The MMA thread

Oggmonster said:
Surely kickboxing or muay thai would be more for you then? The whole point of MMA is it's mixed martial arts so multiple disciplines. It seems you only like certain ones (which is fair enough no problem with that) and then you won't be a huge fan of MMA.

They do break up fights if they're against the cage as well with no action, it happens all the time. Watch the Woodley vs. Till fight anytime they got near the cage it was split up...probably to soon really.
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Ground fighting is fine in small quantities, I do appreciate the whole skill behind it but it just doesn't make for good viewing. Nothing like a good ground and pound or slamming take down but on the other hand you have Chad Mendes vs McGregor, where one guy has no other plan but to do take down repetitively.

Again I can appreciate it. Jiu Jitsu for example, it's an incredible fighting style. Just leave it at home and go in a thump the heads off each other in the octagon. :lol:
 
Trizy said:
Not a huge UFC fan but a McGregor one, that's the only reason I watch MMA.

Reason I'm not a huge UFC fan is exactly what this match is: One man wanting to fight standing up and the other looking to dry hump on the ground. I can't stand UFC when it's two dudes who spend most the match on the ground, if I wanted to watch that shit I'd watch WWE. None bias rule, but there should be a time short time limit of how long you can be on the ground/against the cage before the ref breaks it up. Would be proper Ultimate Fighting and not Intimate Wrestling.

But hey, that's just my opinion.
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It's called mixed martial arts, not UFC and if you want to watch stand up fighting only then try boxing, kickboxing, muay-thai or any of the other multitude of combat sports that cater exclusively for that.
 
Is Mendes anything close to Khabib's level in terms of wrestling?

I just hope McGregor knocks him out real nice and early. I wasn't confident before the Alvarez fight but that was as easy as they come for Conor so hopefully he'll surprise me again tomorrow. Can't fecking wait.
 
@Vato it seems it isn't on Play Sports or Eleven, is there a channel showing this or do you have to buy the UFC Fight Pass?
 
Trizy said:
Ground fighting is fine in small quantities, I do appreciate the whole skill behind it but it just doesn't make for good viewing. Nothing like a good ground and pound or slamming take down but on the other hand you have Chad Mendes vs McGregor, where one guy has no other plan but to do take down repetitively.

Again I can appreciate it. Jiu Jitsu for example, it's an incredible fighting style. Just leave it at home and go in a thump the heads off each other in the octagon. :lol:
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If you think that it's your opinion and you're perfectly entitled to it. Just seems it's the wrong sport to watch and you would prefer stuff like kickboxing than MMA as it will always have a wrestling element. I think you're doing Mendes a massive disservice there to. He's hugely entertaining to watch and has as many KO wins as he does decision wins. His 2nd fight with Aldo is probably the best featherweight fight ever.

You've admitted you don't like MMA and it's fair enough, just offering some other ways for you to enjoy combat sport and McGregor's style which is obviously not very wrestling heavy.
 
RobinLFC said:
@Vato it seems it isn't on Play Sports or Eleven, is there a channel showing this or do you have to buy the UFC Fight Pass?
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Yep, either buy the ppv, stream it (reddit mma streams) or download it the day after.

Aren't the prelims on Eleven sports though? Haven't checked yet.

I'd watch it live but the problem is that it ends so fecking late (almost 8am), and usually I'm so knackered for the main event, that I almost don't enjoy it.

Edit - I'm not sure if the ppv events are on Fight Pass either, I think it's just the prelims and the ufc fight night events.
 
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Vato said:
Yep, either buy the ppv, stream it (reddit mma streams) or download it the day after.

Aren't the prelims on Eleven sports though? Haven't checked yet.

I'd watch it live but the problem is that it ends so fecking late (almost 8am), and usually I'm so knackered for the main event, that I almost don't enjoy it.

