The natural successor: Has Neymar blown it?

https://www.skysports.com/share/12204970


News about Messi and his contract come out. Barca obviously struggling financially. This lad took PSG for an absolute ride the last few years and probably did more to destabilise the team than anyone else. Reminds me of our time with Pogba but worse... Now, for some reason which he can’t quite explain he’s very happy to stay and finally get his head down and he hopes Mbappe will do the same. He’s a total chancer!
 
He has been at PSG since 17/18. 3 full seasons. The one time he wasn't knocked out of CL by a serious injury, he lead them to the final...
 
Ali Dia said:
https://www.skysports.com/share/12204970


News about Messi and his contract come out. Barca obviously struggling financially. This lad took PSG for an absolute ride the last few years and probably did more to destabilise the team than anyone else. Reminds me of our time with Pogba but worse... Now, for some reason which he can’t quite explain he’s very happy to stay and finally get his head down and he hopes Mbappe will do the same. He’s a total chancer!
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Through what exactly? Goals, assists, mesmerizing performances?

Some people really can't look past their sympathies, it's amazing.
 
Zehner said:
Through what exactly? Goals, assists, mesmerizing performances?

Some people really can't look past their sympathies, it's amazing.
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going awol? Faking injuries so he can go hang out with his sister for her birthday every year? That’s coming up soon I think. Flirting with Barca every opportunity he got after fecking them over to leave in the first place. Exemplary behaviour! As I said he’s a good footballer but he’s a total chancer. It’s amazing alright. Make him one of the highest paid players in the world. Build a team around him in an amazing city to be rich in and he still wasn’t happy but barca hit some financial turbulence and now he’s suddenly really happy to lead by example at PSG. It’s just so cynical!
 
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Ali Dia said:
going awol? Faking injuries so he can go hang out with his sister for her birthday every year? That’s coming up soon I think. Flirting with Barca every opportunity he got after fecking them over to leave in the first place. Exemplary behaviour!
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So rumors and gossip, I see. One could think you're more interested in the soap opera stuff than actual football.
 
Zehner said:
Through what exactly? Goals, assists, mesmerizing performances?

Some people really can't look past their sympathies, it's amazing.
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They failed to reach even the quarters of the Champions League in 2018 and 2019, Mbappe overtook him as the fan favourite for obvious reasons, constant murmurings of wanting to leave and return to Spain. You're making out like there's some agenda when there clearly isn't. Lots of this was widely reported. Whether you choose to believe it or not is a different matter.
 
Ali Dia said:
one could probably say the same thing about neymar
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83 goals and 46 assists in 101 games, equaling a scorer every 67 minutes, as well as reaching a CL final last year, suggests he's more interested in the footballing aspect.

Harry Harries said:
They failed to reach even the quarters of the Champions League in 2018 and 2019, Mbappe overtook him as the fan favourite for obvious reasons, constant murmurings of wanting to leave and return to Spain. You're making out like there's some agenda when there clearly isn't. Lots of this was widely reported. Whether you choose to believe it or not is a different matter.
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They went out two times while he was injured and reached the final when he was fit. Mbappe might be the fan favourite but if the PSG fans in here are anything to go by, the majority still knows that Neymar is the superior player to him. So yes, there is definitely an agenda. I don't think there's any player in this world that has a stronger agenda going against him than Neymar for what it's worth.
 
Harry Harries said:
They failed to reach even the quarters of the Champions League in 2018 and 2019, Mbappe overtook him as the fan favourite for obvious reasons, constant murmurings of wanting to leave and return to Spain. You're making out like there's some agenda when there clearly isn't. Lots of this was widely reported. Whether you choose to believe it or not is a different matter.
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Wasn’t he injured when they went out? Didn’t play the second leg against us and I’m sure he only played 1 game against Real Madrid
 
Zehner said:
83 goals and 46 assists in 101 games, equaling a scorer every 67 minutes, as well as reaching a CL final last year, suggests he's more interested in the footballing aspect.



They went out two times while he was injured and reached the final when he was fit. Mbappe might be the fan favourite but if the PSG fans in here are anything to go by, the majority still knows that Neymar is the superior player to him. So yes, there is definitely an agenda. I don't think there's any player in this world that has a stronger agenda going against him than Neymar for what it's worth.
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Will I pull up zlatan or Cavanis goal stats in Ligue 1? What difference does that make? it doesn’t change the fact he’s obviously been disruptive and now he’s doing a total 180 because barca don’t have the money.
 
