The Mueller Report

Rado_N said:


So he's claiming executive privilege over something that both completely exonerates him and is also fake news.
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Imho he is doing everything he can to tempt the Dems into impeaching and for once Pelosi might actually be on to something.

Step 1. Get Dems to impeach you as ultimate "proof" they re on a witch hunt and they just want DoJ to break the law.

Step 2. Start war with Iran to distract from everything else.

Step 3. Get re-elected.
 
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Barr contempt hearing is live now.
 
Red Defence said:
Does that mean he is or he isn’t...is it the truth or is it another lie!
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Protective privilege is a stalling tactic to give them time to work through the underlying materials and decide which items will be formally privileged.

Actually, thinking about it this will probably work as a defence for Barr against the contempt citation too. "Sorry guys, we can't comply with your subpoena as we need to do a further review of what we can hand over. We're not obstructing you, honest."
 
Listening to some of this JC hearing...it does seem that everyone from the President - AG - GOP are fighting with everything they can think of, no matter how ridiculous an argument they present, to prevent the underlying details of the Mueller report from being disclosed. Only reason that can account for some of this behaviour is that there are some very damning details in that report.

It’s vital that this information is released imo.
 
Redplane said:
Imho he is doing everything he can to tempt the Dems into impeaching and for once Pelosi might actually be on to something.

Step 1. Get Dems to impeach you as ultimate "proof" they re on a witch hunt and they just want DoJ to break the law.

Step 2. Start war with Iran to distract from everything else.

Step 3. Get re-elected.
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6D chess.
 
Redplane said:
Imho he is doing everything he can to tempt the Dems into impeaching and for once Pelosi might actually be on to something.

Step 1. Get Dems to impeach you as ultimate "proof" they re on a witch hunt and they just want DoJ to break the law.

Step 2. Start war with Iran to distract from everything else.

Step 3. Get re-elected.
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Trump is a senile moron, come on.
 
There is an interesting dynamic coming soon.

Congress have indicated they’re preparing to subpoena Mueller.

Mueller is reported to be both prepared for testimony and keen to do so which ties in with him being unhappy about Barr’s actions and keen to provide his summation and answer any questions to allow congress to do their job as he always intended.

Barr and the Trump Admin are keen to stop Mueller testifying. If he is keen to do so, as a private citizen if needs be, then it will be interesting to see how he goes about doing that and what measures Barr/Trump attempt to keep him from testifying.

With the SCO wrapped up, it’s obvious that they have kept him in employment so far because they have control of him.
 
Pexbo said:
There is an interesting dynamic coming soon.

Congress have indicated they’re preparing to subpoena Mueller.

Mueller is reported to be both prepared for testimony and keen to do so which ties in with him being unhappy about Barr’s actions and keen to provide his summation and answer any questions to allow congress to do their job as he always intended.

Barr and the Trump Admin are keen to stop Mueller testifying. If he is keen to do so, as a private citizen if needs be, then it will be interesting to see how he goes about doing that and what measures Barr/Trump attempt to keep him from testifying.

With the SCO wrapped up, it’s obvious that they have kept him in employment so far because they have control of him.
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Yeah I'm really curious if he'll quit to do it. If he did that, and his testimony caused actual deserved consequences he could go down as a genuine American historical figure, someone they teach future generations about. I've no idea if that's where he's going but it seems as likely as him testifying tamely.
 
I'm struggling to think of an appropriate analogy for the way Dem leadership have so completely been publicly embarrassed by their refusal to take Trump on with the power they actually have.
 
shabadu84 said:
I'm struggling to think of an appropriate analogy for the way Dem leadership have so completely been publicly embarrassed by their refusal to take Trump on with the power they actually have.
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It really does have to be handled procedurally IMO. By slow walking it like this, following every necessary step, getting every single piece of paper work correct, they are letting the White House and many Republicans in Congress rack up countless federal crimes and show exactly what they are about to every independent that might be on the fence.

When the GOP conducted investigations into just about everything in the Obama Admin, Obama and his staff complied at every step and the investigations came up empty. It’s goinf to be this massive coverup that will loll Trump and the GOP.

If they go in heavy handed and rush it, Fox and Friends and every single conservative talking head will scram coup and it will dent the Democrats at the poll of they come up empty.
 
Pexbo said:
It really does have to be handled procedurally IMO. By slow walking it like this, following every necessary step, getting every single piece of paper work correct, they are letting the White House and many Republicans in Congress rack up countless federal crimes and show exactly what they are about to every independent that might be on the fence.