Edit - I'm not sure if the ppv events are on Fight Pass either, I think it's just the prelims and the ufc fight night events.
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Cheers, I'll stream it in that case. I don't bother with the other fights usually, now I think I'll get up around 5am and catch the Ferguson fight to get in the mood.
 
cyberman said:
Khabib doesn't finish fights, Khabib would have to take him down for 5 straight rounds for Conor to stand no chance? They're stood up at the end of every round too lol.
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The hatred and animosity between them - do you honestly think Khabib won't destroy Conor within a round if he gets him down? In fact, if Khabib has his way, he'll probably torture Conor in there so absolutely batter him every round to make him want to quit, which would be the ultimate humiliation. The standing up then will be redundant because Conor will be slow and exhausted.

Conor has gas, in a normal bout, for about 2 rounds, you add in any kind of mauling, and he's good for one, imo. If Conor wins, it will be early and decisive, but it won't be a puncher's chance - it'll be a clean and decisive K.O..
 
But Khabib doesn't really do submissions, he pressures you and mauls you on the ground.
He can be angry all he wants, unless Conor taps to punches or the ref forgets to stand them up at the end of every round then Conor still has every chance to win if Khabib gets him down.
Repeatedly getting Conor down is a different matter but Conor only has to smack him one time to win, thats a huge difference.
 
The Conor will gas out is a bit of overblown if you ask me. 2 times he gassed out, once v Diaz in the 1st fight, where he moved up 2 weight classes to fight him and only after his original opponent had pulled out. 2nd v Mayweather in a sport he doesn't fight in against one of the most technical fighters of all time. In both those scenarios most fighters would gas out. Not saying he's won't tire, all fighters do, but look at his 2nd fight v Diaz, Conor finished that fight strong in the last round, he give as good as he got against one of the fittest fighters on the roster in that last round after a gruelling contest. I also don't buy he needs to knock him early. Khabib will tire too, and as we've seen before he does leave himself open. Dan Hardy made a good case about Conor knocking him in the 3rd. Conor spends a lot of energy throwing his big punches, esp those that don't land, but as Sonnen said in his preview, there's a lot of energy spent in getting your opponent to the ground and holding him. Regardless of what Khabib's camp are saying, you can tell he's had a very tough weight cut and probably in smaller time frame than he's used to. I'm 50/50 on who wins it tbh at this stage. It's mixed martial arts, but really these are 2 top level fights in one domain each, striking and grappling. I'm a massive Conor fan, hope he does it.
 
poleglass red said:
The Conor will gas out is a bit of overblown if you ask me. 2 times he gassed out, once v Diaz in the 1st fight, where he moved up 2 weight classes to fight him and only after his original opponent had pulled out. 2nd v Mayweather in a sport he doesn't fight in against one of the most technical fighters of all time. In both those scenarios most fighters would gas out. Not saying he's won't tire, all fighters do, but look at his 2nd fight v Diaz, Conor finished that fight strong in the last round, he give as good as he got against one of the fittest fighters on the roster in that last round after a gruelling contest. I also don't buy he needs to knock him early. Khabib will tire too, and as we've seen before he does leave himself open. Dan Hardy made a good case about Conor knocking him in the 3rd. Conor spends a lot of energy throwing his big punches, esp those that don't land, but as Sonnen said in his preview, there's a lot of energy spent in getting your opponent to the ground and holding him. Regardless of what Khabib's camp are saying, you can tell he's had a very tough weight cut and probably in smaller time frame than he's used to. I'm 50/50 on who wins it tbh at this stage. It's mixed martial arts, but really these are 2 top level fights in one domain each, striking and grappling. I'm a massive Conor fan, hope he does it.
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It probably is slightly but he does have issues with it.

The Mendes fight he was struggling a bit with it, especially at the end of the 1st round when he got taken down twice, both the Diaz fights he had moments (once he lost cos of it, the other he did well to overcome it in fairness) and Mayweather he was struggling albeit he was in with one of the best of his generation. I think it's a valid point to make based on his history that if Khabib pressures him he may struggle with stamina
 
Oggmonster said:
It probably is slightly but he does have issues with it.