Already on €700K p/w and next contract should be the last big one in his career so how much will PSG pay him (and Mbappe who earns €440K or so)?
 
Ali Dia said:
Will I pull up zlatan or Cavanis goal stats in Ligue 1? What difference does that make? it doesn’t change the fact he’s obviously been disruptive and now he’s doing a total 180 because barca don’t have the money.
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That's not a fact, it's your impression. And your impression is biased as far as I can tell.
 
Zehner said:
That's not a fact, it's your impression. And your impression is biased as far as I can tell.
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and yours isn’t? All the stuff I’ve listed above thats been widely reported. His own fans booing him at PSG (fact) His dads behaviour with the transfer to barca. The way he left barca. (It all came out in the barca leaks) There’s so much evidence to the contrary of what you are saying but believe what you want. Everyone is just out to get him :lol:
 
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Zehner said:
They went out two times while he was injured and reached the final when he was fit. Mbappe might be the fan favourite but if the PSG fans in here are anything to go by, the majority still knows that Neymar is the superior player to him. So yes, there is definitely an agenda. I don't think there's any player in this world that has a stronger agenda going against him than Neymar for what it's worth.
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That wasn't my point. I never once said they went out with Neymar playing (who's playing into the agenda now..?), the point was that Neymar was by all accounts bitterly disappointed that they failed to progress. He didn't think they were progressing and wanted to return to Spain. United fans of all people should have a decent bloody clue, loads of stuff came out about it immedaitely after they went out to us in 2019 ffs!
 
Ali Dia said:
and yours isn’t? All the stuff I’ve listed above thats been widely reported. His own fans booing him at PSG (fact) His dads behaviour with the transfer to barca. The way he left barca. (It all came out in the barca leaks) There’s so much evidence to the contrary of what you are saying but believe what you want. Everyone is just out to get him :lol:
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I don't care about this stuff. I'm not interested in gossip, be it about film stars, models or football players. Such stories are always overdramatic. interprete too much into small things and intentionally try to polarize. I find it cringeworthy when people base their opinions on players on such reports. It's reminiscent of people taking pure gossip magazines seriously.

All I know is that Neymar is far and away the best and most important player for his team, one that elevates PSG onto another level.
 
Harry Harries said:
That wasn't my point. I never once said they went out with Neymar playing (who's playing into the agenda now..?), the point was that Neymar was by all accounts bitterly disappointed that they failed to progress. He didn't think they were progressing and wanted to return to Spain. United fans of all people should have a decent bloody clue, loads of stuff came out about it immedaitely after they went out to us in 2019 ffs!
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Then what's the point? That there were reports he wanted to leave? That he even might have wanted to leave?

I'm not arguing that this wasn't the case, for all we know it might have been true and it might have been wrong. Thing is, why does it even matter as long as he performs like he does? As if that somehow prevented them from winning a CL or something like that. Cristiano was rumored to leave Madrid every single season. Same with Messi ever since Neymar left at the very least. There will always be rumors surrounding top players, this doesn't destabilize anything. It's part of the business.
 
Zehner said:
I don't care about this stuff. I'm not interested in gossip, be it about film stars, models or football players. Such stories are always overdramatic. interprete too much into small things and intentionally try to polarize. I find it cringeworthy when people base their opinions on players on such reports. It's reminiscent of people taking pure gossip magazines seriously.

All I know is that Neymar is far and away the best and most important player for his team, one that elevates PSG onto another level.
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You’ve ignored everything I’ve said just to have the last word so I’m going to reply in kind. I couldn’t give a toss about rumours and articles about what players do in their private lives but if you get paid 700k a week the least you can do is remain professional and try and be a leader and positive influence. He’s been neither at Barca or PSG. He’s fallen out with teammates and coaches and the fans there and repeatedly tried to leave. It’s a bit rich for him to try and become a leader now all of a sudden the move that he’s been very publicly angling for for years is down the drain. It’s all just a coincidence! Ignore it if you want. What you’re saying is its everyone else’s problem and he can do no wrong just because he’s a good player which is only half the battle as we’ve seen with Pogba here plenty. Glad that particular circus is nowhere near our club
 
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Zehner said:
Then what's the point? That there were reports he wanted to leave? That he even might have wanted to leave?

