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The Mourinho Thread: Should he stay or go? | Sacked
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I don’t get your top red point? You was either upset or not. Just pick one.
this thread is a fecking winner isnt it?
Lol. My point exactly. Just because we're Manchester United, you expect us to compete and win every year. Please take a look at the squad Mourinho inherited. A broken squad full of players past their best or simply nowhere near good enough. We still have masses of deadwood in our squad because it's not possible to simply sell everyone and replace them all with better players. It takes time.
Take a look at City's transfer policy this past 5 years, it's excellent. They consistently buy world class players in their early 20's Pep walked in to a world class spine, that was used to winning.
Mourinho took over a fecking awful squad. The worst in my lifetime and I've been a season ticket holder over 10 years and a fan for 25 years.
No spine, no real quality, only 1 world class player in DDG - yet fans like you just throw your toys out of the pram and say "we should win all the time because we're Man United". You need to open your eyes and realise the relativity of the job Mourinho as done.
A squad comprising of Jones Smalling Young Valencia Darmian Schweinsteiger Schneiderlain Fellaini Depay Rooney etc doesn't come close to comparing to the spine of City or even of Spurs.
But no, lets sack every manager who tries to rebuild us.
4 paragraphs of excuses. Which players where old and over the hill? Rooney? We had one of the youngest squads in the league. LVG did the rebuild Mourinho’s job was to improve the quality which he has. To me this squad is better than Fergie’s title winning squad and our points tally and position last season kind of proves it. I don’t really care what City have been doing with spent a fair bit ourself and we have brought well.. we need to focus on how to get this title back by improving on the pitch we haven’t been good enough.
God-awful is probably an exaggeration on my part (this is not a new thing) so let's just call it 'negative' for the sake of argument. I have to admit, the team have shown a lot of attacking intent over the last couple of weeks in combination with an intense high-press that seems to be working well at the moment, not to mention this new style of play is a great deal more pleasing on the eye.
If we can sustain this playstyle over the course of the season and pick up valuable points along the way, who knows, it may just work out for Jose. Still, I have my doubts, probably something to do with the near endless false dawns we have had to contend with over the last 5 years.
He's also improved his attitude toward the press (he was laughing and joking with them yesterday) plus heading over to the fans after the game to applaud them for their incredible support - people are suggesting that his intentions are disingenuous or a PR stunt but even if that is indeed the case, it shows that he cares enough about the club and its fans to go out of his way to make the effort in winning them back, which speaks volumes in itself.
Funny post.
Schweinstiger, Rooney, Schneiderlin, Carrick all needed slow transitioning out the team whilst LVG left no established, proven striker ready to lead the line.
He had Blind as his mainstay centre back and thought Darmien was the right man to replace Valencia FFS. It was quite the joke.
Jose basically walked into the shower of shite squad and brought in players who on their day, could push for a place amongst his domestic rivals. Like Matic Pogba, Lukaku, Sanchez.
He then improved players like Lingard and Rojo further by tweaking their position or giving them a bit more creative freedom.
If Mourinho buys a house in Manchester and brings him family here, I will change my opinion of him and want him to stay. It's all about commitment for me. I don't think he's committed, heartedly, and that's a sin for any manager of this great club. Too late for that of course, it won't happen.
From the man who earlier this year labelled him outdated. I don’t respect his opinions, he’s strangely overrated. He seems convinced Mourinho bonding with the fans was planned (next door to “staged”), he continues the narrative that “everyone” thinks he’ll end up sacked (the everyone refers to hacks like Ronay and the drivel rival club pundits). And there is no context whatsoever. Just miserable Jose with his shite underdog football didn’t work, now the fake nice Jose might be morally acceptable to me but he’ll get sacked before the season’s finished.
It’s not really optimistic, it’s a sarcastic back-handed compliment by one of the early birds of the anit-Mourinho narrative.
Oh not this again...
