like him. I know he's advised by Al Haymon so he may become fully promoted by PBC so that doesn't really affect him wanting to fight LSC, Russell, Selby, Mares any more than currently since they are all clients too but it would mean he's less likely to stay active since PBC has no money left and are relying on Showtime to pony up for the fights and SHO made it clear it's good match-ups or nothing. Either $1m to face a champion on Showtime or $100k to fight on Bounce (a channel barely anybody knows).
 
Thoughts on Floyd fighting like a bum last night...

He was walking forward in straight lines ffs, probably the right approach to the fight all things considered though.
 
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Thoughts in Floyd fighting like a bum last night...

He was walking forward in straight lines ffs, probably the right approach to the fight all things considered though.

Probably knew how many levels ahead he was and how easy it was really. I'm sure he trained properly for it but I'd guess he knew he never had to get out of 2nd gear.
 
How do y'all rank Floyd Mayweather as a boxer? One of the best ever or hasn't he proven enough for that?
 
How do y'all rank Floyd Mayweather as a boxer? One of the best ever or hasn't he proven enough for that?
Skills and talent he's very high, resume he's a bit lacking of the absolute greatest. I say anywhere from 30-50 is a fair ranking. I personally did my top 100 all-time recently (it's in this thread) and placed him 45. I think had he fought Pacquaio around 2010-2012 and won clearly and taken on a few more challenges at the right time he could have been top 25-30.
 
Now we can finally look forward to the real fight of the year. GGG vs Canelo. Am I the only one who thinks this is a mismatch and GGG will expose Canelo? Can't see a scenario where Canelo wins.
 
Skills and talent he's very high, resume he's a bit lacking of the absolute greatest. I say anywhere from 30-50 is a fair ranking. I personally did my top 100 all-time recently (it's in this thread) and placed him 45. I think had he fought Pacquaio around 2010-2012 and won clearly and taken on a few more challenges at the right time he could have been top 25-30.

Couldn't fault your list at the time and that rationale is on point too.
 
Sorry lads, but I think it's laughable how hip it is to underrate Mayweathers achievements in the ring. The usual arguments about avoiding fighters, purse splits etc etc. So easy to pull up P4p lists that just love to exclude him. To not even have him top 20 ??? Are you kidding me?! :D
 
Now we can finally look forward to the real fight of the year. GGG vs Canelo. Am I the only one who thinks this is a mismatch and GGG will expose Canelo? Can't see a scenario where Canelo wins.

I think Canelo will beat him. Neither have looked brilliant in their last couple of fights but I just think it's a timing thing and where as Canelo has fought fighters way out his league and not looked brilliant I think it's age catching up with GGG now.

Re the Mayweather stuff I think he's a great boxer, I'm not sure where he ranks on an all time great list, I honestly don't really get lists like that. I admire the effort and thought that goes into them but lets be honest...a fighter who fought in something like the early to mid 1900's it's hard to give a fair opinion of surely? There's no chance you can give a fair reading on people like that.

Look at Floyd for example as he's the fighter we're discussing, his CV includes Castillo, Hatton, De La Hoya, Marqeuz, Moseley, Cotto, Pacquiao and McGregor that's some of the best boxers he could of fought and yet the common counter argument is they were all (or most of them) were way past their best. By then putting someone from the early 1900s in a list as an all time great you're suggesting that you know their history, you know their opponents history and know their opponents weren't old/overrated/past their best/not that good to begin with. To me it just seems an odd way of judging something but each to their own.

Basically what I'm saying is people will judge on record and what they read etc and surely that's not a fair way to give an opinion. In years time when Floyd is long gone for example and he has a record of 50-0 that includes the names above people will automatically end up putting him on a list of P4P All Time Greats and no one would argue. People look back fonder on history than they do what is happening in the current.
 
I think Canelo will beat him. Neither have looked brilliant in their last couple of fights but I just think it's a timing thing and where as Canelo has fought fighters way out his league and not looked brilliant I think it's age catching up with GGG now.

Re the Mayweather stuff I think he's a great boxer, I'm not sure where he ranks on an all time great list, I honestly don't really get lists like that. I admire the effort and thought that goes into them but lets be honest...a fighter who fought in something like the early to mid 1900's it's hard to give a fair opinion of surely? There's no chance you can give a fair reading on people like that.

Look at Floyd for example as he's the fighter we're discussing, his CV includes Castillo, Hatton, De La Hoya, Marqeuz, Moseley, Cotto, Pacquiao and McGregor that's some of the best boxers he could of fought and yet the common counter argument is they were all (or most of them) were way past their best. By then putting someone from the early 1900s in a list as an all time great you're suggesting that you know their history, you know their opponents history and know their opponents weren't old/overrated/past their best/not that good to begin with. To me it just seems an odd way of judging something but each to their own.

Basically what I'm saying is people will judge on record and what they read etc and surely that's not a fair way to give an opinion. In years time when Floyd is long gone for example and he has a record of 50-0 that includes the names above people will automatically end up putting him on a list of P4P All Time Greats and no one would argue. People look back fonder on history than they do what is happening in the current.

Exactomundo. Outside of a few, such as SRR, Ali, Leonard, Pep, Duran and a few others whom I'd put right at the top, these lists are almost meaningless. They're quite fun I guess, and each to their own, but aside from being a source of amusement and debate , they're really not that important.

Re Floyd specifically just longevity alone puts him right up there. Where most boxers decline significantly at a certain age, even at 40 years of age his skills are clearly superior regardless of level of opposition. The only comparable boxer of his era in terms of longevity is B'hop.
 
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Think if Canelo was fighting the GGG of 2 years ago then it would be an easy win for GGG but now I'm unsure. He looks slower and even easier to punch, he was sluggish against Jacobs but it's difficult to say how good Jacobs is and at the end of the day, he's clearly a good fighter and GGG still got the win.

Canelo is a step up and he's been getting better each fight since the Mayweather bout. I would favour GGG for a decision but given how Canelo is the 'future of boxing' if it's a close fight I can see him being given the decision.

It really is a great fight though, as close as a fight as you can get at the moment.
 
Sorry lads, but I think it's laughable how hip it is to underrate Mayweathers achievements in the ring. The usual arguments about avoiding fighters, purse splits etc etc. So easy to pull up P4p lists that just love to exclude him. To not even have him top 20 ??? Are you kidding me?! :D
He's top 10 imo but 9th or 10th.
 
He doesn't compare to other all time greats, he never even fought an ATG fighter in their prime. His signature wins were against De La Hoya (well past it), Pacquiao (well past it) and Corrales (a good but not great fighter in the context of history). Enough said.
Also a 22 year old Canelo and Hatton undefeated in 44? professional fights. He fought what was in front of him. You can't diminish his achievements. I think he'd have beaten Pacquiao in 2009.

Mayweather is definitely the most intelligent fighter I've ever seen. His ring IQ is ridiculous. Not even human.

He's up there with Duran and Leonard imo, but probably behind both.