I'm not arguing that this wasn't the case, for all we know it might have been true and it might have been wrong. Thing is, why does it even matter as long as he performs like he does? As if that somehow prevented them from winning a CL or something like that. Cristiano was rumored to leave Madrid every single season. Same with Messi ever since Neymar left at the very least. There will always be rumors surrounding top players, this doesn't destabilize anything. It's part of the business.
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Why do you think so many people have an issue with Pogba? People weigh up the net contribution of each player, which includes off the pitch stuff. With players like Messi and Ronaldo you're more likely to give them the benefit of the doubt for obvious reasons.
 
Zehner said:
I don't care about this stuff. I'm not interested in gossip, be it about film stars, models or football players. Such stories are always overdramatic. interprete too much into small things and intentionally try to polarize. I find it cringeworthy when people base their opinions on players on such reports. It's reminiscent of people taking pure gossip magazines seriously.

All I know is that Neymar is far and away the best and most important player for his team, one that elevates PSG onto another level.
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I agree with this. I think also people don’t actually watch him regularly because they are dismissive of the French league. If you watch him regularly, he’s awesome. He was also good in the CL last year but they lost to the better team in the final
 
Ali Dia said:
You’ve ignored everything I’ve said just to have the last word so I’m going to reply in kind. I couldn’t give a toss about rumours and articles about what players do in their private lives but if you get paid 700k a week the least you can do is remain professional and try and be a leader and positive influence. He’s been neither at Barca or PSG. He’s fallen out with teammates and coaches and the fans there and repeatedly tried to leave. It’s a bit rich for him to try and become a leader now all of a sudden the move that he’s been very publicly angling for for years is down the drain. It’s all just a coincidence! Ignore it if you want. What you’re saying is its everyone else’s problem and he can do no wrong just because he’s a good player which is only half the battle as we’ve seen with Pogba here plenty. Glad that particular circus is nowhere near our club
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Thing with gossip is, you never know what's true or not but if you pay attention to it, it will always stick and leave an impression. Countless negative stories about Neymar have been proven wrong.

Fact of the matter, he's PSG's best player and delivered on the pitch time and again. And despite all the gossip, he gets along with his team mates very well. If you want to believe he's actually harming PSG for whatever reason, this is up to you.

Harry Harries said:
Why do you think so many people have an issue with Pogba? People weigh up the net contribution of each player, which includes off the pitch stuff. With players like Messi and Ronaldo you're more likely to give them the benefit of the doubt for obvious reasons.
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Neymar delivers, Pogba doesn't. I'm not a United fan but I don't like Pogba as a football player because I always thought he's seriously overrated and never justified his reputation with actual performances.

NasirTimothy said:
I agree with this. I think also people don’t actually watch him regularly because they are dismissive of the French league. If you watch him regularly, he’s awesome. He was also good in the CL last year but they lost to the better team in the final
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Exactly, he was spectacular last season and effectively throughout his whole tenure there. Incredible player people grew to hate more and more over time and underrate out of spite.
 
Zehner said:
Neymar delivers, Pogba doesn't. I'm not a United fan but I don't like Pogba as a football player because I always thought he's seriously overrated and never justified his reputation with actual performances.
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Well, there you go you see. And yet, I'm sure most data-collating platforms will have Pogba as our highest-rated player on average in the majority of seasons since he arrived (whoscored have him way out in front). I'm not sure people would agree that Pogba doesn't deliver. Despite that, lots of people still want him to leave. Two years into Neymar's career with PSG and it was widely agreed that it hadn't worked out. I'm sure it's better now, but in 2019 that was the situation. It feels like a revision of history is going on and I'm not sure why. No one is denying his talent (at least, I'm not!), but it's been anything but smooth-sailing since he arrived.

He's also made less than a hundred appearances for PSG in 4 years which sounds mad, but actually not when you remember he was allowed to miss 'unimportant' games and would fly back to Brazil for weeks at a time mid-season.
 