He said players were past their best? There was only Rooney. Schweinstiger was always injured. Carrick still could play and play well. I don’t know what we was expecting from a rebuild it wasn’t going to happen in a season but it wasn’t a bad job. Yes we had no recognised striker but that’s because we had to get rid of an aging RVP, Hernandez and quite frankly a crap Rooney(who José did a perfect job of removing). I just don’t get where LVG did bodge of a job. If anything he pretty much proved fans no nothing about players. When we was after Nathaniel Clyne for RB half of the transfer forum kept raving about this Italian who was the best RB in Serie A lol, then we got him. I say that was a success. Schneiderlin was some demi god at Southampton who fans also wanted and Memphis was a Player with great potential, quick strong and a great strike. I don’t remember redcafe moaning about poor signings at the time. Everyone was pretty chuffed. What we didn’t count on was players need a certain type of mentality to play here and it still exist now as your Lindelof’s and Mkhitaryan’s have shown.
Pretty debatable about the players playing for him... That is to be determined. If the first games of the season are any indication then the players don't give a toss about Jose. Of course Shaw is going to play along and say good things... He's not on a suicide mission to leave the club.
If you truly believe it is only the media who is trying to turn people against Jose I don't know what to say other than that is very naive. It is Jose who has turned people against him and no one else. He's done this by acting so petulant and devoid of any happiness or optomism in front of the supporters. The days of his dry humor and charm are over... He now sounds like grumpy old man living in the past and carrying on about how great he used to be. No one cares how many trophies he's won back in the day. And to complain that he's not been backed sufficiently by Woodward and United is just insulting. His signings have left a lot to be desired and that's just the truth. More and more people are starting to get tired of his approach...on and off the pitch. He only has himself to blame.
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LVG broadly misbought whereas Jose didn't. That's pretty much what it comes down to.
Jose's Mkhi was a transfer comparable in price and position to Depay, except Jose fixed it by pouncing on Sanchez. LVG had 2 seasons to find a long term established striker and failed to address the issue. Jose meanwhile went in and got Lukaku at the start of last year.
Yeah Schneiderlin was rated at the time of purchase but LVG made him operate in a role he never even played for Southampton. He forced him to sit and hold which was just bizzare for the skil set he was bought for.
Carrick couldn't perform for a whole season and Schweinstiger was definately over the hill. Valencia also needed transitioning (and still does). Then you have the whole playing a left back (Blind) at CB. Whilst playing someone better at CB (Rojo) at left back. The whole thing was just bizzare and a complete shit show for Jose to walk in and manage.
I think he did well. Learned from the Casilas issue from Real and tactfully phased Rooney out, made some use of Rojo for a solid first season as CB, brought in Zlatan as a stop gap before Lukaku, and spent money well on Matic. Pogba is up for debate but that's another matter tbf. He's not as big a flop as £60m Di Maria that's for damn sure.
LVG broadly misbought whereas Jose didn't. That's pretty much what it comes down to.
Jose's Mkhi was a transfer comparable in price and position to Depay, except Jose fixed it by pouncing on Sanchez. LVG had 2 seasons to find a long term established striker and failed to address the issue. Jose meanwhile went in and got Lukaku at the start of last year.
Yeah Schneiderlin was rated at the time of purchase but LVG made him operate in a role he never even played for Southampton. He forced him to sit and hold which was just bizzare for the skil set he was bought for.
Carrick couldn't perform for a whole season and Schweinstiger was definately over the hill. Valencia also needed transitioning (and still does). Then you have the whole playing a left back (Blind) at CB. Whilst playing someone better at CB (Rojo) at left back. The whole thing was just bizzare and a complete shit show for Jose to walk in and manage.
I think he did well. Learned from the Casilas issue from Real and tactfully phased Rooney out, made some use of Rojo for a solid first season as CB, brought in Zlatan as a stop gap before Lukaku, and spent money well on Matic. Pogba is up for debate but that's another matter tbf. He's not as big a flop as £60m Di Maria that's for damn sure.