When the GOP conducted investigations into just about everything in the Obama Admin, Obama and his staff complied at every step and the investigations came up empty. It’s goinf to be this massive coverup that will loll Trump and the GOP.

If they go in heavy handed and rush it, Fox and Friends and every single conservative talking head will scram coup and it will dent the Democrats at the poll of they come up empty.
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I get the value in going about this by the book. But the longer they drag it out and set 3-4 week good faith deadlines for an administration that has never acted in good faith, the more Trump and Co get to direct the narrative, and of course, continue to implement their policy goals. We're into the middle of May, almost 2 months since the Barr letter, and precisely zero people have been brought in to testify on any of this. Trump, Barr & Rosenstein are gloating in public while Nadler wrings his hands and Pelosi schemes to make Biden the Dem nominee.
 
The more I think about it the more I think there’s a chance Mueller has been threatened, or warned against testifying and saying too much. Sort of a “stick to the script” type of warning. But he will testify and he will not stick to any script but his own. This is his report and it matters to him, just as it matters to all the prosecutors/investigators involved in compiling it. He knows just how serious this situation is too.

Don’t miss his testimony whatever you do or you’ll regret it.
 
Red Defence said:
The more I think about it the more I think there’s a chance Mueller has been threatened, or warned against testifying and saying too much. Sort of a “stick to the script” type of warning. But he will testify and he will not stick to any script but his own. This is his report and it matters to him, just as it matters to all the prosecutors/investigators involved in compiling it. He knows just how serious this situation is too.

Don’t miss his testimony whatever you do or you’ll regret it.
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Did you read his thoughts?
 
I made a similar analogy before, but it's ringing more true now: Trump is basically 'playing' the Dems by just ignoring the rules of the game. Western politics are based around institutions and the norms that govern them. Much of the way that the US political system operates is not 'enshrined in law' - it's just norms. If congress subpoenas you, you show up. If an oversight committee requests material from the WH, it is provided.

But because of luck, skill, wealth whatever, Trump has never had to operate by the rules. I think this is the real reason so many poor, down-trodden Americans love him. Because they followed the rules and their lives (in relative terms) suck. But Trump doesn't. Lose a ton of money on a development? Don't pay the contractors. Get sued? Sue em back, and threaten them like a mobster. Fail? Just lie about it. Decorum? Don't know what it means, don't care.

For all those criticising the Dems ability to 'win' against such a man-child, he's basically fluked a 1-0 lead, picked up the football and is currently holding it in his arms outside the stadium, while the ref (Barr) is waving away protests. And you're blaming the other team for not getting back into the match.

I honestly don't know how you compete with him. He has no shame, he has no truth, he has no morals and he stands for nothing.

I really hope that 20 years from now America is able to look back upon him as a reckoning for the danger of anti-intellectualism, but I fear it's more likely that we'll be in the 2nd term of some televangelist preacher's presidency, having won the electoral college with just 25% of the popular vote.
 
Beachryan said:
I made a similar analogy before, but it's ringing more true now: Trump is basically 'playing' the Dems by just ignoring the rules of the game. Western politics are based around institutions and the norms that govern them. Much of the way that the US political system operates is not 'enshrined in law' - it's just norms. If congress subpoenas you, you show up. If an oversight committee requests material from the WH, it is provided.

But because of luck, skill, wealth whatever, Trump has never had to operate by the rules. I think this is the real reason so many poor, down-trodden Americans love him. Because they followed the rules and their lives (in relative terms) suck. But Trump doesn't. Lose a ton of money on a development? Don't pay the contractors. Get sued? Sue em back, and threaten them like a mobster. Fail? Just lie about it. Decorum? Don't know what it means, don't care.

For all those criticising the Dems ability to 'win' against such a man-child, he's basically fluked a 1-0 lead, picked up the football and is currently holding it in his arms outside the stadium, while the ref (Barr) is waving away protests. And you're blaming the other team for not getting back into the match.

I honestly don't know how you compete with him. He has no shame, he has no truth, he has no morals and he stands for nothing.

I really hope that 20 years from now America is able to look back upon him as a reckoning for the danger of anti-intellectualism, but I fear it's more likely that we'll be in the 2nd term of some televangelist preacher's presidency, having won the electoral college with just 25% of the popular vote.
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I agree about the fragile norms, Trump's background and appeal, good post.
 
Did @Brwned ever come back to this thread? Anyway, the now this goes on the more it becomes clear that Barr is just another Trump man.
 
Wonder what stunt Democrats have up their sleeves for the no show of Mcahn.
 
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