The Guardian

12OunceEpilogue said:
In-house subbing is being wiped out everywhere (including by me is seems ffs) and being outsourced to large super subbing centres around the country. Private Eye covered the Telegraph, I think, moving their subbing out to a big centre in Wales with laughably bad results.
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The Tel has outsourced? Mate used to sub there- they used to have a three errors and you're sacked rule, very strict.

The Indy got rid of its subs years ago then hired them back when it turned to shit.

We've all let something through tbh. It's embarrassing, but it will always happen.
 
12OunceEpilogue said:
In-house subbing is being wiped out everywhere (including by me is seems ffs) and being outsourced to large super subbing centres around the country. Private Eye covered the Telegraph, I think, moving their subbing out to a big centre in Wales with laughably bad results.
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Sounds about right aye
 
Welsh Wonder said:
Sounds about right aye
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:lol: I think the slight is very much on the concept of outsourcing a very distinct thing; your house style, your pride in correct spelling and grammar, to any large outside agency rather than on the good people of Wales.

Jippy said:
The Tel has outsourced? Mate used to sub there- they used to have a three errors and you're sacked rule, very strict.

The Indy got rid of its subs years ago then hired them back when it turned to shit.

We've all let something through tbh. It's embarrassing, but it will always happen.
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I'd need to look through my back copies but I'm pretty sure the Telegraph has lost not only its subs but the vast majority of its reporters. I was never a particular fan but the state it (and the clickbait factory the paperless Indy has become) is pretty sad.
 
12OunceEpilogue said:
:lol: I think the slight is very much on the concept of outsourcing a very distinct thing; your house style, your pride in correct spelling and grammar, to any large outside agency rather than on the good people of Wales.



I'd need to look through my back copies but I'm pretty sure the Telegraph has lost not only its subs but the vast majority of its reporters. I was never a particular fan but the state it (and the clickbait factory the paperless Indy has become) is pretty sad.
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Bloody hell. I know the Tel has periodic culls of news desk. I know a couple of journos on the personal finance side that quit this year cos they were being worked like dogs.
Half of me ranks a paper by its PF section, plus I've written for the Tel and have a soft spot for it.
 
Jippy said:
Bloody hell. I know the Tel has periodic culls of news desk. I know a couple of journos on the personal finance side that quit this year cos they were being worked like dogs.
Half of me ranks a paper by its PF section, plus I've written for the Tel and have a soft spot for it.
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I was reading (once again in the Eye!) the Telegraph recently brought back its business pull-out to great fanfare, having dropped it to cut printing costs and most of its in-house business/City staff. As you indicate they are finding, amazingly, that treating good staff like shit by either booting them out or making their working lives a misery is having a negative impact on the quality of their output.

I know we're in The Guardian thread so on the subject of subbing, do you still do yours in-house and if so how many full time subs have you got? They seem to have become a very rare breed lately.
 
12OunceEpilogue said:
I was reading (once again in the Eye!) the Telegraph recently brought back its business pull-out to great fanfare, having dropped it to cut printing costs and most of its in-house business/City staff. As you indicate they are finding, amazingly, that treating good staff like shit by either booting them out or making their working lives a misery is having a negative impact on the quality of their output.

I know we're in The Guardian thread so on the subject of subbing, do you still do yours in-house and if so how many full time subs have you got? They seem to have become a very rare breed lately.
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City and money desks losing loads of journos to the asset managers too- they pay loads for content writers (could stick £10-20k) on my salary but sounds boring tbh.

We have two full-time subs and budget for freelance cover when needed and a design team. Would be a nightmare not having them in the office. You need to help adapt headlines to fit, bounce ideas and just be able to discuss pages either on screen or page.
I guess it works if they're remote, but would be a lot harder and just impractical. Even things like knowing your house style, page templates, the design and production team is essential.
 
donkeyfish said:
It was never really a conscious decision, but I find myself reading the Guardian more and more. Lot's of interesting articles that pops up in my feeds.

I like this paper
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I have to read an incredible amount of media because of my job.
Given I have a business focus cos of the job, but do like reading crap, it depends if I'm checking whether there is something I need to know for work or more personal interest. Makes it hard to rank.

Work- FT, Sky, Times, Tel, Bloomberg, Reuters

Personal- Guardian, Sun, BBC, Tel, FT, Mirror, Bloomberg
 




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The absolute state of The Guardian and CNN here. (That edit on the CNN/Rocha tweet is shameful, shameful 'reporting'.) These arseholes are exactly the problem when it comes to reporting on Trump and why exaggerating and sensationalising non-controversies is doing nothing only solidifying and entrenching his supporters' support of him.

Also, if they are compelled to lie about something as innocuous as a fish-feeding PR event, what else are they capable of embellishing in their reporting?
 
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When you're dealing with a bloke who constantly accuses everyone of 'fake news' why commit such a blatant instance of it over something so trivial? Silly, self-defeating and, dare I say it, Sad!!!
 
12OunceEpilogue said:
When you're dealing with a bloke who constantly accuses everyone of 'fake news' why commit such a blatant instance of it over something so trivial? Silly, self-defeating and, dare I say it, Sad!!!
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Probably just missed wires, largely irrelevant to be honest. Most of the "bad news" about Trump tends to come from the horse's mouth itself.
 
FlawlessThaw said:
Probably just missed wires, largely irrelevant to be honest. Most of the "bad news" about Trump tends to come from the horse's mouth itself.
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The whole thing was an irrelevance, which is the point. There are a thousand and one serious matters about Trump they could be looking into and yet they're pissing around with conveniently zoomed-in footage of him dropping some fish food into a pond.