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I absolutely detest Jose - saying that; the one thing I could not stand about him is his inability to change - his persona, his players, his tactics etc. The fact he is trying things differently is making it a bit easier for me to watch his football. I didn't want him to turn this to his porto/chelsea 2.0 & since the pressure has increased; he looks further away from it after looking initially closer than ever.
Bunch of plastics in this thread.
The poll is completely biased.
The poll is completely biased.
So true, especially the start of last season. Good luck with the press or 60% of this place ever believing you.
I also see lot of posters keep talking about Mourinho should do away with the park the bus strategy. We don't park the bus at all. It is as if, people don't even see our matches and just keep using the same old phrase because some of the so called pundits keep saying that
Some people asking if he is commited, of course he is. If he is not commited then he is an idiot. He is commited for sure.ö
Saw this on goal.com. Not sure what was the actual quote. But all of it was mentioned in jest apparently
Sunday's convincing 2-0 win over Burnley has gone some way to quietening the Portuguese's detractors, however, but there are still rumours abound that he could face the sack if he cannot secure positive results with more regularity
Mourinho, though, has no such fears, laughing as he told La Repubblica: “If they sent me away, do you have any idea how much money they would have to give me?!”
“They say I'm in danger, but I don't think so.”
When jokingly asked to admit that it was he who paid for the fly-over, Mourinho replied: “No... but I could have!”
Sunday's convincing 2-0 win over Burnley has gone some way to quietening the Portuguese's detractors, however, but there are still rumours abound that he could face the sack if he cannot secure positive results with more regularity
Mourinho, though, has no such fears, laughing as he told La Repubblica: “If they sent me away, do you have any idea how much money they would have to give me?!”
“They say I'm in danger, but I don't think so.”
When jokingly asked to admit that it was he who paid for the fly-over, Mourinho replied: “No... but I could have!”
Crazy the amount of Yes votes here.
There's no quick fix to get us back to being title contenders, and it's only been a handful of games so far this season.
There's no quick fix to get us back to being title contenders, and it's only been a handful of games so far this season.
You were saying.
Why, what were you expecting in The Mourinho Out Thread ?
There is selection Bias. For example, I have been ignoring the thread for some time, and today just by chance opened it up and saw there’s a poll attached.
Lol. My point exactly. Just because we're Manchester United, you expect us to compete and win every year. Please take a look at the squad Mourinho inherited. A broken squad full of players past their best or simply nowhere near good enough. We still have masses of deadwood in our squad because it's not possible to simply sell everyone and replace them all with better players. It takes time.
Take a look at City's transfer policy this past 5 years, it's excellent. They consistently buy world class players in their early 20's Pep walked in to a world class spine, that was used to winning.
Mourinho took over a fecking awful squad. The worst in my lifetime and I've been a season ticket holder over 10 years and a fan for 25 years.
No spine, no real quality, only 1 world class player in DDG - yet fans like you just throw your toys out of the pram and say "we should win all the time because we're Man United". You need to open your eyes and realise the relativity of the job Mourinho as done.
A squad comprising of Jones Smalling Young Valencia Darmian Schweinsteiger Schneiderlain Fellaini Depay Rooney etc doesn't come close to comparing to the spine of City or even of Spurs.
But no, lets sack every manager who tries to rebuild us.
This times a million!
Although I think the squad Fergie left was arguably worse tbh. He somehow eeked that title out of those players then left. And with him David Gill which was a huge mistake for the transition period.
Back to your point, not only did Pep walk into a world class spine, he also walked into a club that had spent four years preparing for him. Jose's situation was about as far opposite as you could get - literally. Imagine taking hold of an entire team schooled to play the opposite way and having to turn them around. It takes time. You can't just throw everything out, you have to work with what you got. City were well ahead of us when he took over, and then they added to it and outspent us too. They had one problem with their defence and in one season he took care of it. He even bought a shit goalie then replaced him the next season. How can people just say I dont care what happened to City as though it shouldn't have any effect on our ability to win the title?