Harry Harries said:
Well, there you go you see. And yet, I'm sure most data-collating platforms will have Pogba as our highest-rated player on average in the majority of seasons since he arrived (whoscored have him way out in front). I'm not sure people would agree that Pogba doesn't deliver. Despite that, lots of people still want him to leave. Two years into Neymar's career with PSG and it was widely agreed that it hadn't worked out. I'm sure it's better now, but in 2019 that was the situation. It feels like a revision of history is going on and I'm not sure why. No one is denying his talent (at least, I'm not!), but it's been anything but smooth-sailing since he arrived.

He's also made less than a hundred appearances for PSG in 4 years which sounds mad, but actually not when you remember he was allowed to miss 'unimportant' games and would fly back to Brazil for weeks at a time mid-season.
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I'm not really sure what point you're trying to argue. Sure, there might be people who think he delivers and still want him to leave, but my initial point was that in general fans allow gossip to influence there opinions too much. I mean, I don't think Pogba is a great player for various reasons I don't want to discuss in this thread (or at all, since this is a very sensible topic with United fans) but if you do then it makes no sense to me that you want him out as long as he performs and the team functions. And that was definitely the case with Neymar. PSG's issues only became apparent when he was absent.

You just don't know if gossip is true and even if there is truth to it you never know the full story. So what if Neymar wanted out after his second year? He definitely got his shit together and delivered. And there are countless examples of that, e. g. Ronaldo, Ribery or Lewandowski.

People simply buy every story they read about Neymar because they hate him for whatever reasons. And they use it as an excuse to belittle his performances.
 
Zehner said:
I'm not really sure what point you're trying to argue. Sure, there might be people who think he delivers and still want him to leave, but my initial point was that in general fans allow gossip to influence there opinions too much. I mean, I don't think Pogba is a great player for various reasons I don't want to discuss in this thread (or at all, since this is a very sensible topic with United fans) but if you do then it makes no sense to me that you want him out as long as he performs and the team functions. And that was definitely the case with Neymar. PSG's issues only became apparent when he was absent.

You just don't know if gossip is true and even if there is truth to it you never know the full story. So what if Neymar wanted out after his second year? He definitely got his shit together and delivered. And there are countless examples of that, e. g. Ronaldo, Ribery or Lewandowski.

People simply buy every story they read about Neymar because they hate him for whatever reasons. And they use it as an excuse to belittle his performances.
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Again, it's not necessarily about 'hating' Neymar or there being some sinister agenda, or about denying his ability. The first half of his time in PSG was ultimately regarded as a failure by people that know a lot more about French football and Neymar than the majority of people here do.

Neymar obviously wasn't signed to put out spellbinding performances in Ligue 1, he could win another 5 league titles and it will still have been somewhat of a disappointment if they aren't able to win the CL while he's there. They didn't spend hundreds of millions on him and Mbappe just to win Ligue 1! Getting his shit together means him taking the mantle of the best player in the world and winning the biggest honours. That was the expectancy, that's the barometer of whether or not the massively expensive gamble paid off.

Also, you can't keep saying it was all gossip when it quite clearly wasn't! It was basically confirmed that he was allowed to miss unimportant games and travel back to Brazil at various points during the season. Anyway, I don't think we're massively disagreeing. It's an interesting conversation though as he's one of the biggest and most 'glamorous' footballers of our time.
 
Ali Dia said:
going awol? Faking injuries so he can go hang out with his sister for her birthday every year? That’s coming up soon I think. Flirting with Barca every opportunity he got after fecking them over to leave in the first place. Exemplary behaviour! As I said he’s a good footballer but he’s a total chancer. It’s amazing alright. Make him one of the highest paid players in the world. Build a team around him in an amazing city to be rich in and he still wasn’t happy but barca hit some financial turbulence and now he’s suddenly really happy to lead by example at PSG. It’s just so cynical!
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This is pure nonsense and it's pretty obvious you don't know what you're talking about. Neymar never faked any injury to go to his sister's birthday while at PSG, he went once and it was when he had an actual broken bone so he hardly faked it. He tried to leave one summer, yes, but once the mercato was over and he couldn't leave, he started his 1st game by scoring a game winner overhead kick with his left foot and never complained about staying for one second. On top of that, we never heard about his dad besides this summer of 2019.

Harry Harries said:
Also, you can't keep saying it was all gossip when it quite clearly wasn't! It was basically confirmed that he was allowed to miss unimportant games and travel back to Brazil at various points during the season. Anyway, I don't think we're massively disagreeing. It's an interesting conversation though as he's one of the biggest and most 'glamorous' footballers of our time.
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No it's not.
 