The Mendes fight he was struggling a bit with it, especially at the end of the 1st round when he got taken down twice, both the Diaz fights he had moments (once he lost cos of it, the other he did well to overcome it in fairness) and Mayweather he was struggling albeit he was in with one of the best of his generation. I think it's a valid point to make based on his history that if Khabib pressures him he may struggle with stamina
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Plus as I remember the second Diaz a big part of his recovery after he dipped was down to him leg kicking the shit out of Diaz to keep him at bay? Don't think that will work against Khabib.
 
Fortitude said:
The hatred and animosity between them - do you honestly think Khabib won't destroy Conor within a round if he gets him down? In fact, if Khabib has his way, he'll probably torture Conor in there so absolutely batter him every round to make him want to quit, which would be the ultimate humiliation. The standing up then will be redundant because Conor will be slow and exhausted.

Conor has gas, in a normal bout, for about 2 rounds, you add in any kind of mauling, and he's good for one, imo. If Conor wins, it will be early and decisive, but it won't be a puncher's chance - it'll be a clean and decisive K.O..
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Conor is far too dangerous on his feet to play with. If he gets him down and has a chance to finish he will take it, no way he risks it getting stood up at the end of the round.
 
cyberman said:
But Khabib doesn't really do submissions, he pressures you and mauls you on the ground.
He can be angry all he wants, unless Conor taps to punches or the ref forgets to stand them up at the end of every round then Conor still has every chance to win if Khabib gets him down.
Repeatedly getting Conor down is a different matter but Conor only has to smack him one time to win, thats a huge difference.
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You're assuming Khabib cannot submit here, though, which, I would bet is definitely not the case and if he does get Conor down he's going to want to really damage him, and not just in terms of winning the fight, imo. If Khabib is having his way, then we'll see just what he puts Conor through. I'd expect it to be the worst beating he's given anybody since being in UFC, personally.

Being stood up at the end of each round, on a massively diminished tank is not the same as having all faculties completely intact and ready to go. Conor doesn't swing like a lunatic and hope a haymaker ends the fight, and to do what Conor does, he has to still have that energy for movement still there and ready to access. Beyond the 2nd round, he'll be a sitting duck if he has been put through the mill on the ground, imo. That's when it becomes a puncher's chance, but before that, Conor knocking Khabib out would not be some unexpected miracle as it has a very real chance of happening, which is why I refute what nucks said as he makes it sound like something improbable when it is in fact highly probable if Khabib can't get him down - Khabib stands no chance in a stand-up bout with Conor unless he's severely exhausted him first.
 
Oggmonster said:
It probably is slightly but he does have issues with it.

The Mendes fight he was struggling a bit with it, especially at the end of the 1st round when he got taken down twice, both the Diaz fights he had moments (once he lost cos of it, the other he did well to overcome it in fairness) and Mayweather he was struggling albeit he was in with one of the best of his generation. I think it's a valid point to make based on his history that if Khabib pressures him he may struggle with stamina
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I’m sure he said in the Mendez fight he went in to the fight injured and couldn’t move like he wanted to. Diaz fight he went out there and threw bomb after bomb at Nate and he seemed to have this fascination with that spinning cartwheel like heel kick. Basically think he overestimated his power and underestimated how much Nate could take and just blew himself out. Got to figure in the carrying an extra 15lbs on top of that from what was intended a 155 fight and Nate being somewhere in the region of 190+ so he was giving away something like 20lbs since Conner said he was struggiling to maintain 170.

There is no doubt in my mind he maybe doesn’t have as good a gas tank as some professional fighters but I think the reason he burns out is just to how he fights it’s power and explosition mixed in with just incredible understanding of movement and timing. That Floyd fight he was being the aggressor switching up constantly punching and just gassed out then Mayweather took over and let his experience and quality do the damage.
 
cyberman said:
Khabib doesn't finish fights, Khabib would have to take him down for 5 straight rounds for Conor to stand no chance? They're stood up at the end of every round too lol.
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Trouble is his opponents are extremely gassed and demoralized in later rounds to where they no longer have the stamina to use their striking after Khabib has spent the entire round probably punching them on the face from half guard.
 
poleglass red said:
The Conor will gas out is a bit of overblown if you ask me.
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Correct.