Things move on. We don't have a divine right to win the title just cos we're United. If you snooze you lose and we're in a slumber. When you're ahead you can't stand still you have to keep improving because everyone else will. Fergie performed miracles with what he had and that made our board complacent. Because why spend more money if you can just make it. But that was only going to last so long. And time ran out. Now we're in a totally different age. In Fergie's time it used to be one on one. Man Utd vs Leeds, Man Utd vs Blackburn, vs Villa, Newcastle, Arsenal, Chelsea. That's a whole lot easier to deal with. Plus we were outspending everyone and streets ahead in terms of our brand, earning millions more. That's gone now. Now we're battling clubs like City and PSG funded by countries.
We're not just fighting one team in our league, we're fighting 5. 5 teams that arguably are better equipped and have a single-minded vision. Look at what Liverpool have done this season. Like City they've completely focused on their defense. Spurs bought no one and they will suffer, but they already had a good squad, playing the same way for years.
Should we be playing better football with our current squad? Sure. But expecting us to bridge a 19 point gap by just improving our existing players is ludicrous.
Jose may me a bit pragmatic and risk averse but the fact is he's right. The best attacks are founded on a good defence. Just like we had when we won all our titles.
We needed reinforcements and we didnt get them. So now we'll see. We're in for a bumpy ride but if we continue to play how we're doing now then it's gonna be exciting.
And like Fergie always said, we never like to make it easy.
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If we don't make it out of group and and look like we can't compete for the title, then he should be fired in December.
As I walked home tonight I saw either by the Sun or the Star (or one of the similar shite tabloids) the back story of Mourinho claiming Rashford was a “naive boy”.
Anyone who sides with the fecking media makes me sick.
Anyone who sides with the fecking media makes me sick.
You say this after two games. You are very difficult to take serious. This is one of the greatest managers of all time. I cannot believe some of the stuff said about him.
In b4 da lock.
In hindsight I can criticise purchasing all the way back to Fergie and when we get the new manager I can also criticise Mourinho to the hill too. I could do it now. But to say LVG failed to fix problems is a joke. He didn’t get a striker? We brought Falcao. He then got rid of Falcao and RVP because they was over the hill and brought a talented Martial. What’s wrong with that? Blind at CB was a success and if we continued to play that B-tec tika taka way he would still be a success now. Mourinho got the best years of Valencia at RB so I don’t get how LVG doesn’t get credit for converting him into that position. Yes it naturally was going to have its ups and downs at first like the Arsenal game but other than that he’s been a top RB.
Jose came in and put world class quality into the team where as LVG was willing to coach the players he had, as you noted though.. some of them badly lol. However in hindsight I think we would have seen a better Luke Shaw, Martial, Rashford, Blind, Pereira and Borthwick-Jackson if he stayed. But it was time for us to move on. Only difference is this team was actually ready for Pep and not a Mourinho.
Mourinho was willing to allow Martial leave at the expense of Perisic/Willian. Think about that for a second. If anyone at Chelsea had the guts to do what Ed is doing now, Mo Salah and De Bruyne will still be playing for Chelsea.
And Mourinho has been back with over 400M pounds, If Mourinho found a decent signing, Ed will go for it. Toby at 60M? Get out of town. The rhetoric that everybody know Mourinho style is pure nonsense. He's 2004 Chelsea team was very young with only Makalele at 31yrs, same with his Porto side. Mourinho wants to win now to counter the competition, Ed wants to build a legacy. I'm still shocked with how United fans can have issues with Ed's logic to low point of flying a plane.