Yeah, I'd say he has blown it. He's had a very good career, but at a young age he looked like he could turn into a top, top tier player who would go down as one of the best of all time. In twenty years we just won't talk about him in those terms unless something drastic changes. In fact I'd suggest he pretty much sealed that fate when he moved to PSG.
 
Such a waste of money.

I know injuries are not something we should bash about, but damn. Imagine this place if we spent quarter of billion for this unreliability.

I mean, they only bought him to win UCL, but if he always missing at this stage...how much money have they wasted?
 
He is the last 'baller' that Brazil produced, to be honest. Such an entertaining player to watch. Then you look at the likes of Richarlison, Gabriel Jesus and Firmino and think, what are they doing over at Brazil? Hope Brazil can produce more of the Kaka's, Neymar's and Ronaldinho's in the near future.
 
Much as his theatrics cant be irritating at the best of times he's still one of my favourite players , and one of the more greatly unique talents, in world football.

There's very few players present today who combine the skillset Neymar has with the air of confidence and the uninhibitedness in their style of play.

It must also be refreshing, and possibly one of great relief, for Brazilians that, since Neymar left his homeland, that element of his game hasn't been slowly chipped away at.
Sure there's possibly a slight pragmatism in his game nowadays but the level of flair and unpredictability he brings to the game is still very prominent.
 
Injured ? Must be that time of year again, time to celebrate the sisters birthday.
 
What's the point of him? Has no balls to play in a real league so he's wasting his career in a farmers league. Will never be remembered as one of the greats.
 
Zehner said:
83 goals and 46 assists in 101 games, equaling a scorer every 67 minutes, as well as reaching a CL final last year, suggests he's more interested in the footballing aspect.



They went out two times while he was injured and reached the final when he was fit. Mbappe might be the fan favourite but if the PSG fans in here are anything to go by, the majority still knows that Neymar is the superior player to him. So yes, there is definitely an agenda. I don't think there's any player in this world that has a stronger agenda going against him than Neymar for what it's worth.
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That's in French league though, where Ibra in his 30's has 156 goals and 47 assists in 180 games too.
It wasn't bad record at all, but I think Neymar in Barca was more impressive than Neymar in PSG. It was bit of a step down move for him.
 
RedRonaldo said:
That's in French league though, where Ibra in his 30's has 156 goals and 47 assists in 180 games too.
It wasn't bad record at all, but I think Neymar in Barca was more impressive than Neymar in PSG. It was bit of a step down move for him.
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His rate has steadily improved over the seasons, injuries took a hit but Neymar is just as impressive with PSG. You probably only see him during the CL where he's always coming back from injury. I just don't understand why PSG don't cover him in bubble wrap and maybe don't send him out against freakin' Caen who are going to look to hack him, in the round of 32 of the French cup, when they have a knockout game against Barcelona not even a week later. It's just poor management IMO.
 
It’s all about perception with Neymar.

If he’d have stayed at Barca, he’d have forever been in the shadow of Messi. You could argue that eventually he’d step into the lime light. Ligue 1 isn’t in the limelight like La Liga, so if he scored a hat trick in a game, not as many people will hear about it.

Therefore you remember the Champions League games, where PSG have flattered to deceive.

This doesn’t stop Neymar, or PSG being amongst the top players / teams of the past 5 years though. They’ve just always been pipped at the post.

History remembers stats and trophies. Neymar at this moment in time, won’t excel or ever reach the numbers of at least 10 other players in his era.
 
Sleigh said:
It’s all about perception with Neymar.

If he’d have stayed at Barca, he’d have forever been in the shadow of Messi. You could argue that eventually he’d step into the lime light. Ligue 1 isn’t in the limelight like La Liga, so if he scored a hat trick in a game, not as many people will hear about it.

Therefore you remember the Champions League games, where PSG have flattered to deceive.

This doesn’t stop Neymar, or PSG being amongst the top players / teams of the past 5 years though. They’ve just always been pipped at the post.

History remembers stats and trophies. Neymar at this moment in time, won’t excel or ever reach the numbers of at least 10 other players in his era.
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He literally was only healthy in 1 Champions League and took them to the finals.
 
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