Oggmonster said:
It probably is slightly but he does have issues with it.

The Mendes fight he was struggling a bit with it, especially at the end of the 1st round when he got taken down twice, both the Diaz fights he had moments (once he lost cos of it, the other he did well to overcome it in fairness) and Mayweather he was struggling albeit he was in with one of the best of his generation. I think it's a valid point to make based on his history that if Khabib pressures him he may struggle with stamina
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I think the whole Diaz and McGregor cardio is a bit of a myth to be honest. McGregor absolutely hammered Diaz in both fights with huge shots over and over. Only for Diaz is brain dead or a zombie and took them. Had McGregor fought any other fighter in 155 and hit them with the same shots, they'd be dead. He obviously gassed because of the punches he was landing. Source: Diaz face both fights.

Mendez was on short notice and he wasn't prepared for a wrestler IIRC. Also, before he landed the knock out combo, Mendez looked more tired.

Mayweather is a better example of gassing. But the only way he was going to win is give it all and hard in the early rounds.

I'm not MMA expert but I have seen all McGregor's fights, I don't think we've truly seen a battle where he's gassed where it's fair to judge it without taking things into account. I think Aldo would've been a true indicator of where his cardio was, but McGregor killed him in 1 punch :lol:
 
Raoul said:
Trouble is his opponents are extremely gassed and demoralized in later rounds to where they no longer have the stamina to use their striking after Khabib has spent the entire round probably punching them on the face from half guard.
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Khabib hasn't had many 5 round fights if I recall so he's going into unchartered waters too once we go into the 4th and 5th. Al Iaquinta in his last is the only one I can recall, and that was a fighter who took that fight very late. Like Conor hasn't faced someone with the wrestling pedigree of Khabib, the same can be said about Khabib and his opponents in regards to striking. Maybe Barboza but his striking is more kick related and that's negated somewhat by the treat of Khabib's takedowns. Khabib's last 4 wins have been Horcher, Johnson, Barboza and Laquinta. None of them have that 1 punch ko that Conor has. For a guy who cuts a lot of weight, going into a 4th and 5th round, could be a bit more taxing that people realise.
 
poleglass red said:
Khabib hasn't had many 5 round fights if I recall so he's going into unchartered waters too once we go into the 4th and 5th. Al Iaquinta in his last is the only one I can recall, and that was a fighter who took that fight very late. Like Conor hasn't faced someone with the wrestling pedigree of Khabib, the same can be said about Khabib and his opponents in regards to striking. Maybe Barboza but his striking is more kick related and that's negated somewhat by the treat of Khabib's takedowns. Khabib's last 4 wins have been Horcher, Johnson, Barboza and Laquinta. None of them have that 1 punch ko that Conor has. For a guy who cuts a lot of weight, going into a 4th and 5th round, could be a bit more taxing that people realise.
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That's all true but Conor has only been in a 3rd round or beyond twice ever, so it stands to reason that if he gets taken down against a great grappler then he is not likely to retain his punching advantage past round 1 or 2. He faded very quickly in Nate Diaz 1 and will be even more demoralized if Khabib takes him down early. His only chance therefore will be to knock him out early.
 
Raoul said:
That's all true but Conor has only been in a 3rd round or beyond twice ever, so it stands to reason that if he gets taken down against a great grappler then he is not likely to retain his punching advantage past round 1 or 2. He faded very quickly in Nate Diaz 1 and will be even more demoralized if Khabib takes him down early. His only chance therefore will be to knock him out early.
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could very well be that what is exciting about this.
I don't agree personally he needs to knock him early. Khabib will tire as well and I feel Conor could still ko him past the 3rd. The Diaz 1 fight I don't give much credence too, he moved up a weight class to fight RDA then less than 2 weeks out he pulls out and he moves up another weight class to fight Diaz, thats a 25lb jump in one fight. The Diaz 2 fight is a better barometer. He prepped for that fighter at welterweight his whole camp. Conor was still throwing bombs late on against a cardio machine in Diaz in a weight class he doesn't fight in. I'd take more value from Conor's only 5 round fight v diaz 2 fight than Khabib's only 5 round win v Laquinta who was a last min change. I agree that early on when Conor is fresh he has a greater chance, a much greater chance in fact, but I still believe he can do it in the later rounds. Khabib leaves his chin exposed when he's fresh, the tireder he gets the more that will be left open.
 