When you say Pep walked into a better situation you kind of have to explain. KDB was up for grabs for us too. We just decided not to go for him however if the manager wanted him im sure we could have made the deal happen. This City side had a lot of work to fix, they wasn’t playing the Pep way the only player remotely identified who could play his way was KDB and David Silva. This was a team who’s transfer policy consisted of purchasing yes Kompany, Fernandinho, Silva and Augero. However that was over a very long period many in Fergie’s flipping era. After that includes you Dzeko’s, Jovetic, Jack Rodwell, Fernando, Mangala, Jesus Neves, Nasri, Sagna, Clichy, Demichilis. Do you guys wish we had these glorious players? I don’t think you do but this is what Pep had to deal with and fix. So let’s stop acting like his job was a walk in the park. Whilst he was aloud to fix his early mistakes he also learned pretty quickly.
Just watch jose now, I really believe that moment after the final whistle on Sunday has galvanised us, he's got a point to prove not only to the doubters and the anti utd press but to himself.
The war starts now.
The war starts now.
It should be binned off. At least for now.
It’s clear the hardcore match going support are behind him, it’s clear the lads are behind him, and there are signs of hope where the football is concerned.
He’s done well to ride this storm, lesser managers would have crumbled. It’s clear he’s one of the few managers out there with the balls and ego for this job.
While we all have reservations now is the time to be United. Threads like this on one of the biggest United forums going just gives more ammunition to those ABU tabloid scumbags.
Wow. I can't believe that's second person to talk this way about this incident.
Astonishing that some can't grasp the fact that fecking football isn't the most important thing in life.
I'm thinking about how after he shipped them of the club he won the Premier league.
This argument is really silly, and I'm being polite, for numerous reasons. First of all, De Bruyne and Salah were not the same players in 2013 as they are today. Before they joined City/Liverpool they had two seasons in Werder/Wolfsburg - De Bruyne and Fiorentina/Roma - Salah where they further developed and grown. Second, they had better players in their place - Hazard, Oscar, Willian, Schurrle who tore apart the league. And third, which is pretty much the most important thing for this context, Chelsea was never a developing club, they don't give a shit about academy players, all Abramović care is short term results and titles so Mourinho didn't really have time to deal with kids.
Also, he won the fecking league after!
I personally can't support Mourinho because of the amount of disrepect he's given to the club and players, referring to the 'football heritage' rant he had and other times he's called into question the quality of the team (he said that there were 'many' Sevilla players who would play in his team). I don't understand how fans would also defend those type of comments, it's like being in a bad relationship where the other person makes you think you're a piece of sh*t (football heritage rant) and worthless without him (getting 2nd place was the biggest achievement of his career quote). What he said about United's football 'heritage' as a way to defend his crap performance against Sevilla was absolutely disgraceful and an insult to the club, unforgivable.
That's just his attitude, when things go wrong he never blames himself but rather goes on to demean the club and players. I never wanted him here and will never be a fan of him. I'm not in the 'Mourinho Out' campaign though where I want him to be fired immediately because he did come 2nd in the league and you couldn't expect anyone to beat that City team. But if he doesn't pose a title challenge this year with our rivals doing well, along with struggling in the UCL, then his position can be called into question.
That's just his attitude, when things go wrong he never blames himself but rather goes on to demean the club and players. I never wanted him here and will never be a fan of him. I'm not in the 'Mourinho Out' campaign though where I want him to be fired immediately because he did come 2nd in the league and you couldn't expect anyone to beat that City team. But if he doesn't pose a title challenge this year with our rivals doing well, along with struggling in the UCL, then his position can be called into question.
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I hope so, playing that way is much more progressive and will take us further. Keeping the ball away from our own goal is the best way to stop conceding.
Yeah I do think they'll have an influence, all i've ever wanted is progression with this team but the last 6 months I felt we were going backwards. I don't expect us to win every match but if we can play some good football and give it 100% every match i'll be happy. Doing that we will win 80% of the matches anyway. You could see the positive effect it had on the fans too, they didn't stop signing all game because they actually enjoyed it.
Maybe signing Joga Bonito made Jose understand what the fans want
Yeah but they were also behind Moyes when he had us languishing in 7th.
Quite.
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