And CNN have the brass balls to launch "Facts First", their 'fight against fake news'. Phew, thank God we have our best guys on the case.
 
12OunceEpilogue said:
The whole thing was an irrelevance, which is the point. There are a thousand and one serious matters about Trump they could be looking into and yet they're pissing around with conveniently zoomed-in footage of him dropping some fish food into a pond.

And CNN have the brass balls to launch "Facts First", their 'fight against fake news'. Phew, thank God we have our best guys on the case.
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Constant lies from the president and administration /= a caption about fish food.
 
Kentonio said:
Constant lies from the president and administration /= a caption about fish food.
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I didn't say they were as bad, but they are diminishing their reporting into the serious matters you allude to with rubbish like this. Why do they need to manufacture diplomatic gaffes? Report the real ones! Report the real lies, rather than making them up themselves!
 
I doubt any news organisation is 100% correct. Mistakes happen, if it’s over fish food, forgive me for not creating a false equivalency.
 
12OunceEpilogue said:
I didn't say they were as bad, but they are diminishing their reporting into the serious matters you allude to with rubbish like this. Why do they need to manufacture diplomatic gaffes? Report the real ones! Report the real lies, rather than making them up themselves!
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They do report the real lies. Endlessly. Given they are under constant assault from the very highest levels of US government though, I don't really blame them for having a bit of fun now and again.
 
Kentonio said:
They do report the real lies. Endlessly. Given they are under constant assault from the very highest levels of US government though, I don't really blame them for having a bit of fun now and again.
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I don't blame them for mentioning Trump as often as they can; it's well-known news organisations have seen a sizeable increase in traffic viewers and subscribers since the election. I just wish they'd leave fun items to The Onion, fake news to Fox/The Mail/Trump himself and stick to proper reporting. I know it sounds pious but I this kind of stuff should be beneath news organisations of the standing of The Guardian and CNN, regardless of who the target is.

Pogue Mahone said:


Good stuff. Great to see there are options other than the annoying paywalls.
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Their drive has been huge, and sorely needed, given the state of the group's finances of late. It is very good to see, particularly as you say having avoided a paywall.
 
Gary Younge is no longer with the Guardian but they are carrying some of his stuff - he went on a tour of the midwest/south to meet Trump voters, and also Richard Spencer.
Interivew.

As expected, comments are fairly grim. The "idpol for white people" or whatever it's called now has spread very wide.
 
berbatrick said:
Gary Younge is no longer with the Guardian but they are carrying some of his stuff - he went on a tour of the midwest/south to meet Trump voters, and also Richard Spencer.
Interivew.

As expected, comments are fairly grim. The "idpol for white people" or whatever it's called now has spread very wide.
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Brilliant piece also it's a very good argument to why it's ok to punch Richard Spencer in the head.
 
berbatrick said:
Gary Younge is no longer with the Guardian but they are carrying some of his stuff - he went on a tour of the midwest/south to meet Trump voters, and also Richard Spencer.
Interivew.

As expected, comments are fairly grim. The "idpol for white people" or whatever it's called now has spread very wide.
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Fair fecks to Younge for staying calm headed through all that, it's made my heart go crazy and I'm just watching on fecking twitter.
 
Pogue Mahone said:


Good stuff. Great to see there are options other than the annoying paywalls.
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I would have contributed if they published their weekend long reads in print and mailed it out on a subscription basis instead of merely asking to donate. Those are usually excellent pieces of journalism.
 
Stanzin Lama said:
Watch out, manspreaders: the womanspreading fightback starts now
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Much of the action is verbal, with thousands of women speaking out about shared experiences of sexual assault, harassment and discrimination. But it’s also starting to get physical. Women like myself are breaking free of society’s strict restraints on our bodies. After years of being told to “give us a smile”, be “seen not heard” and “not speak unless you have something nice to say”, we’re using #womanspreading. We’re finally taking up the space that we deserve.
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Victim of sexual assault? No problem, ladies, as I'm leading the fightback by spreading my legs on public transport. The revolution starts now... assuming you're not wearing a skirt.
 
Fener1907 said:
Victim of sexual assault? No problem, ladies, as I'm leading the fightback by spreading my legs on public transport. The revolution starts now... assuming you're not wearing a skirt.
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She raises a valid point though in that if a woman sits with her legs open they get either disparaging or creepy looks. Men get nothing.
 
Not allowed in the CE forum. In fact just don't.
Jippy said:
She raises a valid point though in that if a woman sits with her legs open they get either disparaging or creepy looks. Men get nothing.
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No one wants their train cabin to smell like fish, that’s why.
 
Classical Mechanic said:
It did make me chuckle, some sort of feminist ‘fightback’ in sexually suggestive poses with their tits hanging out.
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That's where this meta bollox gets confusing. Is it empowering for women to adopt an antisocial male trait or are they better served by rising above it- who knows?
 
Jippy said:
She raises a valid point though in that if a woman sits with her legs open they get either disparaging or creepy looks. Men get nothing.
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I look at men like they're utter twats when they do it. If she feels like her best course of action is to join them in looking like a twat, all the power to her.
 
Fener1907 said:
I look at men like they're utter twats when they do it. If she feels like her best course of action is to join them in looking like a twat, all the power to her.
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I'm not suggesting that I have no choice to sit with my legs as wide apart as possible but it is very uncomfortable to sit with your knees anywhere near together.
 
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