Mendes took him to the ground multiple times as well and Mendes looked a lot more tired than Conor did at the end of round 2 imo.
 
RobinLFC said:
Mendes took him to the ground multiple times as well and Mendes looked a lot more tired than Conor did at the end of round 2 imo.
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That's because Mendes is a far more explosive/fast twitch type fighter who is prone to gassing. He took Conor down with ease and would've finished him in round two if he had better cardio. Khabib is far more efficient and suffocating once he gets his opponents down (although Mendes is probably a more explosive puncher).
 
Trizy said:
Ground fighting is fine in small quantities, I do appreciate the whole skill behind it but it just doesn't make for good viewing. Nothing like a good ground and pound or slamming take down but on the other hand you have Chad Mendes vs McGregor, where one guy has no other plan but to do take down repetitively.

Again I can appreciate it. Jiu Jitsu for example, it's an incredible fighting style. Just leave it at home and go in a thump the heads off each other in the octagon. :lol:
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Opinions and all that but if you appreciated the work that goes into the ground game and the technique -- you'd have a different outlook on it.
 
RobinLFC said:
Is Mendes anything close to Khabib's level in terms of wrestling?

I just hope McGregor knocks him out real nice and early. I wasn't confident before the Alvarez fight but that was as easy as they come for Conor so hopefully he'll surprise me again tomorrow. Can't fecking wait.
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No. He isn't. He doesn't have the same intensity, power or gnp game. Khabib is a different beast.
 
RobinLFC said:
Mendes took him to the ground multiple times as well and Mendes looked a lot more tired than Conor did at the end of round 2 imo.
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last min change of opponent again for Conor. Prepped to fight Aldo who pulls out, then replaced 2 weeks out by a wrestler in Mendes. Would have required a totally different training camp to prep for each fighter. Kudos on both men for taking that fight and saving that card. Woodley's last fight, he categorically stated had Till not made weight, which was a legitimate concern, that he wouldn't have faced Usman who made it be known he was prepared to step in last min and fight. Is Woodley scared of him, no, in fact I think he beats him, but it would take a different training camp to prep for each fighter
 
People underestimate the amount of cardio it takes to try to defend a take take down or when you're in clench, never mind being on the ground or against the fence. If you've ever wrestled before, you'll know what I'm talking about. It's fecking horrible and puts stress on all of your body. You thighs go. Your arms are gassed. Trying to wrestle your way out doesn't even compare to throwing punches -- it's way more exerting on your stamina. Now couple that with getting your face punched for 3-4 minutes it becomes truly exhausting. So like Conors cardio will definitely be under scrutiny if it goes to ground.

Conor wins this is he uses few combinations of his. I can't actually remember who he K.O'd with one punch at 155. It'll be a T.K.O if anything. But we will see what Khabibs chin is like, we actually don't know. I know MJ tagged him and Barboza kicked him in the head but he walked through those with relative ease. So we will see on Sunday no doubt as Conor will surely land a few.

If it goes to ground -- Conor is fecked. He can wrestle 200 pounds guys all he wants, Khabib's wrestling partner is DC which is fecking legit crazy. And besides, it takes years to master wrestling, you're not going to be anywhere near a level of an Olympic/World Champion wrestler if you weren't before. Even if you're competement wrestler like Truijlo, a double college champion - you'll still get fecked by someone who's been on a different level to you their whole life.

I'm rooting for Khabib obviously but McGregor can definitely do this if Khabib keeps leaving his head up and eating punches like sometimes he does.
 
poleglass red said:
last min change of opponent again for Conor. Prepped to fight Aldo who pulls out, then replaced 2 weeks out by a wrestler in Mendes. Would have required a totally different training camp to prep for each fighter. Kudos on both men for taking that fight and saving that card. Woodley's last fight, he categorically stated had Till not made weight, which was a legitimate concern, that he wouldn't have faced Usman who made it be known he was prepared to step in last min and fight. Is Woodley scared of him, no, in fact I think he beats him, but it would take a different training camp to prep for each fighter
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Likewise Mendes was literally on a fishing trip days before he fought Conor. He was completely out of shape and nearly managed to beat him. So the idea that Conor somehow adjusted for Mendes is generally outweighed by the fact that Mendes didn't have a camp and took the fight with little to no training.
 
Raoul said:
Likewise Mendes was literally on a fishing trip days before he fought Conor. He was completely out of shape and nearly managed to beat him. So the idea that Conor somehow adjusted for Mendes is generally outweighed by the fact that Mendes didn't have a camp and took the fight with little to no training.
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he wasn't completely out of shape, that's a stretch. he wasn't fight ready fit, that's for sure. His mistake in that fight was going for the guillotine, so fight IQ came into it a lot more than people credit that loss for. Would he have gone for that with a full training regime, maybe, we don't know. We certainly know that Conor would have had a more extensive wrestling focused training camp for that fight. It is interesting that the 2 fights people use to highlight Conor's weakness are 2 fights he took late change of opponents on
 
MaxiPaxi said:
People underestimate the amount of cardio it takes to try to defend a take take down or when you're in clench, never mind being on the ground or against the fence. If you've ever wrestled before, you'll know what I'm talking about. It's fecking horrible and puts stress on all of your body. You thighs go. Your arms are gassed. Trying to wrestle your way out doesn't even compare to throwing punches -- it's way more exerting on your stamina. Now couple that with getting your face punched for 3-4 minutes it becomes truly exhausting. So like Conors cardio will definitely be under scrutiny if it goes to ground.

Conor wins this is he uses few combinations of his. I can't actually remember who he K.O'd with one punch at 155. It'll be a T.K.O if anything. But we will see what Khabibs chin is like, we actually don't know. I know MJ tagged him and Barboza kicked him in the head but he walked through those with relative ease. So we will see on Sunday no doubt as Conor will surely land a few.

If it goes to ground -- Conor is fecked. He can wrestle 200 pounds guys all he wants, Khabib's wrestling partner is DC which is fecking legit crazy. And besides, it takes years to master wrestling, you're not going to be anywhere near a level of an Olympic/World Champion wrestler if you weren't before. Even if you're competement wrestler like Truijlo, a double college champion - you'll still get fecked by someone who's been on a different level to you their whole life.

I'm rooting for Khabib obviously but McGregor can definitely do this if Khabib keeps leaving his head up and eating punches like sometimes he does.
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Pretty much how I see it. Conor doesn't have the cardio to take this into the later rounds because Khabib will simply keep him on the ground and continue punching him until he either does a Nate Diaz choke on him or simply wins on points by dominating the rounds on the ground. Conor therefore has to knock him out since that is his only weapon.
 
Raoul said:
Pretty much how I see it. Conor doesn't have the cardio to take this into the later rounds because Khabib will simply keep him on the ground and continue punching him until he either does a Nate Diaz choke on him or simply wins on points by dominating the rounds on the ground. Conor therefore has to knock him out since that is his only weapon.
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I don't think it goes the distance either way. Conor T.K.O him or Khabib slaps the feck out of him for 3 rounds then Kimura's him or something as I can't see Conor throwing a towel in but I can't see him lasting 5 rounds wrestling either.


Edit- wait till we see a Conor submit Khabib or Khabib knocking Conor out cold. :lol:
 
Khabib made weight, 155.
 
Khabib making weight is great
That seemed the biggest risk to this fight happening.
So great it should be on. Be shocked if McGregor didn’t make it
 
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